CDZ EV question

[beagle9]

Your alternator always will be a drag on your engine. You can make it a little better by installing more efficient components but at the end of the day it takes gasoline to turn the engine to produce the electricity from the alternator.

The only thing that helps with drag is like what you see in some of the hybrid vehicles where they have been able to recover some of the lost breaking energy.

Do you really not understand the concept of the conservation of energy? I am an engineer so I understand it very well but I didn't think there was anybody in the world that didn't understand that there is no such thing a perpetual motion machine.

Why bring up perpetual motion when that isn't what we are talking about here ? We are talking about the engineering of a technology that works to replenish an energy source, otherwise that is being reduced by the source that is depleting the source as it is converted to power in order to move a vehicle. How is it that we were able to forward engineer something, but we can't reverse engineer it to do the opposite that we are discussing here ?

 

[westwall]

Why bring up perpetual motion when that isn't what we are talking about here ? We are talking about the engineering of a technology that works to replenish an energy source, otherwise that is being reduced by the source that is depleting the source as it is converted to power in order to move a vehicle. How is it that we were able to forward engineer something, but we can't reverse engineer it to do the opposite that we are discussing here ?

Because what you are describing IS perpetual motion.

 

[Flash]

Because what you are describing IS perpetual motion.

I was going to tell him that but you beat me to it.

 

[beagle9]

Because the amount of drag induced by generating the electricity will cause the vehicle to slow to the point where it stops.

More energy is being lost in the interaction than is being gained.

F1 uses hybrid technology, they are, quite literally, the best in the world, their KERS systems require multiple laps and the attendant braking involved, to charge the onboard batteries.

So the braking is used in some cases for the recharging system, and that's because it isn't using any energy that puts the vehicle in motion ? Otherwise so you are saying that absolutely none of the forward energy can be utilized for the recharging of an extra set of batteries on board for the switch out process ? Do these vehicles truly need to compete with their rivals in power (the oil and gas powered engine) or could it sacrifice some of that power to add the gear reduction charging system ??

 

[beagle9]

Because what you are describing IS perpetual motion.

No such thing made or engineered by man can be considered as perpetual, so no it's not perpetual motion because man's hand is involved, and the components make it not that way.

 

[jwoodie]

Friction isn't the issue. In space, perpetual motion isn't a problem. On Earth, it is a problem because of resistance from gravity, atmosphere and inertia (stop & start). Some of that resistance can be recaptured, but there is always a net energy conversion loss. Thus the other (non-powered) wheels of a car may be able to recapture some energy (primarily through braking), but it is the powered wheel which provides the full amount of energy in the first place.

 

[alang1216]

Gear reduction is key in these things.

Every gear generates heat and loses power.

 

[beagle9]

Friction isn't the issue. In space, perpetual motion isn't a problem. On Earth, it is a problem because of resistance from gravity, atmosphere and inertia (stop & start). Some of that resistance can be recaptured, but there is always a net energy conversion loss. Thus the other (non-powered) wheels of a car may be able to recapture some energy (primarily through braking), but it is the powered wheel which provides the full amount of energy in the first place.

The powered wheel is dispensing the energy that propels the vehicle yes, but the non-powered wheel or wheels don't have enough motion to create energy with a drag reduction system in place that allows the wheel generators to turn at twice the revolutions in which the wheel is turning in order to produce the regeneration power needed ? It's not like the full amps are needed instantly, but rather a slow charge would exist that would complete the switching when it's time to switch batteries for the new fully generated recharge that was needed.

 

[beagle9]

Every gear generates heat and loses power.

Gear reduction reduces heat and friction against the system, which is why reduction is needed in order to not drive the system above it's capacity right ??

Are hydro's gear reduced in order to help not drive the system above capacity as the water drives the turbines ?? Otherwise not but so many KVs are needed, and the system has to be regulated by gear reduction and speed in order to achieve the desired output correct ?

 

[beagle9]

 

[alang1216]

Gear reduction reduces heat and friction against the system, which is why reduction is needed in order to not drive the system above it's capacity right ??

Every gear, no matter what kind, will absorb energy.

Are hydro's gear reduced in order to help not drive the system above capacity as the water drives the turbines ?? Otherwise not but so many KVs are needed, and the system has to be regulated by gear reduction and speed in order to achieve the desired output correct ?

You can make the system as efficient as possible and it will still never be 100%.

 

[DudleySmith]

Go nuclear, perfect making hydrogen cheap; it's by far the cheapest and most efficient route. No need for exotic rare earths mines using child labor, same engines and autos we have today, no massive piles of slow crap moving on freeways.

 

[Captain Caveman]

I want to ask this, and please give the best answer you all can bring within your abilities to think inside or outside the box.

Question - Why can't an EV be self charging if it only needs one drive wheel turning for the power, and yet there are three other wheels turning, where as couldn't at least one of them be hooked up to a charging mechanism in order to automatically charge the batteries ??? Even if the power is switched to the spare set while the mains recharge in a loop that is constantly managed and monitored by the on board computer, would it work ?????

This has got to be possible now, but is it being withheld due to the sudden and devastating impact it might have on the volume of oil used, and the job's committed to the fossil fuel industry that involve the transportation category ?????

EV's also contain and super capacitors. These are good at providing rapid high power when you accelerate off. This means they take the load off the batteries and recharged as the vehicle is in motion, they only take a couple of minutes to charge.

This is why Tesla bought Maxwell, kept the super capacitor technology and sold the rest off.

 

[Leo123]

Care to tell me why you think that it isn't possible ? We already have a self charging loop on vehicles now, and it keeps the charging system fully operational in order to start the fossil fuel burning engine everytime you climb back into your rig. The only thing that'll be missing is the oil and gas burning engine if take the loop to be adapted into the EV system where as it will still serve to charge the electrical system with a switching system for transference of charging from one set of batteries to the other during operations.

I think EV's already have a regenerative brake system that takes kinetic energy and generates electricity to the charging system. I believe you have to have some kind of outside energy source in order to recharge. The car's own movement (kinetic energy) is one source but it is intermittent and only capable of extending driving distance. Solar might be another but, so far, it is not adequate to charge an EV in an adequate time frame.

A 'closed loop' where a a motor turns a generator and the generator charges batteries and then the batteries run the motor will not work because of the first law of thermodynamics. Not sure that is what you are talking about though.

 

[jwoodie]

A 'closed loop' where a a motor turns a generator and the generator charges batteries and then the batteries run the motor will not work because of the first law of thermodynamics.

That is where a small auxiliary engine can provide economical battery recharging and extended range at the same time (like the Chevy Volt).

 

[beagle9]

EV's also contain and super capacitors. These are good at providing rapid high power when you accelerate off. This means they take the load off the batteries and recharged as the vehicle is in motion, they only take a couple of minutes to charge.

This is why Tesla bought Maxwell, kept the super capacitor technology and sold the rest off.

Interesting.... I'm going to predict that everything will be on board as far as re-charging goes, and the driving of them goes, because the charging stations don't seem attainable in the near future unless billion's are spent setting it all up.

 

[miketx]

Simple, put generators on all 4 wheels.

 

[beagle9]

That is where a small auxiliary engine can provide economical battery recharging and extended range at the same time (like the Chevy Volt).

Auxillary engine or better yet an added magneto system mounted on the non-powered wheels where as when they turn the magneto's charge the used batteries until they are switched back over to the drive the vehicle onward.

 

[Leo123]

That is where a small auxiliary engine can provide economical battery recharging and extended range at the same time (like the Chevy Volt).

Yep, we have had diesel-electric trains for a long time. Diesel engine turns generators which power electric motors to turn the wheels.

 

[beagle9]

Simple, put generators on all 4 wheels.

They're saying that it would rob to much power from the vehicle, therefore bringing it to a halt under the weight/drain of it all. A magneto system seems it would work if added to the wheels not powering the vehicle. Just need an on board charging system that works to energize the batteries in a switching system that would keep the vehicle always active in a loop.