Interesting argument against the Ground Zero Mosque

[Modbert]

because you were saying that
'you have now changed
you confronted conhog even when HE said it was radical islam
YOU have now seen the light and are saying the same thing

No, I'm not. Conhog and I are making two separately different points. What happened at first is I worded it poorly to be honest. When I said Islam had nothing to do with 9/11, I'm talking about the regular muslims who practice it daily. I decided to word it better since you weren't getting my point.

 

[007]

It wasn't Islam that killed 3,000+ people that day. It was 19 cowards who carried out that act.

It was Radical Islam, not sure why you're saying I'm saying it wasn't involved at this point.

Wha...

 

[DiveCon]

because you were saying that
'you have now changed
you confronted conhog even when HE said it was radical islam
YOU have now seen the light and are saying the same thing

No, I'm not. Conhog and I are making two separately different points. What happened at first is I worded it poorly to be honest. When I said Islam had nothing to do with 9/11, I'm talking about the regular muslims who practice it daily. I decided to word it better since you weren't getting my point.

yes, you did change

 

[DiveCon]

Heard in interesting theory on FoxNews last night though, one of the guests, I don't remember which, said it will never be built, the claim was that no no banks would finance, permits would get lost in paperwork and unions would drag their feet if they even agreed to do any work at all. I'd love to see that happen actually.

If we start shredding our constitution, especially the first amendment because of what happened on 9/11, then Osama Bin Laden is going to get partly of exactly what he wanted.

now this^^^^ i can agree with

 

[Modbert]

In the name of islam, shouting "ALLAH AKBAR" as the planes smashed into the twin towers.

Okay? So they're going to blame 1.3-1.5 billion people for the action of 19? That doesn't sound the least bit idiotic in your mind?

 

[007]

i do not oppose this Islamic center being built, you can not blame 1.3 billion people for the actions of a few

Yes I can blame them, when they don't scream from the roof tops in denunciation of such actions. Fact of the matter is, islam is such a violent religion that if a muslim ever did speak out against their own islamist terrorists, they'd get their head sawed off. islam is a violent, merciless, BLOODY religion.

but for bert to be saying that Islam wasn't involved in this terrorist attack is just plain FALSE

I agree.

Rauf has LOUDLY spoken out against Radical Islamic terrorism.

Repeatedly.

Whoop-dee-doo... and American born, convert, basketball player.

 

[Modbert]

It wasn't Islam that killed 3,000+ people that day. It was 19 cowards who carried out that act.

It was Radical Islam, not sure why you're saying I'm saying it wasn't involved at this point.

Wha...

There is a difference between Islam and Radical Islam. You are not separating the two.

 

[hjmick]

This is merely one step in the process. There is still much work before this center is built. It may take them years to even hire a construction firm, if they can find one willing to do the work. Of course, if they can't I imagine they would sue...

I wonder if the Imam and his followers would protest if someone decided to open a rib joint next door...

Perhaps a dog grooming business...

A gay bar...

How tolerant would they be?

 

[Modbert]

yes, you did change

Listen, I'm not going to debate whether I changed or not Dive. You know why? I've been here almost two years now, and I've discussed this topic more times than I care to count. Simple as that.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

This is merely one step in the process. There is still much work before this center is built. It may take them years to even hire a construction firm, if they can find one willing to do the work. Of course, if they can't I imagine they would sue...

I wonder if the Imam and his followers would protest if someone decided to open a rib joint next door...

Perhaps a dog grooming business...

A gay bar...

How tolerant would they be?

Seeing as how there's already a strip club on the corner, I doubt they'd really care. Perhaps all Muslims are not as dogmatic as you believe?

 

[007]

In the name of islam, shouting "ALLAH AKBAR" as the planes smashed into the twin towers.

Okay? So they're going to blame 1.3-1.5 billion people for the action of 19? That doesn't sound the least bit idiotic in your mind?

Don't try and make it sound as though there only 19 islamo facist jihadist in the world, and they all died on 9/11. The religion is full of cold blooded killer terrorists who have vowed to the death to kill the infidels... "US."

So you think it's a good idea for them to build a shrine to themselves right on top of the largest, cold blooded, killing of innocent men, women and children in the history of the United States of America is a good thing? That doesn't sound the least bit idiotic in your mind?

 

[Kat]

So, Let me start by saying I am not making this argument. I heard someone make it today and wanted to know what others thought of it as I found it rather compelling.

Note (I am personally leaning towards being oppose to the mosque being built where they want. But do not think we have a legal means to stop it, and would not support a non legal means)


The argument is that Islam has a tradition of building mosques on sites they have concurred. Now I do not even know it that is true. I mean we all know about the dome of the rock in Israel, but is this something they do all the time? Is it tradition to build mosques on the sites of some victory? If so how do you feel about the Mosque held in that light?

My personal Leaning towards being against it has to do with the loss of life at Ground Zero, The planned Mosques proximity to it, and the fact that the building they want to tear down actually had the landing gear of one of the planes that hit the WTC crash into it. That is How close it is to the site. I feel like they could build it just a few more blocks away and it will alleviate most of the angst about it. I feel that if this mosque and community center is really about reaching out to us, then they should respect the feelings of almost 70% of Americans and build it somewhere else. After all how can you reach out when you are doing something that many Americans are against?

We allow Mosques to be build all over the country, so this is not about discrimination, it is about the site, and the history of it.

However all that said, like I said I do not see any legal way left to stop it, and would not support any non legal way, So while I am personally opposed to it, I recognize their right to build it.

Yes. It is a tradition to build a mosque on the grounds they conquer.

Watch the video


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjS0Novt3X4]YouTube - ‪No mosque at Ground Zero‬‎[/ame]

 

[ConHog]

i do not oppose this Islamic center being built, you can not blame 1.3 billion people for the actions of a few

Yes I can blame them, when they don't scream from the roof tops in denunciation of such actions. Fact of the matter is, islam is such a violent religion that if a muslim ever did speak out against their own islamist terrorists, they'd get their head sawed off. islam is a violent, merciless, BLOODY religion.

but for bert to be saying that Islam wasn't involved in this terrorist attack is just plain FALSE

I agree.

Rauf has LOUDLY spoken out against Radical Islamic terrorism.

Repeatedly.

Read his book, Seriously, read the book he wrote for Muslims.

 

[Modbert]

Don't try and make it sound as though there only 19 islamo facist jihadist in the world, and they all died on 9/11. The religion is full of cold blooded killer terrorists.

So you think it's a good idea for them to build a shrine to themselves right on top of the largest, cold blooded, killing of innocent men, women and children in the history of the United States of America is a good thing? That doesn't sound the least bit idiotic in your mind?

I never said there was only 19 Muslims who have similar views to the hijackers. What I'm saying is you want to label every single Muslim out there, whether they be innocent or guilty of such thought.

You seem to think every muslim is a terrorist and my evidence is the comment I bolded.

You're on here often enough Pale, talking about how much you think Obama is destroying America and the Constitution. Yet, in this case, you are the one who is more than willing to tear up the Constitution because it gets in the way of your agenda. Let's put it this way, you're acting no better than what you accuse Obama of.

 

[ConHog]

In the name of islam, shouting "ALLAH AKBAR" as the planes smashed into the twin towers.

Okay? So they're going to blame 1.3-1.5 billion people for the action of 19? That doesn't sound the least bit idiotic in your mind?

Don't try and make it sound as though there only 19 islamo facist jihadist in the world, and they all died on 9/11. The religion is full of cold blooded killer terrorists who have vowed to the death to kill the infidels... "US."

So you think it's a good idea for them to build a shrine to themselves right on top of the largest, cold blooded, killing of innocent men, women and children in the history of the United States of America is a good thing? That doesn't sound the least bit idiotic in your mind?

This just in:

Nazi party announces plans to open bakery 1/2 mile from Auschwitz. It is meant to celebrate all those peaceful NAZIs who were against the Holocaust.

 

[007]

It wasn't Islam that killed 3,000+ people that day. It was 19 cowards who carried out that act.

It was Radical Islam, not sure why you're saying I'm saying it wasn't involved at this point.

Wha...

There is a difference between Islam and Radical Islam. You are not separating the two.

No, it's like two identical cars sitting side by side. One is blue and the other is red, but they're still both the same car.

islam is islam is islam, pure and simple. Dissecting them for the sake of defending them really doesn't work. It's still islam.

 

[ConHog]

Bert, why have you conveniently ignored a couple facts here?

A) You claimed McVeigh was a Christian terrorist, I provided evidence that you were wrong

B) You claimed that there are as many Christian terrorists and Muslim terrorists, I presented evidence that you are wrong

C) You claimed that a shinto shrine was built 5 miles from Pearl Harbor and I presented proof that the shrine was in fact there before the military installation, let alone prior to the Dec 7 attack.

 

[Modbert]

This just in:

Nazi party announces plans to open bakery 1/2 mile from Auschwitz. It is meant to celebrate all those peaceful NAZIs who were against the Holocaust.

So you equate the Nazis with Muslims?

 

[B. Kidd]

It wasn't Islam that killed 3,000+ people that day. It was 19 cowards who carried out that act.

It was Radical Islam, not sure why you're saying I'm saying it wasn't involved at this point.

Wha...

There is a difference between Islam and Radical Islam. You are not separating the two.

Since you've been here two years, and discussed this subject exhaustively, you should be an expert.
Please tell me the main differences between a moderate Muslim and a radical Muslim. Really, I don't know.
Teach me.

 

[007]

Okay? So they're going to blame 1.3-1.5 billion people for the action of 19? That doesn't sound the least bit idiotic in your mind?

Don't try and make it sound as though there only 19 islamo facist jihadist in the world, and they all died on 9/11. The religion is full of cold blooded killer terrorists who have vowed to the death to kill the infidels... "US."

So you think it's a good idea for them to build a shrine to themselves right on top of the largest, cold blooded, killing of innocent men, women and children in the history of the United States of America is a good thing? That doesn't sound the least bit idiotic in your mind?

This just in:

Nazi party announces plans to open bakery 1/2 mile from Auschwitz. It is meant to celebrate all those peaceful NAZIs who were against the Holocaust.

Makes every bit as much sense as building a mosque at ground zero.

I'M ALL FOR IT! YES, SEE HOW TOLERANT I AM NOW? NOW I'M PERFECT, AND THE POLITICALLY CORRECT CROWD WILL GIVE ME AN AWARD.