God and mass genocide

[alang1216]

'm reading a book written by Dennis Prager on Exodus.

Okay, here's the thing. There is no evidence the Hebrews ever lived in Egypt. None. And we've dug up Egypt pretty thoroughly.

Actually that is not true, at least according to the Elephantine papyri. There was a Jewish community at Elephantine, then called Yeb, the island in the Nile at the border of Nubia, which was probably founded as a military installation in about 650 BCE during Manasseh's reign to assist Pharaoh Psammetichus I in his Nubian campaign. The Jews were likely mercenaries for the Pharaohs and later the Persians for centuries.

It seems to me the Passover story is a myth that provides a justification for the Jewish conquest of Palestine.

 

[Votto]

Sadly, this became the backstory for one religion, and nobody questioned it for thousands of years, even the parts about talking snakes and donkeys.

lol ... Has anyone ever searched for archeological evidence to confirm the story of the boy who cried wolf?

I never heard someone who read the story of the three pigs question how wolves could talk or how pigs could build houses. I never heard anyone demand evidence that bears eat porridge.

Not even a child..

You could start a new thread and be the first!

You can call it... Talking pigs are for the birds, fairy tales are lies...or, I'm too smart to believe in the big bad wolf.

.

Naw, we don't have people telling folks what kind of birth control they should use or who they can marry because of actual fairy tales.

We do have that used as an excuse for these things with the BIble.

"You can't have an abortion... the bible says so!"

Ever heard of Biblical Archaeology? It's a secular pursuit of archaeology digs based upon the stories of the Bible.

In fact, it is the only scientific discipline I know of that is based upon a religious text.

For example, ever hear of the Philistines? Well according to archaeology, they did not exist UNTIL Biblical Archaeologists went digging where the Bible said they should be located.

To dismiss Biblical history is a mistake.

 

[Votto]

'm reading a book written by Dennis Prager on Exodus.

Okay, here's the thing. There is no evidence the Hebrews ever lived in Egypt. None. And we've dug up Egypt pretty thoroughly.

Actually that is not true, at least according to the Elephantine papyri. There was a Jewish community at Elephantine, then called Yeb, the island in the Nile at the border of Nubia, which was probably founded as a military installation in about 650 BCE during Manasseh's reign to assist Pharaoh Psammetichus I in his Nubian campaign. The Jews were likely mercenaries for the Pharaohs and later the Persians for centuries.

It seems to me the Passover story is a myth that provides a justification for the Jewish conquest of Palestine.

There are other evidences. Just read the web site I provided to see that.

Again, the assumption was that the Biblical Exodus occurred under Ramses ll when really it looks as it if was well before that time.

 

[IsaacNewton]

What of 'god's' own mass genocide. The Flood.

He murdered all men women and children except for one family to 'cleans' humanity of its debauchery but, it didn't work. You'd think he'd have known ahead of time that it wouldn't work but he killed all those people anyway. For nothing.

Sounds like the Salem witch trials.

 

[Votto]

If anybody gets a chance, this is a good film on the subject.



So if it never happened, why would the story be made up?

Also, where exactly did the Israeli people come from to conquer the Holy Land?

Naturally, this story is politically volatile today for obvious reasons. There are powerful political forces that have a stake in suppressing this story.

 

[Votto]

What of 'god's' own mass genocide. The Flood.

He murdered all men women and children except for one family to 'cleans' humanity of its debauchery but, it didn't work. You'd think he'd have known ahead of time that it wouldn't work but he killed all those people anyway. For nothing.

Sounds like the Salem witch trials.

Once man fell, then all of us who were born in sin were to die.

It's not like he had to let any of us live after the fall. That my friend was grace.

 

[IsaacNewton]

What of 'god's' own mass genocide. The Flood.

He murdered all men women and children except for one family to 'cleans' humanity of its debauchery but, it didn't work. You'd think he'd have known ahead of time that it wouldn't work but he killed all those people anyway. For nothing.

Sounds like the Salem witch trials.

Once man fell, then all of us who were born in sin were to die.

It's not like he had to let any of us live after the fall. That my friend was grace.

You ignore the crime that was committed for no reason.

And the 'original sin', he didn't know ahead of time that man would fall? Or liked apples? You do not use reason to support an argument, you use circular reference to myth to support the myth itself.

 

[Votto]

What of 'god's' own mass genocide. The Flood.

He murdered all men women and children except for one family to 'cleans' humanity of its debauchery but, it didn't work. You'd think he'd have known ahead of time that it wouldn't work but he killed all those people anyway. For nothing.

Sounds like the Salem witch trials.

Once man fell, then all of us who were born in sin were to die.

It's not like he had to let any of us live after the fall. That my friend was grace.

You ignore the crime that was committed for no reason.

And the 'original sin', he didn't know ahead of time that man would fall? Or liked apples? You do not use reason to support an argument, you use circular reference to myth to support the myth itself.

What are you talking about? Are you suggesting God did not know ahead of time? What do you mean ignore the crime that was committed for no reason?

 

[IsaacNewton]

What of 'god's' own mass genocide. The Flood.

He murdered all men women and children except for one family to 'cleans' humanity of its debauchery but, it didn't work. You'd think he'd have known ahead of time that it wouldn't work but he killed all those people anyway. For nothing.

Sounds like the Salem witch trials.

Once man fell, then all of us who were born in sin were to die.

It's not like he had to let any of us live after the fall. That my friend was grace.

You ignore the crime that was committed for no reason.

And the 'original sin', he didn't know ahead of time that man would fall? Or liked apples? You do not use reason to support an argument, you use circular reference to myth to support the myth itself.

What are you talking about? Are you suggesting God did not know ahead of time? What do you mean ignore the crime that was committed for no reason?

re the flood -
All of humanity was drowned to 'end the wicked'. Except one righteous family. And that family has apparently produced the exact same wickedness the flood was supposed to be the cure for. And if 'god' is all knowing he knew this would be the outcome. Yet he murdered all of humanity anyway.

 

[JoeB131]

Ever heard of Biblical Archaeology? It's a secular pursuit of archaeology digs based upon the stories of the Bible.

And it has about as much credibility as those guys who go looking for proof that humans and dinosaurs co-existed.

Right-wingers think this is a documentary!

The problem with the anti-Science Right is that they fit the evidence into the theory, not the theory around the evidence.

For example, ever hear of the Philistines? Well according to archaeology, they did not exist UNTIL Biblical Archaeologists went digging where the Bible said they should be located.

To dismiss Biblical history is a mistake.

Yeah, when a book has Giants and Talking Snakes in it, it's pretty easy to dismiss it.

So if it never happened, why would the story be made up?

Mostly as religious propaganda. Your shitty little tribal God lives in a tent, and their Gods have huge, kick ass temples that have actually survived to the present day, sure you are going to make up stories about how you put one over on them.

The Ten Plagues, for instance, are all directed against specific Egyptian Gods.

 

[Votto]

What of 'god's' own mass genocide. The Flood.

He murdered all men women and children except for one family to 'cleans' humanity of its debauchery but, it didn't work. You'd think he'd have known ahead of time that it wouldn't work but he killed all those people anyway. For nothing.

Sounds like the Salem witch trials.

Once man fell, then all of us who were born in sin were to die.

It's not like he had to let any of us live after the fall. That my friend was grace.

You ignore the crime that was committed for no reason.

And the 'original sin', he didn't know ahead of time that man would fall? Or liked apples? You do not use reason to support an argument, you use circular reference to myth to support the myth itself.

What are you talking about? Are you suggesting God did not know ahead of time? What do you mean ignore the crime that was committed for no reason?

re the flood -
All of humanity was drowned to 'end the wicked'. Except one righteous family. And that family has apparently produced the exact same wickedness the flood was supposed to be the cure for. And if 'god' is all knowing he knew this would be the outcome. Yet he murdered all of humanity anyway.

God said that the flood was necessary to help save humanity from itself, much like when he comes back again.

 

[Votto]

Ever heard of Biblical Archaeology? It's a secular pursuit of archaeology digs based upon the stories of the Bible.

And it has about as much credibility as those guys who go looking for proof that humans and dinosaurs co-existed.

Right-wingers think this is a documentary!

The problem with the anti-Science Right is that they fit the evidence into the theory, not the theory around the evidence.

For example, ever hear of the Philistines? Well according to archaeology, they did not exist UNTIL Biblical Archaeologists went digging where the Bible said they should be located.

To dismiss Biblical history is a mistake.

Yeah, when a book has Giants and Talking Snakes in it, it's pretty easy to dismiss it.

So if it never happened, why would the story be made up?

Mostly as religious propaganda. Your shitty little tribal God lives in a tent, and their Gods have huge, kick ass temples that have actually survived to the present day, sure you are going to make up stories about how you put one over on them.

The Ten Plagues, for instance, are all directed against specific Egyptian Gods.

So you are going to discard the entire Bible based upon the first two chapter of Genesis?

First off, I'm not a young earth creationist. Many who believe in the Bible are not as well. Secondly, the story of Adam and Eve in the Garden has real meaning and significance, much of which obviously has escaped you. The story revolves around Adam and Eve eating from the tree of knowledge. Does that seem odd to you? Well it 's not if you consider the significance of the relationship between knowledge verses wisdom.

Knowledge without wisdom brings death. Just look at the world around us to see that. We have global warming, caused by the knowledge of being able to exploit fossil fuels for our benefit. We have weapons of mass destruction, all based upon the knowledge of how nuclear fission works and radiation works, etc. We even have the capability to genetically alter crops that can't reproduce, yet these same crops will sterilize other crops of a similar nature until none of these plants can reproduce.

Frightening, isn't it?

So go ahead, mock me and the Bible if you like despite it's wisdom and historical veracity.

Obviously, you are a half wit.

 

[hobelim]

Sadly, this became the backstory for one religion, and nobody questioned it for thousands of years, even the parts about talking snakes and donkeys.

lol ... Has anyone ever searched for archeological evidence to confirm the story of the boy who cried wolf?

I never heard someone who read the story of the three pigs question how wolves could talk or how pigs could build houses. I never heard anyone demand evidence that bears eat porridge.

Not even a child..

You could start a new thread and be the first!

You can call it... Talking pigs are for the birds, fairy tales are lies...or, I'm too smart to believe in the big bad wolf.

.

Naw, we don't have people telling folks what kind of birth control they should use or who they can marry because of actual fairy tales.

We do have that used as an excuse for these things with the BIble.

"You can't have an abortion... the bible says so!"

It's funny you should mention abortion. As I have pointed out, ancient religions used to routinely sacrifice their children to the gods.

And why did they do it? They did it for better crops, better fertility, a win in battle. Anything to enhance their daily lives.

Conversely, in today's world the average person has an abortion due to financial concerns.

The more times change, the more they stay the same.

Every time someone drops off their children to be indoctrinated into a religion before they know anything about science, history, literature - reality itself - they have sacrificed their children to whatever God that religion espouses.

You already know that death comes in many forms, under many guises...


There wouldn't be one person on earth who believed that spiritual life is edible, God became a man, righteousness can be attained by eating or abstaining from certain food, or that mohammed the pedophile was the perfect example of holiness if they had not been ruthlessly put to death at a very early age.

I suspect that even you were once given up to be sacrificed to molech, the abomination of the children of Ammon....You just forgot.

 

[Votto]

Sadly, this became the backstory for one religion, and nobody questioned it for thousands of years, even the parts about talking snakes and donkeys.

lol ... Has anyone ever searched for archeological evidence to confirm the story of the boy who cried wolf?

I never heard someone who read the story of the three pigs question how wolves could talk or how pigs could build houses. I never heard anyone demand evidence that bears eat porridge.

Not even a child..

You could start a new thread and be the first!

You can call it... Talking pigs are for the birds, fairy tales are lies...or, I'm too smart to believe in the big bad wolf.

.

Naw, we don't have people telling folks what kind of birth control they should use or who they can marry because of actual fairy tales.

We do have that used as an excuse for these things with the BIble.

"You can't have an abortion... the bible says so!"

It's funny you should mention abortion. As I have pointed out, ancient religions used to routinely sacrifice their children to the gods.

And why did they do it? They did it for better crops, better fertility, a win in battle. Anything to enhance their daily lives.

Conversely, in today's world the average person has an abortion due to financial concerns.

The more times change, the more they stay the same.

Every time someone drops off their children to be indoctrinated into a religion before they know anything about science history literature, etc,. they have sacrificed their children to whatever God that religion espouses.

You already know that death comes in many forms, under many disguises...


There wouldn't be one person on earth who believed that spiritual life is edible, God became a man, or that mohammed the pedophile was the perfect example of holiness if they had not been ruthlessly put to death at a very early age.

The Bible is like the Constitution. It is often read but either ignored or used as a weapon if so happens to help their cause.

However, if read properly, the Bible SHOULD step on your own toes. As Mark Twain once wrote, "I'm not too concerned about what I don't understand in the Bible. What concerns me is what I do understand."

The Bible, as well as the Constitution, are warnings. They are warnings about the ills of human nature and how those ills can destroy us as well as the rest of society. We all play a part and, as such, we can either participate or we can fight our sin nature and help preserve our lives and that of society.

In short, these documents should cause us to curb our own bad inclinations. The problem is, people routinely violate both with seeming impunity.

I'm always reminded of what Ben Franklin said about the Constitution.

In these sentiments, Sir, I agree to this Constitution with all its faults, if they are such; because I think a general Government necessary for us, and there is no form of Government but what may be a blessing to the people if well administered, and believe farther that this is likely to be well administered for a course of years, and can only end in Despotism, as other forms have done before it, when the people shall become so corrupted as to need despotic Government, being incapable of any other.

 

[hobelim]

Sadly, this became the backstory for one religion, and nobody questioned it for thousands of years, even the parts about talking snakes and donkeys.

lol ... Has anyone ever searched for archeological evidence to confirm the story of the boy who cried wolf?

I never heard someone who read the story of the three pigs question how wolves could talk or how pigs could build houses. I never heard anyone demand evidence that bears eat porridge.

Not even a child..

You could start a new thread and be the first!

You can call it... Talking pigs are for the birds, fairy tales are lies...or, I'm too smart to believe in the big bad wolf.

.

Naw, we don't have people telling folks what kind of birth control they should use or who they can marry because of actual fairy tales.

We do have that used as an excuse for these things with the BIble.

"You can't have an abortion... the bible says so!"

It's funny you should mention abortion. As I have pointed out, ancient religions used to routinely sacrifice their children to the gods.

And why did they do it? They did it for better crops, better fertility, a win in battle. Anything to enhance their daily lives.

Conversely, in today's world the average person has an abortion due to financial concerns.

The more times change, the more they stay the same.

Every time someone drops off their children to be indoctrinated into a religion before they know anything about science history literature, etc,. they have sacrificed their children to whatever God that religion espouses.

You already know that death comes in many forms, under many disguises...


There wouldn't be one person on earth who believed that spiritual life is edible, God became a man, or that mohammed the pedophile was the perfect example of holiness if they had not been ruthlessly put to death at a very early age.

The Bible is like the Constitution. It is often read but either ignored or used as a weapon if so happens to help their cause.

However, if read properly, the Bible SHOULD step on your own toes. As Mark Twain once wrote, "I'm not too concerned about what I don't understand in the Bible. What concerns me is what I do understand."

The Bible, as well as the Constitution, are warnings. They are warnings about the ills of human nature and how those ills can destroy us as well as the rest of society. We all play a part and, as such, we can either participate or we can fight our sin nature and help preserve our lives and that of society.

In short, these documents should cause us to curb our own bad inclinations. The problem is, people routinely violate both with seeming impunity.

The Bible is nothing like the Constitution. The constitution spells things out and is easily understood, the bible is arcane, its wisdom concealed and redacted over thousands of years by unknown editors for security reasons.

Even if neither existed, no one ever gets away with anything.....

 

[Votto]

lol ... Has anyone ever searched for archeological evidence to confirm the story of the boy who cried wolf?

I never heard someone who read the story of the three pigs question how wolves could talk or how pigs could build houses. I never heard anyone demand evidence that bears eat porridge.

Not even a child..

You could start a new thread and be the first!

You can call it... Talking pigs are for the birds, fairy tales are lies...or, I'm too smart to believe in the big bad wolf.

.

Naw, we don't have people telling folks what kind of birth control they should use or who they can marry because of actual fairy tales.

We do have that used as an excuse for these things with the BIble.

"You can't have an abortion... the bible says so!"

It's funny you should mention abortion. As I have pointed out, ancient religions used to routinely sacrifice their children to the gods.

And why did they do it? They did it for better crops, better fertility, a win in battle. Anything to enhance their daily lives.

Conversely, in today's world the average person has an abortion due to financial concerns.

The more times change, the more they stay the same.

Every time someone drops off their children to be indoctrinated into a religion before they know anything about science history literature, etc,. they have sacrificed their children to whatever God that religion espouses.

You already know that death comes in many forms, under many disguises...


There wouldn't be one person on earth who believed that spiritual life is edible, God became a man, or that mohammed the pedophile was the perfect example of holiness if they had not been ruthlessly put to death at a very early age.

The Bible is like the Constitution. It is often read but either ignored or used as a weapon if so happens to help their cause.

However, if read properly, the Bible SHOULD step on your own toes. As Mark Twain once wrote, "I'm not too concerned about what I don't understand in the Bible. What concerns me is what I do understand."

The Bible, as well as the Constitution, are warnings. They are warnings about the ills of human nature and how those ills can destroy us as well as the rest of society. We all play a part and, as such, we can either participate or we can fight our sin nature and help preserve our lives and that of society.

In short, these documents should cause us to curb our own bad inclinations. The problem is, people routinely violate both with seeming impunity.

The Bible is nothing like the Constitution. The constitution spells things out, the bible was rarified, its wisdom concealed and redacted by unknown editiors for security reasons.

Even if neither existed, no one ever gets away with anything.....

You are right. In the long run, if you violate either you will pay a price down the road, but in the short term they are ignored.

You are wrong though if you think that the Constitution is not often ignored.

Case in point is FDR throwing innocent Japanese Americans behind bars. To all, this was an obvious violation of our Constitution, yet no one raised a finger to stop it. At the end of the day though, it is just another nail in the coffin of a country that continues to look the other way regarding never ending abuses that will ultimately lead to the demise of the country, thus they will eventually pay a very big price.

The Bible is also routinely ignored, and just as Ben Franklin aptly pointed out, no amount of law making can force people to obey those laws. People need to be able to self regulate their moral behavior.

If you take a group of amoral convicts to run a government and society, they will destroy that society and themselves, even if you give them the most perfect form of government.

Conversely, if you take a moral group of people and give them a terrible form of government, they will fix it.

Both the Bible and Constitution attempt to show that man needs to self regulate his moral behavior in order to maintain a civil society because man is ultimately flawed.

James Madison sums it up perfectly.

If men were angels, no government would be necessary. If angels were to govern men, neither external nor internal controls on government would be necessary. In framing a government which is to be administered by men over men, the great difficulty lies in this: you must first enable the government to control the governed; and in the next place oblige it to control itself

 

[hobelim]

You are right. In the long run, if you violate either you will pay a price down the road, but in the short term they are ignored.

You are wrong though if you think that the Constitution is not often ignored.

I didn't say that the constitution is not often ignored, I said that, unlike the Bible, the constitution is easily understood.

If you take a group of amoral convicts to run a government and society, they will destroy that society and themselves, even if you give them the most perfect form of government.

Conversely, if you take a moral group of people and give them a terrible form of government, they will fix it.

Looks like we are already well along the way on that road to that destruction, thanks to a group of amoral people pretending to be religious moral authorities running the government..

Looks like that moral group, wherever they are, have their work cut out for them....


I'm not convinced they even exist. I mean WTF. How can everyone sit at a poker table and continue playing the game as if everything was hunky dory when everyone knows some jerk is cheating?

 

[Votto]

You are right. In the long run, if you violate either you will pay a price down the road, but in the short term they are ignored.

You are wrong though if you think that the Constitution is not often ignored.

I didn't say that the constitution is not often ignored, I said that, unlike the Bible, the constitution is easily understood.

.

Really? The Constitution is easily understood? Well tell that to SCOTUS who passed the Dred Scott Decision.

Or tell that to a Lefty who wants to redefine the 2nd amendment.

I think you will find that people are able to argue pretty much any position based upon their own desired outcomes.

As I have said, when people are for an agenda verses the truth you can twist words any way you wish. Next thing you know, what you said is not what you said. Instead, what you said becomes a living breathing entity capable of evolving at any moment.

 

[hobelim]

You are right. In the long run, if you violate either you will pay a price down the road, but in the short term they are ignored.

You are wrong though if you think that the Constitution is not often ignored.

I didn't say that the constitution is not often ignored, I said that, unlike the Bible, the constitution is easily understood.

.

Really? The Constitution is easily understood? Well tell that to SCOTUS who passed the Dred Scott Decision.

Or tell that to a Lefty who wants to redefine the 2nd amendment.

I think you will find that people are able to argue pretty much any position based upon their own desired outcomes.

As I have said, when people are for an agenda verses the truth you can twist words any way you wish. Next thing you know, what you said is not what you said. Instead, what you said becomes a living breathing entity capable of evolving at any moment.

lol....

you are right!


Words, even words from God, once uttered seem to take on a life of their own, depending on where the hearer is at, that are often unrelated to the speakers intent.

 

[Votto]

You are right. In the long run, if you violate either you will pay a price down the road, but in the short term they are ignored.

You are wrong though if you think that the Constitution is not often ignored.

I didn't say that the constitution is not often ignored, I said that, unlike the Bible, the constitution is easily understood.

If you take a group of amoral convicts to run a government and society, they will destroy that society and themselves, even if you give them the most perfect form of government.

Conversely, if you take a moral group of people and give them a terrible form of government, they will fix it.

Looks like we are already well along the way on that road to that destruction, thanks to a group of amoral people pretending to be religious moral authorities running the government..

Looks like that moral group, wherever they are, have their work cut out for them....


I'm not convinced they even exist. I mean WTF. How can everyone sit at a poker table and continue playing the game as if everything was hunky dory when everyone knows some jerk is cheating?

The reason the Constitution was formed and successful for so long, is because of two things. It was the moral fiber of the Founding Fathers and the society that produced them. One cannot come without the other.

But you are correct. Those in government sit on their perches pretending to be the moral authority on everything. That's what makes them so terrifying. They think they know everything. That is why limited government is essential.

C. S. Lewis saw this problem coming when he wrote, “Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.”

So how do collectivists in government try to appear as the moral elite? Here is a quote of my own.

"In ancient times, collectivist first wanted us to believe that they were a god, but when that no longer worked, they tried to convince us that they spoke for God, but when that no longer worked, they tried to convince us that there is no God, thus making themselves the ultimate authority once again."