candycorn
Diamond Member
P@triot is a fan of claiming that he “brings receipts” as (what he calls) proof of his claims. One such claim is rather nebulous and concerns voter fraud. He calls it “rampant”.
To prove this he references one--and so far the only--“receipt” was his referencing the right wing think tank Heritage Foundation listing of 1,620 instances of irregularities. He often cites the usual rabble of crazy right wing websites (epoch times, gateway pundit, etc...) but only the citation of the Heritage Foundation has any supposed gravitas. Here is the description from their website:
Again, the above are their words; not mine. Verify that below if you like.
electionfraud.heritage.org
In some cases--383 of the 1620: 23.64% to be exact--no ballots were even cast to sway an outcome. They add in citations of registration irregularities.
Thats right....the “receipt” of alleged “rampant” voter fraud includes nearly a quarter of the time when no ballots were cast. But for ease of math, I’m not eliminating the nearly a quarter of the times when there were no ballots cast.
As for the other 1,237 cases spread over 44 years many happen in off year elections not involving federal offices. Even then, most of the cases are one-offs. Example--voting for a dead relative (all below are direct quotes from the Heritage Foundation database).
You get the idea. Then there are some that involved dozens of voters (or did they????). Here is an example...
What Patriot does is try to claim the story I have listed as one of the 1620 then use each of the ones I showed in the graphic above as separate cases when, in fact, they are just enumerated examples of the 41 that were listed. For example; when you click on one of the instances....you see the person identified as “AN INDIVIDUAL”. Put another way, they list 41 insntances multiple times.
So clearly the 1620 instances is specious at best when they are listing one item as saying there are 41 instances of fraud AND THEN listing each of the 41 instances. They do this numerous times.
11 cases in NJ
They list the 11 cases 11 times. The total number is 11 cases of irregularities...if you reach each one, you’re thinking it’s over 100 which is false.
So how many cases has there been since 1982? He won’t say.
When pinned down Patriot always--without exception--says that there are far more cases than this--alleging that there is fraud that isn’t caught. Which is probably the case. So naturally I asked him what the actual number is--just his estimate. He, of course, wouldn’t say; setting up the strawman to continue to claim “rampant” fraud without any proof. But one time he did get out of his lane and give a number:
Also keep in mind, rarely the political parties of the candidates in whose name the almost-non-existent fraud was committed is seldom mentioned meaning that Republicans, Democrats, and other parties perhaps, are guilty. As a “receipt” proving “rampant” fraud, it’s hilarious. As a “receipt” proving democratic party voter fraud, it’s impotent beyond belief.
Now lets examine the number of votes cast during the same time span. The Heritage Foundation database includes all elections. Not just federal ones. For ease of math, I’m just going to count the number of votes in the Presidential elections. How many votes were cast since 1984?
But for the sake of accuracy, to be polite, and to have some fun, lets look at what I’m not counting.
I’m omitting about a billion other votes for midterm elections. Microsoft CoPilot would not list how many midterm votes were cast so I asked it to guess:
Put another way, Heritage is using off year and midterm elections in their 1620; I’m not using the off year and midterm votes to show how small a percentage this is. I’m leaving 700 million to a billion votes on the table to show how looney the assertion he is making is.
So of the 1,900,000,000 cast in ONLY PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS, 1620 instances represents 0.00008526%. But hell, lets give Patriot a helping hand--he certinaly needs one. Lets pretend that the 1620 instances each represents 10,000 cases of actual voter fraud--not registration irregularies, not mistaken identities, not an instance of someone voting in the wrong precinct...lets pretend that ther eare 16 Million cases of people actively trying to deceive.... That would mean that the percentage is 0.008526%.
Still not close to 1% of a fraction of the votes cast
Not every year...that is over 44 years.
I invite his rebuttal.
View attachment 1250686
To prove this he references one--and so far the only--“receipt” was his referencing the right wing think tank Heritage Foundation listing of 1,620 instances of irregularities. He often cites the usual rabble of crazy right wing websites (epoch times, gateway pundit, etc...) but only the citation of the Heritage Foundation has any supposed gravitas. Here is the description from their website:
The Election Fraud Map displays a sampling of proven instances of election fraud. Every case ended in a finding that the individual engaged in wrongdoing in an election hoping to affect its outcome—or that the results were sufficiently in question to be overturned. While not comprehensive, this map demonstrates vulnerabilities in the election process and the ways in which fraud is committed.
Again, the above are their words; not mine. Verify that below if you like.
The Heritage Foundation's Election Fraud Map
The Heritage Foundation's Election Fraud Map is an interactive tool providing a sampling of proven instances of election fraud across the U.S. From @HeritageDataviz
electionfraud.heritage.org
In some cases--383 of the 1620: 23.64% to be exact--no ballots were even cast to sway an outcome. They add in citations of registration irregularities.
Thats right....the “receipt” of alleged “rampant” voter fraud includes nearly a quarter of the time when no ballots were cast. But for ease of math, I’m not eliminating the nearly a quarter of the times when there were no ballots cast.
As for the other 1,237 cases spread over 44 years many happen in off year elections not involving federal offices. Even then, most of the cases are one-offs. Example--voting for a dead relative (all below are direct quotes from the Heritage Foundation database).
- Crayton was convicted of impersonation fraud for illegally voting in her sister's name during the 2002 election.
- Cheryl Mihaliak was charged by the state in Lancaster County with two counts of forging and destroying ballots after filling out and submitting an absentee ballot on behalf of her deceased mother during the May 2022 primary election.
- Christine Daikawa was charged with absentee ballot fraud (a misdemeanor) and attempting to impersonate an elector (a felony) after submitting her dead partner's ballot during the 2020 general election.
- Elizabeth Gale of San Diego was charged by the state with four felony counts of fraudulently casting a vote, impersonating a voter, attempting to vote as a fictious person, and personate with a written instrument after casting an absentee ballot on behalf of her deceased mother during the 2021 California Gubernatorial Recall Election.
- Francis Presto of South Park, a registered Republican, requested and cast an absentee ballot on behalf of his deceased wife.
- Frederick Gattuso, former Carteret Republican mayoral candidate, was charged with one count of fraudulent voting for voting twice during the November 2020 presidential election as different people with similar names.
- Caesar Abutin, of Norwalk, voted under the name of his deceased mother three times between 2012 and 2014. He was charged with one count of impersonating another voter, one count of fraudulently requesting an absentee ballot, and one count of fraudulent voting, all felony charges.
- Jeanene Johnson pleaded guilty to unlawfully depositing a ballot. Johnson assisted Latunia Thomas, a fellow Harris County poll worker, to unlawfully cast a ballot for her daughter, who was not present. Johnson served one day in jail and was released.
- Manuel Rodriguez III, of Edwards County, impersonated his elderly grandfather to vote in the 2014 general election while on supervised parole for a felony.
- Sarilu Sosa-Sanchez voted twice in the 2013 election,
You get the idea. Then there are some that involved dozens of voters (or did they????). Here is an example...
- Project Westvote was a massive investigation by the FBI into endemic vote-buying operations in western North Carolina. The operation netted 41 convictions in counties throughout the western part of the state. 41 votes in 1986--40 years ago.
What Patriot does is try to claim the story I have listed as one of the 1620 then use each of the ones I showed in the graphic above as separate cases when, in fact, they are just enumerated examples of the 41 that were listed. For example; when you click on one of the instances....you see the person identified as “AN INDIVIDUAL”. Put another way, they list 41 insntances multiple times.
So clearly the 1620 instances is specious at best when they are listing one item as saying there are 41 instances of fraud AND THEN listing each of the 41 instances. They do this numerous times.
11 cases in NJ
- Eleven individuals were arrested in a state investigation of possible manipulation of absentee ballots in the election of Paterson Councilman Rigo Rodriguez. They entered into pre-trial intervention, a probationary program, to avoid trial and possible prison time.
They list the 11 cases 11 times. The total number is 11 cases of irregularities...if you reach each one, you’re thinking it’s over 100 which is false.
So how many cases has there been since 1982? He won’t say.
When pinned down Patriot always--without exception--says that there are far more cases than this--alleging that there is fraud that isn’t caught. Which is probably the case. So naturally I asked him what the actual number is--just his estimate. He, of course, wouldn’t say; setting up the strawman to continue to claim “rampant” fraud without any proof. But one time he did get out of his lane and give a number:
The above was in a thread about an election in NYC. Strangely enough, his “receipt” lists only 28 cases of voter fraud. Apparently they missed over 134,000 alleged instances. LOL.
Also keep in mind, rarely the political parties of the candidates in whose name the almost-non-existent fraud was committed is seldom mentioned meaning that Republicans, Democrats, and other parties perhaps, are guilty. As a “receipt” proving “rampant” fraud, it’s hilarious. As a “receipt” proving democratic party voter fraud, it’s impotent beyond belief.
Now lets examine the number of votes cast during the same time span. The Heritage Foundation database includes all elections. Not just federal ones. For ease of math, I’m just going to count the number of votes in the Presidential elections. How many votes were cast since 1984?
But for the sake of accuracy, to be polite, and to have some fun, lets look at what I’m not counting.
I’m omitting about a billion other votes for midterm elections. Microsoft CoPilot would not list how many midterm votes were cast so I asked it to guess:
Put another way, Heritage is using off year and midterm elections in their 1620; I’m not using the off year and midterm votes to show how small a percentage this is. I’m leaving 700 million to a billion votes on the table to show how looney the assertion he is making is.
So of the 1,900,000,000 cast in ONLY PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS, 1620 instances represents 0.00008526%. But hell, lets give Patriot a helping hand--he certinaly needs one. Lets pretend that the 1620 instances each represents 10,000 cases of actual voter fraud--not registration irregularies, not mistaken identities, not an instance of someone voting in the wrong precinct...lets pretend that ther eare 16 Million cases of people actively trying to deceive.... That would mean that the percentage is 0.008526%.
Still not close to 1% of a fraction of the votes cast
Not every year...that is over 44 years.
I invite his rebuttal.
View attachment 1250686
