Ellison very possible risks acquittal for Chauvin in order to virtue signal.

[sakinago]

Ellison ups charges from 3rd degree murder, (which is exactly what should be charged as well as a slam dunk case) to 2nd degree murder.

3rd Degree murder defined in Minnesota:
“Minnesota law originally defined third-degree murder solely as depraved-heart murder("without intent to effect the death of any person, caus[ing] the death of another by perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life")”

2nd Degree Murder in Minnesota:
“Second-degree murder is an intentional killing, but is less serious than first-degree murder because some malicious factors aren’t present.”

Now, what made this case already difficult, and Ellison knows this full well, is that a knee on the neck is part of the police procedure for the city of St Paul. Yes it’s an absurd police procedure, but it is part of the curriculum taught of how to subdue a perp.

So Ellison is going to risk Chauvin getting off because he wants to virtue signal to the rest of the world. And if he does get off, Ellison and the left can say “see, told you the system is racist, these cops get away Scott free”. Even though the problem lies in Ellison himself overcharging.

 

[colfax_m]

Not a lawyer but I believe there’s a way the jury could find for murder in 3rd degree even when charges with murder in 2nd degree.

 

[MarcATL]

No reasonable jury will agree with the argument being posited by the OP.

Any sane American understands that keeping the full weight of a grown-ass-man on the neck of an individual is, in fact, an intent to kill said individual.

The procedure notwithstanding. It will be gotten rid of after this as well.

This case rests solely with the jury chosen. I just hope there's at least 4 blacks on it.

 

[Blackrook]

Not a lawyer but I believe there’s a way the jury could find for murder in 3rd degree even when charges with murder in 2nd degree.

It depends on what the prosecutor charges him with.

If they charge him with both second and third degree murder, the jury gets to choose.

But if the prosecutor goes for broke and charges for second only, then the jury will have to decide if he's guilty of that, and if he isn't, they have no choice but to let him off completely.

 

[Mac-7]

Any sane American understands that keeping the full weight

Too bad you prove that it was the full weight

if your whole case rests on that you are screwd

 

[playtime]

amerika, & the rest of the world witnessed a snuff film.

 

[Polishprince]

Not a lawyer but I believe there’s a way the jury could find for murder in 3rd degree even when charges with murder in 2nd degree.

I suppose that is true, if the prosecution charges him with both.

But the facts and arguments they present to the jury have to be consistent with one of the charges or the other. They have to focus in on one or the other

 

[sakinago]

Not a lawyer but I believe there’s a way the jury could find for murder in 3rd degree even when charges with murder in 2nd degree.

It’s felony crime rule they might be going for. So you get into a fight, knock the person out, they fall over, crack their head open on a curb, die...that’s felony assault that leads to murder. Your taking part in a felony and someone dies as a result. But the fact that a knee on the neck is procedure in St Paul blows that out of the water. It made 3rd degree murder a little tougher, but not impossible, to prosecute. If this wasn’t such a highly publicized case, this cop would get acquitted. Or should fairly easily/probably get acquitted. The only thing the prosecution has going for them is the fact a jury is going to be scared to acquit and have the country burn down again as a result. Which is 100% how our legal system should NOT work. Minnesota is only 1 of 3 stats that has 3rd degree murder. It fits perfectly. It still has the “murder” title in there. It comes with a 40 year sentence. And it would be a slam dunk to prosecute. There is zero need for Ellison to up the charges here. It’s almost like he wants the cop to get acquitted, and not because he’s looking out for the cop. It’s ridiculous.

 

[JoeB131]

It depends on what the prosecutor charges him with.

If they charge him with both second and third degree murder, the jury gets to choose.

But if the prosecutor goes for broke and charges for second only, then the jury will have to decide if he's guilty of that, and if he isn't, they have no choice but to let him off completely.

Reality check, buddy. After this last week and all the riots, Ellison could charge him with Witchcraft and they'd find him guilty of that.

 

[Blackrook]

Not a lawyer but I believe there’s a way the jury could find for murder in 3rd degree even when charges with murder in 2nd degree.

I suppose that is true, if the prosecution charges him with both.

But the facts and arguments they present to the jury have to be consistent with one of the charges or the other. They have to focus in on one or the other

Actually no, it is allowed for prosecutors to argue more than one theory to a jury.

 

[playtime]

It depends on what the prosecutor charges him with.

If they charge him with both second and third degree murder, the jury gets to choose.

But if the prosecutor goes for broke and charges for second only, then the jury will have to decide if he's guilty of that, and if he isn't, they have no choice but to let him off completely.

Reality check, buddy. After this last week and all the riots, Ellison could charge him with Witchcraft and they'd find him guilty of that.

the world is watching - & that pig will never be free. even on the most slightest chance that he serves no time - - - he's a marked 'man'.

 

[Blackrook]

It depends on what the prosecutor charges him with.

If they charge him with both second and third degree murder, the jury gets to choose.

But if the prosecutor goes for broke and charges for second only, then the jury will have to decide if he's guilty of that, and if he isn't, they have no choice but to let him off completely.

Reality check, buddy. After this last week and all the riots, Ellison could charge him with Witchcraft and they'd find him guilty of that.

You're right. Let's just spare the taxpayers the expense of a trial and string him up on a tree.

 

[Polishprince]

It depends on what the prosecutor charges him with.

If they charge him with both second and third degree murder, the jury gets to choose.

But if the prosecutor goes for broke and charges for second only, then the jury will have to decide if he's guilty of that, and if he isn't, they have no choice but to let him off completely.

Reality check, buddy. After this last week and all the riots, Ellison could charge him with Witchcraft and they'd find him guilty of that.

The Liberal Rioting will be over by the time of any trial. Further, an IMPARTIAL jury and a FAIR trial, including the presumption of innocence is guaranteed to all defendants.

 

[Blackrook]

It depends on what the prosecutor charges him with.

If they charge him with both second and third degree murder, the jury gets to choose.

But if the prosecutor goes for broke and charges for second only, then the jury will have to decide if he's guilty of that, and if he isn't, they have no choice but to let him off completely.

Reality check, buddy. After this last week and all the riots, Ellison could charge him with Witchcraft and they'd find him guilty of that.

the world is watching - & that pig will never be free. even on the most slightest chance that he serves no time - - - he's a marked 'man'.

I see that the prospect of him getting murdered by a politically motivated assassin fills your heart with glee.

 

[Polishprince]

It depends on what the prosecutor charges him with.

If they charge him with both second and third degree murder, the jury gets to choose.

But if the prosecutor goes for broke and charges for second only, then the jury will have to decide if he's guilty of that, and if he isn't, they have no choice but to let him off completely.

Reality check, buddy. After this last week and all the riots, Ellison could charge him with Witchcraft and they'd find him guilty of that.

the world is watching - & that pig will never be free. even on the most slightest chance that he serves no time - - - he's a marked 'man'.

Being locked up makes him a lot easier target for bloodthirsty Libs however. There is a million dollar bounty on George Zimmerman posted by the Black Panther Party, and Zim is still alive and well. Mr. Zimmerman would have died a lot time ago if he had been sent to prison.

 

[Polishprince]

Not a lawyer but I believe there’s a way the jury could find for murder in 3rd degree even when charges with murder in 2nd degree.

I suppose that is true, if the prosecution charges him with both.

But the facts and arguments they present to the jury have to be consistent with one of the charges or the other. They have to focus in on one or the other

Actually no, it is allowed for prosecutors to argue more than one theory to a jury.

Arguing two different theories is sort of stupid, even if its allowed. The jurors have to make their mind up and agree on the same theory, a prosecutor who would do that is giving the people reasonable doubt about BOTH theories presented.

 

[playtime]

It depends on what the prosecutor charges him with.

If they charge him with both second and third degree murder, the jury gets to choose.

But if the prosecutor goes for broke and charges for second only, then the jury will have to decide if he's guilty of that, and if he isn't, they have no choice but to let him off completely.

Reality check, buddy. After this last week and all the riots, Ellison could charge him with Witchcraft and they'd find him guilty of that.

the world is watching - & that pig will never be free. even on the most slightest chance that he serves no time - - - he's a marked 'man'.

I see that the prospect of him getting murdered by a politically motivated assassin fills your heart with glee.

<pfffft>

your presumption is politically motivated. you think he'll be able to walk around like he did b4 he murdered mr. floyd? i don't care what happenes to someone capable of doing that - & has nothing to do with politics.

a pig is a pig is a pig. i have used that term to describe sociopaths & murderers b4. it has nothing to do with wearing a badge.

you failed.

 

[Blackrook]

Not a lawyer but I believe there’s a way the jury could find for murder in 3rd degree even when charges with murder in 2nd degree.

I suppose that is true, if the prosecution charges him with both.

But the facts and arguments they present to the jury have to be consistent with one of the charges or the other. They have to focus in on one or the other

Actually no, it is allowed for prosecutors to argue more than one theory to a jury.

Arguing two different theories is sort of stupid, even if its allowed. The jurors have to make their mind up and agree on the same theory, a prosecutor who would do that is giving the people reasonable doubt about BOTH theories presented.

Not really, because most of the elements the prosecutor have to prove are the same, with second degree murder adding the additional element of intent to kill.

 

[playtime]

It depends on what the prosecutor charges him with.

If they charge him with both second and third degree murder, the jury gets to choose.

But if the prosecutor goes for broke and charges for second only, then the jury will have to decide if he's guilty of that, and if he isn't, they have no choice but to let him off completely.

Reality check, buddy. After this last week and all the riots, Ellison could charge him with Witchcraft and they'd find him guilty of that.

the world is watching - & that pig will never be free. even on the most slightest chance that he serves no time - - - he's a marked 'man'.

Being locked up makes him a lot easier target for bloodthirsty Libs however. There is a million dollar bounty on George Zimmerman posted by the Black Panther Party, and Zim is still alive and well. Mr. Zimmerman would have died a lot time ago if he had been sent to prison.

lol.... 'bloodthirsty libs '.

better tell blackrook how you are making this politically motivated.

& if he does serve time - he needs to be in the GP. no solitary confinement.

 

[sakinago]

No reasonable jury will agree with the argument being posited by the OP.

Any sane American understands that keeping the full weight of a grown-ass-man on the neck of an individual is, in fact, an intent to kill said individual.

The procedure notwithstanding. It will be gotten rid of after this as well.

This case rests solely with the jury chosen. I just hope there's at least 4 blacks on it.

What are you talking about. 2nd degree comes with an intent to murder, without premeditation. With what you just said, if it were true, then 1st degree murder should be a slam dunk. Obviously it isn’t. Any medical professional, as well as police officer, will tell you that if someone is able to speak, they’re able to breath. Which is a dumb standard for police to follow, that someone audibly says they can’t breath, so you’re ok to keep on doing what you’re doing. That’s stupid. But It’s the exact justification used by the police in Eric Garner. If I remember correctly, Garner died of an MI and I think he had an oversized heart. I could be wrong about that. Obviously the MI was caused by the interaction with the police, and exacerbated by the fact they were hindering his breathing. Heart attacks and dog piles from police don’t really mix. I think the police in the garner case should’ve got manslaughter. I digress.

With the knee on neck procedure being part of curriculum in St. Paul, it’s going to make this the equivalent of charging a cop with 2nd degree for using a taser to subdue a perp, and the perp dies of heart attack, or they fell and cracked their head open when tased. It would be hard to charge 3rd degree for that. Chauvin case is easier to charge because he didn’t check on Floyd after he went silent, and because video shows Floyd was subdued.