Zone1 I'm Having An Issue With A Part Of The Bible

[Likkmee]

Like I said, I'm not PROTESTANT.

To put it more plainly, I don't follow any daughters of the Great Whore -- Roman Catholicism
But Protestants do look to the cross, while you pray to your dead saints

I'm not a protestant either...and damn sure not a Trinitarian. I have the ability to read rather than listen

 

[Likkmee]

Wrong again. This is the heresy of the Watchtower Society,

 

[surada]

Like I said, I'm not PROTESTANT.

To put it more plainly, I don't follow any daughters of the Great Whore -- Roman Catholicism
But Protestants do look to the cross, while you pray to your dead saints

Rome was not the great whore until about 1500 AD. Luther fell out with Rome so he started that accusation. The whore of Babylon is Israel. Read the scriptures.

 

[Red Front]

What a flimsy premise you've based this dump of words on.

Text analysis here. Tell us exactly what little words you've based this entire theology on.

John 1:1 Greek Text Analysis

biblehub.com

Any non-Trinitarian scriptural analysis would be flippantly dismissed as a "dump of words", since it doesn't matter to you what the evidence supports. I'm not going to get too academic here, if at all. I speak from the Spirit of YHWH.

A number of respected trinitarian scholars have admitted that the literal translation of Jn 1:1c is actually "And the Word was a god":

W. E. Vine - "a god was the Word" - p. 490, An Expository Dictionary of the New Testament.

C. H. Dodd - "The Word was a god" - Technical Papers for the Bible Translator, Jan., 1977.

Murray J. Harris - "the Word was a god" - p. 60, Jesus as God, Baker Book House, 1992.

Robert Young - "and a God (i.e. a Divine Being) was the Word" - Young's Concise Critical Bible Commentary.

W. E. Vine, Prof. C. H. Dodd (Director of the New English Bible project), and Murray J. Harris admit that this ("the Word was a god") is the literal translation, but, being Trinitarians, they insist that it be interpreted and translated as "and the Word was God." Why? Because they're Trinitarians. At least they were honest enough to admit that grammatically, it literally reads "a god".

Ernest Cadman Colwell a Trinitarian scholar writes:

"The opening verse of John’s Gospel contains one of the many passages where this rule suggests the translation of a predicate as a definite noun. Καὶ θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος [Kaì theòs ên ho lógos] looks much more like "And the Word was God" than "And the Word was divine" when viewed with reference to this rule. The absence of the article does not make the predicate indefinite or qualitative when it precedes the verb, it is indefinite in this position only when the context demands it."

The context does demand it. The Word is with The God, hence the Word is clearly not The God he is with or before (as in the presence of a superior or King with one of His subjects facing Him, standing or kneeling ). Hello?

​

The ark of the covenant has the "Triune Godhead" at the crown, the mercy seat. Before Satan's rebellion, he was there with the 1st born. The light bearer, at the right hand of the Archangel (Sar Gadol - High Prince, Daniel 12:1). One of the many names and titles of the firstborn is "Mika'El". This name is a question, for all of the armies of heaven. The firstborn, The Word, Yeshua, asks the legions of heaven "MIKA'EL?". WHO IS LIKE GOD? It's not Satan and his fallen armies, it's Him, the First Born, The Son of The Living God. He is MIKA'EL, the One Who Is Like God to Israel. He is The Angel Of YHWH who bears THE NAME, YAHWEH. No one in heaven bears The Name like Him. He is special, unique, the exemplary one, the divine Son Par Excellence, the one who sits on the throne of YHWH. Both Him and Lucifer, were before the presence of YHWH The Father, who is INFINITE LIGHT, LIFE, TRUTH, LOVE, POWER, GLORY. THE NON-CONTINGENT, ETERNAL SOURCE. HE IS, REALITY ITSELF, WITH ALL OF ITS LAWS. PURE EXISTENCE IS GOOD. RIGHTEOUS. THAT IS YAHWEH, THE INFINITE FATHER/SOURCE.

Lucifer felt he was more worthy than the First Born, to sit on YHWH's throne, so he rebelled. He convinced billions of angels to fight for him and the rebels lost the war. Those thought forms or "angels", who were once immortal holy heavenly spirits, were cast into a "black hole" ( a dark, cosmic, mental gravity well that leads to death). This universe is the tree of knowledge of good and evil. We sought knowledge, and wisdom, without YHWH GOD or His First Born. We are in the forbidden tree of pride, seeking knowledge and power free of YHWH's life and law. Hence our deplorable state.

Many of them were fractured, hence we get the story of Adam naming the animals, giving them their nature or names. This is all a parable. They were naked, then they received the animal skins. You're reading a symbolic representation of what occurred during that war that we fought against Yahweh and His Son. We are all fallen ones here.

The Archangel, the first born of YHWH, loved us so much, that He was willing to sacrifice Himself, to save a bunch of fallen, rebel angels. He came down into the abyss, to save us. Thanks to Him, we will all be resurrected on the day of judgment. His disciples are the only ones who don't have to suffer in the grave or contend with the torments and enticements of demonic spirits.

All other human beings are summoned by Satan and enticed to serve Him as a demonic, familiar spirit. Death is sleep, being unconscious, until a living person, be it the witch of Endor who summoned Samuel, waking him up and drawing him from Sheol i.e. the realm of the dead, or be it Satan and his fallen ones, summoning a dead human soul from its sleep, people will be tested by Satan even in their graves. They will be offered a deal they can't refuse, and that is, to remain awake, "alive" in his service until the day of reckoning. There will be a last battle between the forces of Satan and the First Born. Those who choose to be demons in Satan's service will be defeated and condemned to the lake of fire or the second death, from which there is no return. The second death, unlike the first one, is permanent. There's no more redemption in the lake of fire.

Yeshua i.e. Jesus, is the incarnation of the Archangel and First Born. He defeats Satan by becoming a little lamb, consigned to a mortal life of suffering and sacrifice. Death had no authority over Him because unlike us, HE IS PERFECT! He kept The Law, flawlessly, without error. Not one sin or injustice. He paid the ransom, for you and me to return to the family of YHWH, becoming One With Him Again. We can be holy again in Christ Our Lord and King.

Rev_3:21 He that overcometh, I will give to him to sit down with me in my throne, as I also overcame, and sat down with my Father in his throne.

Rev_3:5 He that overcometh shall thus be arrayed in white garments, and I will in no wise blot his name out of the book of life, and I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

Rev_14:1 And I saw, and behold, the Lamb standing on the mount Zion, and with him a hundred and forty and four thousand, having his name, and the name of his Father, written on their foreheads.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

I'm not a protestant either...and damn sure not a Trinitarian. I have the ability to read rather than listen

I can see you understand the scriptures better than most

 

[Carl in Michigan]

but Christ's life only effects a small group is something I will NEVER come to terms with

Christ's mission on this earth does affect ALL. All are now FORCED to make the choice or not. Nobody will be without excuse.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

he Church He began began in the beginning, not surprisingly. The only Church (and there is only ONE) that goes back to the Beginning is the Catholic Church, first called such at least as early as 107 AD (ancient writings tell us).

Your church began with Simon Magus after Peter threw him out of the Church of God.

Yours is not the first, but the second -- a COUNTERFEIT of the true church

 

[Red Front]

Christ's mission on this earth does affect ALL. All are now FORCED to make the choice or not. Nobody will be without excuse.

Everyone will be risen from the dead and judged according to their works. What Yeshua accomplished for everyone, is resurrection. We can also become His disciples in this life and receive His protection when we die, from being tormented and summoned by Satan.

 

[surada]

Your church began with Simon Magus after Peter threw him out of the Church of God.

Yours is not the first, but the second -- a COUNTERFEIT of the true church

Simon Magus thought he could fly.

Simon Magus | Samarian Magician, Gnostic Heresies | Britannica

Simon Magus was a practitioner of magical arts who probably came from Gitta, a village in biblical Samaria. Simon, according to the New Testament account in Acts of the Apostles 8:9–24, after becoming a Christian, offered to purchase from the Apostles Peter and John the supernatural power of

www.britannica.com

 

[Red Front]

Simon Magus thought he could fly.

Simon Magus | Samarian Magician, Gnostic Heresies | Britannica

Simon Magus was a practitioner of magical arts who probably came from Gitta, a village in biblical Samaria. Simon, according to the New Testament account in Acts of the Apostles 8:9–24, after becoming a Christian, offered to purchase from the Apostles Peter and John the supernatural power of

www.britannica.com

I believe Simon Magus was a moniker for Paul.

 

[surada]

I believe Simon Magus was a moniker for Paul.

Why do you think that? Simon Magus flew off a building and was killed.

 

[Red Front]

Why do you think that? Simon Magus flew off a building and was killed.

In the clementines, an apocryphal work, there was a conflict between Simon Magus and Peter, and the scholars believe that is in reference to a disagreement between Paul and Peter. I don't necessarily believe that, I was just mentioning it.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

I believe Simon Magus was a moniker for Paul.

People believe a lot of things

 

[surada]

In the clementines, an apocryphal work, there was a conflict between Simon Magus and Peter, and the scholars believe that is in reference to a disagreement between Paul and Peter. I don't necessarily believe that, I was just mentioning it.

I posted a link from the encyclopedia Britannica earlier.

 

[notmyfault2020]

Like I said, I'm not PROTESTANT.

To put it more plainly, I don't follow any daughters of the Great Whore -- Roman Catholicism
But Protestants do look to the cross, while you pray to your dead saints

You just called the Church Christ founded a Whore

I think I'm done w/ you

 

[notmyfault2020]

That is an unbelievable conclusion--a true example, indeed, that a conclusion is the point where someone stops thinking! I defy you to find any post of mine that denies the need for Christ's life, death, and resurrection.

Adam and Eve's first sin of disobedience had the power to effect all of mankind down through the ages. Seriously, do you grant them more power than Jesus' life of obedience--including his death and resurrection? You believe their action had more might? Do you not believe Jesus changed this world? I do! And with all my heart.

In Post #19, I said calling an religion a false religion is out of line. To me it is unthinkable that people choosing the "wrong" religion can weaken or interfere with Jesus' work of redemption and reconciliation. The thought that the life of Adam and Eve can effect all but Christ's life only effects a small group is something I will NEVER come to terms with.

Question for you: How can anyone who believes that Jesus and the Father are One even think that that Adam and Eve have more power and influence than the Almighty?

You have used the word Effect improperly: You mean Affect, with an A

 

[surada]

You just called the Church Christ founded a Whore

I think I'm done w/ you

All through the Old Testament the prophets scold Israel as a whore and harlot whoring after false gods. Israel is the whore of Babylon. That's what Christianity believed until 1500 AD when Martin Luther fell out with Rome.

 

[GMCGeneral]

You just called the Church Christ founded a Whore

I think I'm done w/ you

He is right. Praying to Mary is idolatry.

 

[Meriweather]

You have used the word Effect improperly: You mean Affect, with an A

No, I meant 'effect'. However, a more correct wording would have been 'effected'. (consequence to all vs make a difference to)

 

[notmyfault2020]

All through the Old Testament the prophets scold Israel as a whore and harlot whoring after false gods. Israel is the whore of Babylon. That's what Christianity believed until 1500 AD when Martin Luther fell out with Rome.

yes, protestants seem to think Luther was some kind of 2nd coming of Christ or something... Read The Facts about Luther and see if you think so..