Fears of a Chinese attack on Taiwan are growing, and Taiwan isn't sure who would help if it happened

[rightwinger]

That's the problem: they would not know about it. Chinese control; of information is very effective.

They seem to 'tolerate' genocide and slave labor of their fellow countrymen every single day already.

North Korea?
Maybe

But China would know about a military disaster of that magnitude

 

[HenryBHough]

China will do as it damn well pleases and Xiden, addled puppet that he is, will lie down and then lie about having written a "strong" letter to his puppet masters in China. In reality it will contain only congratulations on their Mission Accomplished.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

North Korea?
Maybe

But China would know about a military disaster of that magnitude

Some would. Some are too brainwashed to believe anything but what their government tells them. And some who aren't brainwashed are too afraid to end up in a camp or 6 feet under to speak out. We can see this today with the ongoing genocide and slave labor in China right now.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

China will do as it damn well pleases and Xiden, addled puppet that he is, will lie down and then lie about having written a "strong" letter to his puppet masters in China. In reality it will contain only congratulations on their Mission Accomplished.

So what SHOULD Biden do, if China invades Taiwan?

You forgot to say. Weird.

Here's your chance.

And... go

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

*crickets*

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Anyone else want to step up to the plate and answer?

"What SHOULD Biden do, if China invades Taiwan?"

 

[Mushroom]

I didn't say, that DPP are scared because of existence of the Chinese nukes. They will be scared if PRC demonstratively use it against RoC forces (may be as an answer to some kind of provocation or false flag operation) to demonstrate their decisiveness, and more than scared, if the USA don't nuke PRC, too.

*shakes head*

The US would not nuke China if they did that. They would not have to.

China would have essentially nuked itself. Almost all International trade with them would cease immediately. All assets frozen, and likely after some legal argument largely sent to Taiwan to help in rebuilding. Most corporations would cease doing business with China and never return. Their "Most Favored Nation" status that they have enjoyed with most trade partners would cease immediately.

Nobody would buy their goods, and nobody will sell them the raw materials they need to make more goods.

But the US would not "nuke China", at least at first. However, I could see what the immediate reaction would be. The sending of a large contingent of US forces, to help in "recovery". And if China was foolish to do so again, at that point I could not speak for their not being a response to a second nuke.

As I said, you just can not seem to understand how the rest of the world would react. What, that they are scared of a nuke? The world has had a cloud of "Nuclear Armageddon" over its head for over 70 years now. I am just glad you are just a foolish troll and not actually in charge of a country like China.

But in closing, the US has no "Nuclear Defense Treaty" with Taiwan, like it does with say NATO. Where a nuclear attack demands a nuclear response. And the likely response by the US and other nations (specifically France and the UK) would be to rush their own military on the scene, to actually help out in relief efforts as those are the parts of their government most trained to respond to a nuclear attack. Because all in the military have the training and equipment to operate in such a situation.

And a second nuke with their own forces on the ground would at that point almost demand a nuclear response. And the US, UK, and France are all nuclear nations. In fact, it would not surprise me if Russia sent aid also, and would respond the same way.

 

[Mushroom]

"What SHOULD Biden do, if China invades Taiwan?"

To me, this is not even a "Biden" question, but "What should the US do" in general.

Myself, move two of our carrier groups in response, one to the East and the other to the West of the nation. Bring the Third Marine Division from Okinawa and place them there, as well as increase airborne patrols. In general, do nothing but let it be known that to get to Taiwan, China would be risking a major war.

I am not a big supporter of war, in fact I hate it. I much prefer stepping up deterrence, and those steps would actually be done before China actually "attacked".

China could not make such an attack without it being known. It is not like they could just snap their fingers and teleport their forces to Taiwan. And if they started to do the things that would have to come before an attack, the US and rest of the International community should be doing their own actions in response to show why that would be a bad idea.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

China would have essentially nuked itself. Almost all International trade with them would cease immediately. All assets frozen, and likely after some legal argument largely sent to Taiwan to help in rebuilding. Most corporations would cease doing business with China and never return. Their "Most Favored Nation" status that they have enjoyed with most trade partners would cease immediately.

Seems reasonable, but this is not what happened after Russia invaded TWO European countries in the last 13 years.

Why? because countries rely on their goods, especially natural gas. Many countries are 100% reliant on cheap Chinese goods to maintain their economies and standard of living. We are sitting in one right now.

Suspend ALL trade with China? I imagine that would create an economic crisis in this country.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

To me, this is not even a "Biden" question, but "What should the US do" in general.

Agreed 100%, really.

Myself, move two of our carrier groups in response, one to the East and the other to the West of the nation. Bring the Third Marine Division from Okinawa and place them there, as well as increase airborne patrols. In general, do nothing but let it be known that to get to Taiwan, China would be risking a major war.

But if the invasion has already begun....

How many American lives would we sacrifice for Taiwan? How many americans would we be willing to send into an essentially impoverished state, if China invades Taiwan? In this case, "impoverished" meaning unable to find or purchase essential goods.

 

[Silver Cat]

Anyone else want to step up to the plate and answer?

"What SHOULD Biden do, if China invades Taiwan?"

He should evacuate US cities, prepare to counter-force strike or all-out nuclear war against both Russia and China simultaneously, try to find a diplomatic solution, if unsuccessful - attack first.
Obviously - he won't do it, because he is a stupid coward and don't even want to think about 'unthinkable'.

But what question is more important - what Biden should do to prevent such a conflict.
1) Buy some time by signing the non-agression pact with Russia.
2) Dump the ballast and improve the economy.
3) Start the new crash R&D program in offensive and defensive nuclear weapons.
4) Make America Great Again.

 

[Mushroom]

Seems reasonable, but this is not what happened after Russia invaded TWO European countries in the last 13 years.

Neither of which belonged to any kind of international bodies that would have assisted them afterwards.

Taiwan is in kind of a unique status, not unlike say Micronesia. Nominally independent, but still very closely tied to the US.

And most know that the "official policy" of the US in regards to the "One China Policy" is largely a fiction. We have an Ambassador there who is not an ambassador, in an Embassy building that is not an embassy. We do not "officially" recognize them, yet still train and cooperate with their military.

If those "European countries" had done something similar, then they might have had more assistance. But that is the thing about politics, you need to give in order to get. And you can not just pop up after ignoring such offers, then expect assistance because it is finally in your interest after the fact. The Ukraine in particular rejected all offers for decades. Well, if you reject all offers to work together, do not be surprised when under attack you suddenly have nobody helping you.

 

[Mushroom]

He should evacuate US cities, prepare to counter-force strike or all-out nuclear war against both Russia and China simultaneously, try to find a diplomatic solution, if unsuccessful - attack first.
Obviously - he won't do it.

Wait a minute, Russia and China?

I read that, and was actually wondering if maybe you intended Muscovy. Because that sounded almost like what another of our deranged clueless posters would have said.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

unsuccessful

He should evacuate US cities, prepare to counter-force strike or all-out nuclear war against both Russia and China simultaneously, try to find a diplomatic solution, if unsuccessful - attack first

Wow, that is maybe the worst possible answer I could imagine a poster giving.

 

[Unkotare]

Seems reasonable, but this is not what happened after Russia invaded TWO European countries in the last 13 years.

Why? because countries rely on their goods, especially natural gas. Many countries are 100% reliant on cheap Chinese goods to maintain their economies and standard of living. We are sitting in one right now.

Suspend ALL trade with China? I imagine that would create an economic crisis in this country.

China has a lot more to lose from that than us.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Neither of which belonged to any kind of international bodies that would have assisted them afterwards

True, but this still triggered a diplomatic response that was limited by countries being beholden to Russia in one way or another.

And international agreements only have as much substance as they are given on any given day. We stopped recognizing Taiwan as an independent State in 1971, for example. This was politically expedient, at the time.

 

[Unkotare]

He should evacuate US cities, prepare to counter-force strike or all-out nuclear war against both Russia and China simultaneously, ...

Holy cow, that’s stupid.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

China has a lot more to lose from that than us.

Yes, maybe so, but the fact still remains that we have much to lose. Knowing that a Chinese citizen is also suffering isn't much comfort to an American who is suffering.

 

[Silver Cat]

*shakes head*

The US would not nuke China if they did that. They would not have to.

China would have essentially nuked itself. Almost all International trade with them would cease immediately. All assets frozen, and likely after some legal argument largely sent to Taiwan to help in rebuilding. Most corporations would cease doing business with China and never return. Their "Most Favored Nation" status that they have enjoyed with most trade partners would cease immediately.

Nobody would buy their goods, and nobody will sell them the raw materials they need to make more goods.

But the US would not "nuke China", at least at first. However, I could see what the immediate reaction would be. The sending of a large contingent of US forces, to help in "recovery". And if China was foolish to do so again, at that point I could not speak for their not being a response to a second nuke.

As I said, you just can not seem to understand how the rest of the world would react. What, that they are scared of a nuke? The world has had a cloud of "Nuclear Armageddon" over its head for over 70 years now. I am just glad you are just a foolish troll and not actually in charge of a country like China.

But in closing, the US has no "Nuclear Defense Treaty" with Taiwan, like it does with say NATO. Where a nuclear attack demands a nuclear response. And the likely response by the US and other nations (specifically France and the UK) would be to rush their own military on the scene, to actually help out in relief efforts as those are the parts of their government most trained to respond to a nuclear attack. Because all in the military have the training and equipment to operate in such a situation.

And a second nuke with their own forces on the ground would at that point almost demand a nuclear response. And the US, UK, and France are all nuclear nations. In fact, it would not surprise me if Russia sent aid also, and would respond the same way.

Russia totally support China in their Taiwan claims. I'm pretty sure, that they can even send some fighters and bombers to kill some 'Evil Americans' (or at least distract the USA from the militarisation of Ukraine). You know, now they really empathize adventures of the brave Chines pilot Li Xi-Qing (in fact - Russian pilot Lisitsyn), who has been fighting against evil Japans and Americans in skies of China, Korea and Vietnam.

 

[Mushroom]

But if the invasion has already begun....

How many American lives would we sacrifice for Taiwan?

Such an invasion could not be made in a vacuum, and would be known long before it happened. And the moment such things were obvious, that is when you start your own movement of pieces.

To begin with, their Navy is in no way set up to do this, and neither is their Army. You would have months of preparation first, China could not hide that. And weeks before such could happen, they would have to start bringing all of their pieces together on the board. Loading ships, and moving them to positions to prepare for the attack. Also the forces needed, those also would have to be moved into position.

This would be seen, and the US would be acting in concert at the same time to let China know it was watching.

And if I had to predict, if they tried it, largely it would end up being a three ring circus.

And the reason is simple, China's Navy is almost a joke. They do almost no fleet operations, and have no experience in amphibious operations. I bet most of what they do "know" is out of the books on that the US wrote 70 years ago. There is a hell of a lot more involved than simply "put people on boats, sail boats, put soldiers on ground". That was not even how it was done 100 years ago, as the UK forces discovered at a little place called Gallipoli.

No, the US would be watching each of the steps they started to make, and would be countering them with their own forces. Most likely simply by placing them into positions so they would have to "go through" the US in order to get to Taiwan. And we all know how that ends up, we saw it in 1941.

When Japan wanted the resources of the Dutch East Indies, but realized that to get through them, they had to go past a stronghold of the US. They made the decision to attack, and the world knows the result. And just like in 1941, the UK was heavily involved because they see that as "their area of the world" as well because of alliances and partnerships in the region. As well as France.

Myself, I often shake my head when people for some reason think it would be the "US alone", because many nations would be involved. Including Japan, Philippines, South Korea, Australia, possibly even Russia. And not on the side of China, Russia would also see this as a threat to their interests in the area. And at each step China started to make, others would see it and be making their own movements.

As far as "How many American lives?" Well, ultimately that is up to China. But for myself, I will say it this way and do not take it as an attack. I am not such an arrogant and self-centered prick that I measure lives in that way. If a nation makes a naked show of force and tries to annex and destroy another country then I have no problem in fighting against it. Even at the risk of my own life, which I proved by my own actions in the past.

Because if there is one thing we should have learned in the last century, appeasement does not work. Allow a bully to do it once, they will simply keep doing it over and over again. And they must be stopped quickly, or it will only end up worse in the long run.