Illusion vs. Reality: The Rampant Voter Fraud Myth

[BULLDOG]

When you have over 100% participation thats called fraud..........when you have more registered voters than actual voters thats fraud.......this is allowed to persist and protected by one party...democrats

So you don't think some people are registered, but just don't make it to the polls to vote? What about the ones that register, but don't have a picture ID? Couldn't that cause more registered than who actually vote, but not be fraud?

 

[phoenyx]

It's true that there have been a few cases of apparent voter fraud. However, as my opening article makes clear, the cases have been minimal. The disenfranchisement of voters through voter id laws as well as down and dirty disenfranchisement of voters without even the pretext of a voter id law to back it up, has been shown to be quite real, however, while I also believe my opening post in this thread demonstrates...

Why did you start a new thread when you could have just admitted in the other one that voter fraud isn't a myth? Just because it isn't rampant, does not mean it is a myth.

I started a new thread because the old one (my introduction thread) was not a place to be talking at length about political matters- that's what the -rest- of this forum is for . As to voter fraud not being a myth entirely, alright, fair enough, there have been a few reported cases. That being said, there have been a -massive- amount of disenfranchisement cases, many caused by voter id laws that seem to be targeted to suppress the votes of blacks and the poor.

What you think they seem to do doesn't really play out in reality. The people most hurt by voter ID laws are elderly conservatives in rural areas. What the DNC is doing to pander to its base with the unending "racism" card is keeping the GOP from slitting its own throat with their most loyal off year election base.

What evidence do you have for your assertion? For my part of the argument:
Getting a photo ID so you can vote is easy. Unless you’re poor, black, Latino or elderly.

Really??.

So if you're a poor Democrat you can't get a FREE ID????

Gee, I thought Democrats had that "free shit" thing down pat!!!!

Hopefully I've been able to educate you on the facts. You did read the article, didn't you?

 

[Manonthestreet]

When you have over 100% participation thats called fraud..........when you have more registered voters than actual voters thats fraud.......this is allowed to persist and protected by one party...democrats

So you don't think some people are registered, but just don't make it to the polls to vote? What about the ones that register, but don't have a picture ID? Couldn't that cause more registered than who actually vote, but not be fraud?

YOur question makes no sense in regard to my post

 

[Manonthestreet]

When you have over 100% participation thats called fraud..........when you have more registered voters than actual voters thats fraud.......this is allowed to persist and protected by one party...democrats

So you don't think some people are registered, but just don't make it to the polls to vote? What about the ones that register, but don't have a picture ID? Couldn't that cause more registered than who actually vote, but not be fraud?

YOur question makes no sense in regard to my post

Correction my post should have read when you have more actual votes than registered voters........

 

[BULLDOG]

When you have over 100% participation thats called fraud..........when you have more registered voters than actual voters thats fraud.......this is allowed to persist and protected by one party...democrats

So you don't think some people are registered, but just don't make it to the polls to vote? What about the ones that register, but don't have a picture ID? Couldn't that cause more registered than who actually vote, but not be fraud?

YOur question makes no sense in regard to my post

It makes perfect sense. You said ".......when you have more registered voters than actual voters thats fraud......" I simply presented cases where your statement didn't hold up.

 

[Obiwan]

When you have over 100% participation thats called fraud..........when you have more registered voters than actual voters thats fraud.......this is allowed to persist and protected by one party...democrats

So you don't think some people are registered, but just don't make it to the polls to vote? What about the ones that register, but don't have a picture ID? Couldn't that cause more registered than who actually vote, but not be fraud?

But how do the freeloading Democrats get HUD housing, welfare, and food stamps, since they all require a photo ID????

 

[Google]

Here is a good summation of minor issue that voter fraud is:
**In August, Justin Levitt, a professor at Loyola University Law School, detailed for Wonkblog 31 instances of documented, in-person voter fraud that would have been prevented by stricter rules around identification at the polling place. The most severe instance Levitt outlined involved as many as 24 voters in Brooklyn who tried to vote under assumed names.

There are almost no elections in which 24 votes makes a significant difference, particularly at the federal level. The graph below compares the vote total and the margin of victory for every race with less than a million votes in general elections since 2006.**

Source: The disconnect between voter ID laws and voter fraud

Some more points:
**
Here are some selections from our reporting on the voter fraud myth and the impact of anti-voter-fraud laws:

• The rate of fraud in US elections is close to zero.
• UFO sightings are more common than voter fraud.
• So is getting struck by lightning.
• Florida’s aggressive efforts to root out voter fraud before the 2000 election erroneously purged 12,000 names from the voter rolls—of the 12,000, 44 percent, more than 4,700 voters—were African American. That was more than enough votes to change the outcome of that year's presidential election.
• Native Americans are fighting a slew of high-stakes legal battles over voting rights; many of the lawsuits are linked to rules that were designed to prevent voting fraud.
• Voter ID laws are among a host of hurdles that minorities face when they cast a ballot.
• A national voter ID card could end the debate on voter fraud, but both parties hate that idea.
• GOP presidential contender Ted Cruz's Iowa chairman spent $250,000 to stop people from voting.
• Interestingly, a conservative activist inadvertently demonstrated how hard it is to commit voter fraud.**

Source: 9 facts that blow up the voter fraud myth

I'm interested in hearing constructive views as to the validity of these sources.

I've already been discussing voter fraud in my introduction thread, so I'll be moving my responses to points there into this thread...

There are several states where voting has always required showing photo ID. It has been the law in Georgia for decades. So by the logic of the left, black people have not been able to vote--or have been having their votes suppressed for decades? Also there are literally dozens of examples of voter fraud. Whether you think it is an insignificant problem or not, why wouldn't you want the election process to be as secure as possible. And what does it say about the people that are standing in the way of doing so?


CBS2 Investigation Uncovers Votes Being Cast From Grave Year After Year

Study: 1.8 Million Dead People Still Registered To Vote

270 Dead People Shown to Have Voted in Nassau County

Ohioan gets 5-year prison term for illegal voting

 

[Dekster]

Why did you start a new thread when you could have just admitted in the other one that voter fraud isn't a myth? Just because it isn't rampant, does not mean it is a myth.

I started a new thread because the old one (my introduction thread) was not a place to be talking at length about political matters- that's what the -rest- of this forum is for . As to voter fraud not being a myth entirely, alright, fair enough, there have been a few reported cases. That being said, there have been a -massive- amount of disenfranchisement cases, many caused by voter id laws that seem to be targeted to suppress the votes of blacks and the poor.

What you think they seem to do doesn't really play out in reality. The people most hurt by voter ID laws are elderly conservatives in rural areas. What the DNC is doing to pander to its base with the unending "racism" card is keeping the GOP from slitting its own throat with their most loyal off year election base.

You can look at it any way you want. The main thing is that the new voter ID laws prevent people from voting no matter which party is effected most, and they should be done away with.

I think they should be expanded. Not having a photo ID puts you at such margins of society that enabling people to not be able to carry out most transactions we do every day other than voting is cruel and a disservice to them and society like being able to cash a check at a bank instead of a convenience store that takes a chunk of it.

You advocating that the government pay the -costs- of getting these voter ids as well? Or ensuring that state officials don't close down driver's registration offices even as they're instituting these voter id laws? If not, the result of any expansion will simply be the disenfranchisement of many more voters, regardless of what those supporting such expansions claim it will do for the poor.

Here's some reading you might want to look at:
Alabama DMV closings draw call for federal voting rights probe

Getting a photo ID so you can vote is easy. Unless you’re poor, black, Latino or elderly.

I can get my ID renewed over the internet and I have no problem with free ID. Just charge Prius owners more to register their vehicle to make up the cost.

 

[Dekster]

Why did you start a new thread when you could have just admitted in the other one that voter fraud isn't a myth? Just because it isn't rampant, does not mean it is a myth.

I started a new thread because the old one (my introduction thread) was not a place to be talking at length about political matters- that's what the -rest- of this forum is for . As to voter fraud not being a myth entirely, alright, fair enough, there have been a few reported cases. That being said, there have been a -massive- amount of disenfranchisement cases, many caused by voter id laws that seem to be targeted to suppress the votes of blacks and the poor.

What you think they seem to do doesn't really play out in reality. The people most hurt by voter ID laws are elderly conservatives in rural areas. What the DNC is doing to pander to its base with the unending "racism" card is keeping the GOP from slitting its own throat with their most loyal off year election base.

You can look at it any way you want. The main thing is that the new voter ID laws prevent people from voting no matter which party is effected most, and they should be done away with.

I think they should be expanded. Not having a photo ID puts you at such margins of society that enabling people to not be able to carry out most transactions we do every day other than voting is cruel and a disservice to them and society like being able to cash a check at a bank instead of a convenience store that takes a chunk of it.

People don't use convenience stores to cash checks because they don't have ID. They use convenience stores because they don't have bank accounts.

There are places that will still cash your check for free--but you need ID--and to open a bank account the first thing they will ask you for is....wait for it.....your ID.

 

[BULLDOG]

When you have over 100% participation thats called fraud..........when you have more registered voters than actual voters thats fraud.......this is allowed to persist and protected by one party...democrats

So you don't think some people are registered, but just don't make it to the polls to vote? What about the ones that register, but don't have a picture ID? Couldn't that cause more registered than who actually vote, but not be fraud?

But how do the freeloading Democrats get HUD housing, welfare, and food stamps, since they all require a photo ID????

I guess they do it the same way freeloading Republicans do since there are more people in red stated on government assistance than there are in blue states.

 

[BULLDOG]

I started a new thread because the old one (my introduction thread) was not a place to be talking at length about political matters- that's what the -rest- of this forum is for . As to voter fraud not being a myth entirely, alright, fair enough, there have been a few reported cases. That being said, there have been a -massive- amount of disenfranchisement cases, many caused by voter id laws that seem to be targeted to suppress the votes of blacks and the poor.

What you think they seem to do doesn't really play out in reality. The people most hurt by voter ID laws are elderly conservatives in rural areas. What the DNC is doing to pander to its base with the unending "racism" card is keeping the GOP from slitting its own throat with their most loyal off year election base.

You can look at it any way you want. The main thing is that the new voter ID laws prevent people from voting no matter which party is effected most, and they should be done away with.

I think they should be expanded. Not having a photo ID puts you at such margins of society that enabling people to not be able to carry out most transactions we do every day other than voting is cruel and a disservice to them and society like being able to cash a check at a bank instead of a convenience store that takes a chunk of it.

People don't use convenience stores to cash checks because they don't have ID. They use convenience stores because they don't have bank accounts.

There are places that will still cash your check for free--but you need ID--and to open a bank account the first thing they will ask you for is....wait for it.....your ID.

No the first thing they ask you for is........wait for it.........money, which they don't have.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Here is a good summation of minor issue that voter fraud is:...

The Democratic Party Ward Bosses have been engaging in rampant voter fraud since the early 1800s, as well as fully implementing their new motto "Deny everything, admit nothing, and make counter accusations".

Of course a hack like you would deny that there was ever a problem with voter fraud - that is the game you shits play.

 

[Manonthestreet]

When you have over 100% participation thats called fraud..........when you have more registered voters than actual voters thats fraud.......this is allowed to persist and protected by one party...democrats

So you don't think some people are registered, but just don't make it to the polls to vote? What about the ones that register, but don't have a picture ID? Couldn't that cause more registered than who actually vote, but not be fraud?

YOur question makes no sense in regard to my post

It makes perfect sense. You said ".......when you have more registered voters than actual voters thats fraud......" I simply presented cases where your statement didn't hold up.

No I simply typed it wrong.....counties with over 100% participation = fraud.....and your answer is........

 

[BULLDOG]

Here is a good summation of minor issue that voter fraud is:
**In August, Justin Levitt, a professor at Loyola University Law School, detailed for Wonkblog 31 instances of documented, in-person voter fraud that would have been prevented by stricter rules around identification at the polling place. The most severe instance Levitt outlined involved as many as 24 voters in Brooklyn who tried to vote under assumed names.

There are almost no elections in which 24 votes makes a significant difference, particularly at the federal level. The graph below compares the vote total and the margin of victory for every race with less than a million votes in general elections since 2006.**

Source: The disconnect between voter ID laws and voter fraud

Some more points:
**
Here are some selections from our reporting on the voter fraud myth and the impact of anti-voter-fraud laws:

• The rate of fraud in US elections is close to zero.
• UFO sightings are more common than voter fraud.
• So is getting struck by lightning.
• Florida’s aggressive efforts to root out voter fraud before the 2000 election erroneously purged 12,000 names from the voter rolls—of the 12,000, 44 percent, more than 4,700 voters—were African American. That was more than enough votes to change the outcome of that year's presidential election.
• Native Americans are fighting a slew of high-stakes legal battles over voting rights; many of the lawsuits are linked to rules that were designed to prevent voting fraud.
• Voter ID laws are among a host of hurdles that minorities face when they cast a ballot.
• A national voter ID card could end the debate on voter fraud, but both parties hate that idea.
• GOP presidential contender Ted Cruz's Iowa chairman spent $250,000 to stop people from voting.
• Interestingly, a conservative activist inadvertently demonstrated how hard it is to commit voter fraud.**

Source: 9 facts that blow up the voter fraud myth

I'm interested in hearing constructive views as to the validity of these sources.

I've already been discussing voter fraud in my introduction thread, so I'll be moving my responses to points there into this thread...

There are several states where voting has always required showing photo ID. It has been the law in Georgia for decades. So by the logic of the left, black people have not been able to vote--or have been having their votes suppressed for decades? Also there are literally dozens of examples of voter fraud. Whether you think it is an insignificant problem or not, why wouldn't you want the election process to be as secure as possible. And what does it say about the people that are standing in the way of doing so?


CBS2 Investigation Uncovers Votes Being Cast From Grave Year After Year

Study: 1.8 Million Dead People Still Registered To Vote

270 Dead People Shown to Have Voted in Nassau County

Ohioan gets 5-year prison term for illegal voting

Because disenfranchising thousands is not worthwhile to prevent dozens of cases.

 

[Dekster]

What you think they seem to do doesn't really play out in reality. The people most hurt by voter ID laws are elderly conservatives in rural areas. What the DNC is doing to pander to its base with the unending "racism" card is keeping the GOP from slitting its own throat with their most loyal off year election base.

You can look at it any way you want. The main thing is that the new voter ID laws prevent people from voting no matter which party is effected most, and they should be done away with.

I think they should be expanded. Not having a photo ID puts you at such margins of society that enabling people to not be able to carry out most transactions we do every day other than voting is cruel and a disservice to them and society like being able to cash a check at a bank instead of a convenience store that takes a chunk of it.

People don't use convenience stores to cash checks because they don't have ID. They use convenience stores because they don't have bank accounts.

There are places that will still cash your check for free--but you need ID--and to open a bank account the first thing they will ask you for is....wait for it.....your ID.

No the first thing they ask you for is........wait for it.........money, which they don't have.

Nope they ask for your ID. Even at the bank I have multiple accounts at and everybody who works there knows me, I have to show ID to open an account. They don't make me show it at the window to cash the checks, but for the account opening part they have to have it to scan into the system.

 

[BULLDOG]

I started a new thread because the old one (my introduction thread) was not a place to be talking at length about political matters- that's what the -rest- of this forum is for . As to voter fraud not being a myth entirely, alright, fair enough, there have been a few reported cases. That being said, there have been a -massive- amount of disenfranchisement cases, many caused by voter id laws that seem to be targeted to suppress the votes of blacks and the poor.

What you think they seem to do doesn't really play out in reality. The people most hurt by voter ID laws are elderly conservatives in rural areas. What the DNC is doing to pander to its base with the unending "racism" card is keeping the GOP from slitting its own throat with their most loyal off year election base.

You can look at it any way you want. The main thing is that the new voter ID laws prevent people from voting no matter which party is effected most, and they should be done away with.

I think they should be expanded. Not having a photo ID puts you at such margins of society that enabling people to not be able to carry out most transactions we do every day other than voting is cruel and a disservice to them and society like being able to cash a check at a bank instead of a convenience store that takes a chunk of it.

People don't use convenience stores to cash checks because they don't have ID. They use convenience stores because they don't have bank accounts.

There are places that will still cash your check for free--but you need ID--and to open a bank account the first thing they will ask you for is....wait for it.....your ID.

Name someplace other than a bank where you have an account, or your family member's store that will cash a paycheck for free without a purchase for that amount,

 

[JimBowie1958]

Nope they ask for your ID. Even at the bank I have multiple accounts at and everybody who works there knows me, I have to show ID to open an account. They don't make me show it at the window to cash the checks, but for the account opening part they have to have it to scan into the system.

BAh, you act as if keeping voters limited to only American citizens is a good thing or something. That is so last Millenia. /sarc

 

[BULLDOG]

You can look at it any way you want. The main thing is that the new voter ID laws prevent people from voting no matter which party is effected most, and they should be done away with.

I think they should be expanded. Not having a photo ID puts you at such margins of society that enabling people to not be able to carry out most transactions we do every day other than voting is cruel and a disservice to them and society like being able to cash a check at a bank instead of a convenience store that takes a chunk of it.

People don't use convenience stores to cash checks because they don't have ID. They use convenience stores because they don't have bank accounts.

There are places that will still cash your check for free--but you need ID--and to open a bank account the first thing they will ask you for is....wait for it.....your ID.

No the first thing they ask you for is........wait for it.........money, which they don't have.

Nope they ask for your ID. Even at the bank I have multiple accounts at and everybody who works there knows me, I have to show ID to open an account. They don't make me show it at the window to cash the checks, but for the account opening part they have to have it to scan into the system.

Of course they do, but the main reason people can't cash checks for free at the bank is because they don't have a bank account. Poor people can't leave their small amount of money in a bank. It's needed before they get their next check.

 

[Google]

Here is the logic of the left. There are vulnerabilities that compromise the election process. The vulnerabilities could be easily fixed by simply requiring people to prove they are who they are. Ignore the fact that 15 states have had the requirements for decades. When these common sense actions that secure the integrity of American elections are taken they scream bloody murder. Just like earnest attempts to reform broken education systems, the left fights tooth and nail to stop it. Why? Why do they not want to strengthen the integrity of elections?

Could it be that they are the ones that benefit? That they have openly encouraged illegal aliens to vote? That felons who have illegally voted in elections overwhelmingly vote democrat?

 

[Google]

Bronx politician Hector Ramirez has been arrested after a 242-count grand jury indictment charged him with a massive voter fraud scheme that involved tricking voters into letting Ramirez and his staff illegally vote their absentee ballots. The local prosecutor told the New York Daily Newsthat Ramirez, who lost two prior tries at a state assembly seat, “made a decision that he was not going to lose, under any circumstance.”