CDZ EV question

[beagle9]

Nobody is saying it can't do what you want. What we are saying is that you will need more energy than you are putting back in the system. Put in simple terms, you start with 100 units or energy. 90 are used to move the vehicle. 10 are used to charge the secondary system. Of those 10, 3 are wasted on friction so you only put 7 back. The self charging to extend the range is accomplished somewhat today by regenerative braking. You use the friction of a charging system to slow the vehicle down and add energy to the system. That is "free" energy put back in the system.

I just don't believe your numbers are correct. How about we work to take that 100 unit's of energy, and get it to where it only takes 60 unit's to adequately move the vehicle, so we have 40 unit's left.

Out of that 40 we'll take 10 and use it for recharging puposes, then we'll have 30 unit's to spare, so we add a few accessories that take another 20 unit's, and now we have 10 left over. What to do, what to do ? lol

 

[HenryBHough]

Fella I know who "earned" a Doctorate in Philosophy from Harvard has resolved the question philosophically. He admits it looks odd but thinks the savings from it will offset the poor appearance.

His proposed vehicle has one electric motor and five (5) wheels,one of which is amidships like a Porsche. There are five batteries. Initially the one driving the central wheel has to be charged off household mains and it IS a slow process. The other for wheels each have a smaller motor/generator; each has its own battery. When purchased all five batteries are charged fully. To accelerate from the dealership all five wheels are powered for quick acceleration. Once underway the central wheel (larger diameter than the others and that IS critical) is powered so as to maintain the motion. The other four switch automatically to generator mode and charge their own batteries. When those are full they remain engaged but the power they produce from the forward motion maintained by the fifth wheel is re-routed to the battery for the central wheel maintaining its charge. On downgrades the power now generated by the fifth wheel is distributed to maintain a full charge on all five batteries. When an upgrade is encountered all five wheels go into the motor mode and the vehicle quickly tops the hill to the crest whereupon the central computer switches all five motor/generators to the generator mode - recharging all the batteries. The load on the wheels produces a gentle braking action so it's not necessary to "ride the brakes" on extreme downhills. That saves wear on the braking system so the factory-installed original will last the lifetime of the vehicle.

He credits his unique perspective to the philosophy of Zen coupled with extensive study of the ancient art of motorcycle maintenance.

 

[beagle9]

Fella I know who "earned" a Doctorate in Philosophy from Harvard has resolved the question philosophically. He admits it looks odd but thinks the savings from it will offset the poor appearance.

His proposed vehicle has one electric motor and five (5) wheels,one of which is amidships like a Porsche. There are five batteries. Initially the one driving the central wheel has to be charged off household mains and it IS a slow process. The other for wheels each have a smaller motor/generator; each has its own battery. When purchased all five batteries are charged fully. To accelerate from the dealership all five wheels are powered for quick acceleration. Once underway the central wheel (larger diameter than the others and that IS critical) is powered so as to maintain the motion. The other four switch automatically to generator mode and charge their own batteries. When those are full they remain engaged but the power they produce from the forward motion maintained by the fifth wheel is re-routed to the battery for the central wheel maintaining its charge. On downgrades the power now generated by the fifth wheel is distributed to maintain a full charge on all five batteries. When an upgrade is encountered all five wheels go into the motor mode and the vehicle quickly tops the hill to the crest whereupon the central computer switches all five motor/generators to the generator mode - recharging all the batteries. The load on the wheels produces a gentle braking action so it's not necessary to "ride the brakes" on extreme downhills. That saves wear on the braking system so the factory-installed original will last the lifetime of the vehicle.

He credits his unique perspective to the philosophy of Zen coupled with extensive study of the ancient art of motorcycle maintenance.

That's awesome brother, so when was this ? I think everyone should be attacking the idea with creativity, and then it should be flooded with formulated engineered proto-types for possible production purposes. It can be done. Thanks Henry, cool story.

 

[HenryBHough]

That's awesome brother, so when was this ? I think everyone should be attacking the idea with creativity, and then it should be flooded with formulated engineered proto-types for possible production purposes. It can be done. Thanks Henry, cool story.

It ended badly.

The prototype was nearly finished when he got an offer from a medium size college in Pennsylvania to teach philosophy to a new generation of suckers. Recognizing that the student loans he had accumulated really did need to be serviced he accepted and abandoned the project. It's in a recently re-activated chicken coop with its primer coated exterior turning white.

He hopes to return to it one day.

In his free time he's exploring the morality of diverting chicken shit to energy.

 

[beagle9]

It ended badly.

The prototype was nearly finished when he got an offer from a medium size college in Pennsylvania to teach philosophy to a new generation of suckers. Recognizing that the student loans he had accumulated really did need to be serviced he accepted and abandoned the project. It's in a recently re-activated chicken coop with its primer coated exterior turning white.

He hopes to return to it one day.

In his free time he's exploring the morality of diverting chicken shit to energy.

Well it's time to return to it, because if they want to achieve these EVs without having them going to seek charging stations in route, then they need to seriously look at the total package instead of the proverbial glass being still half empty.

 

[HenryBHough]

Well it's time to return to it, because if they want to achieve these EVs without having them going to seek charging stations in route, then they need to seriously look at the total package instead of the proverbial glass being still half empty.

Dealer in North Dakota is offering an option for the EVs they cell. A small trailer with a generator and propane tank.

 

[JoeMoma]

For those who thought maybe that I was talking about the vehicle somehow being able to power itself in a loop without the batteries, then you misunderstood me.. I am only talking about the system being set up to utilize the free rolling wheels to generate power to the second set of batteries. Then as the main system is depleted it can be switched over to the newly charged batteries. The loop created is in the charging of the batteries through switching.

The generator would be a drag on the "free rolling" wheels so that they would no longer be free rolling. In braking situations when car is being slowed intentionally such a system would be able to recover a relatively small amount of wasted energy; otherwise it is more efficient use of energy to allow the wheels to remain "free rolling". Long story short, the drag caused by putting a generator on the free wheels would use more energy than it can capture. It's the 1st law of thermodynamics that people have been talking about.

 

[beagle9]

The generator would be a drag on the "free rolling" wheels so that they would no longer be free rolling. In braking situations when car is being slowed intentionally such a system would be able to recover a relatively small amount of wasted energy; otherwise it is more efficient use of energy to allow the wheels to remain "free rolling". Long story short, the drag caused by putting a generator on the free wheels would use more energy than it can capture. It's the 1st law of thermodynamics that people have been talking about.

The law can be changed.... It just needs to be studied very extensively, and then engineered to work. We CAN DO IT... lol

I bet a while ago or throughout the years gone by, these same arguments saying that something can't be done had been proven big time wrong. Look where it all has come too.... Unbelievable really.

 

[AsherN]

The law can be changed.... It just needs to be studied very extensively, and then engineered to work. We CAN DO IT... lol

I bet a while ago or throughout the years gone by, these same arguments saying that something can't be done had been proven big time wrong. Look where it all has come too.... Unbelievable really.

You can't engineer against the laws of physics.

 

[beagle9]

You can't engineer against the laws of physics.

Depends on if you are right or wrong about the laws of physics applying or maybe not in the application of, otherwise if they do or don't apply as you claim they do when maybe they don't.

If they don't, then plenty of wiggle room is available in the study of, it's creation of, it's application of, it's innovation of, and ultimately it's final invention of.

So either you are right or wrong, and we might just agree to disagree on many things, and this might be one of them.

 

[JoeMoma]

Depends on if you are right or wrong about the laws of physics applying or maybe not in the application of, otherwise if they do or don't apply as you claim they do when maybe they don't.

If they don't, then plenty of wiggle room is available in the study of, it's creation of, it's application of, it's innovation of, and ultimately it's final invention of.

So either you are right or wrong, and we might just agree to disagree on many things, and this might be one of them.

Everyone telling you that it won't work might be wrong, so go make a prototype that works, We will be waiting.

 

[Baron Von Murderpaws]

I want to ask this, and please give the best answer you all can bring within your abilities to think inside or outside the box.

Question - Why can't an EV be self charging if it only needs one drive wheel turning for the power, and yet there are three other wheels turning, where as couldn't at least one of them be hooked up to a charging mechanism in order to automatically charge the batteries ??? Even if the power is switched to the spare set while the mains recharge in a loop that is constantly managed and monitored by the on board computer, would it work ?????

This has got to be possible now, but is it being withheld due to the sudden and devastating impact it might have on the volume of oil used, and the job's committed to the fossil fuel industry that involve the transportation category ?????

Self charging vehicles would eliminate a LOT of money to be made by the auto makers.
In order to shaft the customer and abuse them as much as the auto makers possibly can, they make all vehicles with faults and frailties on purpose. If they made them solid pieces of lasting machinery, they'd lose millions upon millions of dollars a year in producing replacement parts and having lines of vehicles at their mechanics shops.

 

[AsherN]

Depends on if you are right or wrong about the laws of physics applying or maybe not in the application of, otherwise if they do or don't apply as you claim they do when maybe they don't.

If they don't, then plenty of wiggle room is available in the study of, it's creation of, it's application of, it's innovation of, and ultimately it's final invention of.

So either you are right or wrong, and we might just agree to disagree on many things, and this might be one of them.

Do you understand what Laws of Physics are? They are not things you choose to apply or not. They just are. It's how the physical world works. As much as I don't want to apply the law of gravity and fly, I can't.

 

[M14 Shooter]

I want to ask this, and please give the best answer you all can bring within your abilities to think inside or outside the box.
Question - Why can't an EV be self charging if it only needs one drive wheel turning for the power, and yet there are three other wheels turning, where as couldn't at least one of them be hooked up to a charging mechanism in order to automatically charge the batteries

You can.
But you'll lose energy due to friction and your drive wheel(s) will use more power due to the drag from the generating wheel.

 

[Burgermeister]

I remember when I was a kid I had an ah ha moment that you could have a motor powering a generator powering the motor. Then when I got home by Dad ruined it for me.

 

[beagle9]

Self charging vehicles would eliminate a LOT of money to be made by the auto makers.
In order to shaft the customer and abuse them as much as the auto makers possibly can, they make all vehicles with faults and frailties on purpose. If they made them solid pieces of lasting machinery, they'd lose millions upon millions of dollars a year in producing replacement parts and having lines of vehicles at their mechanics shops.

Yep, I was a mechanic once upon a time, so trust me I know... The old joke was that "a mechanic must have run off with the engineer's wife", otherwise when we had to stand on our heads trying to discombobulate our body's in order to get to something that undoubtedly wasn't designed to get too... lol.

 

[beagle9]

You can.
But you'll lose energy due to friction and your drive wheel(s) will use more power due to the drag from the generating wheel.

How much friction do you think that it would rob, otherwise in order to operate a magneto on the wheel, and then that small amount of power being generated of course would be transferred to a small charger that would then be charging the secondary batteries that are in waiting until switched over too when the primaries have dropped to a level that warrant's the switch over ?? The front wheel mag's or mag would have no role in powering the vehicle, but rather it would only be is used as an operating accessory that assist in just charging a spare battery pack for later use. This pack would need to be switched over to in order to relieve the primaries when they are ready to go dormant, and are ready to be recharged.

 

[beagle9]

You can.
But you'll lose energy due to friction and your drive wheel(s) will use more power due to the drag from the generating wheel.

Ok so let's say the vehicle is good for 200 miles without the system I'm talking about, but then it needs to be charged at a charging station right ?

However if add the on board charging system, then it may cause the vehicle's reach to be less due to the extra drag on it, so it goes 145 miles out instead of 200, and this before recharge is needed correct ? But instead of looking for or needing a charging station, all one needs to do with the flick of the hand is push a button that switches the vehicle over to the already charged secondary battery pack in order to keep rolling. Then the process is repeated over and over again.

 

[beagle9]

Let's say that Elon Musk decides that he needs to get water to his California factory Giga California via an aqueduct, and it has to be pushed in from Giga Texas by force, so Elon has a great wash dug out that extends from Giga Texas to Giga California around 1200 miles across a great landscape ripe for the project let's say.

Ok so he needs to grade the bottom in a way to cause as less resistance for the water to flow easily to it's destination, and then he installs forward water pushing paddle wheels at the mouth to give it assisting power, and these are spun by power generating hydro's once he opens the water gates to achieve his goal of sending the water on it's way.

So the gates are lowered, and the flowing system begins. It's winter time, so not hardly any water is lost along the way.

Around 600 miles the flowing aqueduct is raging like a natural river, and then it happens - someone see's opportunity, and stick's a small paddle wheel at the 600 mile mark, and all he needs is a little turn of the wheel from the current in order to generate a small amount of electricity in a tiny cabin his generator and paddle wheel would be feeding him.

Now how much power is the wheel robbing from the current, and do you think that Elon will detect the feedback or loss all the way back to the mouth where the push is coming from ? Would Elon detect the loss on the other end where the water is flowing too ??

The only way that Elon would detect the situation is if he had a drone fly along the wash or aqueduct in which would just by chance see the small wheel spinning in the edge of the flow.

 

[JoeMoma]

Ok so let's say the vehicle is good for 200 miles without the system I'm talking about, but then it needs to be charged at a charging station right ?

However if add the on board charging system, then it may cause the vehicle's reach to be less due to the extra drag on it, so it goes 145 miles out instead of 200, and this before recharge is needed correct ? But instead of looking for or needing a charging station, all one needs to do with the flick of the hand is push a button that switches the vehicle over to the already charged secondary battery pack in order to keep rolling. Then the process is repeated over and over again.

The amount the second battery can be charged will never be enough to go the original 200 miles that the car could go with out the system. The resistance the charging of the second battery will cause more of an energy drain that would of resulted in miles traveled than will be recovered by charging the second battery.

I can of wonder if you are shitting us by pretending that you don't already understand this.