Is Roe v. Wade "widely accepted by legal scholars as settled law"...What is "widely accepted"?

[Markle]

Then just ask the fetus. If it doesnt respond in 10 minutes, it loses its choice.

Just like children, they should have a Guardian ad Litem, right?

 

[Markle]

I dont consider a completely dependent fetus a human being.

In your opinion, at what point do they become a human being?

 

[Lesh]

So you are defending the right of women to have sexual gratification at the PRICE of a human life?
Wow... sex must be very important to you.

Apparently you think that women can create babies without the "input" of a man?

 

[DOTR]

Are you the only liberal in America who didn’t know Republicans oppose abortion?

Not true.

As a Conservative, I, and most of us disapprove of abortion overall. We oppose using it as a method of birth-control or today, a child that may not be perfect or the "right" sex.

What is "not true"?

 

[Markle]

If Roe is overturned and the knuckle dragging dark ages types in certain red states start throwing young women and doctors in jail. The elections on state and national levels will be the end of far right politicians holding elected office. Nobody has even considered the protests and marches outside of those jails courthouses and state representatives offices and their being hounded 24/7/365. Anyone who thinks it will be accepted and tolerated for any time at all is deluded beyond all imagination.

That's just foolish. Why not join the real world?

 

[Markle]

One stark indication of the prevalence of illegal abortion was the death toll. In 1930, abortion was listed as the official cause of death for almost 2,700 women—nearly one-fifth (18%) of maternal deaths recorded in that year. The death toll had declined to just under 1,700 by 1940, and to just over 300 by 1950 (most likely because of the introduction of antibiotics in the 1940s, which permitted more effective treatment of the infections that frequently developed after illegal abortion). By 1965, the number of deaths due to illegal abortion had fallen to just under 200, but illegal abortion still accounted for 17% of all deaths attributed to pregnancy and childbirth that year. And these are just the number that were officially reported; the actual number was likely much higher.

Poor women and their families were disproportionately impacted. A study of low-income women in New York City in the 1960s found that almost one in 10 (8%) had ever attempted to terminate a pregnancy by illegal abortion; almost four in 10 (38%) said that a friend, relative or acquaintance had attempted to obtain an abortion. Of the low-income women in that study who said they had had an abortion, eight in 10 (77%) said that they had attempted a self-induced procedure, with only 2% saying that a physician had been involved in any way.

These women paid a steep price for illegal procedures. In 1962 alone, nearly 1,600 women were admitted to Harlem Hospital Center in New York City for incomplete abortions, which was one abortion-related hospital admission for every 42 deliveries at that hospital that year. In 1968, the University of Southern California Los Angeles County Medical Center, another large public facility serving primarily indigent patients, admitted 701 women with septic abortions, one admission for every 14 deliveries.

Check your computer, this is 2018. Yeah, WOW!

 

[Markle]

Very few people ever read party platforms and even fewer believe they will be carried out

That's why Democrats and Progressives are so filled with hate and vitriol. President Donald Trump is actually doing what he PROMISED! In spite of everything going so well, Democrats and Progressives are terrorized that people will learn what they promised could not happen, is happening!

 

[oreo]

Kavanaugh advised against calling Roe v. Wade ‘settled law’ while a White House lawyer
“it is widely accepted by legal scholars across the board that Roe v. Wade and its progeny are the settled law of the land,”
Kavanaugh advised against calling Roe v. Wade ‘settled law’ while a White House lawyer

This is one of arguments defending Roe v. Wade that all legal scholars accept it and it can't be changed.

BUT

Most people in favor of Roe v. Wade are NOT aware of these statistics:

Of the 36,649,884 DEATHS since Roe v. Wade:

• 36.6% were performed on women with one or two prior abortions, and
• 8.1% were performed on women with three or more prior abortions (CDC).

44.7% or nearly half by women are either stupid, definitely don't use birth control continue to act as pre-meditated murders at that point.

U.S. Abortion Statistics

Think about it.
Most Americans like me do believe an abortion is right in the case of:
1) Rape
2) Incest
3) Mother's health.

BUT in the above statistics nearly half or almost 18 million lives snuffed out because the woman was either:

1. too uninformed to know about contraceptives
2. Too lazy to do anything about protection.
3. And all evidently WILLING partners to a few moments satisfaction that costs lives.

Why is it OK that these 44.7% women can get their sexual satisfaction at the price of a life?

What is the difference between

• the Romans watching people being eaten by lions for satisfaction?
• the Nazis killing people for information?

and women that are getting a few moments of satisfaction at the price of a life?

I don't believe your statistics--and I see that you haven't provided a verifiable-trusted link to your source.

A woman is not going to pay out of pocket $1200 to $1700 per abortion when birth control contraceptives are much cheaper. I am still waiting for you abortion activists to drag up one single woman, out of the hundreds of thousands of women you claim that have abortions, to testify that her abortion was paid for with tax payer dollars.

As far as Roe v Wade considered widely accepted by legal scholars. Of course it is. That is why it has survived every single legal challenge brought forward over the last 45 years.

In fact, Niel Gorsuch, Trump's 1st appointee to the court stated that Roe V Wade is precedent in the Constitution, meaning set in stone to you.
Gorsuch to Feinstein: Abortion ruling is 'precedent'

Republicans aren't doing so well with this issue anymore. It's going to show up in the voting booth. Women are the largest voting block in this country today, and they're sick & tired of having their intelligence & integrity insulted by Republicans.

1st woman's march held the day after Trump was inaugurated, January 20, 2017. For more pictures on the woman's march go to this link on this board, and you'll probably find your home state.
Woman's march pictures

The 2nd annual woman's march January 20, 2018.
More Than 4,000 Women Say They Want to Run for Office Since Trump's Election

It appears that a sleeping giant has awoken, and it's pissed. This is what you get when you are campaigning on already settled U.S. Supreme court issues, that belong no where on a political platform. I don't feel a bit sorry for you.

If these women are willing to freeze their behinds off in January, I am certain they won't have any issues voting this November. For more on that, go to this link.
Blue wave coming this November 2018

 

[ThunderKiss1965]

Weird how the left fervently believes that abortion is settled law, but my right to bear arms, which is specifically mentioned in the Constitution, is not.

 

[Dana7360]

Here come the anti-abortion freaks.

Make no mistake.

This IS an attack on choice.

They would outlaw any and all abortions and take us back to the 1950s and back alley abortions (well not for the rich...they always "go on vacation"

So you are defending the right of women to have sexual gratification at the PRICE of a human life?
Wow... sex must be very important to you.

I guess the man she had that sexual gratification with didn't.

Women don't get pregnant alone.

Why are you only condemning women for their choices?

Why aren't you condemning men for their sexual gratification?

Why don't you have a problem with men who create a pregnancy then just walk away without even looking back to see what he has done?

Why don't you have a problem with men who deny their own flesh and blood?

Why don't you have a problem with men who cause pregnancies then just walk away from their own flesh and blood?

All you're doing is attacking women. Which tells me you really don't care anything about any pregnancies. If you did you would include men in your attacks. All you care about is being holier than thou and attack women.

Women don't get pregnant alone but apparently you believe so.

There is no argument regarding it takes a man to be responsible.
BUT ultimately the woman is the one that gets the abortion.
And as I've pointed out I'm not against abortions for rape, incest, health of the mother (which can include the mental capabilities to raise child).
But the woman that has as nearly 44% of abortions are to women that had made the same mistake at least 2 times or more?
Come on that's NOT the man's fault. That's the woman's fault.
She evidently doesn't LEARN from the first time. Doesn't care. Or some other reason to have multiple abortions!
With these women's careless actions it seems that sterilization or tube tying would be their better solution all around...health wise as abortions ARE dangerous!

She didn't get pregnant alone. It's ALWAYS both people's fault for a pregnancy.

Plus birth control doesn't always work. Mostly because of human error.

Vasectomies and getting tubes tied doesn't always work either.

My sister had a patient who had her tubes tied. Her husband had a vasectomy. She ended up pregnant.

One of my assistants had her tubes tied. She ended up pregnant.

A sister in law of an ex boyfriend had her tubes tied. She ended up pregnant.

Then there's medications that make the pill useless but doctors don't tell the patient. Such as certain antibiotics. A friend of mine got pregnant that way because he doctor didn't tell her that medication made her birth control useless.

There are many reasons why women get pregnant even when they use birth control.

Nothing is perfect.

If a woman has more than one abortion it's none of your business and it's certainly not up to you to judge.

Why don't you have a problem with men who walk away from their own flesh and blood? A lot of abortions happen because the man who got her pregnant either pressured her to have that abortion or she realized that she's on her own because that man is a deadbeat.

Because there's many reasons for abortion, people who aren't directly involved really should stay out of the situation.

If you're christian, then follow your own bible and let your god judge other people.

 

[Natural Citizen]

I am not making an argument, I am stating the reason the SCOTUS will not over turn RvW.

And you were correct in your assessment.

I want to see federal jurisdiction removed, and give the jurisdiction back to the states. I'll be content with that.

 

[healthmyths]

Here come the anti-abortion freaks.

Make no mistake.

This IS an attack on choice.

They would outlaw any and all abortions and take us back to the 1950s and back alley abortions (well not for the rich...they always "go on vacation"

So you are defending the right of women to have sexual gratification at the PRICE of a human life?
Wow... sex must be very important to you.

I guess the man she had that sexual gratification with didn't.

Women don't get pregnant alone.

Why are you only condemning women for their choices?

Why aren't you condemning men for their sexual gratification?

Why don't you have a problem with men who create a pregnancy then just walk away without even looking back to see what he has done?

Why don't you have a problem with men who deny their own flesh and blood?

Why don't you have a problem with men who cause pregnancies then just walk away from their own flesh and blood?

All you're doing is attacking women. Which tells me you really don't care anything about any pregnancies. If you did you would include men in your attacks. All you care about is being holier than thou and attack women.

Women don't get pregnant alone but apparently you believe so.

There is no argument regarding it takes a man to be responsible.
BUT ultimately the woman is the one that gets the abortion.
And as I've pointed out I'm not against abortions for rape, incest, health of the mother (which can include the mental capabilities to raise child).
But the woman that has as nearly 44% of abortions are to women that had made the same mistake at least 2 times or more?
Come on that's NOT the man's fault. That's the woman's fault.
She evidently doesn't LEARN from the first time. Doesn't care. Or some other reason to have multiple abortions!
With these women's careless actions it seems that sterilization or tube tying would be their better solution all around...health wise as abortions ARE dangerous!

She didn't get pregnant alone. It's ALWAYS both people's fault for a pregnancy.

Plus birth control doesn't always work. Mostly because of human error.

Vasectomies and getting tubes tied doesn't always work either.

My sister had a patient who had her tubes tied. Her husband had a vasectomy. She ended up pregnant.

One of my assistants had her tubes tied. She ended up pregnant.

A sister in law of an ex boyfriend had her tubes tied. She ended up pregnant.

Then there's medications that make the pill useless but doctors don't tell the patient. Such as certain antibiotics. A friend of mine got pregnant that way because he doctor didn't tell her that medication made her birth control useless.

There are many reasons why women get pregnant even when they use birth control.

Nothing is perfect.

If a woman has more than one abortion it's none of your business and it's certainly not up to you to judge.

Why don't you have a problem with men who walk away from their own flesh and blood? A lot of abortions happen because the man who got her pregnant either pressured her to have that abortion or she realized that she's on her own because that man is a deadbeat.

Because there's many reasons for abortion, people who aren't directly involved really should stay out of the situation.

If you're christian, then follow your own bible and let your god judge other people.

Bullshit!
WE ARE ALL involved in abortions as long as we fund Planned Parenthood PP with TAX dollars.
Remember payroll taxes are paid by everyone.
Payroll taxes are lumped in with income taxes etc by the federal government.
So when we have our payroll check deducted for SS/Medicare part of that payment is going to Planned Parenthood and that is wrong!

FACT:
Planned Parenthood receives more than $500 million annually in government funding, mostly through Medicaid and grants.
Planned Parenthood gets over $500 million annually in public funds. Here's where it goes.
How many abortions did PP perform since 1970? 8,223,342 abortions.
Number of Abortions in US & Worldwide - Number of abortions since 1973
How many abortions by women who have had 1 or more previous abortions?
We found that 45% of patients reported having one or more prior abortions.
Which Abortion Patients Have Had a Prior Abortion? Findings from the 2014 U.S. Abortion Patient Survey

So think about your "singular" subjective ONE off experiences and those are rightfully so sad.
BUT YOU and your cohorts continually CONFLATE these singular, rare and infrequent EXCEPTIONS almost every time you defend Abortions.

And that is so wrong!
Why don't you and your cohorts EDUCATE these 45% of women that have had previous abortions as to
A) how to prevent pregnancies
B) Agree to have tubes tied after first abortion to prevent further deaths.
C) And LASTLY STOP just STOP excusing these women's behavior! Totally wrong for a woman to have two or more abortions.

I've never been against an abortion in case of RAPE, INCEST or health of the mother... BUT these acceptance as nonchalant as people like you of ABORTIONS is
no less equal to the Germans accepting Nazis ovens murdering 6 million people!

YES I believe that abortions that are done by women who've already had an abortion to the Nazis murdering people.

AND as I pointed out above WE, ME, and millions like me don't like to have Planned Parenthood using OUR taxes to murder people.
THAT simple.

Now someone says well how do you know that the 500 million a year is going for abortions?
I never said it was!
But what PP could do is totally segregate their funding. Build a separate abortion facilitate with separate payrolls etc. it can be done.
Then NONE of the $500+million in payroll taxes would be used. $500 million could fund PP's NON-abortion expenses and I am all for that!
BUT don't say we ALL don't have something to say about PP's using OUR payroll taxes for abortions as that is so incorrect!

 

[Markle]

Here come the anti-abortion freaks.

Make no mistake.

This IS an attack on choice.

They would outlaw any and all abortions and take us back to the 1950s and back alley abortions (well not for the rich...they always "go on vacation"

So you are defending the right of women to have sexual gratification at the PRICE of a human life?
Wow... sex must be very important to you.

I guess the man she had that sexual gratification with didn't.

Women don't get pregnant alone.

Why are you only condemning women for their choices?

Why aren't you condemning men for their sexual gratification?

Why don't you have a problem with men who create a pregnancy then just walk away without even looking back to see what he has done?

Why don't you have a problem with men who deny their own flesh and blood?

Why don't you have a problem with men who cause pregnancies then just walk away from their own flesh and blood?

All you're doing is attacking women. Which tells me you really don't care anything about any pregnancies. If you did you would include men in your attacks. All you care about is being holier than thou and attack women.

Women don't get pregnant alone but apparently you believe so.

There is no argument regarding it takes a man to be responsible.
BUT ultimately the woman is the one that gets the abortion.
And as I've pointed out I'm not against abortions for rape, incest, health of the mother (which can include the mental capabilities to raise child).
But the woman that has as nearly 44% of abortions are to women that had made the same mistake at least 2 times or more?
Come on that's NOT the man's fault. That's the woman's fault.
She evidently doesn't LEARN from the first time. Doesn't care. Or some other reason to have multiple abortions!
With these women's careless actions it seems that sterilization or tube tying would be their better solution all around...health wise as abortions ARE dangerous!

She didn't get pregnant alone. It's ALWAYS both people's fault for a pregnancy.

Plus birth control doesn't always work. Mostly because of human error.

Vasectomies and getting tubes tied doesn't always work either.

My sister had a patient who had her tubes tied. Her husband had a vasectomy. She ended up pregnant.

One of my assistants had her tubes tied. She ended up pregnant.

A sister in law of an ex boyfriend had her tubes tied. She ended up pregnant.

Then there's medications that make the pill useless but doctors don't tell the patient. Such as certain antibiotics. A friend of mine got pregnant that way because he doctor didn't tell her that medication made her birth control useless.

There are many reasons why women get pregnant even when they use birth control.

Nothing is perfect.

If a woman has more than one abortion it's none of your business and it's certainly not up to you to judge.

Why don't you have a problem with men who walk away from their own flesh and blood? A lot of abortions happen because the man who got her pregnant either pressured her to have that abortion or she realized that she's on her own because that man is a deadbeat.

Because there's many reasons for abortion, people who aren't directly involved really should stay out of the situation.

If you're christian, then follow your own bible and let your god judge other people.

It all comes down to personal responsibility. People who are irresponsible get pregnant.

If a woman has one abortion or three, if I'm paying, it's my business.

 

[DOTR]

The country is not ready or willing to absorb 750,000 more babies a year.

Better in the trash heap then? Or sold for parts?

What a stupid argument.

I am not making an argument, I am stating the reason the SCOTUS will not over turn RvW.

As usual you are part of the problem. The Court should rule on laws..not on how many babies there will be.

 

[Lesh]

WE ARE ALL involved in abortions as long as we fund Planned Parenthood PP with TAX dollars.

We don't.

Stop lying

PP gets "federal dollars" for medical procedures from Medicaid...like any other healthcare provider. NOT for abortion services

 

[JoeB131]

Most people in favor of Roe v. Wade are NOT aware of these statistics:

Of the 36,649,884 DEATHS since Roe v. Wade:

Fetuses aren't babies... There have been ZERO deaths of fetuses. There have been a few dozen deaths of women due to shady operators.

44.7% or nearly half by women are either stupid, definitely don't use birth control continue to act as pre-meditated murders at that point.

So what? Again, if birth control were left up to the men, we'd have even more unwanted pregnancies.

Why is it OK that these 44.7% women can get their sexual satisfaction at the price of a life?

What is the difference between

• the Romans watching people being eaten by lions for satisfaction?
• the Nazis killing people for information?

and women that are getting a few moments of satisfaction at the price of a life?

You do realize that the Romans throwing people to the lions is a myth, right?

Here's the reality. The thing you anti-choice nuts seem to think is that before Roe v. Wade, we lived in a happy land of unicorns where girls kept their legs closed and all pregnancies were brought to term.

The reality. OB/GYN's performed just as many abortions before Roe as they did after. They just wrote down something else on the charts and billed insurance.

Take a look at the birth rates. There was NO huge drop in the birth rate after 1973. In fact, the birth rate creeped up. (It did drop after 1965 when the birth control pill was introduced.)

In fact, if you look at birth rates, you'll see that the birth rate drops whenver there are bad economic times, whether abortion is legal or not.

 

[healthmyths]

Most people in favor of Roe v. Wade are NOT aware of these statistics:

Of the 36,649,884 DEATHS since Roe v. Wade:

Fetuses aren't babies... There have been ZERO deaths of fetuses. There have been a few dozen deaths of women due to shady operators.

44.7% or nearly half by women are either stupid, definitely don't use birth control continue to act as pre-meditated murders at that point.

So what? Again, if birth control were left up to the men, we'd have even more unwanted pregnancies.

Why is it OK that these 44.7% women can get their sexual satisfaction at the price of a life?

What is the difference between

• the Romans watching people being eaten by lions for satisfaction?
• the Nazis killing people for information?

and women that are getting a few moments of satisfaction at the price of a life?

You do realize that the Romans throwing people to the lions is a myth, right?

Here's the reality. The thing you anti-choice nuts seem to think is that before Roe v. Wade, we lived in a happy land of unicorns where girls kept their legs closed and all pregnancies were brought to term.

The reality. OB/GYN's performed just as many abortions before Roe as they did after. They just wrote down something else on the charts and billed insurance.

Take a look at the birth rates. There was NO huge drop in the birth rate after 1973. In fact, the birth rate creeped up. (It did drop after 1965 when the birth control pill was introduced.)

In fact, if you look at birth rates, you'll see that the birth rate drops whenver there are bad economic times, whether abortion is legal or not.

View attachment 216916

JoeB131 wrote :You do realize that the Romans throwing people to the lions is a myth, right?

Take a look at this and then read the attached closely because it is NOT a myth.

It is important to emphasise that such cruel deaths were not unique to Christians. Condemnation to the beasts was a popular punishment for criminals of any type, because it maximized their suffering and allowed good and proper Roman citizens to gain pleasure from the deaths of wrong-doers.
Mythbusting Ancient Rome – throwing Christians to the lions

Mythbusting Ancient Rome – throwing Christians to the lions

 

[Lesh]

I am not making an argument, I am stating the reason the SCOTUS will not over turn RvW.

And you were correct in your assessment.

I want to see federal jurisdiction removed, and give the jurisdiction back to the states. I'll be content with that.

Because it's so much easier to pick off state laws...right?

 

[Natural Citizen]

Because it's so much easier to pick off state laws...right?

Well, I've always been a firm believer at working from the bottom up, rather than from the top down. While everyone else is worried about the national elections and the Supreme Court, I'm more interested in loading up the political offices at the local and State levels. And, of course, that's where and how winning is done. Know what I mean?

People should be trying to get elected or appointed at every local level office. Even if it's Town Treasurer. Doesn't matter what it is. This is how we change the course of history. This is how we influence the laws. Remove federal jurisdiction and we'll take it from there. We've already taken over a minority of office at the local levels all across the country while peope are arguing over apples and oranges at the national level. And over time, we'll take over more local office. The old will move aside for the young, a newly educated youth, yes indeedy. Have you ever witnessed 10,000 screaming youth yelling end the gosh darned Fed? I have. More than a lot of times. And they have not gone away. People just don't hear about them anymore. And that's a wonderful thing. In time...

 

[Lesh]

Because it's so much easier to pick off state laws...right?

Well, I've always been a firm believer at working from the bottom up, rather than from the top down. While everyone else is worried about the national elections and the Supreme Court, I'm more interested in loading up the political offices at the local and State levels. And, of course, that's where and how winning is done. Know what I mean?

People should be trying to get elected or appointed at every local level office. Even if it's Town Treasurer. Doesn't matter what it is. This is how we change the course of history. This is how we influence the laws. Remove federal jurisdiction and we'll take it from there. We've already taken over a minority of office at the local levels all across the country while peope are arguing over apples and oranges at the national level. And over time, we'll take over more local office. The old will move aside for the young, a newly educated youth, yes indeedy. Have you ever witnessed 10,000 screaming youth yelling end the gosh darned Fed? I have. More than a lot of times. And they have not gone away. People just don't hear about them anymore. And that's a wonderful thing. In time...

WHile I agree with that in a general sense...it is NOT protection for Roe.

A biased SCOTUS can essentially outlaw abortion regardless of what the states do