Zone1 Grant Christianity protections as a registered disability

[john54]

Lately some of my views on Christianity have evolved and I wonder if I might be getting closer to "getting it," if you'll just consider this idea. I've recognized that to many Christians their beliefs aren't seen as a problem and also for many it may be something they'll deal with for life, and it isn't reasonable to expect people steeped in it to just up and overcome it. Nor is it even kind to try in many cases.


Just as with obesity, while it's important to teach good health, simply stigmatizing the obese too often leads to cruelty, as the fact remains that millions will be obese for life, either way. Whether one's efforts to lose weight have failed, or whether one has made a life choice to remain how they are, they should be respected and certainly not denied appropriate help when it's reached the stage of disability.

More and more often nowadays the ADA and APA are treating both physical and mental health disorders as only a problem if the patient considers it a problem. Many with diagnoses including dissociative disorders, and even schizophrenia remain high-functioning and do not seek or require help. To add to that, some actually credit schizophrenia as prompting the success of artists like Vincent van Gogh, and yes, even religious leaders like Jesus Christ and Muhammad.


To that effect, if Christians find that they can still lead high functioning lives and aren't impeded by Christianity, why not drop the "religious" legal affiliation and instead, as a society, choose to include Christianity and other theistic religions in a category where they can receive disability services -if needed- and be protected against discrimination? As if Christians aren't already suffering enough believing their loved ones will burn in hell, and that rapture could come any day. Insulting the religion they're stuck with on top of that is hardly a helpful solution.


Jesus needed help and support for his own schizophrenia and instead was cruelly mobbed and killed. And what better way to love and honor a person persecuted simply for having a different brain than most, than to love and honor those with similar mental health disorders in today's world - not just Christians, but Muslims, Jews, Hindhus and so forth - why not offer the safety net of "registered disability" and address the real issue of religion head-on?

 

[progressive hunter]

Lately some of my views on Christianity have evolved and I wonder if I might be getting closer to "getting it," if you'll just consider this idea. I've recognized that to many Christians their beliefs aren't seen as a problem and also for many it may be something they'll deal with for life, and it isn't reasonable to expect people steeped in it to just up and overcome it. Nor is it even kind to try in many cases.


Just as with obesity, while it's important to teach good health, simply stigmatizing the obese too often leads to cruelty, as the fact remains that millions will be obese for life, either way. Whether one's efforts to lose weight have failed, or whether one has made a life choice to remain how they are, they should be respected and certainly not denied appropriate help when it's reached the stage of disability.

More and more often nowadays the ADA and APA are treating both physical and mental health disorders as only a problem if the patient considers it a problem. Many with diagnoses including dissociative disorders, and even schizophrenia remain high-functioning and do not seek or require help. To add to that, some actually credit schizophrenia as prompting the success of artists like Vincent van Gogh, and yes, even religious leaders like Jesus Christ and Muhammad.


To that effect, if Christians find that they can still lead high functioning lives and aren't impeded by Christianity, why not drop the "religious" legal affiliation and instead, as a society, choose to include Christianity and other theistic religions in a category where they can receive disability services -if needed- and be protected against discrimination? As if Christians aren't already suffering enough believing their loved ones will burn in hell, and that rapture could come every day, insulting the religion they're stuck with is hardly a helpful solution.


Jesus needed help and support for his own schizophrenia and instead was cruelly mobbed and killed. And what better way to love and honor a person persecuted simply for having a different brain than most, than to love and honor those with similar mental health disorders in today's world - not just Christians, but Muslims, Jews, Hindhus and so forth - why not offer the safety net of "registered disability" and address the real issue of religion head-on?

you still have some learning to do,,,

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Lately some of my views on Christianity have evolved and I wonder if I might be getting closer to "getting it," if you'll just consider this idea. I've recognized that to many Christians their beliefs aren't seen as a problem and also for many it may be something they'll deal with for life, and it isn't reasonable to expect people steeped in it to just up and overcome it. Nor is it even kind to try in many cases.


Just as with obesity, while it's important to teach good health, simply stigmatizing the obese too often leads to cruelty, as the fact remains that millions will be obese for life, either way. Whether one's efforts to lose weight have failed, or whether one has made a life choice to remain how they are, they should be respected and certainly not denied appropriate help when it's reached the stage of disability.

More and more often nowadays the ADA and APA are treating both physical and mental health disorders as only a problem if the patient considers it a problem. Many with diagnoses including dissociative disorders, and even schizophrenia remain high-functioning and do not seek or require help. To add to that, some actually credit schizophrenia as prompting the success of artists like Vincent van Gogh, and yes, even religious leaders like Jesus Christ and Muhammad.


To that effect, if Christians find that they can still lead high functioning lives and aren't impeded by Christianity, why not drop the "religious" legal affiliation and instead, as a society, choose to include Christianity and other theistic religions in a category where they can receive disability services -if needed- and be protected against discrimination? As if Christians aren't already suffering enough believing their loved ones will burn in hell, and that rapture could come every day, insulting the religion they're stuck with is hardly a helpful solution.


Jesus needed help and support for his own schizophrenia and instead was cruelly mobbed and killed. And what better way to love and honor a person persecuted simply for having a different brain than most, than to love and honor those with similar mental health disorders in today's world - not just Christians, but Muslims, Jews, Hindhus and so forth - why not offer the safety net of "registered disability" and address the real issue of religion head-on?

Congratulations dumbass! You earned ignore status on the first post of yours I ever read.

 

[Jessica-stormlover]

It is a mental illness. There's literally no evidence for it and it is fiction that effects the world in very real ways that makes zero sense. I can't wait until we can step away from irrational things such as this and start using science and logic to run society.

 

[john54]

you still have some learning to do,,,

I agree - I want to understand more and I don't think it's helpful to treat Christianity as a problem for everyone who has it. Just as some people need crutches, we have to be real about this and recognize many Christians do need their religion - whether it's just for a time, or even for life, as sad a prognosis as that may seem to some. It's their choice whether they want help or not.

 

[Jessica-stormlover]

I agree - I want to understand more and I don't think it's helpful to treat Christianity as a problem for everyone who has it. Just as some people need crutches, we have to be real about this and recognize many Christians do need their religion - whether it's just for a time, or even for life, as sad a prognosis as that may seem to some. It's their choice whether they want help or not.

The problem is with the reality that religion effects everyone else negatively and creates unlimited hatred of others. Examples being gays and transgender people. I wish it was limited to these peoples minds and a paddled room but it isn't! I'd focus on slowly getting rid of religion and replacing it with logic, science and common sense based thought process. Such a world would be much more peaceful and would allow humanaity to move forward.

 

[john54]

The problem is with the reality that religion effects everyone else negatively and creates unlimited hatred of others. Examples being gays and transgender people. I wish it was limited to these peoples minds and a paddled room but it isn't! I'd focus on slowly getting rid of religion and replacing it with logic, science and common sense based thought process. Such a world would be much more peaceful and would allow humanaity to move forward.

Yes, that would be in everyone's best interests, but simply criticizing religion when it's a real health issue does little to dissuade people from continuing to use it, and realistically many will always use religion. Like with obesity, there has to be a duel-focus on being understanding and non-pushy with those who deal with the condition, but also on tackling how to improve the health of the next generation to prevent the issue from restarting in perpetuity. It's complicated and often those suffering the most are Christians and ex-christians themselves. Have you heard of rapture-anxiety? This is an interesting read and shows how complicated Christianity is as a condition, even for those who left the religion:

For some Christians, 'rapture anxiety' can take a lifetime to heal | CNN

Some groups of evangelical and fundamentalist Christians are warned from childhood about the rapture -- an apocalyptic event in which the righteous will ascend to heaven, and sinners remain on Earth to suffer. The toll of so-called rapture anxiety is real, "exvangelicals" say, and it takes years...

www.cnn.com

 

[themirrorthief]

The problem is with the reality that religion effects everyone else negatively and creates unlimited hatred of others. Examples being gays and transgender people. I wish it was limited to these peoples minds and a paddled room but it isn't! I'd focus on slowly getting rid of religion and replacing it with logic, science and common sense based thought process. Such a world would be much more peaceful and would allow humanaity to move forward.

the liberal religions like dope, climate change, and no difference between sexes makes even less sense unfortunately

 

[BackAgain]

It is a mental illness. There's literally no evidence for it and it is fiction that effects the world in very real ways that makes zero sense. I can't wait until we can step away from irrational things such as this and start using science and logic to run society.

You and the OP don’t seem to grasp the rules for Zone 1.

 

[john54]

You and the OP don’t seem to grasp the rules for Zone 1.

I understand this is a sensitive issue, -especially- for people living with Christianity themselves and I'm trying to understand better how to broach the topic. As I said my views are evolving and I don't think simply insulting Christians is helpful to anyone and I think they need support, if they want it, or just to be left alone if they are aware of the health risks and have made a life choice for themselves. I have personally criticized many atheists who preach hatred and go around insulting Christians, Muslims etc - they're in the wrong.

 

[BackAgain]

I understand this is a sensitive issue, -especially- for people living with Christianity themselves and I'm trying to understand better how to broach the topic. As I said my views are evolving and I don't think simply insulting Christians is helpful to anyone and I think they need support, if they want it, or just to be left alone if they are aware of the health risks and have made a life choice for themselves. I have personally criticized many atheists who preach hatred and go around insulting Christians, Muslims etc - they're in the wrong.

You are not subtle and you aren’t on the level. But you are violating the rules.

And I don’t give a shit about your insistence on denigrating people’s religious beliefs. I am just always amazed by the arrogance of you lowlifes. It’s fine that you have no religious beliefs. But why do you tools find it so ever necessary to impose your beliefs (or should I say disbeliefs?) on others?

Pretty tacky shit.

 

[john54]

You are not subtle and you aren’t on the level. But you are violating the rules.

And I don’t give a shit about your insistence on denigrating people’s religious beliefs. I am just always amazed by the arrogance of you lowlifes. It’s fine that you have no religious beliefs. But why do you tools find it so ever necessary to impose your beliefs (or should I say disbeliefs?) on others?

Pretty tacky shit.

I think the issue for those of us on the outside, looking in and trying to understand, is to find the balance between how the religious want their religion to be talked about, but while still keeping with what's real and not sacrificing logic and sense just to have a conversation.
I had a friend who was a conspiracy theorist who thought the CIA was tailing him and logging his keys - and one day he told me if I don't believe his conspiracies, we can't be friends. This is the point I'd rather not reach with religious people - to instead find that balance and I'm open to suggestions.

 

[Jessica-stormlover]

You are not subtle and you aren’t on the level. But you are violating the rules.

And I don’t give a shit about your insistence on denigrating people’s religious beliefs. I am just always amazed by the arrogance of you lowlifes. It’s fine that you have no religious beliefs. But why do you tools find it so ever necessary to impose your beliefs (or should I say disbeliefs?) on others?

Pretty tacky shit.

You impose your beliefs on us even more so. You want to ban homosexuality and transgenderism based on your religion. That is a fact. I don't believe I've broken any rules just because you don't like what I am saying doesn't make it an violation of zone 1.

 

[The Irish Ram]

I think the issue for those of us on the outside, looking in and trying to understand, is to find the balance between how the religious want their religion to be talked about, but while still keeping with what's real and not sacrificing logic and sense just to have a conversation.
I had a friend who was a conspiracy theorist who thought the CIA was tailing him and logging his keys - and one day he told me if I don't believe his conspiracies, we can't be friends. This is the point I'd rather not reach with religious people - to instead find that balance and I'm open to suggestions.

I suggest you do your home work then. Nothing about Christ was schizophrenic...

 

[john54]

I suggest you do your home work then. Nothing about Christ was schizophrenic...

Mental health of Jesus - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

He was almost certainly schizophrenic but far from being a hindrance the historical Jesus's mental health was highly likely to be what gained him his notoriety, and allowed him to find acceptance outside his own town, where family and friends stigmatized his mental health. That even Jesus dealt with and thrived with schizophrenia is likely a comfort and inspiration to many who cope with it in today's society. Parallels can even be drawn between Jesus's mistreatment for his beliefs of divinity and the hardships many go through today due to lack of education on the disability as well as stigmatization.

Looking at physical or mental health disorders as making someone inferior is simply nonsense - I have disabled friends more accomplished and admirable than me. People like them, and especially like Jesus destroy the notions that being disabled makes one less, and I think that could resonate with many Christians.

 

[The Irish Ram]

You couldn't be more wrong...

 

[john54]

You couldn't be more wrong...

So you think being disabled makes some one less? That's your opinion and you're entitled to it but would you take away hope from schizophrenics who find solace knowing Jesus had the same disorder? Why do you see Jesus having schizophrenia as a bad thing, or as incompatible with your current views?

 

[The Irish Ram]

Well, what should we do with you? You certainly aren't wrapped too tight...

 

[john54]

Well, what should we do with you? You certainly aren't wrapped too tight...

If Christianity is where you're at, or where you want to stay, that's cool. There are doors open to you if you want out but it's always your choice. One reminder is that even if you let go of "God," everything good you got from believing there was a God will still be here. But hey, be where you need to be.

 

[Meriweather]

I understand this is a sensitive issue, -especially- for people living with Christianity themselves and I'm trying to understand better how to broach the topic. As I said my views are evolving and I don't think simply insulting Christians is helpful to anyone and I think they need support, if they want it, or just to be left alone if they are aware of the health risks and have made a life choice for themselves. I have personally criticized many atheists who preach hatred and go around insulting Christians, Muslims etc - they're in the wrong.

I see this thread has taken to heart lessons we see throughout history. Want to mistreat a group? Dehumanize them. We saw it slavery, in sexual deviance, in abortion. Worked so well, let's try it with Christians, even separating them from all other faiths that believe in God.

How to broach the topic? First, spend at least five years studying and researching Christianity--and probably even more time studying mental illness. One of the first things to learn is that the majority of Christians do not see faith in God as what was outlined in the opening post.

Consider the possibility that seeing people of faith as having something you don't, you are anxious to drag people of faith down to your level. If you don't have something, no one else can have it either.

Saying having religious philosophy prevents people from knowing science and logic makes no sense. It is like saying those who have artistic abilities prevents one from knowing how to cook.