Good Teachers....Bad Teachers

[chanel]

No Dentist Left Behind


My dentist is great! He sends me reminders so I don't forget check-ups. He uses the latest techniques based on research. He never hurts me, and I've got all my teeth. When I ran into him the other day, I was eager to see if he'd heard about the new state program. I knew he'd think it was great.

"Did you hear about the new state program to measure effectiveness of dentists with their young patients?" I said. "No," he said. He didn't seem too thrilled. "How will they do that?" "It's quite simple," I said. "They will just count the number of cavities each patient has at age 10, 14, and 18 and average that to determine a dentist's rating. Dentists will be rated as excellent, good, average, below average, and unsatisfactory. That way parents will know which are the best dentists. The plan will also encourage the less effective dentists to get better," I ! ; said. "Poor dentists who don't improve could lose their licenses to practice."

"That's terrible," he said. "What? That's not a good attitude," I said. "Don't you think we should try to improve children's dental health in this state?" "Sure I do," he said, "but that's not a fair way to determine who is practicing good dentistry." "Why not?", I said. "It makes perfect sense to me."

"Well, it's so obvious," he said. "Don't you see that dentists don't all work with the same clientele, and that much depends on things we can't control? For example, I work in a rural area with a high percentage of patients from deprived homes, while some of my colleagues work in upper middle- class neighborhoods. Many of the parents I work with don't bring their children to see me until there is some kind of problem, and I don't get to do much preventive work. Also, more educated parents who understand the relationship between sugar and decay. To top it all off, so many of my clients have well water which is untreated and has no fluoride in it. Do you have any idea how much difference early use of fluoride can make?"

"It sounds like you're making excuses," I said. "I can't believe that you, my dentist, would be so defensive. After all, you do a great job, and you needn't fear a little accountability."

"I am not being defensive!" he said. "My best patients are as good as anyone's, my work is as good as anyone's, but my average cavity count is going to be higher than a lot of other dentists because I chose to work where I am needed most."

"Don't get touchy," I said. "Touchy?" he said. His face had turned red, and from the way he was clenching and unclenching his jaws, I was afraid he was going to damage his
teeth. "Try furious! In a system like this, I will end up being rated average, below average, or worse. The few educated patients I have who see these ratings may believe this so-called rating is an actual measure of my ability and proficiency as a dentist. They may leave me, and I'll be left with only the most needy patients. And my cavity average score will get even worse. On top of that, how will I attract good dental hygienists and other excellent dentists to my practice if it is labeled below average?"

"I think you are overreacting," I said. "'Complaining, excuse-making and stonewalling won't improve dental health'...I am quoting from a leading member of the DOC," I noted. "What's the DOC?" he asked. "It's the Dental Oversight Committee," I said, "a group made up of mostly lay persons to make sure dentistry in this state gets improved. "Spare me," he said, "I can't believe this. Reasonable people won't buy it," he said hopefully.

The program sounded reasonable to me, so I asked, "How else would you measure good dentistry?" "Come watch me work," he said. "Observe my processes." "That's too complicated, expensive and time- consuming," I said. "Cavities re the bottom line, and you can't argue with the bottom line.

It's an absolute measure." "That's what I'm afraid my parents and prospective patients will think. This can't be happening," he said despairingly.

"Now, now," I said, "don't despair. The state will help you some." "How?" he asked. "If you receive a poor rating, they'll send a dentist who is rated excellent to help straighten you out," I said brightly. "You mean," he said, "they'll send a dentist with a wealthy clientele to show me how to work on severe juvenile dental problems with which I have probably had much more experience? BIG HELP!"

"There you go again," I said. "You aren't acting professionally at all." "You don't get it," he said. "Doing this would be like grading schools and teachers on an average score made on a test of children's progress with no regard to influences outside the school, the home, the community served and stuff like that.

Why would they do something so unfair to dentists? No one would ever think of doing that to schools."

I just shook my head sadly, but he had brightened. "I'm going to write my representatives and senators," he said. "I'll use the school analogy. Surely they will see the point." He walked off with that look of hope mixed with fear and suppressed anger that I, a teacher, see in the mirror so often lately.

No Dentist Left Behind - A to Z Teacher Stuff Forums

 

[editec]

"did you hear about the new state program to measure effectiveness of dentists with their young patients?" i said. "no," he said. He didn't seem too thrilled. "how will they do that?" "it's quite simple," i said. "they will just count the number of cavities each patient has at age 10, 14, and 18 and average that to determine a dentist's rating. Dentists will be rated as excellent, good, average, below average, and unsatisfactory. that way parents will know which are the best dentists. The plan will also encourage the less effective dentists to get better," i ! ; said. "poor dentists who don't improve could lose their licenses to practice."

lol!

 

[Samson]

When I was in school, the good teachers always seemed to be pleased with my intelligence. The bad teachers were always the ones who were critical of the teachers that thought I was smart.

Did you have any good teachers?

 

[Samson]

Every single year, I have gotten all the classes I have requested. When I ask for supplies, maintenance requests, or anything else to make the job less stressful, it is granted. When others bitch about all of the above, I just smile. That's worth far more than money.

Heh....you just explained why teachers will never be paid more.

IMHO the best way to evaluate good teachers is to give parents a $500/yr voucher payable to the teacher of their choice.

 

[random3434]

No Dentist Left Behind


My dentist is great! He sends me reminders so I don't forget check-ups. He uses the latest techniques based on research. He never hurts me, and I've got all my teeth. When I ran into him the other day, I was eager to see if he'd heard about the new state program. I knew he'd think it was great.

"Did you hear about the new state program to measure effectiveness of dentists with their young patients?" I said. "No," he said. He didn't seem too thrilled. "How will they do that?" "It's quite simple," I said. "They will just count the number of cavities each patient has at age 10, 14, and 18 and average that to determine a dentist's rating. Dentists will be rated as excellent, good, average, below average, and unsatisfactory. That way parents will know which are the best dentists. The plan will also encourage the less effective dentists to get better," I ! ; said. "Poor dentists who don't improve could lose their licenses to practice."

"That's terrible," he said. "What? That's not a good attitude," I said. "Don't you think we should try to improve children's dental health in this state?" "Sure I do," he said, "but that's not a fair way to determine who is practicing good dentistry." "Why not?", I said. "It makes perfect sense to me."

"Well, it's so obvious," he said. "Don't you see that dentists don't all work with the same clientele, and that much depends on things we can't control? For example, I work in a rural area with a high percentage of patients from deprived homes, while some of my colleagues work in upper middle- class neighborhoods. Many of the parents I work with don't bring their children to see me until there is some kind of problem, and I don't get to do much preventive work. Also, more educated parents who understand the relationship between sugar and decay. To top it all off, so many of my clients have well water which is untreated and has no fluoride in it. Do you have any idea how much difference early use of fluoride can make?"

"It sounds like you're making excuses," I said. "I can't believe that you, my dentist, would be so defensive. After all, you do a great job, and you needn't fear a little accountability."

"I am not being defensive!" he said. "My best patients are as good as anyone's, my work is as good as anyone's, but my average cavity count is going to be higher than a lot of other dentists because I chose to work where I am needed most."

"Don't get touchy," I said. "Touchy?" he said. His face had turned red, and from the way he was clenching and unclenching his jaws, I was afraid he was going to damage his
teeth. "Try furious! In a system like this, I will end up being rated average, below average, or worse. The few educated patients I have who see these ratings may believe this so-called rating is an actual measure of my ability and proficiency as a dentist. They may leave me, and I'll be left with only the most needy patients. And my cavity average score will get even worse. On top of that, how will I attract good dental hygienists and other excellent dentists to my practice if it is labeled below average?"

"I think you are overreacting," I said. "'Complaining, excuse-making and stonewalling won't improve dental health'...I am quoting from a leading member of the DOC," I noted. "What's the DOC?" he asked. "It's the Dental Oversight Committee," I said, "a group made up of mostly lay persons to make sure dentistry in this state gets improved. "Spare me," he said, "I can't believe this. Reasonable people won't buy it," he said hopefully.

The program sounded reasonable to me, so I asked, "How else would you measure good dentistry?" "Come watch me work," he said. "Observe my processes." "That's too complicated, expensive and time- consuming," I said. "Cavities re the bottom line, and you can't argue with the bottom line.

It's an absolute measure." "That's what I'm afraid my parents and prospective patients will think. This can't be happening," he said despairingly.

"Now, now," I said, "don't despair. The state will help you some." "How?" he asked. "If you receive a poor rating, they'll send a dentist who is rated excellent to help straighten you out," I said brightly. "You mean," he said, "they'll send a dentist with a wealthy clientele to show me how to work on severe juvenile dental problems with which I have probably had much more experience? BIG HELP!"

"There you go again," I said. "You aren't acting professionally at all." "You don't get it," he said. "Doing this would be like grading schools and teachers on an average score made on a test of children's progress with no regard to influences outside the school, the home, the community served and stuff like that.

Why would they do something so unfair to dentists? No one would ever think of doing that to schools."

I just shook my head sadly, but he had brightened. "I'm going to write my representatives and senators," he said. "I'll use the school analogy. Surely they will see the point." He walked off with that look of hope mixed with fear and suppressed anger that I, a teacher, see in the mirror so often lately.

No Dentist Left Behind - A to Z Teacher Stuff Forums

Ah, but this will go over many of the 'haters' heads Chanel...................


But spot on!

Happy 4th!

 

[MaggieMae]

Our country is in an education crisis, the administrators are paid huge fixed salaries and are not delivering. They don't want fair evaluations because it will show just how bad things are. We rank very near the bottom of the list in Texas and we have been throwing money at it for years. Teachers today can't teach because they have become day care providers for parents who can not or will not do anything to education their own children. It is far easier to blame someone else.

Not only are schools expected to teach and also to parent, but some high schools (several in Texas) actually have day care centers on site to care for babies born to unwed teens who still want to graduate. The abysmal quality of education won't get any better until EDUCATION becomes its own entity again.

 

[MaggieMae]

Teachers don't need to teach you how to read and write or to do basic math and by all means, don't worry about teaching history as it really happened. What they are required to do though is to teach you that condoms are available in the nurses office, you don't need to have your parent's permission to get an abortion and the only real political solution to today's problems come from only the liberal politicians. They are also determined to inform your kid about how nice is it that there are queers in the world.

Hey, Doggie...are you suggesting that education isn't what it once was???

It's no longer the attempt to instill middle class values and erudition??

Why...I never!


Hey, wanna feel worse, this from one of Winchester's books, check out what the English folk of the time were like:

On Wednesday, June 6, 1928 the Oxford English Dictionary was completed. In "The Meaning of Everything," Simon Winchester discusses the English of the time as follows:

“The English establishment of the day might be rightly derided at this remove as having been class-ridden and imperialist, bombastic and blimpish, racist and insouciant- but it was marked undeniably also by a sweeping erudition and confidence, and it was peopled by men and women who felt they were able to know all, to understand much, and in consequence to radiate the wisdom of deep learning.”


(sigh)

You mean that's changed? Not from my perch of many years. Different century, maybe, but nothing else. I'm right and you're not is still the norm, regardless the subject.

 

[MaggieMae]

A value-added system sounds good on paper, but how would it work? Testing in every subject every year? Do you know how much that would cost? How much time would be wasted? How would special education teachers be paid?

Is it fair to hold teachers responsible for truancy, transiency, and neglect?

Tenure needs to be reformed; not eliminated. "Bad teachers" need to be fired, but student test scores do NOT measure "bad teachers". When a 4th grader is tested in October, does that reflect what he has learned in 4th grade, or in K-3?

Believe it or not folks, good teachers are rewarded and bad teachers are punished. In the first 3 years, many new teachers are denied tenure. After that, certain favorites are given perks like good classes, duties, and paid extracurricular positions.. Consequently, less popular teachers are given those that nobody else wants. Good teachers are left alone; bad teachers are watched constantly.

Every single year, I have gotten all the classes I have requested. When I ask for supplies, maintenance requests, or anything else to make the job less stressful, it is granted. When others bitch about all of the above, I just smile. That's worth far more than money.

Well first of all I think the most accurate way to determine whether a teacher is good or not, is by monitoring how much their students learn/improve from the start of the school year to the end. I don't think it should be a knee-jerk reaction. I think if over a few years the teacher consistently has students that just aren't learning enough-they should be fired.

Not sure how it is in your state, or school district but here when teachers go into a pool and apply for an open position the principal HAS to hire the first person who walks in the door. If person A walks in at 10:00 and wants the job, but person B who's much more qualified (has better results, awards, recognitions, higher degree) walks in-they don't get the job.

The principals have to hire based on the longevity of the teacher, and who looks better on paper-even if a newer teacher would make a much better teacher.

Then when schools get money, instead of using it for new computer labs, or other educational tools-what do they do? Build new football facilities, and new locker rooms. And people wonder why our education system sucks.

edit: And the amount of money we spend on the education system shouldn't be an issue. If a better way of measuring teacher's effectiveness is expensive-so? Our education system here is crumbling, and I think it's completely unacceptable. We used to be #1. We used to be the country that produced the most scientists, the most inventors, education was the backbone of this country-and it just isn't anymore. We need to invest (and yes that means spend money) on our education system. But the problem is when we've done that in the past-we just blindly threw money at the problem, we didn't address the needs. I don't think people really mind if we spend money on education-it's how the money gets spent which is the problem.

I find it hard to believe Florida schools, as a matter of policy, must hire on a first-come basis. Maybe one school district got away with that, but it's an absurd policy that should never have been allowed.

Florida recently passed a comprehensive teacher performance requirement, which is in line with the OA's "Race to the Top" changes in teacher tenure and compensation.

Florida Senate passes teacher merit-pay bill - Orlando Sentinel

 

[MaggieMae]

If a student likes the teacher, the teacher is viewed as good, and the student will excell. If the student doesn't like the teacher, the teacher is viewed as bad and the student will not excell. Same teacher different viewpoint. It's not wether teachers are good or bad, but rather are students good or bad.

But who gets to judge in the end? The teacher with a passing grade or not. Students historically want teachers who are reputed to be more lax, but they may wind up not getting what they wish for. I can remember my friends a year ahead of me in HS always passed on which teachers "I hope you get" because he/she was more fun or could be easily diverted to Friday's football game instead of boring history or biology, for example. I was never lucky enough to draw one of those, but I sure as hell learned history and basic biology. And it didn't hurt a bit.

 

[MaggieMae]

from my point of view (elementary teacher for 8 years for title 1 schools), here are some of the things that aren't working;

1.) Some teachers don't seem to like kids. The truth is this, I don't know anyone that became a teacher because they didn't like kids. What I've seen is that young teachers (rather new teachers), don't come in with high enough expectations for the kids. The kids' behavior then gets out of control and the teacher, not wanting to seem like a BAD teacher, resorts to the oldest form of control, yelling and screaming. this leads to unhappy teachers and students. My students go to 5th grade and tell me all about their classrooms. I was there too for a couple of years, but I made adjustments and read a book.

We need prospective teachers to be able to observe great teachers. My student teaching taught me nothing and I was not prepared. There might be a supply and demand problem there.

2.) Parents in low income families are by and large not contributing in any way to their kids education. School is a break from their kid. Parent's are not interested or at least act uninterested in their progress. I know a lot of that is human nature, but its not good for the kid, teacher and test scores.

There is a direct correlation between the income of a family and how well I know the parents by the end of the year, and the children are never failing if I know their parents well.

3.) No child left behind, leaves children behind. Test scores require hard decisions at times. Students who are enrolled after Oct 4th do not count on test scores. Who do you think gets the in school tutoring we provide with push in subs, not them. What happens to the student who had to move mid year and has gaps to fill. They don't get filled. Its all for the almighty test score. Games are played with reclassification of English language learners (probably not a big deal, but I'm saying this is a science now).

I am at a very high performing school in southern california and we are the model for our large district.

4.) Our district requires so many tests we haven't got much time for teaching because we are either prepping for a test or taking a test. I counted once and it was over 8 weeks of testing (not for the whole day, but long enough where burnout plays a roll and the rest of the day is not productive).

5.) because we have to congregate as a district every year and applaud each others API scores with little skits (I'm not even joking about this), it has become clear that the score is all that matters anymore. Principals know this and are expendable. They need teachers who will get good scores. Teachers will do whatever it takes to keep the principal off of them so that means we perfect teaching to the test. My principal always said, you're not teaching to the test if your doing it all year. In other words, using test released question from day one is our normal teaching procedure.

This is not fun for anyone and is very stressful for the kids.

I want to leave the education industry soon. I just don't see any positive changes coming. We are the model, others aspire to be like my school, so where could I go.

Parental knowledge and interest is waning. This part of the triangle of learning (parents/teachers/students) is vital to any change. Your throwing money down a hole if the parents aren't involved in their child's learning.

BTW, i might be negative on education, but I have professional pride and care about those kids. I want it more than many of them do. I try to inspire and turn out good critical thinking students. Most teachers are this way, I know of only 2 that weren't in my years of teaching.

That saddens me, and I hope you'll stick it out. Schools are losing potentially excellent teachers because they become too frustrated just fighting "the system," which unfortunately often means school districts, school administrators, unions, and general disinterest work together to contribute hugely to the problem.

 

[MaggieMae]

How many years of experience does a senior teacher have? 20? At that point, a secretary in NYC is making that much.

Not for half a years work: 180 days in the school year.

In all fairness teachers work more than 8 hours a day, when you factor in they have to make lesson plans, and grade papers/projects/tests/etc. How many jobs is it required to take your job home with you? Not many.

Now I think teacher seniority getting more benefits than newer teachers is complete BS. But by no stretch of the imagination do teachers have an easy job.

Not only that, but in some states, teachers are required to maintain their credentials to teach a specific subject by taking current teaching courses in that subject, and they do that in the summer months. Some choose to work at summer jobs because of the low salary scales compared to other professions. Some actually choose to tutor and/or teach summer school. I doubt if you interviewed the average high school teacher, s/he isn't just sitting around by the pool all summer.

 

[sparky]

probably a common misconception Maggie

and yanno, one can usually look in their town school budget to sort it out a bit, top dog and/or supervisory get the lions share, normal teachers sqaut

i used to be amazed at the young teachers hired here, i mean, right outta college 22-23 yr olds in front of a 14 yr old hurricane

you couldn't pay me enough, and we really ought to think seriously about getting what we do pay for, or quit our b*tching imho

~S~

 

[PoliticalChic]

Teachers don't need to teach you how to read and write or to do basic math and by all means, don't worry about teaching history as it really happened. What they are required to do though is to teach you that condoms are available in the nurses office, you don't need to have your parent's permission to get an abortion and the only real political solution to today's problems come from only the liberal politicians. They are also determined to inform your kid about how nice is it that there are queers in the world.

Hey, Doggie...are you suggesting that education isn't what it once was???

It's no longer the attempt to instill middle class values and erudition??

Why...I never!


Hey, wanna feel worse, this from one of Winchester's books, check out what the English folk of the time were like:

On Wednesday, June 6, 1928 the Oxford English Dictionary was completed. In "The Meaning of Everything," Simon Winchester discusses the English of the time as follows:

“The English establishment of the day might be rightly derided at this remove as having been class-ridden and imperialist, bombastic and blimpish, racist and insouciant- but it was marked undeniably also by a sweeping erudition and confidence, and it was peopled by men and women who felt they were able to know all, to understand much, and in consequence to radiate the wisdom of deep learning.”


(sigh)

You mean that's changed? Not from my perch of many years. Different century, maybe, but nothing else. I'm right and you're not is still the norm, regardless the subject.

The point of the quote is that that time, that people, respected and desired knowledge.

Today? Too many folks get their history from Oliver Stone.

 

[MaggieMae]

Hey, Doggie...are you suggesting that education isn't what it once was???

It's no longer the attempt to instill middle class values and erudition??

Why...I never!


Hey, wanna feel worse, this from one of Winchester's books, check out what the English folk of the time were like:

On Wednesday, June 6, 1928 the Oxford English Dictionary was completed. In "The Meaning of Everything," Simon Winchester discusses the English of the time as follows:

“The English establishment of the day might be rightly derided at this remove as having been class-ridden and imperialist, bombastic and blimpish, racist and insouciant- but it was marked undeniably also by a sweeping erudition and confidence, and it was peopled by men and women who felt they were able to know all, to understand much, and in consequence to radiate the wisdom of deep learning.”


(sigh)

You mean that's changed? Not from my perch of many years. Different century, maybe, but nothing else. I'm right and you're not is still the norm, regardless the subject.

The point of the quote is that that time, that people, respected and desired knowledge.

Today? Too many folks get their history from Oliver Stone.

Or the Internet. I agree. But that's not to say that even books (history books) haven't skewed a few facts. My problem with the whole unwillingness to expand one's knowledge on a subject is that these days people are too quick to accept as gospel only one version, failing to look beyond especially if you find yourself saying "that just doesn't sound right..." and taking the initiative to make sure it is right, or not.

 

[PoliticalChic]

You mean that's changed? Not from my perch of many years. Different century, maybe, but nothing else. I'm right and you're not is still the norm, regardless the subject.

The point of the quote is that that time, that people, respected and desired knowledge.

Today? Too many folks get their history from Oliver Stone.

Or the Internet. I agree. But that's not to say that even books (history books) haven't skewed a few facts. My problem with the whole unwillingness to expand one's knowledge on a subject is that these days people are too quick to accept as gospel only one version, failing to look beyond especially if you find yourself saying "that just doesn't sound right..." and taking the initiative to make sure it is right, or not.

Now, Maggie...you know how I hate to start trouble....but did you buy the nonsense about the Republicans having a racist "Southern Strategy," or did you find yourself saying "that just doesn't sound right..."?

 

[whitehall]

Sure there are good teachers...bet each of us can name three who changed our lives.

"Value-added teacher evaluation" can help identify the good ones.

From an interesting essay in the City Journal:

1. Value-added teacher evaluation—a method that estimates the contribution teachers make to student’s test-score gains—is a concept whose time has most definitely come. Californians are entitled to know precisely who is and isn’t delivering the goods for their children.

2. The Los Angeles Times last month published a much-anticipated follow-up to its path-breaking 2010 investigation, which ranked 6,000 third-, fourth-, and fifth-grade teachers based on their students’ progress on standardized tests year after year. The updated rankings include data for more than 11,500 teachers. Using the California Public Records Act, Times reporters Jason Felch, Jason Song, and Doug Smith obtained student math and language arts scores for the Los Angeles Unified School District from 2003 through 2009.

3. The newspaper commissioned Richard Budden, a senior economist and education researcher with the Santa Monica–based RAND Corporation, to analyze the data. Using the value-added technique, he converted the scores into percentile ratings, and then divided them into five equal categories from “least effective” to “most effective.”

4. The Times stories have exposed that what currently passes for teacher evaluation in California is useless. Currently, a principal or other administrator may visit a class several times (usually with a warning given long in advance), stay a few minutes, scribble down some notes, and leave….Thanks to this ineffective process, more than 99 percent of all teachers receive satisfactory ratings, and after just two years in the classroom achieve tenure—essentially a job for life.

5. Undaunted by the union’s bullying, the Times spent the next nine months showing the benefits of value-added teacher evaluations. The paper reported: “Highly effective teachers routinely propel students from below grade level to advanced in a single year. There is a substantial gap at year’s end between students whose teachers were in the top 10 percent in effectiveness and the bottom 10 percent. The fortunate students ranked 17 percentile points higher in English and 25 points higher in math.”

6. Studies have shown that two consecutive years with a bad teacher can leave students so far behind that they will never catch up.

7. Hoover Institution senior fellow and economist Eric Hanushek claims that while value-added analysis isn’t perfect, it’s “the best tool we have available to zero in on the impact of the individual teacher on student achievement gains.

8. Teachers’ unions dislike all forms of substantive teacher evaluation, viewing any kind of official differentiation among teachers as encouraging competition, which sows envy and thus undermines solidarity. Truth is, of course, objective evaluations show that some teachers really are more effective than others.Grading the Teachers by Larry Sand - City Journal


Let's not throw the baby out with the bad teachers....

No offense Chicki but I bet most of us can't name a single teacher who "changed our lives". That's fiction. We may have liked certain teachers who liked us and we hated teachers who demanded more of us and we remember teachers who knew how to artfully place a condom on a cucumber. So much for public ed.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Sure there are good teachers...bet each of us can name three who changed our lives.

"Value-added teacher evaluation" can help identify the good ones.

From an interesting essay in the City Journal:

1. Value-added teacher evaluation—a method that estimates the contribution teachers make to student’s test-score gains—is a concept whose time has most definitely come. Californians are entitled to know precisely who is and isn’t delivering the goods for their children.

2. The Los Angeles Times last month published a much-anticipated follow-up to its path-breaking 2010 investigation, which ranked 6,000 third-, fourth-, and fifth-grade teachers based on their students’ progress on standardized tests year after year. The updated rankings include data for more than 11,500 teachers. Using the California Public Records Act, Times reporters Jason Felch, Jason Song, and Doug Smith obtained student math and language arts scores for the Los Angeles Unified School District from 2003 through 2009.

3. The newspaper commissioned Richard Budden, a senior economist and education researcher with the Santa Monica–based RAND Corporation, to analyze the data. Using the value-added technique, he converted the scores into percentile ratings, and then divided them into five equal categories from “least effective” to “most effective.”

4. The Times stories have exposed that what currently passes for teacher evaluation in California is useless. Currently, a principal or other administrator may visit a class several times (usually with a warning given long in advance), stay a few minutes, scribble down some notes, and leave….Thanks to this ineffective process, more than 99 percent of all teachers receive satisfactory ratings, and after just two years in the classroom achieve tenure—essentially a job for life.

5. Undaunted by the union’s bullying, the Times spent the next nine months showing the benefits of value-added teacher evaluations. The paper reported: “Highly effective teachers routinely propel students from below grade level to advanced in a single year. There is a substantial gap at year’s end between students whose teachers were in the top 10 percent in effectiveness and the bottom 10 percent. The fortunate students ranked 17 percentile points higher in English and 25 points higher in math.”

6. Studies have shown that two consecutive years with a bad teacher can leave students so far behind that they will never catch up.

7. Hoover Institution senior fellow and economist Eric Hanushek claims that while value-added analysis isn’t perfect, it’s “the best tool we have available to zero in on the impact of the individual teacher on student achievement gains.

8. Teachers’ unions dislike all forms of substantive teacher evaluation, viewing any kind of official differentiation among teachers as encouraging competition, which sows envy and thus undermines solidarity. Truth is, of course, objective evaluations show that some teachers really are more effective than others.Grading the Teachers by Larry Sand - City Journal


Let's not throw the baby out with the bad teachers....

No offense Chicki but I bet most of us can't name a single teacher who "changed our lives". That's fiction. We may have liked certain teachers who liked us and we hated teachers who demanded more of us and we remember teachers who knew how to artfully place a condom on a cucumber. So much for public ed.

Of course I wouldn't be offended by your opinion, Whitey...but I, at least, certainly can recall at least three teachers whose erudition, and attitudes, made me wish to be more like them.
I hope they would endorse my efforts.

"...we hated teachers who demanded more of us..."
Not I.

"So much for public ed."
Well, there is much to be said about this...
let me leave it as this: I have had the opportunity to attend the best schools...yet, the greater part of my education occurred after I left formal school, and continues currently.

 

[MaggieMae]

The point of the quote is that that time, that people, respected and desired knowledge.

Today? Too many folks get their history from Oliver Stone.

Or the Internet. I agree. But that's not to say that even books (history books) haven't skewed a few facts. My problem with the whole unwillingness to expand one's knowledge on a subject is that these days people are too quick to accept as gospel only one version, failing to look beyond especially if you find yourself saying "that just doesn't sound right..." and taking the initiative to make sure it is right, or not.

Now, Maggie...you know how I hate to start trouble....but did you buy the nonsense about the Republicans having a racist "Southern Strategy," or did you find yourself saying "that just doesn't sound right..."?

I guess I didn't pursue that because I never believed it in the first place. I'm the last one to claim that liberals don't try to use their own extremist strategies to see what will stick.

 

[MaggieMae]

Sure there are good teachers...bet each of us can name three who changed our lives.

"Value-added teacher evaluation" can help identify the good ones.

From an interesting essay in the City Journal:

1. Value-added teacher evaluation—a method that estimates the contribution teachers make to student’s test-score gains—is a concept whose time has most definitely come. Californians are entitled to know precisely who is and isn’t delivering the goods for their children.

2. The Los Angeles Times last month published a much-anticipated follow-up to its path-breaking 2010 investigation, which ranked 6,000 third-, fourth-, and fifth-grade teachers based on their students’ progress on standardized tests year after year. The updated rankings include data for more than 11,500 teachers. Using the California Public Records Act, Times reporters Jason Felch, Jason Song, and Doug Smith obtained student math and language arts scores for the Los Angeles Unified School District from 2003 through 2009.

3. The newspaper commissioned Richard Budden, a senior economist and education researcher with the Santa Monica–based RAND Corporation, to analyze the data. Using the value-added technique, he converted the scores into percentile ratings, and then divided them into five equal categories from “least effective” to “most effective.”

4. The Times stories have exposed that what currently passes for teacher evaluation in California is useless. Currently, a principal or other administrator may visit a class several times (usually with a warning given long in advance), stay a few minutes, scribble down some notes, and leave….Thanks to this ineffective process, more than 99 percent of all teachers receive satisfactory ratings, and after just two years in the classroom achieve tenure—essentially a job for life.

5. Undaunted by the union’s bullying, the Times spent the next nine months showing the benefits of value-added teacher evaluations. The paper reported: “Highly effective teachers routinely propel students from below grade level to advanced in a single year. There is a substantial gap at year’s end between students whose teachers were in the top 10 percent in effectiveness and the bottom 10 percent. The fortunate students ranked 17 percentile points higher in English and 25 points higher in math.”

6. Studies have shown that two consecutive years with a bad teacher can leave students so far behind that they will never catch up.

7. Hoover Institution senior fellow and economist Eric Hanushek claims that while value-added analysis isn’t perfect, it’s “the best tool we have available to zero in on the impact of the individual teacher on student achievement gains.

8. Teachers’ unions dislike all forms of substantive teacher evaluation, viewing any kind of official differentiation among teachers as encouraging competition, which sows envy and thus undermines solidarity. Truth is, of course, objective evaluations show that some teachers really are more effective than others.Grading the Teachers by Larry Sand - City Journal


Let's not throw the baby out with the bad teachers....

No offense Chicki but I bet most of us can't name a single teacher who "changed our lives". That's fiction. We may have liked certain teachers who liked us and we hated teachers who demanded more of us and we remember teachers who knew how to artfully place a condom on a cucumber. So much for public ed.

I remember Mrs. Pettis clearly, who was in charge of the "secretarial courses" in HS business majors. The standard to pass her courses were taking shorthand at 100 wpm and typing (on a manual typewriter!) at 65 wpm. She pushed her students to do better, though, because we would be the first chosen by potential employers as the creme de la creme. So I got certified at age 18 to take shorthand at 150 wpm and type at 100 wpm. That enabled me to actually skip the last 6 weeks of my senior year and go to work, my first job as secretary to a bank manager. So yes, Mrs. Pettis, long dead now, was a driving force and I'll forever be in her debt.

 

[Cimerian]

Our country is in an education crisis, the administrators are paid huge fixed salaries and are not delivering. They don't want fair evaluations because it will show just how bad things are. We rank very near the bottom of the list in Texas and we have been throwing money at it for years. Teachers today can't teach because they have become day care providers for parents who can not or will not do anything to education their own children. It is far easier to blame someone else.

Not only are schools expected to teach and also to parent, but some high schools (several in Texas) actually have day care centers on site to care for babies born to unwed teens who still want to graduate. The abysmal quality of education won't get any better until EDUCATION becomes its own entity again.

I would love to see education sever itself from the government.