Is "soul sleep" biblical?

[buttercup]

A thread someone posted today in this section brought to mind a belief called "soul sleep," which is held by Seventh Day Adventists and Jehovah's Witnesses. In a nutshell, it's the view that when we die, our soul "sleeps" until the resurrection and final judgment.

The timing of the other thread was interesting because just last night this topic came up in an online small group I'm part of, and someone in our little group believes in soul sleep. I mentioned that what Jesus said to the thief on the cross - "today you will be with me in paradise" - shows that soul sleep is unbiblical, but she said that doesn't make sense because Jesus did not go directly to paradise that day. (That's a whole topic in and of itself, but apparently that is one of the arguments used by those who believe in soul sleep.)

My view is that soul sleep is a false idea, but I'm open to being convinced otherwise. Mainly I'd like to hear the arguments / scriptures for and against this in order to be more confident that the standard view is indeed correct.

I wanted to hear what the Christians here have to say about this, especially anyone who has studied this topic before. Thanks!

 

[Gracie]

Not a christian...not too informed. But in my opinion, yes...you are dead, but spiritually asleep (your soul) until judgement day. Those who fail, stay asleep. dead. no hell. just absent from God forever.

 

[buttercup]

Not a christian...not too informed. But in my opinion, yes...you are dead, but spiritually asleep (your soul) until judgement day. Those who fail, stay asleep. dead. no hell. just absent from God forever.

Thanks for chiming in. I haven't studied this topic but I was looking at some videos about it, and it was interesting to me that those who hold this view had answers for all the scriptures that seem to go against it. Anyway, I was just curious to hear thoughts on this on both sides. Thanks!

 

[Alan Stallion]

Related subject (?), I've been unsure on the concept of "the bosom of Abraham." Any thoughts on that? It's mentioned in the NT once (the parable of Lazarus and the rich man), using the Greek word "kolpos" (meaning "bosom" or "lap")

 

[buttercup]

Related subject (?), I've been unsure on the concept of "the bosom of Abraham." Any thoughts on that? It's mentioned in the NT once (the parable of Lazarus and the rich man), using the Greek word "kolpos" (meaning "bosom" or "lap")

Same here! That is another thing that I haven't studied enough to really say much about it.... but I think before the time of Jesus, things were different in terms of what happens immediately after we die. The Irish Ram spoke a little bit about this on that other thread (the one that brought this topic to mind) and I'd love to hear her thoughts on this in more depth!

 

[Gracie]

Same here! That is another thing that I haven't studied enough to really say much about it.... but I think before the time of Jesus, things were different in terms of what happens immediately after we die. The Irish Ram spoke a little bit about this on that other thread (the one that brought this topic to mind) and I'd love to hear her thoughts on this in more depth!

Irish is awesome. I adore her.

 

[Gracie]

MrG said hell is a resting place. When Jesus returns, then those resting will be raised accordingly. The others...no.
He is ex JW.

 

[Esdraelon]

If we are to believe Paul's words that "to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord - and I do - then all that remains is to understand how that can coexist with OT scriptures that talk of the dead "sleeping" and "knowing nothing". I've wondered about it for a long time and it finally occurred to me that one possibility is that upon our physical death, we have no longer have any concept or recognition of time. We experience a transition from one state of consciousness to another, instantly from our perspective, because we aren't aware of any passage of time.

So, while the living see the death of the body, they cannot observe the transition from this side of death. Believers whose bodies perished 2000 years ago will still be conscious only of stepping through a veil from this side to the other... That's my 2-C.

 

[buttercup]

If we are to believe Paul's words that "to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord - and I do - then all that remains is to understand how that can coexist with OT scriptures that talk of the dead "sleeping" and "knowing nothing". I've wondered about it for a long time and it finally occurred to me that one possibility is that upon our physical death, we have no longer have any concept or recognition of time. We experience a transition from one state of consciousness to another, instantly from our perspective, because we aren't aware of any passage of time.

So, while the living see the death of the body, they cannot observe the transition from this side of death. Believers whose bodies perished 2000 years ago will still be conscious only of stepping through a veil from this side to the other... That's my 2-C.

Pardon my confusion here, but is your view that soul sleep is true, and that since the person whose soul is sleeping has no awareness of time, being 'asleep' for 2000 years would be like a blink of an eye? So from their perspective it would be like dying and waking up to be present with God?

Thanks for your thoughts!

 

[Gracie]

This is why MrG believes what I posted he said. Jesus went to hell. But not THE hell. Found this on google. It explains better.

Did Jesus go to hell between His death and resurrection? | GotQuestions.org

Did Jesus go to hell between His death and resurrection? What was Jesus doing for the three days between His death and resurrection?

www.gotquestions.org

In the Hebrew Scriptures, the word used to describe the realm of the dead is sheol. It simply means “the place of the dead” or “the place of departed souls/spirits.” The New Testament Greek equivalent of sheol is hades, which also refers to “the place of the dead.” Other Scriptures in the New Testament indicate that sheol/hades is a temporary place, where souls are kept as they await the final resurrection and judgment. Revelation 20:11–15 gives a clear distinction between hades and the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the permanent and final place of judgment for the lost. Hades, then, is a temporary place. Many people refer to both hades and the lake of fire as “hell,” and this causes confusion. Jesus did not go to a place of torment after His death, but He did go to hades.

Sheol/hades was a realm with two divisions—a place of blessing and a place of judgment (Matthew 11:23; 16:18; Luke 10:15; 16:23; Acts 2:27–31). The abodes of the saved and the lost are both generally called “hades” in the Bible. The abode of the saved is also called “Abraham’s bosom” (KJV) or “Abraham’s side” (NIV) in Luke 16:22 and “paradise” in Luke 23:43. The abode of the unsaved is called “hell” (KJV) or “Hades” (NIV) in Luke 16:23. The abodes of the saved and the lost are separated by a “great chasm” (Luke 16:26). When Jesus died, He went to the blessed side of sheol and, from there, took the believers with Him to heaven (Ephesians 4:8–10). The judgment side of sheol/hades has remained unchanged. All unbelieving dead go there awaiting their final judgment in the future. Did Jesus go to sheol/hades? Yes, according to Ephesians 4:8–10 and 1 Peter 3:18–20.

 

[buttercup]

This is why MrG believes what I posted he said. Jesus went to hell. But not THE hell. Found this on google. It explains better.

Did Jesus go to hell between His death and resurrection? | GotQuestions.org

Did Jesus go to hell between His death and resurrection? What was Jesus doing for the three days between His death and resurrection?

www.gotquestions.org

In the Hebrew Scriptures, the word used to describe the realm of the dead is sheol. It simply means “the place of the dead” or “the place of departed souls/spirits.” The New Testament Greek equivalent of sheol is hades, which also refers to “the place of the dead.” Other Scriptures in the New Testament indicate that sheol/hades is a temporary place, where souls are kept as they await the final resurrection and judgment. Revelation 20:11–15 gives a clear distinction between hades and the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the permanent and final place of judgment for the lost. Hades, then, is a temporary place. Many people refer to both hades and the lake of fire as “hell,” and this causes confusion. Jesus did not go to a place of torment after His death, but He did go to hades.

Sheol/hades was a realm with two divisions—a place of blessing and a place of judgment (Matthew 11:23; 16:18; Luke 10:15; 16:23; Acts 2:27–31). The abodes of the saved and the lost are both generally called “hades” in the Bible. The abode of the saved is also called “Abraham’s bosom” (KJV) or “Abraham’s side” (NIV) in Luke 16:22 and “paradise” in Luke 23:43. The abode of the unsaved is called “hell” (KJV) or “Hades” (NIV) in Luke 16:23. The abodes of the saved and the lost are separated by a “great chasm” (Luke 16:26). When Jesus died, He went to the blessed side of sheol and, from there, took the believers with Him to heaven (Ephesians 4:8–10). The judgment side of sheol/hades has remained unchanged. All unbelieving dead go there awaiting their final judgment in the future. Did Jesus go to sheol/hades? Yes, according to Ephesians 4:8–10 and 1 Peter 3:18–20.

I was just about to reply to your other post to try to clarify what he meant, but what you just posted above is what I guessed he meant...So thanks for clarifying that!

It's very interesting, and now I'm wondering how that goes along with what Jesus said to the thief on the cross. It seems that paradise was Abraham's bosom… And Jesus raised those believers who were there, along with the thief on the cross....ETA: which I just noticed is what the last paragraph in your last post says. This is all starting to become more clear.

(sorry for the slow replies, my computer is super slow right now for some reason)

 

[foggedinn]

In 1 Samuel 28, Saul commissioned the witch of Endor to wake the spirit of Samuel. Is this the sort of thing that could be viewed as soul sleep?

 

[justinacolmena]

When I was young, I wasn't aware of a spiritual world which exists in other dimensions than say the three of space and one of time we are all familiar with.

Life is eternal, and the soul, once created, does not ever die or cease from its existence, as the physical universe does, but the good is separated from the evil, and the just are separated from among the unjust.

The Bible tells us about the darkness that was upon the face of the deep and the Spirit that was there when life first began on earth.

 

[The Irish Ram]

Abraham's Bosom.
It is also called Paradise. Remember what Christ told the thief on the cross beside Him?
And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.
Some confuse that word with Heaven, but He was referring to the place where God's saints were waiting. That is where they both went. To Abraham's Bosom.
Here is why the place was necessary.
Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me".

No one. Not God's Prophets, Not His friend Abraham. Not the apple of His eye, King David. Sin cannot enter Heaven, and no one had died to pay for their sins yet. So they rested with Abraham, and waited for Jesus. Jesus spent 3 days there. When He left, to return to Jerusalem, He took all of them with Him. About 10,000 whose graves opened during the earthquake that took place while Christ was on the cross.
…At that moment the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth quaked and the rocks were split. The tombs broke open, and the bodies of many saints who had fallen asleep were raised. After Jesus’ resurrection, when they had come out of the tombs, they entered the holy city and appeared to many people.
They stayed for 40 days in their new state of the art glorified bodies. Then ascended with Christ when He left us for Heaven.
Abraham's Bosom is no longer necessary. Our sins have been paid for. We go straight up. Absent from the body means present with the Lord.

Across a deep chasm from Abraham's Bosom was Hell. That is where they all were when the conversation between Abraham and the rich man took place. (The Lazarus referred to there is not the same one Christ raised from the dead.)
Several things are described. Hell was filled with remorse. They believed what the prophets told them now that they were living it. There is severe thirst. And something I noted was that, even in spirit form, they were recognizable. Lazarus recognized Abraham. He still looked like Abraham!

And for a bizarre twist. Guess where Abraham's Bosom was and Hell still is located:
For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

 

[The Irish Ram]

When I was young, I wasn't aware of a spiritual world which exists in other dimensions than say the three of space and one of time we are all familiar with.

Life is eternal, and the soul, once created, does not ever die or cease from its existence, as the physical universe does, but the good is separated from the evil, and the just are separated from among the unjust.

The Bible tells us about the darkness that was upon the face of the deep and the Spirit that was there when life first began on earth.

Your right, but the spiritual world exists here just as it does in Heaven. Lucifer was shot out of Heaven like a bolt of lightening. And with Him went 1/3 of the angels. They go to and fro down here, inflicting as much pain as they can before there time is up. A few had a run in with Jesus:
“What do you want with us, Son of God?” they shouted. “Have you come here to torture us before the appointed time?”
They didn't know about His plan to salvage us first.

 

[justinacolmena]

About 10,000 whose graves opened during the earthquake that took place while Christ was on the cross.

That was heavy thunder, not a tectonic movement earthquake. Lightning struck the veil of the temple, because Jesus saw beforehand, Satan as lightning fell from heaven.
Jesus' coat with no seam on it was full of rainwater when the soldier pierced it with a sword.

Many of the graves were opened after His resurrection, if people were really dead in those days, or if they were doped with sedative as Jesus was, to keep them quiet, and some were granted witness protection.

 

[Turtlesoup]

A thread someone posted today in this section brought to mind a belief called "soul sleep," which is held by Seventh Day Adventists and Jehovah's Witnesses. In a nutshell, it's the view that when we die, our soul "sleeps" until the resurrection and final judgment.

The timing of the other thread was interesting because just last night this topic came up in an online small group I'm part of, and someone in our little group believes in soul sleep. I mentioned that what Jesus said to the thief on the cross - "today you will be with me in paradise" - shows that soul sleep is unbiblical, but she said that doesn't make sense because Jesus did not go directly to paradise that day. (That's a whole topic in and of itself, but apparently that is one of the arguments used by those who believe in soul sleep.)

My view is that soul sleep is a false idea, but I'm open to being convinced otherwise. Mainly I'd like to hear the arguments / scriptures for and against this in order to be more confident that the standard view is indeed correct.

I wanted to hear what the Christians here have to say about this, especially anyone who has studied this topic before. Thanks!

As an atheist, I don't know why this concept would offend anyone or be open to argument or why it matters. If you believe when you die, that your soul takes a nap before it goes to heaven, why would this be considered a much different belief than those who believe that your soul goes straight to heaven with no nap time?

 

[Michael1985]

A thread someone posted today in this section brought to mind a belief called "soul sleep," which is held by Seventh Day Adventists and Jehovah's Witnesses. In a nutshell, it's the view that when we die, our soul "sleeps" until the resurrection and final judgment.

The timing of the other thread was interesting because just last night this topic came up in an online small group I'm part of, and someone in our little group believes in soul sleep. I mentioned that what Jesus said to the thief on the cross - "today you will be with me in paradise" - shows that soul sleep is unbiblical, but she said that doesn't make sense because Jesus did not go directly to paradise that day. (That's a whole topic in and of itself, but apparently that is one of the arguments used by those who believe in soul sleep.)

My view is that soul sleep is a false idea, but I'm open to being convinced otherwise. Mainly I'd like to hear the arguments / scriptures for and against this in order to be more confident that the standard view is indeed correct.

I wanted to hear what the Christians here have to say about this, especially anyone who has studied this topic before. Thanks!

It's what I've adhered to for a long time. I think immediate transport to heaven is nothing more than a fantasy giving comfort to the dying in their last moments and to the loved ones of the deceased once that act has occured.

 

[Care4all]

It seems like we are asleep, until judgement day, from this passage in Revelation???

Revelation 6:9-11 9When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained. 10They called out in a loud voice, "How long, Sovereign LORD, holy and true, until you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?" 11Then each of them was given a white robe, and they were told to wait a little longer, until the full number of their fellow servants, their brothers and sisters, were killed just as they had been.

 

[Polishprince]

I don't think the idea of "soul sleep" is very practical at all.

With the number of people dying each day being so high, its probably hectic in Hell for Satan to process and orientate new residents as it is. To wait until the day of Judgment would be a real mess.