Zone1 Is Long-Wave Infra-Red Radiation Capable of Warming Earth's Oceans?

[Billy_Bob]

In a nutshell, LWIR is incapable of directly warming earth's oceans. (Long Wave Infrared Radiation)

How can this be? It's actually very simple and my friends over at NOAA don't appear to have a grasp on why it cannot happen.

First let's look at the path energy takes from a higher (more excited) molecule to a lower (less excited) molecule. There are two direct methods of energy transfer, radiation and collision. Radiation is the wave of energy propagated outward. Collison is contact transfer of energy.

Anything that can impede these paths can slow or stop energy transfer. This means we must know how each molecule can receive its energy or transmit its energy. In the case of our oceans the WAVELENGTH is imperative to know. How deep into our ocean's energy can penetrate is dependent on its wavelength and the energy it contains.

Below is a graph that shows the Down-Welling Solar Radiation and how it affects our oceans. This is what is generated on the sun. There is overlap between DWSR and LWIR that is generated by the earth's atmosphere (1100nm to 2300nm)

Source: Practical Handbook of Marine Science (routledgehandbooks.com)

The most important thing to look at in this graph is the regions of our oceans that are affected and to what depths they are affected. Does it affect 100m, 10m, 1m, 1cm, or just the surface area? Long Wave Infra-Red radiation starts at about 1.1um and goes out to around 60um. The majority of LWIR is from reradiated energy by the surface or the atmosphere, it does not come from the sun.

This graph above is of Down Welling Solar Radiation and Long Wave Infrared Radiation is to the right as its wavelength is much longer. The next graph shows both the DWSR and LWIR bands of energy. You will also note the eV or energy of oscillations is on the graph below in relation to the wavelength as well. You can see why DWSR will affect the oceans much faster due to the eV (energy) of the wavelength, whereas LWIR has very little energy.

The next thing we are to look at is the ocean and what barriers there are to its absorption. The evaporation layer or 'skin' of the ocean is about 10 microns in depth. The next layer is a thermocline barrier, which is cooler than the skin and is about 150-160 microns in depth. Remember these masses, as it is important to "mixing" due to wave action and what it is capable of.

Below is a graphic I created. It shows the surface of the ocean. I used the molecular version of the evaporative process for a reason. LWIR is so large of a wavelength that it is absolutely absorbed by H2O in the evaporation layer. It is not possible for it to penetrate our oceans beyond the evaporation layer where it is immediately absorbed and removed by water vapor.

The cooler region below the evaporation layer must be warmed if it is to defeat it. This means that the mass of water in the 10-micron region must amass enough energy to warm a region 15 times its size. We could get into the math here but for laymen it is very evident that this cannot warm it. There is simply insufficient energy to warm the mass being emitted from our atmosphere. Evaporation will not allow a buildup of energy in this layer.

Knowing that energy cannot build up in the evaporation layer, it tells us that even with wave mixing of these layers the amount of potential warming is in the margin of being undetectable, if at all. The 'Thermal Surface Layer' (TSL) is the combination of the evaporation layer and the thermocline barrier.

 

[Billy_Bob]

As we are addressing LWIR, there are several sources of it. The big one that everyone is talking about is CO2 and now we add Methane. If we look at my previous post and the emissions graph, you will find that CO2 has three bands of emission, 1.4um, 4.3um, and 14.9um (12-16um). Methane has one around 8um.

If we look at the Ocean penetration graph, we find that anything over 1.1um (1100nm) impacts the surface evaporation layer. There is some overlap of the 1cm into the surface due to ocean make up and salinity issues. However, nothing over 1.4um gets beyond the surface evaporation layer. The layer directly below the evaporation layer, is colder than it is. This thermocline barrier must be defeated before any energy can be transmitted into the depths below it. From this simple assessment alone, you can see that the oceans cannot directly warm from LWIR of any source.

There is the argument of mixing. SO, let's look at this for a moment. The energy from LWIR is being converted into water vapor almost instantaneously. This means the temperature rise associated with LWIR is impeded by the cooling process of evaporation. When we add into this the cold layer just below the evaporation layer and mix them, the amount of remaining energy is insufficient to warm the mass of that layer.

Any gas that emits its energy in LWIR will not affect the mass of the ocean. It cannot. 71-72% of the world is covered in oceans and another 3-5% is covered in lakes and streams. The only way to warm the oceans is for the land to absorb the LWIR and then transmit that energy via collision with the land by water. Warming of the oceans near outlets of rivers is well established but 99.6% of the warming is from Down-Welling Solar Radiation and not LWIR. I would contend that even that number is low as man dumping heated waters from their reclamation plants is causing warming as well.

Let's address rain and the temperature of rain. Rain is either in its collection state or its evaporation state. The range of temperatures is dependent on ambient air temperature, relative humidity of the air mass and rate of evaporation. Near the equator it can be as warm as 87 deg F. Near the 45 deg latitude line you can have ice or 74 deg F. I have not found any studies on rain that would indicate any rise in the range of temperatures or the average for any region.

Let me expand on water (rain fall) for a moment.

When an air mass is warm and heavily laden in water vapor (>60% relative humidity), it will warm. The droplets will become very large and hold energy from the atmosphere. This is how a warm rain fall occurs. The evaporation and cooling are slowed by the level of humidity.

When an air mass is warm but dry (<40% relative humidity) the droplets cool as they are quickly evaporating when they fall.

Rain into the oceans above the equatorial oceans is generally warmer due to the humidity level. Above 30 deg Latitude the humidity levels drop rapidly and so goes the average temperature of the rain which falls.

The key here, how much of a change is occurring in difference from natural variation? Is it warmer or cooler and by how much.

One of the major premises of Anthropogenic Warming is that a hot spot, in our atmosphere, above the equator must form in order for the oceans to warm up through rainfall. It is one of the only ways LWIR can get past the thermocline barrier, the evaporation layer or skin of the oceans. Satellite imagery and thermal analysis demonstrates that this is not occurring.

Source: The Skeptic's Case | Mises Institute

What we are left with is a mathematical query. How much has the rain fall temperatures changed in the last 200 years? Without knowing this we cannot ascertain what the potential warming will be. Given the range we find in the paleo records, the potential energy transfer, due to rain, from increased CO2 levels, is exceedingly small and cannot be discerned from noise in our climatic system.

 

[Billy_Bob]

Supporting studies:

Quote:It is, however, not clear how the greenhouse effect directly affects the ocean's heat uptake in the upper 700 m of the ocean. This is because the penetration depth of IR radiation in water is within submillimeter scales (Figure 1) thereby implying that the incident longwave radiation does not directly heat the layers beyond the top submillimeter of the ocean surface. The objective of this study is therefore to understand and provide an explanation of how increasing levels of anthropogenic GHGs in the atmosphere, which raises the amounts of incident longwave radiation on the ocean surface, causes the upper OHC to rise. Furthermore, at submillimeter scales below the air-sea interface, the mechanism for the transport of heat is through molecular conduction and not by turbulence (e.g., Soloviev & Lukas, 2014). Given the mean vertical temperature gradient of the TSL, heat typically flows from the ocean to the atmosphere, therefore heat from the absorption of longwave radiation will be conducted upward, back to the sea surface. This raises questions about the cause of the observed increase in upper OHC as it suggests that all heat due to the absorption of increased longwave radiation should be concentrated in the upper submillimeter from the interface. We hypothesize that variations in the temperature gradient within the TSL, which is directly affected by the absorption and emission of longwave radiation, modulates the amount of heat loss from the air-sea interface.

The Response of the Ocean Thermal Skin Layer to Variations in Incident Infrared Radiation - Wong - 2018 - Journal of Geophysical Research: Oceans - Wiley Online Library

 

[Billy_Bob]

Wong-2018 postulates, a very minor change, in the phase-change of the evaporation layer, will slow out bound energy from the oceans, causing it to warm.

When we look at the downward solar spectrum, a much more plausible explanation, is a very minor change in the bands of solar output that affect certain areas of the ocean. The whole of 700m is warming not just the very small layer above the thermocline barrier layer. There is simply not enough LWIR energy to create this change in the mass below and the evaporation is still expending the energy in the TSL according to satellite measurements.

Again, what we are left with is rain and DWSR (Down-Welling Solar Radiation). Once again there is no hot spot in the mid-troposphere to create warming of the rain beyond what has been seen in the paleo records. Now we must look at our Sun and what is happening with the fusion reaction on it that is making very minute changes in the bands of solar output.

When we assess river flows, their affects are regional and are dependent on prevailing weather patterns. Again, an area of study that must be completed to determine what our land use changes and use of water for farming and irrigation have done to output temperatures. These temperatures change with the prevailing weather patterns. More study is required to understand the changes from over 100 years ago or more. Until the amount of change from natural flows is determined, the actual effect on the global climate is very hard to ascertain.

In Conclusion:

LWIR cannot directly warm the ocean by emission.
*The radiated wave propagated is too large, to get beyond the skin layer of our oceans.
*The evaporation, which occurs in this layer, impedes the buildup of energy and heat in this layer.
*The cooler layer just below the skin layer is colder than the skin layer. This is a thermocline barrier to downward LWIR energy.
*Mixing of the layers, without an increase in temperature or energy, fails to warm the ocean to any discernable degree.
*Due to the thermal gradient and evaporation, convection is nearly impossible.

LWIR must use another mode to transfer its energy through collision and conduction. Rain is the primary transport mechanism moving energy from LWIR in our atmosphere, into the ocean.
*Without the Mid-Tropospheric hot spot, as postulated by the Catastrophic Anthropogenic Global Warming Hypothesis, rain temperatures cannot increase enough to affect the oceans. It is imperative to find out what the natural cycles and temperatures were in rain fall. Looking at the paleo records, our current temperatures, in rain, are within the range of natural variational cycles. This is one area we must quantify as it changes with latitude and humidity levels.

It remains to be seen what LWIR can actually do to our oceans. Thermal uptake is limited due to the ocean's evaporation layer and the thermocline barrier just below it. The mass of the skin is insufficient to warm the mass of the thermocline barrier even with wind, waves, and mixing. What we are left with is rain and runoff from our continents.

Our global circulation models all fail with 100% certainty. Why? Is the current understanding flawed? Our models generate 10 times more warming than is seen in empirical evidence. Why? Where is this energy miscalculated? Just maybe we need to step back and look at what we believe to be true.

Source posting: Is Long-Wave Infra-Red Capable of Warming Earth's Oceans?

 

[Billy_Bob]

The question remains; Down Welling Solar Radiation or ????? LWIR does not appear to have the ability to warm much of anything over 71-75% of the planet's surface due to ocean waters. IF CO2 and other GHG's, emitting wavelengths that are evaporated away, what is really changing the temperatures of our oceans?

 

[Billy_Bob]

Let's add some clarity to why LWIR is absorbed by the skin of the oceans.

First let's show you the length of the energy wave. Here is a chart of the Electro-Magnetic wave Sprectum.

Source:16.6: The Electromagnetic Spectrum - Physics LibreTexts


The size of the water molecule must allow the energy to pass by it, if it is to penetrate the skin of the ocean. When we look at the comparison between wavelength and molecules sizes, you can see the region of the EM spectrum which can allow penetration of our oceans.

LWIR is much larger than the molecules size so it will impact the surface only. Only wavelengths smaller than 1.1um will penetrate our oceans.

graphic source: How far does light travel in the ocean? {overlay and penetration graph is mine}

As the wavelength gets smaller it also becomes more energetic. If you match the wavelength in the two charts you can see how and why they can penetrate our oceans. Once you get to atomic particles, they can penetrate very deep into the earth's core.

 

[Crick]

In a nutshell, LWIR is incapable of directly warming earth's oceans. (Long Wave Infrared Radiation)

How can this be? It's actually very simple and my friends over at NOAA don't appear to have a grasp on why it cannot happen.

First let's look at the path energy takes from a higher (more excited) molecule to a lower (less excited) molecule. There are two direct methods of energy transfer, radiation and collision. Radiation is the wave of energy propagated outward. Collison is contact transfer of energy.

Anything that can impede these paths can slow or stop energy transfer. This means we must know how each molecule can receive its energy or transmit its energy. In the case of our oceans the WAVELENGTH is imperative to know. How deep into our ocean's energy can penetrate is dependent on its wavelength and the energy it contains.

Below is a graph that shows the Down-Welling Solar Radiation and how it affects our oceans. This is what is generated on the sun. There is overlap between DWSR and LWIR that is generated by the earth's atmosphere (1100nm to 2300nm)

View attachment 746601

Source: Practical Handbook of Marine Science (routledgehandbooks.com)

The most important thing to look at in this graph is the regions of our oceans that are affected and to what depths they are affected. Does it affect 100m, 10m, 1m, 1cm, or just the surface area? Long Wave Infra-Red radiation starts at about 1.1um and goes out to around 60um. The majority of LWIR is from reradiated energy by the surface or the atmosphere, it does not come from the sun.

This graph above is of Down Welling Solar Radiation and Long Wave Infrared Radiation is to the right as its wavelength is much longer. The next graph shows both the DWSR and LWIR bands of energy. You will also note the eV or energy of oscillations is on the graph below in relation to the wavelength as well. You can see why DWSR will affect the oceans much faster due to the eV (energy) of the wavelength, whereas LWIR has very little energy.


View attachment 746605

The next thing we are to look at is the ocean and what barriers there are to its absorption. The evaporation layer or 'skin' of the ocean is about 10 microns in depth. The next layer is a thermocline barrier, which is cooler than the skin and is about 150-160 microns in depth. Remember these masses, as it is important to "mixing" due to wave action and what it is capable of.

Below is a graphic I created. It shows the surface of the ocean. I used the molecular version of the evaporative process for a reason. LWIR is so large of a wavelength that it is absolutely absorbed by H2O in the evaporation layer. It is not possible for it to penetrate our oceans beyond the evaporation layer where it is immediately absorbed and removed by water vapor.

View attachment 746610

The cooler region below the evaporation layer must be warmed if it is to defeat it. This means that the mass of water in the 10-micron region must amass enough energy to warm a region 15 times its size. We could get into the math here but for laymen it is very evident that this cannot warm it. There is simply insufficient energy to warm the mass being emitted from our atmosphere. Evaporation will not allow a buildup of energy in this layer.

Knowing that energy cannot build up in the evaporation layer, it tells us that even with wave mixing of these layers the amount of potential warming is in the margin of being undetectable, if at all. The 'Thermal Surface Layer' (TSL) is the combination of the evaporation layer and the thermocline barrier.

From your handy link:

The additional energy from the absorption of increasing IR radiation adjusts the curvature of the TSL such that the upward conduction of heat from the bulk of the ocean into the TSL is reduced. --https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/2017JC013351

 

[Billy_Bob]

From your handy link:

The additional energy from the absorption of increasing IR radiation adjusts the curvature of the TSL such that the upward conduction of heat from the bulk of the ocean into the TSL is reduced. --https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/2017JC013351

But what is causing this.? And is it sufficient to credit the warming see with? That paper says no.

 

[Crick]

As we are addressing LWIR, there are several sources of it. The big one that everyone is talking about is CO2 and now we add Methane. If we look at my previous post and the emissions graph, you will find that CO2 has three bands of emission, 1.4um, 4.3um, and 14.9um (12-16um). Methane has one around 8um.

If we look at the Ocean penetration graph, we find that anything over 1.1um (1100nm) impacts the surface evaporation layer. There is some overlap of the 1cm into the surface due to ocean make up and salinity issues. However, nothing over 1.4um gets beyond the surface evaporation layer. The layer directly below the evaporation layer, is colder than it is. This thermocline barrier must be defeated before any energy can be transmitted into the depths below it. From this simple assessment alone, you can see that the oceans cannot directly warm from LWIR of any source.

There is the argument of mixing. SO, let's look at this for a moment. The energy from LWIR is being converted into water vapor almost instantaneously. This means the temperature rise associated with LWIR is impeded by the cooling process of evaporation. When we add into this the cold layer just below the evaporation layer and mix them, the amount of remaining energy is insufficient to warm the mass of that layer.

Any gas that emits its energy in LWIR will not affect the mass of the ocean. It cannot. 71-72% of the world is covered in oceans and another 3-5% is covered in lakes and streams. The only way to warm the oceans is for the land to absorb the LWIR and then transmit that energy via collision with the land by water. Warming of the oceans near outlets of rivers is well established but 99.6% of the warming is from Down-Welling Solar Radiation and not LWIR. I would contend that even that number is low as man dumping heated waters from their reclamation plants is causing warming as well.

Let's address rain and the temperature of rain. Rain is either in its collection state or its evaporation state. The range of temperatures is dependent on ambient air temperature, relative humidity of the air mass and rate of evaporation. Near the equator it can be as warm as 87 deg F. Near the 45 deg latitude line you can have ice or 74 deg F. I have not found any studies on rain that would indicate any rise in the range of temperatures or the average for any region.

Let me expand on water (rain fall) for a moment.

When an air mass is warm and heavily laden in water vapor (>60% relative humidity), it will warm. The droplets will become very large and hold energy from the atmosphere. This is how a warm rain fall occurs. The evaporation and cooling are slowed by the level of humidity.

When an air mass is warm but dry (<40% relative humidity) the droplets cool as they are quickly evaporating when they fall.

Rain into the oceans above the equatorial oceans is generally warmer due to the humidity level. Above 30 deg Latitude the humidity levels drop rapidly and so goes the average temperature of the rain which falls.

The key here, how much of a change is occurring in difference from natural variation? Is it warmer or cooler and by how much.

One of the major premises of Anthropogenic Warming is that a hot spot, in our atmosphere, above the equator must form in order for the oceans to warm up through rainfall. It is one of the only ways LWIR can get past the thermocline barrier, the evaporation layer or skin of the oceans. Satellite imagery and thermal analysis demonstrates that this is not occurring.

View attachment 746613

View attachment 746612

Source: The Skeptic's Case | Mises Institute

What we are left with is a mathematical query. How much has the rain fall temperatures changed in the last 200 years? Without knowing this we cannot ascertain what the potential warming will be. Given the range we find in the paleo records, the potential energy transfer, due to rain, from increased CO2 levels, is exceedingly small and cannot be discerned from noise in our climatic system.

I will again criticize your sources. Mises Institute is an extreme right wing entity devoted to the economic theories of Ludwig von Mises, a man who was so far out to the right that the Koch brothers refused to get involved with his work. This crap was most certainly never peer reviewed. In the third sentence of his profile, the author, David M. W. Evans, writes " The area of human endeavor with the most experience and sophistication in dealing with feedbacks and analyzing complex systems is electrical engineering, and the most crucial and disputed aspects of understanding the climate system are the feedbacks." If that isn't a stretch with an aim I don't know what is. What he is attempting to obscure, of course, is that he likely knows almost nothing of atmospheric physics, thermodynamics, climatology or any other topic that would actually inform him on the topic he's taken up here.

 

[justoffal]

I will again criticize your sources. Mises Institute is an extreme right wing entity devoted to the economic theories of Ludwig von Mises, a man who was so far out to the right that the Koch brothers refused to get involved with his work. This crap was most certainly never peer reviewed. In the third sentence of his profile, the author, David M. W. Evans, writes " The area of human endeavor with the most experience and sophistication in dealing with feedbacks and analyzing complex systems is electrical engineering, and the most crucial and disputed aspects of understanding the climate system are the feedbacks." If that isn't a stretch with an aim I don't know what is. What he is attempting to obscure, of course, is that he likely knows almost nothing of atmospheric physics, thermodynamics, climatology or any other topic that would actually inform him on the topic he's taken up here.

Too many words and not enough science. The Sun is moment by moment becoming more energetic.
Regardless of all the dancing you do there is no way to prevent the Earth from absorbing more energy from the primary source. Humans can probably do a very small amount by making some existential adjustments but that will be extremely small. In the final analysis it cannot be stopped and most likely not even slowed down. The Earth will warm, the oceans will evaporate and all life on this planet will cease. This is undisputable.

Jo

 

[CrusaderFrank]

I never understood how atmospheric CO2 was heating the ocean 700m deep. Also, doesn’t it take waaaaaaaaaay more energy to heat water than air?

 

[Billy_Bob]

I never understood how atmospheric CO2 was heating the ocean 700m deep. Also, doesn’t it take waaaaaaaaaay more energy to heat water than air?

CO2 is not heating anything below the evaporation layer. It can't do it. Only downwelling solar radiation can heat the ocean to depths of 700m. It takes 4 times as much energy to heat one cm^2 water than it does to heat air.

 

[Billy_Bob]

I will again criticize your sources. Mises Institute is an extreme right wing entity devoted to the economic theories of Ludwig von Mises, a man who was so far out to the right that the Koch brothers refused to get involved with his work. This crap was most certainly never peer reviewed. In the third sentence of his profile, the author, David M. W. Evans, writes " The area of human endeavor with the most experience and sophistication in dealing with feedbacks and analyzing complex systems is electrical engineering, and the most crucial and disputed aspects of understanding the climate system are the feedbacks." If that isn't a stretch with an aim I don't know what is. What he is attempting to obscure, of course, is that he likely knows almost nothing of atmospheric physics, thermodynamics, climatology or any other topic that would actually inform him on the topic he's taken up here.

feedbacks.... they are not hard to understand. LWIR is not creating the latent heat in the atmosphere to create warming. Your feedback failure is well documented and even Dr Evans could see it.

 

[Crick]

But what is causing this.? And is it sufficient to credit the warming see with? That paper says no.

Bullpucky. The Conclusion of the paper at your link says:

The additional energy generated from the absorption of IR radiation has been shown to support the change in the TSL temperature gradient. Our results indicate the mean curvature of the TSL has adjusted such that the gradient at the bottom boundary of the TSL adjusts from a higher to lower gradient. This was established through the lack of correlation between LWin@zenith with ΔTskin-5m and LWout indicating that the absorption of LWin@zenith is independent of ΔTskin-subskin and the correlation observed between LWin@zenith with ΔT0.1mm and ΔT0.1mm/ΔT5m which illustrates that more of the TSL profile exists within the EM skin layer's emission depth of ∼0.1 mm as LWin@zenith increases.

Our findings provide an explanation of the mechanism for retaining upper ocean heat content as the incident IR radiation increases. The absorption of increased longwave has been deduced to compress vertically the curvature of the TSL, with a higher gradient forming close to the interface and a lower gradient at subskin depths. The smaller vertical gradient at subskin depths impedes the transfer of heat from the mixed layer into the TSL. Because the heat sink at the interface does not change measurably on the scales of our individual measurements, this means that less heat from the mixed layer contributes to the loss of heat at the interface. This analysis was based on the immediate changes of the TSL to the heat fluxes due to the instantaneous response of the TSL. Greater downwelling infrared forcing would alter the upper ocean heat budget by adjusting the TSL such that more heat beneath the TSL, resulting from the absorption of solar radiation, is retained. This thus provides an explanation for the indirect heating of the ocean by increasing levels of incident infrared radiation and the observed increase in upper ocean heat content.

 

[Delldude]

I will again criticize your sources. Mises Institute is an extreme right wing entity devoted to the economic theories of Ludwig von Mises, a man who was so far out to the right that the Koch brothers refused to get involved with his work. This crap was most certainly never peer reviewed. In the third sentence of his profile, the author, David M. W. Evans, writes " The area of human endeavor with the most experience and sophistication in dealing with feedbacks and analyzing complex systems is electrical engineering, and the most crucial and disputed aspects of understanding the climate system are the feedbacks." If that isn't a stretch with an aim I don't know what is. What he is attempting to obscure, of course, is that he likely knows almost nothing of atmospheric physics, thermodynamics, climatology or any other topic that would actually inform him on the topic he's taken up here.

I'd suggest you stop with the RW bullshit and examine the total data.

 

[Stryder50]

Then there is this, coming from the other direction;
...
Our Earth's evolution has been greatly determined by the history of heat transfer from the deep interior through the crust and to the land surface and seabed by means of the fundamental process of plate tectonics, thermal conduction through the rigid lithospheric mantle, convection in the deeper ductile mantle and by hotspot volcanism. Heatflow is determined by measuring the temperature increase with depth to determine the thermal gradient. The outward heatflow is is the product of the thermal gradient and the measured conductivity of the substate. In the case of the ocean floor, the gradient is obtained by inserting electrical thermometers attached to a long pipe driven downward by a heavy weight. The conductivity is measured on the sediments recovered from inside the pipe.

Ocean floor measured heatflow spans the range of 0-250 milliwatts per square meter (mW/m²) and the thermal gradient varies from 10 to 80 degrees Celcius per kilometer (°C/km).

Ocean floor heatflow is highest near the crest (axis) of the mid-ocean ridges where the ocean crust is youngest, the lithoshere beneath is thin and the interior mantle is its warmest. The lithosphere cools as it ages during its transport away from the ridge axis by seafloor spreading. Average heatflow is greater than 100 mW/m² for ocean floor younger than 10 million years. However, the variability in measured heatflow is quite large for young seafloor, because a significant amount of heat escapes from our planet's interor not by conduction through the crust and sediment cover, but via springs of heated seawater called hydrothermal vents.


Heatflow decreases away from the axis of the mid-ocean ridges in proportion to the square root of the age of the crust. The seafloor deepens in the same relationship. These observations support a half-space model in which the lithosphere behaves as a cooling boundary layer where heat only escapes through the top of the layer.
...

Ocean Floor Heatflow

 

[Billy_Bob]

Bullpucky. The Conclusion of the paper at your link says:

The additional energy generated from the absorption of IR radiation has been shown to support the change in the TSL temperature gradient. Our results indicate the mean curvature of the TSL has adjusted such that the gradient at the bottom boundary of the TSL adjusts from a higher to lower gradient. This was established through the lack of correlation between LWin@zenith with ΔTskin-5m and LWout indicating that the absorption of LWin@zenith is independent of ΔTskin-subskin and the correlation observed between LWin@zenith with ΔT0.1mm and ΔT0.1mm/ΔT5m which illustrates that more of the TSL profile exists within the EM skin layer's emission depth of ∼0.1 mm as LWin@zenith increases.

Our findings provide an explanation of the mechanism for retaining upper ocean heat content as the incident IR radiation increases. The absorption of increased longwave has been deduced to compress vertically the curvature of the TSL, with a higher gradient forming close to the interface and a lower gradient at subskin depths. The smaller vertical gradient at subskin depths impedes the transfer of heat from the mixed layer into the TSL. Because the heat sink at the interface does not change measurably on the scales of our individual measurements, this means that less heat from the mixed layer contributes to the loss of heat at the interface. This analysis was based on the immediate changes of the TSL to the heat fluxes due to the instantaneous response of the TSL. Greater downwelling infrared forcing would alter the upper ocean heat budget by adjusting the TSL such that more heat beneath the TSL, resulting from the absorption of solar radiation, is retained. This thus provides an explanation for the indirect heating of the ocean by increasing levels of incident infrared radiation and the observed increase in upper ocean heat content.

It is their hypothesis. It is, as yet, unproven.

Tell me how LWIR can defeat the thermocline barrier when no heat can build up to overcome the colder layer? Where is your increased energy coming from? IT is not from LWIR.

When we look at their "throttling" of heat release in the TSL, "

the heat sink at the interface does not change measurably on the scales of our individual measurements, this means that less heat from the mixed layer contributes to the loss of heat at the interface."

It becomes apparent that they cannot quantify what is being stopped. They have NO IDEA if it is being stopped or how it is being stopped. What they did determine was that LWIR wasn't making it past the evaporation layer.

It is, however, not clear how the greenhouse effect directly affects the ocean's heat uptake in the upper 700 m of the ocean. This is because the penetration depth of IR radiation in water is within submillimeter scales (Figure 1) thereby implying that the incident longwave radiation does not directly heat the layers beyond the top submillimeter of the ocean surface.

Sorry Crick but you have missed the points they made in the conclusion. IF the heat is not coming from our atmosphere, it can only come from the sun.

 

[Billy_Bob]

Then there is this, coming from the other direction;
...
Our Earth's evolution has been greatly determined by the history of heat transfer from the deep interior through the crust and to the land surface and seabed by means of the fundamental process of plate tectonics, thermal conduction through the rigid lithospheric mantle, convection in the deeper ductile mantle and by hotspot volcanism. Heatflow is determined by measuring the temperature increase with depth to determine the thermal gradient. The outward heatflow is is the product of the thermal gradient and the measured conductivity of the substate. In the case of the ocean floor, the gradient is obtained by inserting electrical thermometers attached to a long pipe driven downward by a heavy weight. The conductivity is measured on the sediments recovered from inside the pipe.

Ocean floor measured heatflow spans the range of 0-250 milliwatts per square meter (mW/m²) and the thermal gradient varies from 10 to 80 degrees Celcius per kilometer (°C/km).

Ocean floor heatflow is highest near the crest (axis) of the mid-ocean ridges where the ocean crust is youngest, the lithoshere beneath is thin and the interior mantle is its warmest. The lithosphere cools as it ages during its transport away from the ridge axis by seafloor spreading. Average heatflow is greater than 100 mW/m² for ocean floor younger than 10 million years. However, the variability in measured heatflow is quite large for young seafloor, because a significant amount of heat escapes from our planet's interor not by conduction through the crust and sediment cover, but via springs of heated seawater called hydrothermal vents.


Heatflow decreases away from the axis of the mid-ocean ridges in proportion to the square root of the age of the crust. The seafloor deepens in the same relationship. These observations support a half-space model in which the lithosphere behaves as a cooling boundary layer where heat only escapes through the top of the layer.
...

Ocean Floor Heatflow

You will get areas of flow, like a river. It would take a lot of volcanic activity to make a small dent in the warmth of our oceans. In the last 20 years we found out that Antarctica has major volcanic activity under it. Even that hasn't made a dent in the overall water temperature of the region.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

Does this mean we must continue to destroy the economy?

 

[Billy_Bob]

Does this mean we must continue to destroy the economy?

NO... It does not... Only stupid people will continue to destroy themselves and their economy for the AGW lie.