Here is who REALLY owns the government:

[The Rabbi]

You must have better eye sight than I have because I can't find that text in his post.

Not better eyesight. Smarter.

says the guy who said Perry (R) was going to win the nomination from day-one Don't lecture anyone here guy.

Wow, total fail from Dotbomb.

 

[The T]

Exactly how do you propose to change it?

In 2009 right up to today, the political class has made significant inroads into solidifying their power. They are nearly to the point where our elected seats will become hereditary. One has only to look at the beginning of this with the Kennedy's. Then the Bushes. Congressional Seats and Senate seats are nearly lifetime appointments, given to the newest member by the old guard quietly retiring on the taxpayers money, to live out their golden years in luxury.

How did this come about? People screamed about what they lost. And what they lost was money. Wall street grew and became bloated because the political class wants and needs power. So, they pump 85 billion dollars a month, fattening the coffers of business, but more importantly, keeping the pension funds of those special voters fully funded.

They write labor contract laws that put the taxpayer on the hook for any risk they incur, and give nothing back.

There are literally dozens of groups just like these, all wanting a slice of the pie at no cost to themselves.

To blame JUST the bankers is ludicrous.

Elected officials can be bribed because they want to be bribed.

Amazing that were so close to agreement. Diff is -- there are MORE powers that are bribable, then there used to be. Allowing the Feds to micromanage the marketplace and pick winners and losers just screams corruption. That and the fact that there is no place to hide from your party leadership for politicians with principles. Congress is literally run by 4 people. The 2 parties ekther cut corrupt deals or block all progress. We need to de-emphasize party and elect more independents, or start relying on 3rd parties to give shelter to pols with some morals and convictions.

I am to the point where I would support a Constitutional Amendment banning all political parties. If you want to run for office, then you better convince people of your character, your intent, and your vision and do it separate from any national party or organization.

And have the record to show for it.

 

[The T]

It is always strange when everyone can agree that this is a problem but they turn it into a partisan issue. Both sides are guilty. Maybe if people stopped arguing about which side was more guilty something could get done to fix the problem.

Like banding together and ridding ourselves of the POLITICIANS in it for themselves on BOTH SIDES...and putting in Temporary STATESMEN that really represent...

Maybe?

Question is, could you band with someone like me? I think for most people appearing smart is more important than using logic, and since I am already considered a moron in the community, you feel it's best not to associate with someone like me.

However? WE may have common ground as in Government run amok and stealing our liberty piecemeal.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Pretty sure the american people, those who vote control the government. Last I checked, these "big banks" can't vote.

Nominated for the Head in the Sand award of the day.

 

[JWBooth]

Pretty sure the american people, those who vote control the government. Last I checked, these "big banks" can't vote.

Naivete is cute....except when it affects others.

 

[Bombur]

I think it is one part apathy and partially just because they don't really consider it an option. If they have never done it they don't really know they can do it.

Damn are we lucky to have you on here sharing these huge insights with us, or what?

So what issues are you taking up this year?

So nothing. Thought so.

 

[Dot Com]

Problem isnt who is in power. The problem is we are letting them excersize progressively MORE power. If we ALL complained when they do selective bailouts of their FAVORITE bankers, and told them not to do that -- wouldnt matter if Goldman or Lehman guys run the treasury or the Fed.

I see that you're one of the few people in this thread that actually watched the interview in the OP.

 

[Dot Com]

Not better eyesight. Smarter.

says the guy who said Perry (R) was going to win the nomination from day-one Don't lecture anyone here guy.

Thanks for that tidbit.
I did find it interesting that after Perry left the campaign trail and relaxed a bit he came off a tad more intelligent than he did during the debates.

once he brought up crony capitalism & made a few gaffes, the Establishment shunned him. Repubs are the king of crony capitalism w/ defense contractors for the pentagon (google- duke cunningham (R-CA). Its their golden goose It was good that he brought up the crony capitalism practiced by both sides BUT if we got all that dark $$$ out of politics then, it might ameliorate some of the more brazen theft.

This is why I don't vote at the national- level anymore. It only encourages them.

The Quiet Coup - Simon Johnson - The Atlantic

(snip)

The crash has laid bare many unpleasant truths about the United States. One of the most alarming, says a former chief economist of the International Monetary Fund, is that the finance industry has effectively captured our government—a state of affairs that more typically describes emerging markets, and is at the center of many emerging-market crises. If the IMF’s staff could speak freely about the U.S., it would tell us what it tells all countries in this situation: recovery will fail unless we break the financial oligarchy that is blocking essential reform. And if we are to prevent a true depression, we’re running out of time.

Exactly how do you propose to change it?

In 2009 right up to today, the political class has made significant inroads into solidifying their power. They are nearly to the point where our elected seats will become hereditary. One has only to look at the beginning of this with the Kennedy's. Then the Bushes. Congressional Seats and Senate seats are nearly lifetime appointments, given to the newest member by the old guard quietly retiring on the taxpayers money, to live out their golden years in luxury.

How did this come about? People screamed about what they lost. And what they lost was money. Wall street grew and became bloated because the political class wants and needs power. So, they pump 85 billion dollars a month, fattening the coffers of business, but more importantly, keeping the pension funds of those special voters fully funded.

They write labor contract laws that put the taxpayer on the hook for any risk they incur, and give nothing back.

There are literally dozens of groups just like these, all wanting a slice of the pie at no cost to themselves.

To blame JUST the bankers is ludicrous.

Elected officials can be bribed because they want to be bribed.

ummm..... no They take the money because

1) thats the way the game is currently rigged thanks in no small part to Repubs (see citizens united and the watering-down of the BCRA )

and 2) very few congress critters are there based on principle only, such as Bernie Sanders. The rest took the bribes..... errr.....campaign contributions from the likes of JPM from day-1

 

[Dot Com]

Exactly how do you propose to change it?

In 2009 right up to today, the political class has made significant inroads into solidifying their power. They are nearly to the point where our elected seats will become hereditary. One has only to look at the beginning of this with the Kennedy's. Then the Bushes. Congressional Seats and Senate seats are nearly lifetime appointments, given to the newest member by the old guard quietly retiring on the taxpayers money, to live out their golden years in luxury.

How did this come about? People screamed about what they lost. And what they lost was money. Wall street grew and became bloated because the political class wants and needs power. So, they pump 85 billion dollars a month, fattening the coffers of business, but more importantly, keeping the pension funds of those special voters fully funded.

They write labor contract laws that put the taxpayer on the hook for any risk they incur, and give nothing back.

There are literally dozens of groups just like these, all wanting a slice of the pie at no cost to themselves.

To blame JUST the bankers is ludicrous.

Elected officials can be bribed because they want to be bribed.

Amazing that were so close to agreement. Diff is -- there are MORE powers that are bribable, then there used to be. Allowing the Feds to micromanage the marketplace and pick winners and losers just screams corruption. That and the fact that there is no place to hide from your party leadership for politicians with principles. Congress is literally run by 4 people. The 2 parties ekther cut corrupt deals or block all progress. We need to de-emphasize party and elect more independents, or start relying on 3rd parties to give shelter to pols with some morals and convictions.

I am to the point where I would support a Constitutional Amendment banning all political parties. If you want to run for office, then you better convince people of your character, your intent, and your vision and do it separate from any national party or organization.

that might help some. Washington was against political parties and their malevolent influence. It would help to ban dark $$$ and future employment at wall st firms, defense contractors, think tanks, etc...

 

[hangover]

If Americans don't like the bills passed by Congress, they can vote them out, "big banks" couldn't stop a congressman from being removed. So no, you are wrong.

People get what they vote for, there is no conspiracy afoot.

the bills/laws they enacted will still be there even if the congressman is voted out.

You're naive as they come. Having a choice between one of these two parties is no choice at all. They both simply take turns at the trough

New Congressmen can repeal bills or write laws making previous legislation obsolete.

The thing here is, you just can't accept the fact no one buys your tinfoil hat brand of politics. Instead of just waking to the fact that you are out of the mainstream, you create this illusion that everyone agrees with you, but are kept down by some mystery men behind the curtain.

Really sad. Corporate business owns you like those that followed Jim Jones. Hook, line and sinker.

 

[The Rabbi]

Damn are we lucky to have you on here sharing these huge insights with us, or what?

So what issues are you taking up this year?

So nothing. Thought so.

I'm waiting for suggestions, given your track record here of propounding brilliant original insights. You da man.

 

[Bombur]

So what issues are you taking up this year?

So nothing. Thought so.

I'm waiting for suggestions, given your track record here of propounding brilliant original insights. You da man.

Your state probably has a surplus. How about you talk to your legislators about being fiscally responsible with that surplus so that when the next recession hits your state isn't dealing with massive deficits again.

 

[The Rabbi]

So nothing. Thought so.

I'm waiting for suggestions, given your track record here of propounding brilliant original insights. You da man.

Your state probably has a surplus. How about you talk to your legislators about being fiscally responsible with that surplus so that when the next recession hits your state isn't dealing with massive deficits again.

I'm not sure we do.
So you think lobbying for "fiscal responsibilty" is a winner? That's gonna be a tough sell against all those people pushing for fiscal irresponsibility but your continued brilliant insights give me hope.

 

[Bombur]

I'm waiting for suggestions, given your track record here of propounding brilliant original insights. You da man.

Your state probably has a surplus. How about you talk to your legislators about being fiscally responsible with that surplus so that when the next recession hits your state isn't dealing with massive deficits again.

I'm not sure we do.
So you think lobbying for "fiscal responsibilty" is a winner? That's gonna be a tough sell against all those people pushing for fiscal irresponsibility but your continued brilliant insights give me hope.

I agree it is just easier to complain about things from behind a computer.

 

[Darkwind]

says the guy who said Perry (R) was going to win the nomination from day-one Don't lecture anyone here guy.

Thanks for that tidbit.
I did find it interesting that after Perry left the campaign trail and relaxed a bit he came off a tad more intelligent than he did during the debates.

once he brought up crony capitalism & made a few gaffes, the Establishment shunned him. Repubs are the king of crony capitalism w/ defense contractors for the pentagon (google- duke cunningham (R-CA). Its their golden goose It ws good that he brought up the crony capitalism practiced by both sides BUT if we got all that dak $$$ out of politics then, it might ameliorate some of the more brazen theft.

This is why I don't vote at the national- level anymore. It only encourages them.

The Quiet Coup - Simon Johnson - The Atlantic

(snip)

Exactly how do you propose to change it?

In 2009 right up to today, the political class has made significant inroads into solidifying their power. They are nearly to the point where our elected seats will become hereditary. One has only to look at the beginning of this with the Kennedy's. Then the Bushes. Congressional Seats and Senate seats are nearly lifetime appointments, given to the newest member by the old guard quietly retiring on the taxpayers money, to live out their golden years in luxury.

How did this come about? People screamed about what they lost. And what they lost was money. Wall street grew and became bloated because the political class wants and needs power. So, they pump 85 billion dollars a month, fattening the coffers of business, but more importantly, keeping the pension funds of those special voters fully funded.

They write labor contract laws that put the taxpayer on the hook for any risk they incur, and give nothing back.

There are literally dozens of groups just like these, all wanting a slice of the pie at no cost to themselves.

To blame JUST the bankers is ludicrous.

Elected officials can be bribed because they want to be bribed.

ummm..... no They take the money because

1) thats the way the game is currently rigged thanks in no small part to Repubs (see citizens united and the watering-down of the BCRA )

and 2) very few congress critters are there based on principle only, such as Bernie Sanders. The rest took the bribes..... errr.....campaign contributions from the likes of JPM from day-1

Well, e for effort. You're partially right, which is more than you usually do.

 

[healthmyths]

they can afford 3 lobbyists per congressman to *cough* "help" write bills. You?

You just don't "get it". It isn't who gets elected, its what bills get passed.

If Americans don't like the bills passed by Congress, they can vote them out, "big banks" couldn't stop a congressman from being removed. So no, you are wrong.

People get what they vote for, there is no conspiracy afoot.

People voted for a Nobel peace prize winner guy who promised dialog with Iran and Syria, I voted for a guy who promised no nation building, and the video below takes home my point, I rest my case, now you can switch the subject:

[ame=http://youtu.be/3DvwMrRzrPw]Fraud They call Democratic Elections in America (same I'm sure in other axis of democracy nations) - YouTube[/ame]

You wrote "promised no nation building," and GWB never did any "nation building"!
You as many seem to forget the "1991 Cease Fire" that during the 12 years Saddam was still in power HE abrogated dozens of times.
You also seem to forget what happened after 9/11... remember anthrax attacks? Did you know convincingly at that time the Saddam wasn't behind them?
Did you also forget these 32 Democrat quotes that demanded Saddam to be removed? Not one discussion point about nation building in any.
So where are you coming from regarding GWB and "nation building"???
32 democrat quotes indicate even before GWB that Saddam was a threat!

"..deny Iraq the capacity to develop WMD".Bill Clinton,1998
"..most brutal dictators of Century", Biden,1998
"Iraq compliance with Resolution 687 becomes shell game"..Daschle 1998
"He will use those WMDs again,as he has ten times since 1983" ..Berger Clinton Ntl. Secur. Advr 1998
"posed by Iraq's refusal to end its WMD programs" Levin 1998
"Saddam has been engaged in development of WMDs which is a threat.."Pelosi 1998 WHERE'D SHE GET THIS INFORMATION BEFORE BUSH?
"Hussein has chosen to spend his money on building WMDS.."Albright 1999
"Saddam to refine delivery systems, that will threaten the US..."Graham 2001
"Saddam has ignored the mandate of the UN and is building WMDs and the means to deliver.." Levin 2002
"Iraq's search for WMDs ...will continue as long as Saddam's in power"..Gore 2002
"Saddam retains stockpiles of WMDS.."Byrd 2002
"..give President authority to use force..to disarm Saddam because an arsenal of WMDs..threat our security"..Kerry 2002
"..Unmistakable evidence Saddam developing nuclear weapons next 5 years.."Rockefeller 2002
"Violated over 11 years every UN resolution demanding disarming WMDs.."Waxman 2002
"He's given aid,comfort & sanctuary to al Qaeda members..and keep developing WMDs"..Hillary 2002
"Compelling evidence Saddam has WMDs production storage capacity.." Graham 2002
"Without a question, we need to disarm Saddam. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime .... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction .... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real ...."Kerry , Jan. 23. 2003.


"Between 1999 and 2001, the U.S. and British-led air forces in Iraq dropped 1.3 million pounds of bombs in response to purported violations of the no-fly zones and anti-aircraft fire from Saddam Hussein.
A sweeping attack, conducted in January of 1999, rained down 25 missiles on Iraqi soil, killing civilians. Clinton said the attack was in response to four planes violating the no-fly zones.
Clinton and British Prime Minister Tony Blair authorized air strikes on more than 100 days in 1999, sometimes several times per day. The bombings were ostensibly in response to Husseins refusal to allow UN weapons inspectors into the country, though critics alleged the move was aimed at deflecting attention from impeachment.
The Raw Story | Clinton bombing of Iraq far exceeded Bush's in run-up to war; Bush 'spikes of activity' questioned

 

[The Rabbi]

Your state probably has a surplus. How about you talk to your legislators about being fiscally responsible with that surplus so that when the next recession hits your state isn't dealing with massive deficits again.

I'm not sure we do.
So you think lobbying for "fiscal responsibilty" is a winner? That's gonna be a tough sell against all those people pushing for fiscal irresponsibility but your continued brilliant insights give me hope.

I agree it is just easier to complain about things from behind a computer.

Wow, another golden statement from our resident philosopher! Can I quote you on that?

 

[Bombur]

I'm not sure we do.
So you think lobbying for "fiscal responsibilty" is a winner? That's gonna be a tough sell against all those people pushing for fiscal irresponsibility but your continued brilliant insights give me hope.

I agree it is just easier to complain about things from behind a computer.

Wow, another golden statement from our resident philosopher! Can I quote you on that?

 

[Dot Com]

the bills/laws they enacted will still be there even if the congressman is voted out.

You're naive as they come. Having a choice between one of these two parties is no choice at all. They both simply take turns at the trough

New Congressmen can repeal bills or write laws making previous legislation obsolete.

The thing here is, you just can't accept the fact no one buys your tinfoil hat brand of politics. Instead of just waking to the fact that you are out of the mainstream, you create this illusion that everyone agrees with you, but are kept down by some mystery men behind the curtain.

Really sad. Corporate business owns you like those that followed Jim Jones. Hook, line and sinker.

true but, in his defense, he admitted that he is so young that he wasn't even old enough to vote when 43 was up for re-election. I take umbrage w/ his "The Rabbi-like" attitude where he thinks people should take his opinions as "expert"

I'm not sure we do.
So you think lobbying for "fiscal responsibilty" is a winner? That's gonna be a tough sell against all those people pushing for fiscal irresponsibility but your continued brilliant insights give me hope.

I agree it is just easier to complain about things from behind a computer.

Wow, another golden statement from our resident philosopher! Can I quote you on that?

... says the guy who was a Perry bandwagon jumper before he even declared his candidacy

Question: what have you done to redeem yourself from that disastrous premonition of yours? IOW's why should anyone take you seriously now?

 

[flacaltenn]

Exactly how do you propose to change it?

In 2009 right up to today, the political class has made significant inroads into solidifying their power. They are nearly to the point where our elected seats will become hereditary. One has only to look at the beginning of this with the Kennedy's. Then the Bushes. Congressional Seats and Senate seats are nearly lifetime appointments, given to the newest member by the old guard quietly retiring on the taxpayers money, to live out their golden years in luxury.

How did this come about? People screamed about what they lost. And what they lost was money. Wall street grew and became bloated because the political class wants and needs power. So, they pump 85 billion dollars a month, fattening the coffers of business, but more importantly, keeping the pension funds of those special voters fully funded.

They write labor contract laws that put the taxpayer on the hook for any risk they incur, and give nothing back.

There are literally dozens of groups just like these, all wanting a slice of the pie at no cost to themselves.

To blame JUST the bankers is ludicrous.

Elected officials can be bribed because they want to be bribed.

Amazing that were so close to agreement. Diff is -- there are MORE powers that are bribable, then there used to be. Allowing the Feds to micromanage the marketplace and pick winners and losers just screams corruption. That and the fact that there is no place to hide from your party leadership for politicians with principles. Congress is literally run by 4 people. The 2 parties ekther cut corrupt deals or block all progress. We need to de-emphasize party and elect more independents, or start relying on 3rd parties to give shelter to pols with some morals and convictions.

I am to the point where I would support a Constitutional Amendment banning all political parties. If you want to run for office, then you better convince people of your character, your intent, and your vision and do it separate from any national party or organization.

Rules for administering Congress have been abused. And it's those rules that have been used to consolidate power into very few hands through the 2 parties. No where in the Constitution does it say that Congress is controlled by 4 folks.. (now Harry Reid, Mitch McConnell, Boniour and Pelosi.. ) NOTHING moves, no one gets political clout except thru these folks. All committee assignments, all back room deals are done by these extra-constitutional rules. Either we OPEN the process and force Coalitions to be built thru 3rd parties, or we neuter the 2 Major parties in terms of the administrative rules that gives that much power to just 4 folks.. If that fails -- prohibit Administrative organization of Congress by party affiliation.. I wouldn't be opposed to replacing the Majority/Minority Leaders with a Panel composed of proportional representation.