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If you are human, you are not capable of understanding God.

schmidlap

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Does God exist?

Yes and no.

God is not constrained by existence one way or the other.

No one can impose existence upon God, or deprive God of it.

God is none, or one, or many.

Or all simultaneously.

Or not.

That is what it means to be God.

If you insist God exists, God does not exist.

If you insist God does not exist, God exists.

God does that to remind you that you are not God.

It takes one to know one.

It's way above your pay grade.


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Screen Shot 2021-04-17 at 9.59.41 AM.png
"DO I BELIEVE HUMANS EXIST?
WHAT ARE THEY FOR?"
 

Moonglow

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It must be because God has yet to explain just wtf is going on, all we get is rules and regs...
 

ding

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Does God exist?

Yes and no.

God is not constrained by existence one way or the other.

No one can impose existence upon God, or deprive God of it.

God is none, or one, or many.

Or all simultaneously.

Or not.

That is what it means to be God.

If you insist God exists, God does not exist.

If you insist God does not exist, God exists.

God does that to remind you that you are not God.

It takes one to know one.

It's way above your pay grade.


"DO I BELIEVE HUMANS EXIST?
WHAT ARE THEY FOR?"
Maimonides responds...

"If you remove all anthropomorphic content from your conception of God: you remove all content of any kind. In the end, you are left with a God whose essence is unknowable and indescribable. Of what possible value is such a conception either to philosophy or religion?..."

Maimonides (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)
 

harmonica

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Does God exist?

Yes and no.

God is not constrained by existence one way or the other.

No one can impose existence upon God, or deprive God of it.

God is none, or one, or many.

Or all simultaneously.

Or not.

That is what it means to be God.

If you insist God exists, God does not exist.

If you insist God does not exist, God exists.

God does that to remind you that you are not God.

It takes one to know one.

It's way above your pay grade.


"DO I BELIEVE HUMANS EXIST?
WHAT ARE THEY FOR?"
Does God exist?

Yes and no.

God is not constrained by existence one way or the other.

No one can impose existence upon God, or deprive God of it.

God is none, or one, or many.

Or all simultaneously.

Or not.

That is what it means to be God.

If you insist God exists, God does not exist.

If you insist God does not exist, God exists.

God does that to remind you that you are not God.

It takes one to know one.

It's way above your pay grade.


"DO I BELIEVE HUMANS EXIST?
WHAT ARE THEY FOR?"
there's no yes and no about it--no one can prove he exists = no god...and, please, don't anyone say that stupid shit ''you can't prove he doesn't exist'''
 

mamooth

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If we can know nothing about God, we're left with Cthulhu, something utterly alien. We can't know if any of the supposed pronouncements of this "God" mean what we think they mean. If it says "worship me", it might mean "throw yourself into the ocean abyss, to feed my hungry spawn".
 
OP
schmidlap

schmidlap

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Does God exist?

Yes and no.

God is not constrained by existence one way or the other.

No one can impose existence upon God, or deprive God of it.

God is none, or one, or many.

Or all simultaneously.

Or not.

That is what it means to be God.

If you insist God exists, God does not exist.

If you insist God does not exist, God exists.

God does that to remind you that you are not God.

It takes one to know one.

It's way above your pay grade.


"DO I BELIEVE HUMANS EXIST?
WHAT ARE THEY FOR?"
Maimonides responds...

"If you remove all anthropomorphic content from your conception of God: you remove all content of any kind. In the end, you are left with a God whose essence is unknowable and indescribable. Of what possible value is such a conception either to philosophy or religion?..."

Maimonides (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)
Maimonides was right. Humans can only create gods that are limited by what humans can can comprehend.

Otherwise, the religion business would not exist.

Hubris allows humans to imagine that they can define what is so far beyond them.
 

ding

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Does God exist?

Yes and no.

God is not constrained by existence one way or the other.

No one can impose existence upon God, or deprive God of it.

God is none, or one, or many.

Or all simultaneously.

Or not.

That is what it means to be God.

If you insist God exists, God does not exist.

If you insist God does not exist, God exists.

God does that to remind you that you are not God.

It takes one to know one.

It's way above your pay grade.


"DO I BELIEVE HUMANS EXIST?
WHAT ARE THEY FOR?"
Maimonides responds...

"If you remove all anthropomorphic content from your conception of God: you remove all content of any kind. In the end, you are left with a God whose essence is unknowable and indescribable. Of what possible value is such a conception either to philosophy or religion?..."

Maimonides (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)
Maimonides was right. Humans can only create gods that are limited by what humans can can comprehend.

Otherwise, the religion business would not exist.

Hubris allows humans to imagine that they can define what is so far beyond them.
That's not really what Maimonides was saying. Maimonides believed in a Creator of existence. He was saying that even though the Creator is beyond human comprehension that the only tools available for us are human comprehension. There's nothing wrong with using our experiences as proxies just as long as we don't humanize God to the point that we make God human.
 

ding

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Does God exist?

Yes and no.

God is not constrained by existence one way or the other.

No one can impose existence upon God, or deprive God of it.

God is none, or one, or many.

Or all simultaneously.

Or not.

That is what it means to be God.

If you insist God exists, God does not exist.

If you insist God does not exist, God exists.

God does that to remind you that you are not God.

It takes one to know one.

It's way above your pay grade.


"DO I BELIEVE HUMANS EXIST?
WHAT ARE THEY FOR?"
Maimonides responds...

"If you remove all anthropomorphic content from your conception of God: you remove all content of any kind. In the end, you are left with a God whose essence is unknowable and indescribable. Of what possible value is such a conception either to philosophy or religion?..."

Maimonides (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)
Maimonides was right. Humans can only create gods that are limited by what humans can can comprehend.

Otherwise, the religion business would not exist.

Hubris allows humans to imagine that they can define what is so far beyond them.
My perception of God is that God is infinite logic, infinite truth, infinite intelligence, infinite wisdom, infinite knowledge, infinite love, infinite patience, infinite justice, infinite mercy, infinite kindness and infinite goodness. I am not saying God has those attributes. I am saying God is those attributes. Such that mind has always existed: that this is a life‑breeding universe because the constant presence of mind made it so and imbued his creation with His attributes.
 
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schmidlap

schmidlap

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there's no yes and no about it--no one can prove he exists = no god...and, please, don't anyone say that stupid shit ''you can't prove he doesn't exist'''
God both exists and doesn't exist.

Only gods can do that, because, by definition, gods' powers are limitless.

In their limited capacity, finite humans cannot comprehend simultaneous existence and non-existence.

That
is within the purview of the gods alone.

Gods are impervious to humans' attempting to define them one way or the other.
 

Manonthestreet

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If we can know nothing about God, we're left with Cthulhu, something utterly alien. We can't know if any of the supposed pronouncements of this "God" mean what we think they mean. If it says "worship me", it might mean "throw yourself into the ocean abyss, to feed my hungry spawn".
God came down and walked on earth.......
 
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schmidlap

schmidlap

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That's not really what Maimonides was saying. Maimonides believed in a Creator of existence. He was saying that even though the Creator is beyond human comprehension that the only tools available for us are human comprehension.
It is inevitable. Humans are only human.

In terms of tools, if one only has a hammer, every problem looks like a nail. If wombats have gods, why wouldn't they be conceived of as supreme wombats with infinite wombat skills?

As I noted, humans can only create gods that are limited by what humans can comprehend.

If polytheists and monotheists need to quibble about how many gods there are, I really can't see their ever resolving that.
In Maimonides' culture, one was preferred.
There's nothing wrong with using our experiences as proxies just as long as we don't humanize God to the point that we make God human.
At the basis of Christianity is a god becoming man. Christianity makes god human. It became very popular with humans for that reason.
 

vasuderatorrent

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Does God exist?

Yes and no.

God is not constrained by existence one way or the other.

No one can impose existence upon God, or deprive God of it.

God is none, or one, or many.

Or all simultaneously.

Or not.

That is what it means to be God.

If you insist God exists, God does not exist.

If you insist God does not exist, God exists.

God does that to remind you that you are not God.

It takes one to know one.

It's way above your pay grade.


"DO I BELIEVE HUMANS EXIST?
WHAT ARE THEY FOR?"
Does God exist?

Yes and no.

God is not constrained by existence one way or the other.

No one can impose existence upon God, or deprive God of it.

God is none, or one, or many.

Or all simultaneously.

Or not.

That is what it means to be God.

If you insist God exists, God does not exist.

If you insist God does not exist, God exists.

God does that to remind you that you are not God.

It takes one to know one.

It's way above your pay grade.


"DO I BELIEVE HUMANS EXIST?
WHAT ARE THEY FOR?"
there's no yes and no about it--no one can prove he exists = no god...and, please, don't anyone say that stupid shit ''you can't prove he doesn't exist'''

I say we have a showdown like Elijah did against the prophets of Ba’al.

People who believe in humankind on one side and those who believe in God on the other side. Put two alters up with a lamb. Then ask a group of humans to consume the sacrifice and then have the other side ask God to consume the sacrifice.

Then we will know once and for all. Do humans exist or does God exist? We can’t have it both ways.
 
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schmidlap

schmidlap

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My perception of God is that God is infinite logic, infinite truth, infinite intelligence, infinite wisdom, infinite knowledge, infinite love, infinite patience, infinite justice, infinite mercy, infinite kindness and infinite goodness. I am not saying God has those attributes. I am saying God is those attributes. Such that mind has always existed: that this is a life‑breeding universe because the constant presence of mind made it so and imbued his creation with His attributes.
Man's capacity to conceive of infinite perfection while acknowledging man's incapacity to ever understand or attain it is wonderfully human.

“Ah, but a man’s reach should exceed his grasp, or what’s a heaven for?” ~ ROBERT BROWNING
 
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schmidlap

schmidlap

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I say we have a showdown like Elijah did against the prophets of Ba’al.

People who believe in humankind on one side and those who believe in God on the other side. Put two alters up with a lamb. Then ask a group of humans to consume the sacrifice and then have the other side ask God to consume the sacrifice.
No gods take instructions from human game show hosts.
 

vasuderatorrent

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I say we have a showdown like Elijah did against the prophets of Ba’al.

People who believe in humankind on one side and those who believe in God on the other side. Put two alters up with a lamb. Then ask a group of humans to consume the sacrifice and then have the other side ask God to consume the sacrifice.
No gods take instructions from human game show hosts.

I say it would work.
 
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schmidlap

schmidlap

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If we can know nothing about God, we're left with Cthulhu, something utterly alien. We can't know if any of the supposed pronouncements of this "God" mean what we think they mean. If it says "worship me", it might mean "throw yourself into the ocean abyss, to feed my hungry spawn".
Why would any secure, self-confident god ever say to humans, "Worship ME!"?
 

Meriweather

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Why would any secure, self-confident god ever say to humans, "Worship ME!"?
A study of Hebrew and the etymology of 'worship' are interesting. Back in the days of Middle English worship was derived from another word, worthy. The Hebrew word is nothing like modern English. The Hebrew word is often used in the Bible, and it doesn't always reference God, but also worthy men. Bow down indicates obedience. God said, "Be obedient to me".

Is it possible that God wants us to be obedient to Him because love of God and love of our fellow man brings beauty to everyone? God is goodness and wants goodness for His creation?
 
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schmidlap

schmidlap

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Why would any secure, self-confident god ever say to humans, "Worship ME!"?
A study of Hebrew and the etymology of 'worship' are interesting. Back in the days of Middle English worship was derived from another word, worthy. The Hebrew word is nothing like modern English. The Hebrew word is often used in the Bible, and it doesn't always reference God, but also worthy men. Bow down indicates obedience. God said, "Be obedient to me".

Is it possible that God wants us to be obedient to Him because love of God and love of our fellow man brings beauty to everyone? God is goodness and wants goodness for His creation?
With gods, anything is possible.
 

ding

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At the basis of Christianity is a god becoming man. Christianity makes god human. It became very popular with humans for that reason.
That's a fair point. It took me awhile to come to grips with it just as it took early Christians and the Church time to come to grips with it. Their first obstacle was in accepting He was God but the more difficult obstacle was accepting He was fully human and fully God. The thing is unless you believe there was a broad conspiracy to forge ~24,000 written manuscripts, He only gave us two options; He either is who He says He is or He is mad. I don't know anyone who after reading what He said that believes He is mad.
 

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