Zone1 I'm Having An Issue With A Part Of The Bible

[notmyfault2020]

No, I meant 'effect'. However, a more correct wording would have been 'effected'. (consequence to all vs make a difference to)

No, I am correct. You meant Affect but said Effect

however, it is not something I will argue about all day long

 

[notmyfault2020]

He is right. Praying to Mary is idolatry.

thanks for accusing me of idolatry.

sheez

Protestants are so abusive

 

[Meriweather]

No, I am correct. You meant Affect but said Effect

So now you know my intent (that I put in parenthesis) better than I. Shrug. I formed the sentence poorly, but 'effect' is definitely my intent. If you want to substitute 'affect' for yourself, go right ahead. I see Adam and Eve and Christ's life, death and resurrection having an effect, not just affecting our lives on earth. You may see both as just affecting us, and I have no quarrel with that. Just don't tell me how I see it. Thank you.

 

[SweetSue92]

Any non-Trinitarian scriptural analysis would be flippantly dismissed as a "dump of words", since it doesn't matter to you what the evidence supports. I'm not going to get too academic here, if at all. I speak from the Spirit of YHWH.

A number of respected trinitarian scholars have admitted that the literal translation of Jn 1:1c is actually "And the Word was a god":

W. E. Vine - "a god was the Word" - p. 490, An Expository Dictionary of the New Testament.

C. H. Dodd - "The Word was a god" - Technical Papers for the Bible Translator, Jan., 1977.

Murray J. Harris - "the Word was a god" - p. 60, Jesus as God, Baker Book House, 1992.

Robert Young - "and a God (i.e. a Divine Being) was the Word" - Young's Concise Critical Bible Commentary.

W. E. Vine, Prof. C. H. Dodd (Director of the New English Bible project), and Murray J. Harris admit that this ("the Word was a god") is the literal translation, but, being Trinitarians, they insist that it be interpreted and translated as "and the Word was God." Why? Because they're Trinitarians. At least they were honest enough to admit that grammatically, it literally reads "a god".

Ernest Cadman Colwell a Trinitarian scholar writes:

"The opening verse of John’s Gospel contains one of the many passages where this rule suggests the translation of a predicate as a definite noun. Καὶ θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος [Kaì theòs ên ho lógos] looks much more like "And the Word was God" than "And the Word was divine" when viewed with reference to this rule. The absence of the article does not make the predicate indefinite or qualitative when it precedes the verb, it is indefinite in this position only when the context demands it."

The context does demand it. The Word is with The God, hence the Word is clearly not The God he is with or before (as in the presence of a superior or King with one of His subjects facing Him, standing or kneeling ). Hello?

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The ark of the covenant has the "Triune Godhead" at the crown, the mercy seat. Before Satan's rebellion, he was there with the 1st born. The light bearer, at the right hand of the Archangel (Sar Gadol - High Prince, Daniel 12:1). One of the many names and titles of the firstborn is "Mika'El". This name is a question, for all of the armies of heaven. The firstborn, The Word, Yeshua, asks the legions of heaven "MIKA'EL?". WHO IS LIKE GOD? It's not Satan and his fallen armies, it's Him, the First Born, The Son of The Living God. He is MIKA'EL, the One Who Is Like God to Israel. He is The Angel Of YHWH who bears THE NAME, YAHWEH. No one in heaven bears The Name like Him. He is special, unique, the exemplary one, the divine Son Par Excellence, the one who sits on the throne of YHWH. Both Him and Lucifer, were before the presence of YHWH The Father, who is INFINITE LIGHT, LIFE, TRUTH, LOVE, POWER, GLORY. THE NON-CONTINGENT, ETERNAL SOURCE. HE IS, REALITY ITSELF, WITH ALL OF ITS LAWS. PURE EXISTENCE IS GOOD. RIGHTEOUS. THAT IS YAHWEH, THE INFINITE FATHER/SOURCE.

Lucifer felt he was more worthy than the First Born, to sit on YHWH's throne, so he rebelled. He convinced billions of angels to fight for him and the rebels lost the war. Those thought forms or "angels", who were once immortal holy heavenly spirits, were cast into a "black hole" ( a dark, cosmic, mental gravity well that leads to death). This universe is the tree of knowledge of good and evil. We sought knowledge, and wisdom, without YHWH GOD or His First Born. We are in the forbidden tree of pride, seeking knowledge and power free of YHWH's life and law. Hence our deplorable state.

Many of them were fractured, hence we get the story of Adam naming the animals, giving them their nature or names. This is all a parable. They were naked, then they received the animal skins. You're reading a symbolic representation of what occurred during that war that we fought against Yahweh and His Son. We are all fallen ones here.

The Archangel, the first born of YHWH, loved us so much, that He was willing to sacrifice Himself, to save a bunch of fallen, rebel angels. He came down into the abyss, to save us. Thanks to Him, we will all be resurrected on the day of judgment. His disciples are the only ones who don't have to suffer in the grave or contend with the torments and enticements of demonic spirits.

All other human beings are summoned by Satan and enticed to serve Him as a demonic, familiar spirit. Death is sleep, being unconscious, until a living person, be it the witch of Endor who summoned Samuel, waking him up and drawing him from Sheol i.e. the realm of the dead, or be it Satan and his fallen ones, summoning a dead human soul from its sleep, people will be tested by Satan even in their graves. They will be offered a deal they can't refuse, and that is, to remain awake, "alive" in his service until the day of reckoning. There will be a last battle between the forces of Satan and the First Born. Those who choose to be demons in Satan's service will be defeated and condemned to the lake of fire or the second death, from which there is no return. The second death, unlike the first one, is permanent. There's no more redemption in the lake of fire.

Yeshua i.e. Jesus, is the incarnation of the Archangel and First Born. He defeats Satan by becoming a little lamb, consigned to a mortal life of suffering and sacrifice. Death had no authority over Him because unlike us, HE IS PERFECT! He kept The Law, flawlessly, without error. Not one sin or injustice. He paid the ransom, for you and me to return to the family of YHWH, becoming One With Him Again. We can be holy again in Christ Our Lord and King.

Rev_3:21 He that overcometh, I will give to him to sit down with me in my throne, as I also overcame, and sat down with my Father in his throne.

Rev_3:5 He that overcometh shall thus be arrayed in white garments, and I will in no wise blot his name out of the book of life, and I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

Rev_14:1 And I saw, and behold, the Lamb standing on the mount Zion, and with him a hundred and forty and four thousand, having his name, and the name of his Father, written on their foreheads.

So in your estimation. Every time the word God occurs in Greek without an article, it should be interpreted as "a god"?

Huh.

 

[BS Filter]

Paul gave you the son of god garbage as he needed to convert the Romans with some Superman story.

Just stick to the basic story of Jesus being an above average guy and you will not be far wrong.

Same comment re. The Trinity .

Just story telling .

Father Xmas for the kids and Jesus Son of God for gullible adult Sheeple .

Jesus is God. The Scriptures confirm it all through the Bible, old and new testament.

 

[Red Front]

So in your estimation. Every time the word God occurs in Greek without an article, it should be interpreted as "a god"?

Huh.

No, there are exceptions. John 1:1 is clearly not one of them for the reason I mentioned in that post. Are you going to make me repeat myself? Do you believe the Logos/Word, is The God who he is before or in the presence of? Do you believe the Son is the Father? Aren't they distinct? To translate that as "The Word (The Son) was with The God (The Father) and The Word was The God (The Father), is incorrect. The Word or the Son is simply divine, a god. Of the category of divinity, but that doesn't imply that the Son is co-equal, co-eternal, or consubstantial with YHWH, The God who the Son is with or before (in the presence of). The context clearly indicates that The Word/The Son is a god/divinity. Angels who are in communion with YHWH, are divine, immortal, holy spirits. They are "Sons of Elohim", which means that they are of the category of Elohim. Divinities.

 

[notmyfault2020]

So now you know my intent (that I put in parenthesis) better than I. Shrug. I formed the sentence poorly, but 'effect' is definitely my intent. If you want to substitute 'affect' for yourself, go right ahead. I see Adam and Eve and Christ's life, death and resurrection having an effect, not just affecting our lives on earth. You may see both as just affecting us, and I have no quarrel with that. Just don't tell me how I see it. Thank you.

In every instance of your use of the word Effect, the proper word is Affect. I double check by re-reading your post

It is human nature to not want to ever be wrong. But it's OK... really, it is..

I know words but cannot rebuild an engine... always admired those who can... Everyone has their own talents and interests and etc.. no need to feel bad because you are better at one thing than another or what the heck ever...

 

[surada]

No, there are exceptions. John 1:1 is clearly not one of them for the reason I mentioned in that post. Are you going to make me repeat myself? Do you believe the Logos/Word, is The God who he is before or in the presence of? Do you believe the Son is the Father? Aren't they distinct? To translate that as "The Word (The Son) was with The God (The Father) and The Word was The God (The Father), is incorrect. The Word or the Son is simply divine, a god. Of the category of divinity, but that doesn't imply that the Son is co-equal, co-eternal, or consubstantial with YHWH, The God who the Son is with or before (in the presence of). The context clearly indicates that The Word/The Son is a god/divinity. Angels who are in communion with YHWH, are divine, immortal, holy spirits. They are "Sons of Elohim", which means that they are of the category of Elohim. Divinities.

El and elohim are Canaanite terms in their pantheon. See Ugarit texts.. the scriptures evolved from earlier cultures around them.

 

[GMCGeneral]

thanks for accusing me of idolatry.

sheez

Protestants are so abusive

Protestants are right. Sola scriptura.

 

[surada]

Protestants are right. Sola scriptura.

And they often fiddle with scripture.

 

[notmyfault2020]

And they often fiddle with scripture.

often?

all the time.

Frankly, I get fed up with both camps frequently. But hey... Jesus said there'd be days like this

"You will be hated by all because of My Name"

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

Nope. I told you the Catholic Church was founded by Simon Magus. Yes,

You just called the Church Christ founded a Whore

I think I'm done w/ you

thanks for accusing me of idolatry.

sheez

Protestants are so abusive

And you said there are no christians outside of your church

 

[surada]

Nope. I told you the Catholic Church was founded by Simon Magus. Yes,



And you said there are no christians outside of your church

The Fall and Rise of Simon Magus

www.baslibrary.org

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

Do you believe the Son is the Father? Aren't they distinct?

Again, the Scriptures tell us a husband and wife are "one flesh," while being two distinct individuals. The Father and the "Word" are ONE but two distinct individuals.

He revealed Himself as the God of the OT.
Among His many purposes on this earth was to REVEAL His Father in heaven

REVEAL means we didn't know about the Father before Christ came.

 

[BS Filter]

So in your estimation. Every time the word God occurs in Greek without an article, it should be interpreted as "a god"?

Huh.

That's copy and paste from a jehovah witness site. It's bullshit. They will look you right in the eye and lie about Scripture.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

That's copy and paste from a jehovah witness site. It's bullshit. They will look you right in the eye and lie about Scripture.

Jesus says several places in the Bible he is not his father. Was he lying?

 

[BS Filter]

No, there are exceptions. John 1:1 is clearly not one of them for the reason I mentioned in that post. Are you going to make me repeat myself? Do you believe the Logos/Word, is The God who he is before or in the presence of? Do you believe the Son is the Father? Aren't they distinct? To translate that as "The Word (The Son) was with The God (The Father) and The Word was The God (The Father), is incorrect. The Word or the Son is simply divine, a god. Of the category of divinity, but that doesn't imply that the Son is co-equal, co-eternal, or consubstantial with YHWH, The God who the Son is with or before (in the presence of). The context clearly indicates that The Word/The Son is a god/divinity. Angels who are in communion with YHWH, are divine, immortal, holy spirits. They are "Sons of Elohim", which means that they are of the category of Elohim. Divinities.

According to Scripture, is there only one true God?

 

[BS Filter]

Jesus says several places in the Bible he is not his father. Was he lying?

Nope. Jesus is not the father. God is three persons according to Scripture. Who is going to judge everyone?

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

Jesus says several places in the Bible he is not his father. Was he lying?

He's not. Are you being INTENTIONALLY dense just to argue?

 

[Road Runner]

thanks for accusing me of idolatry.

sheez

Protestants are so abusive

I like you okay but technically they are correct as that's idolatry.

And you said there are no christians outside of your church

Yep, which was incredibly arrogant and ignorant to me as he told me exactly the same thing.