Here’s the reason people tell me they want to buy an AR-15. And it’s simply ludicrous

[WinterBorn]

I think an AR would do fine as a defensive firearm. And I support law abiding citizens being able to buy them.

But there are some other guns I think serve that purpose better. The AR, even in a shorter, tactical setup, is a bit awkward in the house.

1) A semi auto handgun would work great. I have a 1911 in my nightstand in a locked vault. It is more maneuverable in tight spaces and plenty accurate for the job.
2) A revolver of a sufficient caliber. They work every time and jams are exceedingly rare. A .357 revolver would be an excellent choice.
3) A pump shotgun. In addition to the fear factor of hearing a pump shotgun action being worked to chamber a round, it is powerful and will not over penetrate walls. The biggest drawback, imho, is the same as the AR. It is too long.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Let's take the hypothetical further, Batcat shouted, "Go home", to the crowd, they dispersed and went home. No selected gun needed.

It didn't work during the summer of love riots.

 

[Batcat]

Batcat...let me take a stab at this....


How about this..... I'll just make up a situation off the top of my head....

You own a business in a city, and the democrat party has ordered blm and antifa, their brown shirt thugs, to burn, loot and kill in your neighborhood to make it hard for the republican candidate to win an election......the democrat mayor of the city has ordered the police to stand down and do nothing to stop this attack.... a large crowd of blm, and antifa brown shirts have indeed burned and looted the various businesses around you and your business is next in line............

Which firearm do you recommend in this fanciful situation?

Obviously an AR-15 or similar semiautomatic rifle.

 

[Captain Caveman]

The harvard study was a joke.....

You are now known as LPofDS

 

[Captain Caveman]

It didn't work during the summer of love riots.

Because you didn't disperse?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

I think an AR would do fine as a defensive firearm. And I support law abiding citizens being able to buy them.

But there are some other guns I think serve that purpose better. The AR, even in a shorter, tactical setup, is a bit awkward in the house.

1) A semi auto handgun would work great. I have a 1911 in my nightstand in a locked vault. It is more maneuverable in tight spaces and plenty accurate for the job.
2) A revolver of a sufficient caliber. They work every time and jams are exceedingly rare. A .357 revolver would be an excellent choice.
3) A pump shotgun. In addition to the fear factor of hearing a pump shotgun action being worked to chamber a round, it is powerful and will not over penetrate walls. The biggest drawback, imho, is the same as the AR. It is too long.

A pump shotgun has limited capacity, to much kick for smaller frame people and take experience to reload in a stressful event.
Revolver limited capacity
Semiautomatic pistol depending on the caliber will be too powerful for most women, so if you go down to a 380 you're back to limited capacity.
Women most of them are a better shot with an AR and it doesn't have the kick.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Because you didn't disperse?

Because they didn't disperse which makes your belief stupid.

 

[WinterBorn]

A pump shotgun has limited capacity, to much kick for smaller frame people and take experience to reload in a stressful event.
Revolver limited capacity
Semiautomatic pistol depending on the caliber will be too powerful for most women, so if you go down to a 380 you're back to limited capacity.
Women most of them are a better shot with an AR and it doesn't have the kick.

All good points. The limited capacity of the revolver is less of an issue if you practice a lot with a speedloader. My g/f can reload her revolver 4 or 5 seconds. It will probably take that long for the bad guys to realize she might be out of rounds.

I think a 9mm semi auto won't produce too much recoil for most smaller people.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

A pump shotgun has limited capacity, to much kick for smaller frame people and take experience to reload in a stressful event.
Revolver limited capacity
Semiautomatic pistol depending on the caliber will be too powerful for most women, so if you go down to a 380 you're back to limited capacity.
Women most of them are a better shot with an AR and it doesn't have the kick.

I agree for the most part.
I've found that I can reload my revolver every bit as fast as my .45,of course thats using moon clips.
It takes about two seconds.....

 

[WinterBorn]

Yes 5.56 and .223 are almost the same round. Many AR's can shoot both rounds.
And you really wouldnt want to hunt deer with either round. While yes it will kill a deer it's not really potent enough for a deer rifle.
The .243 is a bit better but for me the .270 is the right round.
Anything bigger is overkill.

One point to make about using a .223/5.56mm for hunting is the performance of the round.

While I agree that it is unsuitable for deer, that may just be my own prejudice. One of the most popular guns for hog hunting is an AR. And hogs are tough animals.

A .22 caliber bullet is not suitable in most cases. But the .223/5.56mm has the advantage that the bullet is hauling ass. At such high speeds the hydrostatic shock destroys organs and will usually drop a medium size wild pig, or a human. Plus they are very accurate rounds.

I had an AR that I built specifically for coyote hunting 10 or 15 years ago. It was a tack driver. And the lack of recoil and the speed of the followup rounds made it possible for me to get a pair of "twofers" (2 coyote for one calling). But a guy who lived near me kept offering me more money. So I sold it.

 

[Rigby5]

But he’s correct about wanting to own an AR 15 to ‘defend against government tyranny’ as being ridiculous nonsense.
,,,

As is always the case after a mass shooting or similar event, we see inane, baseless reasons contrived to ‘justify’ owning an AR 15 in a pathetic and unnecessary attempt to fend-off a ‘ban’ of such weapons where there is no political will to do so.

Besides domestic criminals and external invaders, the biggest threat any society always faces if domestic tyranny.
All governments become tyrannical eventually.
Anyone who does not realize that obvious historic fact, and prepare for it, is either ignorant, lazy, or a traitor.

Banning civilian weapons is an obvious increase in tyranny.
Civilians can be trusted with these weapons much more than mercenary police or the military.
It is always the police and military who convert democracies into dictatorships.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

One point to make about using a .223/5.56mm for hunting is the performance of the round.

While I agree that it is unsuitable for deer, that may just be my own prejudice. One of the most popular guns for hog hunting is an AR. And hogs are tough animals.

A .22 caliber bullet is not suitable in most cases. But the .223/5.56mm has the advantage that the bullet is hauling ass. At such high speeds the hydrostatic shock destroys organs and will usually drop a medium size wild pig, or a human. Plus they are very accurate rounds.

I had an AR that I built specifically for coyote hunting 10 or 15 years ago. It was a tack driver. And the lack of recoil and the speed of the followup rounds made it possible for me to get a pair of "twofers" (2 coyote for one calling). But a guy who lived near me kept offering me more money. So I sold it.

There's a ranch down I-10 between Houston and San Antonio that specializes in hog hunts.
They used to not allow you to use 5.56 but with the newer rounds they've come up with he changed the rules.
He brought up the Swine Smasher round in particular.

 

[Circe]

after witnessing the violent mobs looting burning and killing and the demonization and demoralization of the police with instruction from dem leaders to stand down during said riots maybe they just want extra protection for themselves and their families .

THIS of course is actually why gun guys are all getting AR-15s. Duh. Mobs.

People don't care to say that, of course. Nor should they.

Considering the serious breakdown of law and order I think it's a very good idea to be well armed.

 

[Circe]

It's the only real argument gun nuts have, "Fuck off, we like guns". All their rhetoric is copy and pasted fallacies.

No, we just don't like to talk to you about it. Why would we?

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Besides domestic criminals and external invaders, the biggest threat any society always faces if domestic tyranny.
All governments become tyrannical eventually.
Anyone who does not realize that obvious historic fact, and prepare for it, is either ignorant, lazy, or a traitor.

Banning civilian weapons is an obvious increase in tyranny.
Civilians can be trusted with these weapons much more than mercenary police or the military.
It is always the police and military who convert democracies into dictatorships.

I noticed Clayton never told us which firearms were more effective than the A/R.
Wonder why?

 

[Flash]

Because you didn't disperse?

The shitheads that tried to kill Kyle Rittenhouse sure as hell "dispersed" after he shot three of the sonofabitches with his AR, didn' they?

 

[there4eyeM]

The "AR" looks like the real thing. The "AR" is the real thing in disguise. It is a wannabe, and those who want it are, too.

 

[WinterBorn]

The "AR" looks like the real thing. The "AR" is the real thing in disguise. It is a wannabe, and those who want it are, too.

The funny thing, after I sold my AR I bought a Ruger Mini-14. Same caliber. At the local range I had gotten some looks for my AR, but never did for my Ruger. A big part of the AR's issue is pure cosmetics.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

The "AR" looks like the real thing. The "AR" is the real thing in disguise. It is a wannabe, and those who want it are, too.

Actually it does a great job for what its intended purpose is.
It's lightweight,holds a decent amount of ammo,it's accurate and it provides multiple places to mount lights,lasers,scopes.....etc.
More people are killed in military conflicts by single well aimed shots than fully automatic fire.

 

[Rigby5]

Semiautomatic pistol depending on the caliber will be too powerful for most women, so if you go down to a 380 you're back to limited capacity.

Ruger, CZ, and Beretta all sell high capacity magazine pistols in .380.
That is because .380 is sort of a world standard for police, outside the US.