Fast Food Workers Going On Strike

[Uncensored2008]

Just give the American Worker a seat at the table. I think that's a reasonable request. Workers are a big part of the Capitalism picture. They deserve consideration. Too many in their zealous defense of Capitalism, have forgotten the American Worker. Don't be so quick to ridicule and tell them to shut up and be good little slaves. Do the right thing. Support them as much as you support Businesses.

Just give them a seat at the table where the "capitalists" gather to design the central plan on how to allocate goods and services?

You actually have no idea at all what "capitalist" means or how a market economy operates, do you?

 

[Uncensored2008]

Somehow you've arrived at the notion that American workers ARE slaves, Paul. I'm not sure how. I have employees not slaves. They work...I pay them. If they don't like me...the job...the wage I pay...they are free to walk down the street and get a job with my competition. I can't stop them from doing so. I can't chain them up in the basement at closing time. This notion that they are powerless is a crock.

I'm getting the picture that Paulitician has never read a single word that Ron Paul has written. That he heard Paul supports legalizing pot, so he jumped on board - but has no clue what Paul stands for.

Ron Paul :: Pillars of Prosperity: Free Markets, Honest Money, Private Property

 

[paulitician]

Just give the American Worker a seat at the table. I think that's a reasonable request. Workers are a big part of the Capitalism picture. They deserve consideration. Too many in their zealous defense of Capitalism, have forgotten the American Worker. Don't be so quick to ridicule and tell them to shut up and be good little slaves. Do the right thing. Support them as much as you support Businesses.

Somehow you've arrived at the notion that American workers ARE slaves, Paul. I'm not sure how. I have employees not slaves. They work...I pay them. If they don't like me...the job...the wage I pay...they are free to walk down the street and get a job with my competition. I can't stop them from doing so. I can't chain them up in the basement at closing time. This notion that they are powerless is a crock.

Support and defend Workers as vigorously as you do Business. Their a big part of the Capitalism picture. Business owners are not a special protected class. They aren't better than an average American Worker. In fact, many actually do unscrupulous things to increase their profits. But too many in this country choose to ignore that, or even defend it.

So what's so wrong with a Worker trying to get more for them and their family? All i'm saying is, there are two sides to the story. There's no need to ridicule or dismiss them all as being 'lazy & greedy.' They're just doing what they have to do. They're just doing what Businesses do. They're looking out for themselves and their families. Give them a seat at the Capitalism table.

 

[paulitician]

Somehow you've arrived at the notion that American workers ARE slaves, Paul. I'm not sure how. I have employees not slaves. They work...I pay them. If they don't like me...the job...the wage I pay...they are free to walk down the street and get a job with my competition. I can't stop them from doing so. I can't chain them up in the basement at closing time. This notion that they are powerless is a crock.

I'm getting the picture that Paulitician has never read a single word that Ron Paul has written. That he heard Paul supports legalizing pot, so he jumped on board - but has no clue what Paul stands for.

Ron Paul :: Pillars of Prosperity: Free Markets, Honest Money, Private Property

I know very well what Ron Paul stands for. But i don't march in lock-step with anyone. I disagree with the Good Doctor from time to time. I'm a Capitalist. I truly believe in Capitalism. And that's why i think it's important to defend the American Worker. Their a big part of the picture.

This notion you have to march in lock-step with Corporations and defend everything they do, is absolutely ludicrous. Defending all the evil they do, so you can feel good about yourself being a 'Good Capitalist', is simply misguided and wrong. You don't have to defend them and bash American Workers to prove you're a good Capitalist. Try defending the Worker for a change. Who knows? You might just like it. Give it a shot.

 

[Uncensored2008]

I know very well what Ron Paul stands for. But i don't march in lock-step with anyone.

You're not even in the same universe as Paul.

Now your views are pretty consistent with Obama, but that's a different issue.

I disagree with the Good Doctor from time to time. I'm a Capitalist. I truly believe in Capitalism. And that's why i think it's important to defend the American Worker. Their a big part of the picture.

You can't.

You can't be a "capitalist" because you haven't got a clue what the word means.

This notion you have to march in lock-step with Corporations and defend everything they do, is absolutely ludicrous. Defending all the evil they do, so you can feel good about yourself being a 'Good Capitalist', is simply misguided and wrong. You don't have to defend them and bash American Workers to prove you're a good Capitalist. Try defending the Worker for a change. Who knows? You might just like it. Give it a shot.

I understand that ThinkProgress says that one is either in favor of central planning and government dependance, or one is a corporate stooge - with no alternative, but this is simply nonsense, as Dr. Paul would be the first to point out.

I'm right about the dope thing, aren't I?

 

[paulitician]

I know very well what Ron Paul stands for. But i don't march in lock-step with anyone.

You're not even in the same universe as Paul.

Now your views are pretty consistent with Obama, but that's a different issue.

I disagree with the Good Doctor from time to time. I'm a Capitalist. I truly believe in Capitalism. And that's why i think it's important to defend the American Worker. Their a big part of the picture.

You can't.

You can't be a "capitalist" because you haven't got a clue what the word means.

This notion you have to march in lock-step with Corporations and defend everything they do, is absolutely ludicrous. Defending all the evil they do, so you can feel good about yourself being a 'Good Capitalist', is simply misguided and wrong. You don't have to defend them and bash American Workers to prove you're a good Capitalist. Try defending the Worker for a change. Who knows? You might just like it. Give it a shot.

I understand that ThinkProgress says that one is either in favor of central planning and government dependance, or one is a corporate stooge - with no alternative, but this is simply nonsense, as Dr. Paul would be the first to point out.

I'm right about the dope thing, aren't I?

You just refuse to see it from the Workers' perspective. You choose to play deaf, dumb, and blind on that. You truly believe defending everything Businesses do, while bashing Workers, makes you a 'Good Capitalist.' But it doesn't. You may believe that, but it's not the case.

 

[Uncensored2008]

You just refuse to see it from the Workers' perspective. You choose to play deaf, dumb, and blind on that. You truly believe defending everything Businesses do, while bashing Workers, makes you a 'Good Capitalist.' But it doesn't. You may believe that, but it's not the case.

Again, you have no concept of what a market economy is - thus you don't grasp how foolish your post is.

 

[paulitician]

You just refuse to see it from the Workers' perspective. You choose to play deaf, dumb, and blind on that. You truly believe defending everything Businesses do, while bashing Workers, makes you a 'Good Capitalist.' But it doesn't. You may believe that, but it's not the case.

Again, you have no concept of what a market economy is - thus you don't grasp how foolish your post is.

You keep telling yourself that. But just remember, defending everything Businesses do, while ridiculing & bashing Workers, does not make you a 'Good Capitalist.' Try seeing the whole picture. Take care. See ya.

 

[Uncensored2008]

You keep telling yourself that. But just remember, defending everything Businesses do, while ridiculing & bashing Workers, does not make you a 'Good Capitalist.' Try seeing the whole picture. Take care. See ya.

You should invest the time in an introduction to economics course.

 

[Oldstyle]

Just give the American Worker a seat at the table. I think that's a reasonable request. Workers are a big part of the Capitalism picture. They deserve consideration. Too many in their zealous defense of Capitalism, have forgotten the American Worker. Don't be so quick to ridicule and tell them to shut up and be good little slaves. Do the right thing. Support them as much as you support Businesses.

Somehow you've arrived at the notion that American workers ARE slaves, Paul. I'm not sure how. I have employees not slaves. They work...I pay them. If they don't like me...the job...the wage I pay...they are free to walk down the street and get a job with my competition. I can't stop them from doing so. I can't chain them up in the basement at closing time. This notion that they are powerless is a crock.

Support and defend Workers as vigorously as you do Business. Their a big part of the Capitalism picture. Business owners are not a special protected class. They aren't better than an average American Worker. In fact, many actually do unscrupulous things to increase their profits. But too many in this country choose to ignore that, or even defend it.

So what's so wrong with a Worker trying to get more for them and their family? All i'm saying is, there are two sides to the story. There's no need to ridicule or dismiss them all as being 'lazy & greedy.' They're just doing what they have to do. They're just doing what Businesses do. They're looking out for themselves and their families. Give them a seat at the Capitalism table.

The ignorance of that first statement is profound, Paul. Trust me, there are FAR more protections for workers in the United States than there are for business owners! Are there business owners who do "unscrupulous" things to their employees? Of course! There are also a large number of employees that do "unscrupulous" things to their employers.

And I've NEVER ridiculed or dismissed the concerns of any of the people who work for me! They are literally the most important part of the businesses that I've run. I will walk through fire for a good employee. What I WON'T do is tolerate bad ones.

 

[paulitician]

Somehow you've arrived at the notion that American workers ARE slaves, Paul. I'm not sure how. I have employees not slaves. They work...I pay them. If they don't like me...the job...the wage I pay...they are free to walk down the street and get a job with my competition. I can't stop them from doing so. I can't chain them up in the basement at closing time. This notion that they are powerless is a crock.

Support and defend Workers as vigorously as you do Business. Their a big part of the Capitalism picture. Business owners are not a special protected class. They aren't better than an average American Worker. In fact, many actually do unscrupulous things to increase their profits. But too many in this country choose to ignore that, or even defend it.

So what's so wrong with a Worker trying to get more for them and their family? All i'm saying is, there are two sides to the story. There's no need to ridicule or dismiss them all as being 'lazy & greedy.' They're just doing what they have to do. They're just doing what Businesses do. They're looking out for themselves and their families. Give them a seat at the Capitalism table.

The ignorance of that first statement is profound, Paul. Trust me, there are FAR more protections for workers in the United States than there are for business owners! Are there business owners who do "unscrupulous" things to their employees? Of course! There are also a large number of employees that do "unscrupulous" things to their employers.

And I've NEVER ridiculed or dismissed the concerns of any of the people who work for me! They are literally the most important part of the businesses that I've run. I will walk through fire for a good employee. What I WON'T do is tolerate bad ones.

Well, i will say you do seem to be willing to see the whole picture. I have to give you credit there. Capitalism drives people to want and get more. That's what it's all about. Both Workers and Business Owners are trying to get more. One is no better than the other. You can't claim the workers are all just 'lazy & greedy' for wanting more for them and their families. But if you are gonna claim that, then at least be honest & consistent. Business Owners are doing the same thing. American Workers don't have too many looking out for them these days. If they don't stand up and fight for themselves, who's gonna do it?

 

[Uncensored2008]

Well, i will say you do seem to be willing to see the whole picture. I have to give you credit there. Capitalism drives people to want and get more. That's what it's all about. Both Workers and Business Owners are trying to get more. One is no better than the other. You can't claim the workers are all just 'lazy & greedy' for wanting more for them and their families. But if you are gonna claim that, then at least be honest & consistent. Business Owners are doing the same thing. American Workers don't have too many looking out for them these days. If they don't stand up and fight for themselves, who's gonna do it?

No, that is not what capitalism is about.

Capitalism is about honor and good will. Capitalism is a system by which honest people trade what they produce for that which they value. It is the honest exchange between free people of value for value.

When I employ a person, I offer to trade wages and benefits for that persons time and talent. It is a free and fair trade, no one engages in or threatens violence or any sort of coercion. One side needs wages and benefits, the other needs labor. It is no different than if I need a loaf of bread and trade dollars to a store in exchange for the bread. It is a free and fair trade. I may not like the price I have to pay, and if it upsets me, I may go elsewhere, but no one is exploiting anyone, for we are all free to trade or not trade as we see fit.

Capitalism is the exchange of goods between free people.

 

[paulitician]

Well, i will say you do seem to be willing to see the whole picture. I have to give you credit there. Capitalism drives people to want and get more. That's what it's all about. Both Workers and Business Owners are trying to get more. One is no better than the other. You can't claim the workers are all just 'lazy & greedy' for wanting more for them and their families. But if you are gonna claim that, then at least be honest & consistent. Business Owners are doing the same thing. American Workers don't have too many looking out for them these days. If they don't stand up and fight for themselves, who's gonna do it?

No, that is not what capitalism is about.

Capitalism is about honor and good will. Capitalism is a system by which honest people trade what they produce for that which they value. It is the honest exchange between free people of value for value.

When I employ a person, I offer to trade wages and benefits for that persons time and talent. It is a free and fair trade, no one engages in or threatens violence or any sort of coercion. One side needs wages and benefits, the other needs labor. It is no different than if I need a loaf of bread and trade dollars to a store in exchange for the bread. It is a free and fair trade. I may not like the price I have to pay, and if it upsets me, I may go elsewhere, but no one is exploiting anyone, for we are all free to trade or not trade as we see fit.

Capitalism is the exchange of goods between free people.

I agree for the most part, but unfortunately you paint too rosy a picture. The current reality is, American Workers don't have too many looking out for them anymore. They have to fend for themselves. They're not all just 'lazy & greedy.' They're just trying to survive in an ever-increasingly hostile environment. Who's looking out for them? It has to be themselves.

 

[Uncensored2008]

I agree for the most part, but unfortunately you paint too rosy a picture. The current reality is, American Workers don't have too many looking out for them anymore.

This is because you are a socialist and think like a socialist.

Under capitalism, workers are free men. No one "takes care" of them because they are free, they take care of themselves. Workers trade there time and talent on the open market. If they don't like what McDonalds offers in exchange for their time and talent, they are free to go elsewhere and demand a higher price.

Where you socialists get caught up is when a worker has no talent to trade. With no talent, all they can trade is time. Like sod, talentless time is so plentiful that has very little value.

So you seek to change the terms from trading value for value, to that of trading value for needs. The employer is supposed to honor his side of the bargain by paying wages, but the the worker is to trade his needs rather than value. The Employer is not supposed to look at the value the worker offers, but only needs the worker has.

And this is why what you demand is immoral and always fails - it is dishonorable in structure.

They have to fend for themselves. They're not all just 'lazy & greedy.' They're just trying to survive in an ever-increasingly hostile environment. Who's looking out for them? It has to be themselves.

Honorable men survive through trade, through the cooperation that can only come from the free and uncoerced exchange of goods.

 

[paulitician]

I agree for the most part, but unfortunately you paint too rosy a picture. The current reality is, American Workers don't have too many looking out for them anymore.

This is because you are a socialist and think like a socialist.

Under capitalism, workers are free men. No one "takes care" of them because they are free, they take care of themselves. Workers trade there time and talent on the open market. If they don't like what McDonalds offers in exchange for their time and talent, they are free to go elsewhere and demand a higher price.

Where you socialists get caught up is when a worker has no talent to trade. With no talent, all they can trade is time. Like sod, talentless time is so plentiful that has very little value.

So you seek to change the terms from trading value for value, to that of trading value for needs. The employer is supposed to honor his side of the bargain by paying wages, but the the worker is to trade his needs rather than value. The Employer is not supposed to look at the value the worker offers, but only needs the worker has.

And this is why what you demand is immoral and always fails - it is dishonorable in structure.

They have to fend for themselves. They're not all just 'lazy & greedy.' They're just trying to survive in an ever-increasingly hostile environment. Who's looking out for them? It has to be themselves.

Honorable men survive through trade, through the cooperation that can only come from the free and uncoerced exchange of goods.

I'm not a Socialist. I'm just considering both perspectives. Constantly defending Business while ridiculing & bashing Workers, does not mean you're a 'Good Capitalist.' Unfortunately, too many are confused about that. I understand the desire to zealously defend Capitalism, but it's good to understand how to better go about that. You don't always have to be a 'RAH RAH CORPORATIONS!' cheerleader to prove you're a good Capitalist. Try being a 'RAH RAH AMERICAN WORKER!" cheerleader sometimes. Give it a try. I won't call you an 'Anti-Capitalism Socialist.' Some will, but i won't.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Well, i will say you do seem to be willing to see the whole picture. I have to give you credit there. Capitalism drives people to want and get more. That's what it's all about. Both Workers and Business Owners are trying to get more. One is no better than the other. You can't claim the workers are all just 'lazy & greedy' for wanting more for them and their families. But if you are gonna claim that, then at least be honest & consistent. Business Owners are doing the same thing. American Workers don't have too many looking out for them these days. If they don't stand up and fight for themselves, who's gonna do it?

No, that is not what capitalism is about.

Capitalism is about honor and good will. Capitalism is a system by which honest people trade what they produce for that which they value. It is the honest exchange between free people of value for value.

When I employ a person, I offer to trade wages and benefits for that persons time and talent. It is a free and fair trade, no one engages in or threatens violence or any sort of coercion. One side needs wages and benefits, the other needs labor. It is no different than if I need a loaf of bread and trade dollars to a store in exchange for the bread. It is a free and fair trade. I may not like the price I have to pay, and if it upsets me, I may go elsewhere, but no one is exploiting anyone, for we are all free to trade or not trade as we see fit.

Capitalism is the exchange of goods between free people.

I agree for the most part, but unfortunately you paint too rosy a picture. The current reality is, American Workers don't have too many looking out for them anymore. They have to fend for themselves. They're not all just 'lazy & greedy.' They're just trying to survive in an ever-increasingly hostile environment. Who's looking out for them? It has to be themselves.

They're not all just 'lazy & greedy.'

Where did he say they were?

Who's looking out for them?

You're kidding, right?
The state and federal bureaucracies that are dedicated to the protection of workers employ 10s of thousands and spend $10s of billions annually.

 

[paulitician]

No, that is not what capitalism is about.

Capitalism is about honor and good will. Capitalism is a system by which honest people trade what they produce for that which they value. It is the honest exchange between free people of value for value.

When I employ a person, I offer to trade wages and benefits for that persons time and talent. It is a free and fair trade, no one engages in or threatens violence or any sort of coercion. One side needs wages and benefits, the other needs labor. It is no different than if I need a loaf of bread and trade dollars to a store in exchange for the bread. It is a free and fair trade. I may not like the price I have to pay, and if it upsets me, I may go elsewhere, but no one is exploiting anyone, for we are all free to trade or not trade as we see fit.

Capitalism is the exchange of goods between free people.

I agree for the most part, but unfortunately you paint too rosy a picture. The current reality is, American Workers don't have too many looking out for them anymore. They have to fend for themselves. They're not all just 'lazy & greedy.' They're just trying to survive in an ever-increasingly hostile environment. Who's looking out for them? It has to be themselves.

They're not all just 'lazy & greedy.'

Where did he say they were?

Who's looking out for them?

You're kidding, right?
The state and federal bureaucracies that are dedicated to the protection of workers employ 10s of thousands and spend $10s of billions annually.

Well, they're doing a terrible job. American Workers have been getting the shit-end of the stick for many many years. It's time to reverse that awful trend. And btw, Businesses also receive Government protection.

 

[Oldstyle]

Support and defend Workers as vigorously as you do Business. Their a big part of the Capitalism picture. Business owners are not a special protected class. They aren't better than an average American Worker. In fact, many actually do unscrupulous things to increase their profits. But too many in this country choose to ignore that, or even defend it.

So what's so wrong with a Worker trying to get more for them and their family? All i'm saying is, there are two sides to the story. There's no need to ridicule or dismiss them all as being 'lazy & greedy.' They're just doing what they have to do. They're just doing what Businesses do. They're looking out for themselves and their families. Give them a seat at the Capitalism table.

The ignorance of that first statement is profound, Paul. Trust me, there are FAR more protections for workers in the United States than there are for business owners! Are there business owners who do "unscrupulous" things to their employees? Of course! There are also a large number of employees that do "unscrupulous" things to their employers.

And I've NEVER ridiculed or dismissed the concerns of any of the people who work for me! They are literally the most important part of the businesses that I've run. I will walk through fire for a good employee. What I WON'T do is tolerate bad ones.

Well, i will say you do seem to be willing to see the whole picture. I have to give you credit there. Capitalism drives people to want and get more. That's what it's all about. Both Workers and Business Owners are trying to get more. One is no better than the other. You can't claim the workers are all just 'lazy & greedy' for wanting more for them and their families. But if you are gonna claim that, then at least be honest & consistent. Business Owners are doing the same thing. American Workers don't have too many looking out for them these days. If they don't stand up and fight for themselves, who's gonna do it?

I see the whole picture because I've been both an employee and an employer. Once again, I haven't accused workers of being "lazy and greedy". Some are...most aren't.

Years ago when I got my first job as a manager of a nightclub the owner sat me down and explained how he viewed things in that industry. He told me: "25% of the people you hire will never under any circumstances steal...25% of the people you hire will always steal no matter what you do...and the rest are watching to see how you handle the theft situation. Your job as a manager is to reward the ones that would never steal...fire the ones that always steal and make sure the other 50% understand what you're doing."

That's essentially the same business management model that Jack Welch espoused when he was running GE. He wanted the top 25% rewarded...and the bottom 25% fired. The message sent is that if you do the right things then you will be taken good care of and if you don't you will be looking for a new job.

What you can't seem to grasp, Paul is how valuable a good employee is. You make the statement that nobody's looking out for them and that's simply not true. Good employees are not only looked after...they are jealously guarded! The workers that are not "looked after" are the not so good employees...the ones that my old boss wanted me to get rid of and Jack Welch wanted fired. THOSE workers don't have anyone looking out for them unless they're in a union.

 

[paulitician]

The ignorance of that first statement is profound, Paul. Trust me, there are FAR more protections for workers in the United States than there are for business owners! Are there business owners who do "unscrupulous" things to their employees? Of course! There are also a large number of employees that do "unscrupulous" things to their employers.

And I've NEVER ridiculed or dismissed the concerns of any of the people who work for me! They are literally the most important part of the businesses that I've run. I will walk through fire for a good employee. What I WON'T do is tolerate bad ones.

Well, i will say you do seem to be willing to see the whole picture. I have to give you credit there. Capitalism drives people to want and get more. That's what it's all about. Both Workers and Business Owners are trying to get more. One is no better than the other. You can't claim the workers are all just 'lazy & greedy' for wanting more for them and their families. But if you are gonna claim that, then at least be honest & consistent. Business Owners are doing the same thing. American Workers don't have too many looking out for them these days. If they don't stand up and fight for themselves, who's gonna do it?

I see the whole picture because I've been both an employee and an employer. Once again, I haven't accused workers of being "lazy and greedy". Some are...most aren't.

Years ago when I got my first job as a manager of a nightclub the owner sat me down and explained how he viewed things in that industry. He told me: "25% of the people you hire will never under any circumstances steal...25% of the people you hire will always steal no matter what you do...and the rest are watching to see how you handle the theft situation. Your job as a manager is to reward the ones that would never steal...fire the ones that always steal and make sure the other 50% understand what you're doing."

That's essentially the same business management model that Jack Welch espoused when he was running GE. He wanted the top 25% rewarded...and the bottom 25% fired. The message sent is that if you do the right things then you will be taken good care of and if you don't you will be looking for a new job.

What you can't seem to grasp, Paul is how valuable a good employee is. You make the statement that nobody's looking out for them and that's simply not true. Good employees are not only looked after...they are jealously guarded! The workers that are not "looked after" are the not so good employees...the ones that my old boss wanted me to get rid of and Jack Welch wanted fired. THOSE workers don't have anyone looking out for them unless they're in a union.

No offense, but you're painting too rosy a picture. American Workers have been used & abused for many years. The desire for Slave Labor has been devastating for them. That wonderful Global Economy has been anything but wonderful to them. I just don't see too many looking out for them. They're on their own. Slimy Politicians and Businesses really have screwed them. They've been left behind. They only have themselves now. If they want more, they'll have to fight for it themselves. So i'm not gonna sit around ridiculing and bashing them for doing that. They have to do what they have to do.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I agree for the most part, but unfortunately you paint too rosy a picture. The current reality is, American Workers don't have too many looking out for them anymore. They have to fend for themselves. They're not all just 'lazy & greedy.' They're just trying to survive in an ever-increasingly hostile environment. Who's looking out for them? It has to be themselves.

They're not all just 'lazy & greedy.'

Where did he say they were?

Who's looking out for them?

You're kidding, right?
The state and federal bureaucracies that are dedicated to the protection of workers employ 10s of thousands and spend $10s of billions annually.

Well, they're doing a terrible job. American Workers have been getting the shit-end of the stick for many many years. It's time to reverse that awful trend. And btw, Businesses also receive Government protection.

Well, they're doing a terrible job.

So are you, your silly claims are falling right and left.

Businesses also receive Government protection.

Against workers? Name 3.