How do republicans make sense of Trump wanting to push for another round of stimulus payments yet pretends COVID isn’t a crisis?

[Not2BSubjugated]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

 

[Billy000]

I mean which is it? Is it a crisis? Trump definitely doesn’t act like it. He is only pushing for more checks because he desperately wants voters to like him. It’s pretty pathetic.

Republicans generally complain about this kind of socialism yet they won’t with these stimulus checks for two reasons:

1) Trump wants it so therefore it’s a great idea.

2) Welfare like this is obviously excused by republicans because, well, they are people who are getting it lol. It’s not like any republican will say no to their check. They only complain when other people get free monies. They will gladly accept their check yet continue the double speak of COVID being no biggie.

Second stimulus check: Trump says to expect more checks ‘soon’

President Trump said on Tuesday Americans can expect another round of stimulus checks in 2020.

fox8.com

It's simple, you give the public, a few handouts until such time as they can get back TO WORK!

Oh so handouts are fine if Trump does them?

 

[Billy000]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

Okay it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest the shutdowns didn't prevent infections to some degree. Fucking of course they did. Minimizing social contact is how you prevent any fucking virus from spreading. It doesn't matter if Trump always opposed the shutdown. We'd be fucked either way. The option we went with, however, saved lives. You pretending otherwise is stupid. And again, if we did no shut down at all, WAY more people would be dead right now which would inevitably fuck up the economy in its own way. Trump being too stupid to see that doesn't excuse him.

 

[LuckyDuck]

I mean which is it? Is it a crisis? Trump definitely doesn’t act like it. He is only pushing for more checks because he desperately wants voters to like him. It’s pretty pathetic.

Republicans generally complain about this kind of socialism yet they won’t with these stimulus checks for two reasons:

1) Trump wants it so therefore it’s a great idea.

2) Welfare like this is obviously excused by republicans because, well, they are people who are getting it lol. It’s not like any republican will say no to their check. They only complain when other people get free monies. They will gladly accept their check yet continue the double speak of COVID being no biggie.

Second stimulus check: Trump says to expect more checks ‘soon’

President Trump said on Tuesday Americans can expect another round of stimulus checks in 2020.

fox8.com

It's simple, you give the public, a few handouts until such time as they can get back TO WORK!

Oh so handouts are fine if Trump does them?

Only as long as they are extremely "temporary," not part of some Socialist permanent agenda. Once people can get back to work, the handouts must quit. No one should be paid a regular sum for being too lazy to go out and get work, regardless of the type of work it is. The pro-lazy left politicians have publicly said that if you don't want to go to work, you would still be given a regular income. This is absurd. Not one of my tax dollars should go to someone not willing to lift a finger for themselves.

 

[Billy000]

I mean which is it? Is it a crisis? Trump definitely doesn’t act like it. He is only pushing for more checks because he desperately wants voters to like him. It’s pretty pathetic.

Republicans generally complain about this kind of socialism yet they won’t with these stimulus checks for two reasons:

1) Trump wants it so therefore it’s a great idea.

2) Welfare like this is obviously excused by republicans because, well, they are people who are getting it lol. It’s not like any republican will say no to their check. They only complain when other people get free monies. They will gladly accept their check yet continue the double speak of COVID being no biggie.

Second stimulus check: Trump says to expect more checks ‘soon’

President Trump said on Tuesday Americans can expect another round of stimulus checks in 2020.

fox8.com

It's simple, you give the public, a few handouts until such time as they can get back TO WORK!

Oh so handouts are fine if Trump does them?

Only as long as they are extremely "temporary," not part of some Socialist permanent agenda. Once people can get back to work, the handouts must quit. No one should be paid a regular sum for being too lazy to go out and get work, regardless of the type of work it is. The pro-lazy left politicians have publicly said that if you don't want to go to work, you would still be given a regular income. This is absurd. Not one of my tax dollars should go to someone not willing to lift a finger for themselves.

Democrats only want compensation for the duration of the virus. If you don't want to wait that long, it is still arbitrary for Trump to approve these stimulus checks. I mean if the virus is still going to be here after this second round of checks and the shut downs continue, what was the point of the "temporary" checks?

 

[Billy000]

Covid is a crisis...Dems helped to make it one...bigger and bigger and bigger...and then they sent in the rioters that infected who knows how many people....businesses need the nations help right now....we are always first on the scene with aid to tragic events all over the world...now its time we help our own citizens....if you libs and debt fearing republicans want to make this a bad thing you do so at your own peril......its time to help Americans....agree or disagree?....

Lol so what you are saying is that it is the fault of democrats that people need more stimulus checks? Wow that is just precious lol.

No not at all....I blame the virus and the infestation of the virus by folks in the streets not social distancing....businesses were just reopening and the protest started and shut them back down....now the virus is back....and they have to close again....so I support more checks to American small businesses...why don't you?....why?....don't you care enough?....

Lol if businesses are open, what kind of effect do you think that is going to have on social distancing? Obviously there’s a causation there.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

Okay it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest the shutdowns didn't prevent infections to some degree. Fucking of course they did. Minimizing social contact is how you prevent any fucking virus from spreading. It doesn't matter if Trump always opposed the shutdown. We'd be fucked either way. The option we went with, however, saved lives. You pretending otherwise is stupid. And again, if we did no shut down at all, WAY more people would be dead right now which would inevitably fuck up the economy in its own way. Trump being too stupid to see that doesn't excuse him.

I didn't suggest that. No matter how tempting it is to kick down that strawman, it's not the argument I've been making. I'm going to try this one more fucking time for you. Please, attempt to keep in mind that, no matter how convinced you are of the absolute necessity of the lockdowns, there are other people who don't believe that. Any of this making sense for you, and indeed your very ability to understand where other people are coming from in general, is incumbent upon you being able to understand that your beliefs, whether right or wrong, are not everybody else's beliefs.

Trump might be wrong to suggest that the shutdowns were unwarranted. I understand how vehemently you feel that he is. However, the fact that he believes this to be the case does not contradict with the idea that he understands that the shutdowns did, in fact, happen, which means that attempting to address the economic effects of said shutdowns does not make him a hypocrite. No matter how many people you believe would have died without the shutdowns, pointing out those numbers in NO WAY proves or even implies that Donald Trump believes this as well. Whether or not he is a hypocrite hinges on whether or not HE BELIEVES that the shutdowns were necessary, not whether or not they were actually necessary.

If you're going to insist on repeating these numbers and reiterating your reasons for supporting the shutdown as though any of that somehow backs your hypocrisy claim, or if you're going to move the goalposts and try to make our argument about something other than that, you might as well save that shit.

 

[Billy000]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

Okay it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest the shutdowns didn't prevent infections to some degree. Fucking of course they did. Minimizing social contact is how you prevent any fucking virus from spreading. It doesn't matter if Trump always opposed the shutdown. We'd be fucked either way. The option we went with, however, saved lives. You pretending otherwise is stupid. And again, if we did no shut down at all, WAY more people would be dead right now which would inevitably fuck up the economy in its own way. Trump being too stupid to see that doesn't excuse him.

I didn't suggest that. No matter how tempting it is to kick down that strawman, it's not the argument I've been making. I'm going to try this one more fucking time for you. Please, attempt to keep in mind that, no matter how convinced you are of the absolute necessity of the lockdowns, there are other people who don't believe that. Any of this making sense for you, and indeed your very ability to understand where other people are coming from in general, is incumbent upon you being able to understand that your beliefs, whether right or wrong, are not everybody else's beliefs.

Trump might be wrong to suggest that the shutdowns were unwarranted. I understand how vehemently you feel that he is. However, the fact that he believes this to be the case does not contradict with the idea that he understands that the shutdowns did, in fact, happen, which means that attempting to address the economic effects of said shutdowns does not make him a hypocrite. No matter how many people you believe would have died without the shutdowns, pointing out those numbers in NO WAY proves or even implies that Donald Trump believes this as well. Whether or not he is a hypocrite hinges on whether or not HE BELIEVES that the shutdowns were necessary, not whether or not they were actually necessary.

If you're going to insist on repeating these numbers and reiterating your reasons for supporting the shutdown as though any of that somehow backs your hypocrisy claim, or if you're going to move the goalposts and try to make our argument about something other than that, you might as well save that shit.

Lol dude you are really splitting hairs on this shit. Youre arguing over such a stupid minor point which is Trump and his reasoning for the checks as a result of the shutdown itself. But from my perspective, Trump trying to separate these two issues regardless is fucking stupid. Even if Trump’s intention is doing this for the sake of the economy and NOT because of the virus as you claim, it is still fucking stupid. It’s fucking stupid to even hammer that point home.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

Okay it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest the shutdowns didn't prevent infections to some degree. Fucking of course they did. Minimizing social contact is how you prevent any fucking virus from spreading. It doesn't matter if Trump always opposed the shutdown. We'd be fucked either way. The option we went with, however, saved lives. You pretending otherwise is stupid. And again, if we did no shut down at all, WAY more people would be dead right now which would inevitably fuck up the economy in its own way. Trump being too stupid to see that doesn't excuse him.

I didn't suggest that. No matter how tempting it is to kick down that strawman, it's not the argument I've been making. I'm going to try this one more fucking time for you. Please, attempt to keep in mind that, no matter how convinced you are of the absolute necessity of the lockdowns, there are other people who don't believe that. Any of this making sense for you, and indeed your very ability to understand where other people are coming from in general, is incumbent upon you being able to understand that your beliefs, whether right or wrong, are not everybody else's beliefs.

Trump might be wrong to suggest that the shutdowns were unwarranted. I understand how vehemently you feel that he is. However, the fact that he believes this to be the case does not contradict with the idea that he understands that the shutdowns did, in fact, happen, which means that attempting to address the economic effects of said shutdowns does not make him a hypocrite. No matter how many people you believe would have died without the shutdowns, pointing out those numbers in NO WAY proves or even implies that Donald Trump believes this as well. Whether or not he is a hypocrite hinges on whether or not HE BELIEVES that the shutdowns were necessary, not whether or not they were actually necessary.

If you're going to insist on repeating these numbers and reiterating your reasons for supporting the shutdown as though any of that somehow backs your hypocrisy claim, or if you're going to move the goalposts and try to make our argument about something other than that, you might as well save that shit.

Lol dude you are really splitting hairs on this shit. Youre arguing over such a stupid minor point which is Trump and his reasoning for the checks as a result of the shutdown itself. But from my perspective, Trump trying to separate these two issues regardless is fucking stupid. Even if Trump’s intention is doing this for the sake of the economy and NOT because of the virus as you claim, it is still fucking stupid. It’s fucking stupid to even hammer that point home.

I'm arguing over the point you made in your OP. If it's a minor, hair splitting point, why was it literally the focus of your initial statement?

The very title of this thread asks how republicans make sense of Trump pushing more stimulus while refusing to acknowledge that covid is a threat. Thus, this entire time, I've been attempting to answer that question for you. If the answer to that question is too unimportant to be the subject of a conversation, DONT ASK THE QUESTION.

 

[Billy000]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

Okay it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest the shutdowns didn't prevent infections to some degree. Fucking of course they did. Minimizing social contact is how you prevent any fucking virus from spreading. It doesn't matter if Trump always opposed the shutdown. We'd be fucked either way. The option we went with, however, saved lives. You pretending otherwise is stupid. And again, if we did no shut down at all, WAY more people would be dead right now which would inevitably fuck up the economy in its own way. Trump being too stupid to see that doesn't excuse him.

I didn't suggest that. No matter how tempting it is to kick down that strawman, it's not the argument I've been making. I'm going to try this one more fucking time for you. Please, attempt to keep in mind that, no matter how convinced you are of the absolute necessity of the lockdowns, there are other people who don't believe that. Any of this making sense for you, and indeed your very ability to understand where other people are coming from in general, is incumbent upon you being able to understand that your beliefs, whether right or wrong, are not everybody else's beliefs.

Trump might be wrong to suggest that the shutdowns were unwarranted. I understand how vehemently you feel that he is. However, the fact that he believes this to be the case does not contradict with the idea that he understands that the shutdowns did, in fact, happen, which means that attempting to address the economic effects of said shutdowns does not make him a hypocrite. No matter how many people you believe would have died without the shutdowns, pointing out those numbers in NO WAY proves or even implies that Donald Trump believes this as well. Whether or not he is a hypocrite hinges on whether or not HE BELIEVES that the shutdowns were necessary, not whether or not they were actually necessary.

If you're going to insist on repeating these numbers and reiterating your reasons for supporting the shutdown as though any of that somehow backs your hypocrisy claim, or if you're going to move the goalposts and try to make our argument about something other than that, you might as well save that shit.

Lol dude you are really splitting hairs on this shit. Youre arguing over such a stupid minor point which is Trump and his reasoning for the checks as a result of the shutdown itself. But from my perspective, Trump trying to separate these two issues regardless is fucking stupid. Even if Trump’s intention is doing this for the sake of the economy and NOT because of the virus as you claim, it is still fucking stupid. It’s fucking stupid to even hammer that point home.

I'm arguing over the point you made in your OP. If it's a minor, hair splitting point, why was it literally the focus of your initial statement?

My original point is that the economy and the virus are intertwined regardless of what justification Trump gives for this shit. Either way, you seem so convinced over his mindset. You’re really just speculating on this thought process as to WHY he wanted these stimulus checks but you’re convinced of it.

 

[Frankeneinstein]

I mean which is it? Is it a crisis? Trump definitely doesn’t act like it. He is only pushing for more checks because he desperately wants voters to like him. It’s pretty pathetic.

Republicans generally complain about this kind of socialism yet they won’t with these stimulus checks for two reasons:

1) Trump wants it so therefore it’s a great idea.

2) Welfare like this is obviously excused by republicans because, well, they are people who are getting it lol. It’s not like any republican will say no to their check. They only complain when other people get free monies. They will gladly accept their check yet continue the double speak of COVID being no biggie.

Second stimulus check: Trump says to expect more checks ‘soon’

President Trump said on Tuesday Americans can expect another round of stimulus checks in 2020.

fox8.com

LOL Billy, covid is most certainly a manufactured crisis, it is the flu doing what every flu does, kills some but leaves the vast majority alive, it did not shut down the US, white liberals did and like when they want to destroy something they hide behind minorities, when they want to infect something they hide behind the flu...the antidote for white liberals is trump, and their only salvation is to rid the host of him...that's why they are writhing in pain right now, the cure is upon them

 

[Harry Dresden]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

yea billy lots of people aint working so yea they are running out money.....you need someone to prove that for ya?....quit being an asswipe.....

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

Okay it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest the shutdowns didn't prevent infections to some degree. Fucking of course they did. Minimizing social contact is how you prevent any fucking virus from spreading. It doesn't matter if Trump always opposed the shutdown. We'd be fucked either way. The option we went with, however, saved lives. You pretending otherwise is stupid. And again, if we did no shut down at all, WAY more people would be dead right now which would inevitably fuck up the economy in its own way. Trump being too stupid to see that doesn't excuse him.

I didn't suggest that. No matter how tempting it is to kick down that strawman, it's not the argument I've been making. I'm going to try this one more fucking time for you. Please, attempt to keep in mind that, no matter how convinced you are of the absolute necessity of the lockdowns, there are other people who don't believe that. Any of this making sense for you, and indeed your very ability to understand where other people are coming from in general, is incumbent upon you being able to understand that your beliefs, whether right or wrong, are not everybody else's beliefs.

Trump might be wrong to suggest that the shutdowns were unwarranted. I understand how vehemently you feel that he is. However, the fact that he believes this to be the case does not contradict with the idea that he understands that the shutdowns did, in fact, happen, which means that attempting to address the economic effects of said shutdowns does not make him a hypocrite. No matter how many people you believe would have died without the shutdowns, pointing out those numbers in NO WAY proves or even implies that Donald Trump believes this as well. Whether or not he is a hypocrite hinges on whether or not HE BELIEVES that the shutdowns were necessary, not whether or not they were actually necessary.

If you're going to insist on repeating these numbers and reiterating your reasons for supporting the shutdown as though any of that somehow backs your hypocrisy claim, or if you're going to move the goalposts and try to make our argument about something other than that, you might as well save that shit.

Lol dude you are really splitting hairs on this shit. Youre arguing over such a stupid minor point which is Trump and his reasoning for the checks as a result of the shutdown itself. But from my perspective, Trump trying to separate these two issues regardless is fucking stupid. Even if Trump’s intention is doing this for the sake of the economy and NOT because of the virus as you claim, it is still fucking stupid. It’s fucking stupid to even hammer that point home.

I'm arguing over the point you made in your OP. If it's a minor, hair splitting point, why was it literally the focus of your initial statement?

My original point is that the economy and the virus are intertwined regardless of what justification Trump gives for this shit. Either way, you seem so convinced over his mindset. You’re really just speculating on this thought process as to WHY he wanted these stimulus checks but you’re convinced of it.

That was demonstrably not your original point. That point appears NOWHERE in your OP. First you say:

I mean which is it? Is it a crisis? Trump definitely doesn’t act like it. He is only pushing for more checks because he desperately wants voters to like him. It’s pretty pathetic.

Asking that question in no way presents the idea that the economy is directly intertwined with the virus. All it does is explore Trump's motives for this claimed disparity in his thinking. After that, you say:

Republicans generally complain about this kind of socialism yet they won’t with these stimulus checks for two reasons:

1) Trump wants it so therefore it’s a great idea.

2) Welfare like this is obviously excused by republicans because, well, they are people who are getting it lol. It’s not like any republican will say no to their check. They only complain when other people get free monies. They will gladly accept their check yet continue the double speak of COVID being no biggie.

Once again, none of this so much as mentions the relationship of the virus to the economy. All any of this does is cynically explore why Republicans agree with the stimulus proposal. After that, you post your article, and that's it. So you see, NOWHERE in your OP did you actually make any point, other than that Trump is a hypocrite, that he does it because he wants his voters to like him, and that Republicans are hypocrites because they don't like welfare or socialism until they're the ones benefitting from it.

And again, the very title of your thread is, "How do republicans make sense of Trump wanting to push for another round of stimulus payments yet pretends COVID isn’t a crisis?"

So no, I'm sorry, you didn't start out making a noble point about how our economic troubles are an inevitable result of a shutdown that is absolutely necessary and in no way overblown, and I didn't come in here and turn your thread petty to derail it. What actually happened is that you started out making a petty argument, got tired of trying to defend it, and opted for some goal post shifting, projection and accusation in stead of just admitting that you didn't really think through what you were saying.

Also, yes, I'm speculating on his mindset, but so are you. And again, YOU ASKED HOW REPUBLICANS RECONCILE HIS BELIEFS. I explained to you how that happens. They do so by believing that Trump honestly believes that the threat has been overblown and that the reaction went too far. It might be speculation, but it's not outside of the realm of what people might think, especially when a lot of the people in question believe that very scenario themselves.

 

[Billy000]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

Okay it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest the shutdowns didn't prevent infections to some degree. Fucking of course they did. Minimizing social contact is how you prevent any fucking virus from spreading. It doesn't matter if Trump always opposed the shutdown. We'd be fucked either way. The option we went with, however, saved lives. You pretending otherwise is stupid. And again, if we did no shut down at all, WAY more people would be dead right now which would inevitably fuck up the economy in its own way. Trump being too stupid to see that doesn't excuse him.

I didn't suggest that. No matter how tempting it is to kick down that strawman, it's not the argument I've been making. I'm going to try this one more fucking time for you. Please, attempt to keep in mind that, no matter how convinced you are of the absolute necessity of the lockdowns, there are other people who don't believe that. Any of this making sense for you, and indeed your very ability to understand where other people are coming from in general, is incumbent upon you being able to understand that your beliefs, whether right or wrong, are not everybody else's beliefs.

Trump might be wrong to suggest that the shutdowns were unwarranted. I understand how vehemently you feel that he is. However, the fact that he believes this to be the case does not contradict with the idea that he understands that the shutdowns did, in fact, happen, which means that attempting to address the economic effects of said shutdowns does not make him a hypocrite. No matter how many people you believe would have died without the shutdowns, pointing out those numbers in NO WAY proves or even implies that Donald Trump believes this as well. Whether or not he is a hypocrite hinges on whether or not HE BELIEVES that the shutdowns were necessary, not whether or not they were actually necessary.

If you're going to insist on repeating these numbers and reiterating your reasons for supporting the shutdown as though any of that somehow backs your hypocrisy claim, or if you're going to move the goalposts and try to make our argument about something other than that, you might as well save that shit.

Lol dude you are really splitting hairs on this shit. Youre arguing over such a stupid minor point which is Trump and his reasoning for the checks as a result of the shutdown itself. But from my perspective, Trump trying to separate these two issues regardless is fucking stupid. Even if Trump’s intention is doing this for the sake of the economy and NOT because of the virus as you claim, it is still fucking stupid. It’s fucking stupid to even hammer that point home.

I'm arguing over the point you made in your OP. If it's a minor, hair splitting point, why was it literally the focus of your initial statement?

My original point is that the economy and the virus are intertwined regardless of what justification Trump gives for this shit. Either way, you seem so convinced over his mindset. You’re really just speculating on this thought process as to WHY he wanted these stimulus checks but you’re convinced of it.

That was demonstrably not your original point. That point appears NOWHERE in your OP. First you say:

I mean which is it? Is it a crisis? Trump definitely doesn’t act like it. He is only pushing for more checks because he desperately wants voters to like him. It’s pretty pathetic.

Asking that question in no way presents the idea that the economy is directly intertwined with the virus. All it does is explore Trump's motives for this claimed disparity in his thinking. After that, you say:

Republicans generally complain about this kind of socialism yet they won’t with these stimulus checks for two reasons:

1) Trump wants it so therefore it’s a great idea.

2) Welfare like this is obviously excused by republicans because, well, they are people who are getting it lol. It’s not like any republican will say no to their check. They only complain when other people get free monies. They will gladly accept their check yet continue the double speak of COVID being no biggie.

Once again, none of this so much as mentions the relationship of the virus to the economy. All any of this does is cynically explore why Republicans agree with the stimulus proposal. After that, you post your article, and that's it. So you see, NOWHERE in your OP did you actually make any point, other than that Trump is a hypocrite, that he does it because he wants his voters to like him, and that Republicans are hypocrites because they don't like welfare or socialism until they're the ones benefitting from it.

And again, the very title of your thread is, "How do republicans make sense of Trump wanting to push for another round of stimulus payments yet pretends COVID isn’t a crisis?"

So no, I'm sorry, you didn't start out making a noble point about how our economic troubles are an inevitable result of a shutdown that is absolutely necessary and in no way overblown, and I didn't come in here and turn your thread petty to derail it. What actually happened is that you started out making a petty argument, got tired of trying to defend it, and opted for some projection and accusation in stead of just admitting that you didn't really think through what you were saying.

Okay I am going to speak as plainly as I can lol. Your assertion that Trump wanted these checks because of the economic toll and the economic toll only is SPECULATION. You don’t know that’s true. You’re just pretending that is true. Because he’s never said such a thing, it’s a moot point. You’re just trying to justify the contradiction. The contradiction speaks for itself. You pretending Trump did this for the economy and NOT the virus is speculation. My entire post is based on the facts. The facts of Trump wanting a stimulus check despite it contradicting his rhetoric speaks for itself.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

Okay it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest the shutdowns didn't prevent infections to some degree. Fucking of course they did. Minimizing social contact is how you prevent any fucking virus from spreading. It doesn't matter if Trump always opposed the shutdown. We'd be fucked either way. The option we went with, however, saved lives. You pretending otherwise is stupid. And again, if we did no shut down at all, WAY more people would be dead right now which would inevitably fuck up the economy in its own way. Trump being too stupid to see that doesn't excuse him.

I didn't suggest that. No matter how tempting it is to kick down that strawman, it's not the argument I've been making. I'm going to try this one more fucking time for you. Please, attempt to keep in mind that, no matter how convinced you are of the absolute necessity of the lockdowns, there are other people who don't believe that. Any of this making sense for you, and indeed your very ability to understand where other people are coming from in general, is incumbent upon you being able to understand that your beliefs, whether right or wrong, are not everybody else's beliefs.

Trump might be wrong to suggest that the shutdowns were unwarranted. I understand how vehemently you feel that he is. However, the fact that he believes this to be the case does not contradict with the idea that he understands that the shutdowns did, in fact, happen, which means that attempting to address the economic effects of said shutdowns does not make him a hypocrite. No matter how many people you believe would have died without the shutdowns, pointing out those numbers in NO WAY proves or even implies that Donald Trump believes this as well. Whether or not he is a hypocrite hinges on whether or not HE BELIEVES that the shutdowns were necessary, not whether or not they were actually necessary.

If you're going to insist on repeating these numbers and reiterating your reasons for supporting the shutdown as though any of that somehow backs your hypocrisy claim, or if you're going to move the goalposts and try to make our argument about something other than that, you might as well save that shit.

Lol dude you are really splitting hairs on this shit. Youre arguing over such a stupid minor point which is Trump and his reasoning for the checks as a result of the shutdown itself. But from my perspective, Trump trying to separate these two issues regardless is fucking stupid. Even if Trump’s intention is doing this for the sake of the economy and NOT because of the virus as you claim, it is still fucking stupid. It’s fucking stupid to even hammer that point home.

I'm arguing over the point you made in your OP. If it's a minor, hair splitting point, why was it literally the focus of your initial statement?

My original point is that the economy and the virus are intertwined regardless of what justification Trump gives for this shit. Either way, you seem so convinced over his mindset. You’re really just speculating on this thought process as to WHY he wanted these stimulus checks but you’re convinced of it.

That was demonstrably not your original point. That point appears NOWHERE in your OP. First you say:

I mean which is it? Is it a crisis? Trump definitely doesn’t act like it. He is only pushing for more checks because he desperately wants voters to like him. It’s pretty pathetic.

Asking that question in no way presents the idea that the economy is directly intertwined with the virus. All it does is explore Trump's motives for this claimed disparity in his thinking. After that, you say:

Republicans generally complain about this kind of socialism yet they won’t with these stimulus checks for two reasons:

1) Trump wants it so therefore it’s a great idea.

2) Welfare like this is obviously excused by republicans because, well, they are people who are getting it lol. It’s not like any republican will say no to their check. They only complain when other people get free monies. They will gladly accept their check yet continue the double speak of COVID being no biggie.

Once again, none of this so much as mentions the relationship of the virus to the economy. All any of this does is cynically explore why Republicans agree with the stimulus proposal. After that, you post your article, and that's it. So you see, NOWHERE in your OP did you actually make any point, other than that Trump is a hypocrite, that he does it because he wants his voters to like him, and that Republicans are hypocrites because they don't like welfare or socialism until they're the ones benefitting from it.

And again, the very title of your thread is, "How do republicans make sense of Trump wanting to push for another round of stimulus payments yet pretends COVID isn’t a crisis?"

So no, I'm sorry, you didn't start out making a noble point about how our economic troubles are an inevitable result of a shutdown that is absolutely necessary and in no way overblown, and I didn't come in here and turn your thread petty to derail it. What actually happened is that you started out making a petty argument, got tired of trying to defend it, and opted for some projection and accusation in stead of just admitting that you didn't really think through what you were saying.

Okay I am going to speak as plainly as I can lol. Your assertion that Trump wanted these checks because of the economic toll and the economic toll only is SPECULATION. You don’t know that’s true. You’re just pretending that is true. Because he’s never said such a thing, it’s a moot point. You’re just trying to justify the contradiction. The contradiction speaks for itself. You pretending Trump did this for the economy and NOT the virus is speculation. My entire post is based on the facts. The facts of Trump wanting a stimulus check despite it contradicting his rhetoric speaks for itself.

I'm speculating and you're being factual?

When you're telling me Trump is being a hypocrite, that's factual and not based on your own speculation of his beliefs and motives?

When you're telling me Trump is only doing it because he wants his voters to like him, that's factual and not based on your own speculation of his motives and mental state?

When you're telling me that Republicans secretly like socialism as long as they're the ones being paid, that's factual and not you speculating on their motives and beliefs?

When you're telling me that Republicans enjoy welfare as long as they're the ones getting checks, that's factual and not you speculating on their motives and beliefs?

Holy motherfucking shit this thread has been nothing BUT speculation from the fucking ground up! Acting like I'm unique in that regard after the shit you've been posting is just a SHAMEFUL lack of self awareness.

Honestly, so much of what you've said here, even when you're trying to characterize things that you've said here, are so obviously and demonstrably fucking false that I'm kind of impressed that you keep going.

 

[Billy000]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

Okay it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest the shutdowns didn't prevent infections to some degree. Fucking of course they did. Minimizing social contact is how you prevent any fucking virus from spreading. It doesn't matter if Trump always opposed the shutdown. We'd be fucked either way. The option we went with, however, saved lives. You pretending otherwise is stupid. And again, if we did no shut down at all, WAY more people would be dead right now which would inevitably fuck up the economy in its own way. Trump being too stupid to see that doesn't excuse him.

I didn't suggest that. No matter how tempting it is to kick down that strawman, it's not the argument I've been making. I'm going to try this one more fucking time for you. Please, attempt to keep in mind that, no matter how convinced you are of the absolute necessity of the lockdowns, there are other people who don't believe that. Any of this making sense for you, and indeed your very ability to understand where other people are coming from in general, is incumbent upon you being able to understand that your beliefs, whether right or wrong, are not everybody else's beliefs.

Trump might be wrong to suggest that the shutdowns were unwarranted. I understand how vehemently you feel that he is. However, the fact that he believes this to be the case does not contradict with the idea that he understands that the shutdowns did, in fact, happen, which means that attempting to address the economic effects of said shutdowns does not make him a hypocrite. No matter how many people you believe would have died without the shutdowns, pointing out those numbers in NO WAY proves or even implies that Donald Trump believes this as well. Whether or not he is a hypocrite hinges on whether or not HE BELIEVES that the shutdowns were necessary, not whether or not they were actually necessary.

If you're going to insist on repeating these numbers and reiterating your reasons for supporting the shutdown as though any of that somehow backs your hypocrisy claim, or if you're going to move the goalposts and try to make our argument about something other than that, you might as well save that shit.

Lol dude you are really splitting hairs on this shit. Youre arguing over such a stupid minor point which is Trump and his reasoning for the checks as a result of the shutdown itself. But from my perspective, Trump trying to separate these two issues regardless is fucking stupid. Even if Trump’s intention is doing this for the sake of the economy and NOT because of the virus as you claim, it is still fucking stupid. It’s fucking stupid to even hammer that point home.

I'm arguing over the point you made in your OP. If it's a minor, hair splitting point, why was it literally the focus of your initial statement?

My original point is that the economy and the virus are intertwined regardless of what justification Trump gives for this shit. Either way, you seem so convinced over his mindset. You’re really just speculating on this thought process as to WHY he wanted these stimulus checks but you’re convinced of it.

That was demonstrably not your original point. That point appears NOWHERE in your OP. First you say:

I mean which is it? Is it a crisis? Trump definitely doesn’t act like it. He is only pushing for more checks because he desperately wants voters to like him. It’s pretty pathetic.

Asking that question in no way presents the idea that the economy is directly intertwined with the virus. All it does is explore Trump's motives for this claimed disparity in his thinking. After that, you say:

Republicans generally complain about this kind of socialism yet they won’t with these stimulus checks for two reasons:

1) Trump wants it so therefore it’s a great idea.

2) Welfare like this is obviously excused by republicans because, well, they are people who are getting it lol. It’s not like any republican will say no to their check. They only complain when other people get free monies. They will gladly accept their check yet continue the double speak of COVID being no biggie.

Once again, none of this so much as mentions the relationship of the virus to the economy. All any of this does is cynically explore why Republicans agree with the stimulus proposal. After that, you post your article, and that's it. So you see, NOWHERE in your OP did you actually make any point, other than that Trump is a hypocrite, that he does it because he wants his voters to like him, and that Republicans are hypocrites because they don't like welfare or socialism until they're the ones benefitting from it.

And again, the very title of your thread is, "How do republicans make sense of Trump wanting to push for another round of stimulus payments yet pretends COVID isn’t a crisis?"

So no, I'm sorry, you didn't start out making a noble point about how our economic troubles are an inevitable result of a shutdown that is absolutely necessary and in no way overblown, and I didn't come in here and turn your thread petty to derail it. What actually happened is that you started out making a petty argument, got tired of trying to defend it, and opted for some projection and accusation in stead of just admitting that you didn't really think through what you were saying.

Okay I am going to speak as plainly as I can lol. Your assertion that Trump wanted these checks because of the economic toll and the economic toll only is SPECULATION. You don’t know that’s true. You’re just pretending that is true. Because he’s never said such a thing, it’s a moot point. You’re just trying to justify the contradiction. The contradiction speaks for itself. You pretending Trump did this for the economy and NOT the virus is speculation. My entire post is based on the facts. The facts of Trump wanting a stimulus check despite it contradicting his rhetoric speaks for itself.

I'm speculating and you're being factual?

When you're telling me Trump is being a hypocrite, that's factual and not based on your own speculation of his beliefs and motives?

When you're telling me Trump is only doing it because he wants his voters to like him, that's factual and not based on your own speculation of his motives and mental state?

When you're telling me that Republicans secretly like socialism as long as they're the ones being paid, that's factual and not you speculating on their motives and beliefs?

When you're telling me that Republicans enjoy welfare as long as they're the ones getting checks, that's factual and not you speculating on their motives and beliefs?

Holy motherfucking shit this thread has been nothing BUT speculation from the fucking ground up! Acting like I'm unique in that regard after the shit you've been posting is just a SHAMEFUL lack of self awareness.

Honestly, so much of what you've said here, even when you're trying to characterize things that you've said here, are so obviously and demonstrably fucking false that I'm kind of impressed that you keep going.

Here’s the difference. My opinions are based on facts. Each of my assertion is something based on cause and effect. While granted my opinions could be wrong, but they are still supported by facts.

Facts such as republicans spending their first round of stimulus checks.

The fact that Trump has said no message whatsoever on the Covid shutdown when he talks about these checks.

YOUR opinion that Trump is doing this for the sake of the economy only, is not based on anything he said or did. It’s purely speculative reasoning.

 

[Obiwan]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

Okay it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest the shutdowns didn't prevent infections to some degree. Fucking of course they did. Minimizing social contact is how you prevent any fucking virus from spreading. It doesn't matter if Trump always opposed the shutdown. We'd be fucked either way. The option we went with, however, saved lives. You pretending otherwise is stupid. And again, if we did no shut down at all, WAY more people would be dead right now which would inevitably fuck up the economy in its own way. Trump being too stupid to see that doesn't excuse him.

I didn't suggest that. No matter how tempting it is to kick down that strawman, it's not the argument I've been making. I'm going to try this one more fucking time for you. Please, attempt to keep in mind that, no matter how convinced you are of the absolute necessity of the lockdowns, there are other people who don't believe that. Any of this making sense for you, and indeed your very ability to understand where other people are coming from in general, is incumbent upon you being able to understand that your beliefs, whether right or wrong, are not everybody else's beliefs.

Trump might be wrong to suggest that the shutdowns were unwarranted. I understand how vehemently you feel that he is. However, the fact that he believes this to be the case does not contradict with the idea that he understands that the shutdowns did, in fact, happen, which means that attempting to address the economic effects of said shutdowns does not make him a hypocrite. No matter how many people you believe would have died without the shutdowns, pointing out those numbers in NO WAY proves or even implies that Donald Trump believes this as well. Whether or not he is a hypocrite hinges on whether or not HE BELIEVES that the shutdowns were necessary, not whether or not they were actually necessary.

If you're going to insist on repeating these numbers and reiterating your reasons for supporting the shutdown as though any of that somehow backs your hypocrisy claim, or if you're going to move the goalposts and try to make our argument about something other than that, you might as well save that shit.

Lol dude you are really splitting hairs on this shit. Youre arguing over such a stupid minor point which is Trump and his reasoning for the checks as a result of the shutdown itself. But from my perspective, Trump trying to separate these two issues regardless is fucking stupid. Even if Trump’s intention is doing this for the sake of the economy and NOT because of the virus as you claim, it is still fucking stupid. It’s fucking stupid to even hammer that point home.

I'm arguing over the point you made in your OP. If it's a minor, hair splitting point, why was it literally the focus of your initial statement?

My original point is that the economy and the virus are intertwined regardless of what justification Trump gives for this shit. Either way, you seem so convinced over his mindset. You’re really just speculating on this thought process as to WHY he wanted these stimulus checks but you’re convinced of it.

So, Billy...

What is YOUR solution???

Is it to let the economy reopen, and if the Libs want to keep cowering under their beds, let them starve???

Or would you rather let the Libs keep everything shut down, and let people start eating their pets to survive, where they can get a dose of that communist utopia you want so much???

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

If it turned out that all the news was false and all of Covid19 was an absolute hoax (and mind you, I'm not saying that I believe this to be the case in the slightest), that wouldn't change the damage that the shutdown has done to the economy.

Trump is pushing for more stimulus payments because people are broke, not because they're sick. Whether or not Covid19 is as much of a health crisis as they say is irrelevant to the reality of peoples' finances, and Trump's opinions on the matter don't dictate whether or not state governers are going to shut down again/extend ongoing shutdown rules. Don't confuse the concept of "related" with the concept of "directly causal." It'll fuck your perceptions all up.

Because they are broke huh? So Trump arbitrarily decides people need money huh? Not because of the virus?

The virus didn't take everybody's money away, genius. The shutdown did. Viruses, in the biological sense of the word, don't have the capacity to raid your bank account or lift your wallet.

Sure, the governers shut down because of the virus, but since Trump isn't the one deciding on whether or not to shut down, the fact that he doesn't consider the virus to be the threat that the MSM does isn't in any sort of confliction with his recognition that the economy is in the shitter.

Stop being willfully dense about this, I know you're not as dumb as you're playing.

Lol so let’s pretend we never did a shut down and every thing was just normal from the beginning. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be? I mean right now it is 130k. If we did NOTHING to slow the spread. How much higher would it be?

WTF does that have to do with what we're talking about? Our argument wasn't about whether it was right or wrong to shut down the economy, and at no point in anything I've posted in this thread did I venture an opinion on that matter. I said that the economy is where it is regardless of whether Trump acknowledges the threat of the virus. Even if he believed that Covid19 didn't exist and the whole thing was a lie cooked up by China and the Dems, it wouldn't force him to believe that the shutdowns had never happened and that everybody was still going to work like normal.

Honestly the proposition that it's somehow impossible to simultaneously believe that the threat that the virus poses to our health is greatly exaggerated, AND that our reaction to it has hurt the economy, is so insanely God damn ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing that you actually believe it. These two thoughts aren't even REMOTELY contradictory.

The point I am obviously making is that the economy and the virus are completely intertwined issues. Therefore Trump wanting new stimulus checks is hypocritical if he wants to pretend the virus isn't a big deal. If the economy was never shut down, we'd still be in the shitter because many more people would be currently dead than 135k.

Fair enough that this is your point, but it's still a bullshit point. The fact that the governers have shut down for long enough for the economy to be where it is isn't a factual indicator of the virus's potency, it's only an indicator of those governers' perception of the virus's potency. It doesn't make Trump a hypocrite to believe that the governers overreacted to the virus and fucked up the economy more than they had to. It might make him wrong, but there's nothing self-contradictory about that belief. Nothing about what you've said here actually backs the premise of your OP.

Okay it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest the shutdowns didn't prevent infections to some degree. Fucking of course they did. Minimizing social contact is how you prevent any fucking virus from spreading. It doesn't matter if Trump always opposed the shutdown. We'd be fucked either way. The option we went with, however, saved lives. You pretending otherwise is stupid. And again, if we did no shut down at all, WAY more people would be dead right now which would inevitably fuck up the economy in its own way. Trump being too stupid to see that doesn't excuse him.

I didn't suggest that. No matter how tempting it is to kick down that strawman, it's not the argument I've been making. I'm going to try this one more fucking time for you. Please, attempt to keep in mind that, no matter how convinced you are of the absolute necessity of the lockdowns, there are other people who don't believe that. Any of this making sense for you, and indeed your very ability to understand where other people are coming from in general, is incumbent upon you being able to understand that your beliefs, whether right or wrong, are not everybody else's beliefs.

Trump might be wrong to suggest that the shutdowns were unwarranted. I understand how vehemently you feel that he is. However, the fact that he believes this to be the case does not contradict with the idea that he understands that the shutdowns did, in fact, happen, which means that attempting to address the economic effects of said shutdowns does not make him a hypocrite. No matter how many people you believe would have died without the shutdowns, pointing out those numbers in NO WAY proves or even implies that Donald Trump believes this as well. Whether or not he is a hypocrite hinges on whether or not HE BELIEVES that the shutdowns were necessary, not whether or not they were actually necessary.

If you're going to insist on repeating these numbers and reiterating your reasons for supporting the shutdown as though any of that somehow backs your hypocrisy claim, or if you're going to move the goalposts and try to make our argument about something other than that, you might as well save that shit.

Lol dude you are really splitting hairs on this shit. Youre arguing over such a stupid minor point which is Trump and his reasoning for the checks as a result of the shutdown itself. But from my perspective, Trump trying to separate these two issues regardless is fucking stupid. Even if Trump’s intention is doing this for the sake of the economy and NOT because of the virus as you claim, it is still fucking stupid. It’s fucking stupid to even hammer that point home.

I'm arguing over the point you made in your OP. If it's a minor, hair splitting point, why was it literally the focus of your initial statement?

My original point is that the economy and the virus are intertwined regardless of what justification Trump gives for this shit. Either way, you seem so convinced over his mindset. You’re really just speculating on this thought process as to WHY he wanted these stimulus checks but you’re convinced of it.

That was demonstrably not your original point. That point appears NOWHERE in your OP. First you say:

I mean which is it? Is it a crisis? Trump definitely doesn’t act like it. He is only pushing for more checks because he desperately wants voters to like him. It’s pretty pathetic.

Asking that question in no way presents the idea that the economy is directly intertwined with the virus. All it does is explore Trump's motives for this claimed disparity in his thinking. After that, you say:

Republicans generally complain about this kind of socialism yet they won’t with these stimulus checks for two reasons:

1) Trump wants it so therefore it’s a great idea.

2) Welfare like this is obviously excused by republicans because, well, they are people who are getting it lol. It’s not like any republican will say no to their check. They only complain when other people get free monies. They will gladly accept their check yet continue the double speak of COVID being no biggie.

Once again, none of this so much as mentions the relationship of the virus to the economy. All any of this does is cynically explore why Republicans agree with the stimulus proposal. After that, you post your article, and that's it. So you see, NOWHERE in your OP did you actually make any point, other than that Trump is a hypocrite, that he does it because he wants his voters to like him, and that Republicans are hypocrites because they don't like welfare or socialism until they're the ones benefitting from it.

And again, the very title of your thread is, "How do republicans make sense of Trump wanting to push for another round of stimulus payments yet pretends COVID isn’t a crisis?"

So no, I'm sorry, you didn't start out making a noble point about how our economic troubles are an inevitable result of a shutdown that is absolutely necessary and in no way overblown, and I didn't come in here and turn your thread petty to derail it. What actually happened is that you started out making a petty argument, got tired of trying to defend it, and opted for some projection and accusation in stead of just admitting that you didn't really think through what you were saying.

Okay I am going to speak as plainly as I can lol. Your assertion that Trump wanted these checks because of the economic toll and the economic toll only is SPECULATION. You don’t know that’s true. You’re just pretending that is true. Because he’s never said such a thing, it’s a moot point. You’re just trying to justify the contradiction. The contradiction speaks for itself. You pretending Trump did this for the economy and NOT the virus is speculation. My entire post is based on the facts. The facts of Trump wanting a stimulus check despite it contradicting his rhetoric speaks for itself.

I'm speculating and you're being factual?

When you're telling me Trump is being a hypocrite, that's factual and not based on your own speculation of his beliefs and motives?

When you're telling me Trump is only doing it because he wants his voters to like him, that's factual and not based on your own speculation of his motives and mental state?

When you're telling me that Republicans secretly like socialism as long as they're the ones being paid, that's factual and not you speculating on their motives and beliefs?

When you're telling me that Republicans enjoy welfare as long as they're the ones getting checks, that's factual and not you speculating on their motives and beliefs?

Holy motherfucking shit this thread has been nothing BUT speculation from the fucking ground up! Acting like I'm unique in that regard after the shit you've been posting is just a SHAMEFUL lack of self awareness.

Honestly, so much of what you've said here, even when you're trying to characterize things that you've said here, are so obviously and demonstrably fucking false that I'm kind of impressed that you keep going.

Here’s the difference. My opinions are based on facts. Each of my assertion is something based on cause and effect. While granted my opinions could be wrong, but they are still supported by facts.

Facts such as republicans spending their first round of stimulus checks.

The fact that Trump has said no message whatsoever on the Covid shutdown when he talks about these checks.

YOUR opinion that Trump is doing this for the sake of the economy only, is not based on anything he said or did. It’s purely speculative reasoning.

Your opinions might be based, at some level, on facts, but so are mine. That doesn't change the fact that they are opinions, and thus speculation. I get that you believe that your speculations are more logical and insightful than other peoples' speculations, but you know who else believes that? EVERY HUMAN WHO HAS EVER FUCKING EXISTED.

Simply making the assertion that your opinions are more factual than mine without bothering to present any of these supposed facts is just a wordy way to say, "I'm right and you're wrong cuz I'm more smart than you." If updating the language of the juvenile verbal tactic makes you feel better about producing that turd, more power to you, but rest assured that anybody with half a brain can still identify it as a turd.

For the record, my opinion that Trump is doing this for the sake of the economy is based on the probability (some of us can admit that our assertions aren't facts, no matter how strongly we believe in them or how probable it seems to be that they're true) that Trump recognizes that the enthusiastic support of his voting base (you know, the right wingers who you folks are constantly chiding for underestimating the severity of the virus?) depends heavily upon the perception that his presidency has been good for the economy as a whole and good for their pocketbooks in particular. Therefore, if he wants to get reelected, and I don't believe that it's unrealistic to assume that he does, it seems pretty obvious that keeping those pocketbooks from going empty and trying to enable businesses to pay their bills without operating for long enough to survive the lockdown so that he can have bright shiny job numbers to point to in November is his strongest case, especially considering all the blame the Dems and the MSM are/will be laying at his feet for the Covid19 deaths. I'm not saying that I know that he believes that this will be good for the economy in the long term, I'm just assuming that he's hoping to at least cushion the impact that the shutdown has on the perception of his economy for the purposes of reelection. I'd say that's a pretty safe assumption.

In terms of whether or not Trump believes that it was shutting down the economy and forcing most businesses to stop operating that caused everybody to get laid off, yes, I do believe that. I believe that based on the fact that EVERYBODY believes that forcing businesses to stop operating is what caused them to lay everybody off, and the fact that THOSE people believe this because IT is a fact.

EDIT - Pardon me, you did present one fact. Republicans did spend their stimulus checks. Your speculation on their motives and whether or not makes them hypocrites, however, is still speculation. Generally speaking, republicans don't favor welfare. . . compared to democrats. That said, most republicans DO believe that there should be some degree of social/financial safety net. The difference between them and democrats is how much of a social safety net, who it should be available to, and what if any requirements should have to be met to qualify for these things. You'll be hard pressed to find republicans who oppose the concept of stimulus checks to make up for the government mandating a temporary shutdown of all "nonessential" economic activity, so aside from being every bit as speculative as anything that I've said, your assertion of hypocrisy in this case is also largely incorrect.

Now, rather than claiming that your speculations are in fact not speculations but knowledge, why don't you present some of these supposed facts that you cite.

 

[Andylusion]

I mean which is it? Is it a crisis? Trump definitely doesn’t act like it. He is only pushing for more checks because he desperately wants voters to like him. It’s pretty pathetic.

Republicans generally complain about this kind of socialism yet they won’t with these stimulus checks for two reasons:

1) Trump wants it so therefore it’s a great idea.

2) Welfare like this is obviously excused by republicans because, well, they are people who are getting it lol. It’s not like any republican will say no to their check. They only complain when other people get free monies. They will gladly accept their check yet continue the double speak of COVID being no biggie.

Second stimulus check: Trump says to expect more checks ‘soon’

President Trump said on Tuesday Americans can expect another round of stimulus checks in 2020.

fox8.com

First off I disagree with the lock down and the stimulus.

Second, I don't care about Trump.

Third, if the government forces a shutdown of the economy, then it is somewhat logical that the group causing the damage, should pay for the damage, does it not?

The real solution is stop all the nonsense, and end all restrictions on the economy.

Let's pretend we never did a lockdown and from the beginning carried on like there was no virus at all. Just how much bigger do you think the death toll would be now if we never did any shutdown whatsoever? Would you really believe it would be 135k which is what the current death toll is?

Again, Japan and Sweden did not do a lock down, and their death rates are not much different than the rest of the world.

In fact, the places that had the most draconian lock downs, had much worse death rates.

There is almost no real correlation between lock down measures and death rates. Almost none.

There is no factual evidence you can point to, no science, no medical data, that shows that the lock downs were all that effective anywhere.

I think we should have not forced people with Covid-19 back into nursing homes with the most vulnerable people.

I think basic, wise, prudent moves, were all that were needed, just like Japan and Sweden.

No one is suggesting we carry on like there was no illness at all. What we are suggesting is that the lock down, and closing half the country, was unwarranted, and unnecessary, and ineffective, and the facts back that assessment.

That's our point. You can keep playing hypotheticals until the end of time, but I will keep hammering on the facts. Japan and Sweden did not have lock downs. Florida did not have mass lock downs. NYC did. Which had the biggest death rates? NYC.

That's not opinion. That's fact.

 

[Rambunctious]

Covid is a crisis...Dems helped to make it one...bigger and bigger and bigger...and then they sent in the rioters that infected who knows how many people....businesses need the nations help right now....we are always first on the scene with aid to tragic events all over the world...now its time we help our own citizens....if you libs and debt fearing republicans want to make this a bad thing you do so at your own peril......its time to help Americans....agree or disagree?....

Lol so what you are saying is that it is the fault of democrats that people need more stimulus checks? Wow that is just precious lol.

Agree or disagree?....time to help our own countrymen?....like we do for people all around the world.....or not?....