Zone1 do you believe in a god?

[Eman623]

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You are the epitome of a rational theist when on an emotional level you looked inside yourself; you used your mind to question and pursue the meaning of human existence

Jefferson was a rational theist who wrote this.

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First of all, love the graphic. But my belief in God is not part of a search for answers about the meaning of human existence, or anything else.

Let's just say I am rational enough to know when to set rationality aside when I asked myself how I feel about belief in God.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

I am rational enough to know when to set rationality aside when asked about I feel about God.

You are rationally correct to set rationality aside on anything to do with God, spirituality and whatever it was that created your mind.

America needs a rational religion revival that emulates the rational enlightenment of our founding generation who revolted in opposition to the irrational Catholic and Protestant religion that dominated Europe during the furst 1400 years that preceeded the American Revolution that officially began July 4, 177

 

[Grumblenuts]

I said I was having a discussion with you, not a discussion with a link.

And here's what you really said:

As my discussion with you (and others here), I rarely bother with links. I am certain you are capable of making your own point.

FYI: I generally provide links to be helpful, you lying sack of fetid ram dung. Curiously enough,

When starting a new thread and declaring something as fact in your opening post, you must link to a source.

That happens to be a rule here for good reason. Your "students" are abused hamsters and your mattress is a rotting elderberry.

 

[Meriweather]

Grumblenuts - I do not start a new thread something as fact in an opening post. My new threads invite discussion over issues already known. I have no interest in tossing links back and forth with other posters. This is a discussion forum, and reading what others have to say and sometimes responding is what interest me and what I value.

As this is a discussion forum, I also have no interest in coming here to watch youtube videos or even entering a "Coffee Shop". I understand others have a great interest in all of that, and that doesn't bother me in the least. It's just not for me. I understand you feel these preferences are worthy of hurling grave insults at me, which make me laugh as I move on. My students and I are just fine--I hope it doesn't discourage you too much that way too often I hear I am their favorite teacher. Nor do I have hamsters, but if they could talk my own chinchillas (and others I often care for) would tell you they readily enjoy and accept me.

Speaking of enjoying: Yesterday, I was truly enjoying the discussion with you. I regret you found that so irritating and annoying, but hopefully insulting me has eased that pain. I'll now remove my odoriferous self from your presence and wish for balmy fragrances floating your way.

 

[Grumblenuts]

Victory at last!

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Rational Theism is poetically for me as defined by Thomas Jefferson when he wrote about his belief that everything in the universe had a wholly material existence rather than there being both material and spiritual worlds.

Jefferson insisted that such matters of dogma were not critical; telling one correspondent that on these

“I … reposed my head on that pillow of ignorance which a benevolent creator has made so soft for us, knowing how much we should be forced to use it.”

1. ^ Jefferson to Isaac Story, December 5, 1801, in PTJ, 36:30. Transcriptionavailable at Founders Online.

Jefferson's Religious Beliefs​

 

[Grumblenuts]

Setting aside his own abridgement, Jefferson did support the Virginia Bible Society in its efforts to ensure that any family in Virginia unable to afford a Bible could obtain one. He believed that the Bible contained useful lessons, in spite of its corruptions. At the same time, given his commitment to allow people to form their own religious beliefs, Jefferson pointedly argued that the Bible should be kept out of the hands of children, only made available after their own ability to reason independently had been established through study of history and philosophy.

I.e., let's not get 'em while they're young. Corrupting them later is a more worthy challenge. Or something.

 

[ding]

I'm neither Chistian, Jewish or anything else. And I don't think God cares what I believe - He certainly isn't going to give me any special treatment if I profess belief in Him. That's just more reasons, more pros and cons, eg "Believe in Me and you'll go to the Good Place."

My belief just is. It stands without anything supporting it, or needing to.

Catholics believe it is a little bit more than just saying words and paying lip service. Besides we don't make it about the destination. We make it about the journey.

Where did you get your beliefs from?

 

[ding]

I.e., let's not get 'em while they're young. Corrupting them later is a more worthy challenge. Or something.

Karl Marx probably said something similar to that. Would you like to ban religion?

 

[Eman623]

Catholics believe it is a little bit more than just saying words and paying lip service. Besides we don't make it about the destination. We make it about the journey.

It's about the destination too. Catholic dogma is that there's a good place but also a bad place, if you make the wrong "journey".

Where did you get your beliefs from?

That is a very good question. Part of it was clearly my upbringing as a JW, and part of it is my particular makeup. Nature v nurture and all that. Humans evolved with the hard-coded ability to think abstractly, and I think spirituality comes from that.

 

[ding]

It's about the destination too. Catholic dogma is that there's a good place but also a bad place, if you make the wrong "journey".

Never once has that been discussed at mass that I am aware of. It's not a thing.

Catholic dogma doesn't describe it like that. Catholic dogma says we chose whether we want to be eternally united with God or eternally separated from God. That's it.

 

[ding]

That is a very good question. Part of it was clearly my upbringing as a JW, and part of it is my particular makeup. Nature v nurture and all that. Humans evolved with the hard-coded ability to think abstractly, and I think spirituality comes from that.

Evolved? You don't believe it is an artifact of intelligence? Do you know of any other species that makes a distinction between good and evil?

 

[Eman623]

Never once has that been discussed at mass that I am aware of. It's not a thing.

Catholic dogma doesn't describe it like that. Catholic dogma says we chose whether we want to be eternally united with God or eternally separated from God. That's it.

It would seem i may know more about your religion than you do.

It's not possible for me to be separated from my mental image of God. Ever. And I didn't have to be born again or check any boxes or anything My God doesn't even care if I believe in him or not.

 

[Eman623]

Evolved? You don't believe it is an artifact of intelligence? Do you know of any other species that makes a distinction between good and evil?

Who created evolution?

 

[Grumblenuts]

Karl Marx probably said something similar to that.

Dunno. Don't care. Thomas Jefferson definitely did. Children are supposedly "innocent." Let them work it out for themselves awhile before trying to shove your silly dogma down their throats. That's what Jesus would do.

Would you like to ban religion?

Religion:

noun

1. the belief in and worship of a superhuman power or powers, especially a God or gods.

Nope. I'm no king and no ban would ever prevent others' mileage from varying anyway. Nature suffices nicely for me.

Freethought matters.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Catholic dogma doesn't describe it like that

Catholic dogma is the “one shot” deal for human beings that St.Ding is describing.

They could have had something along the lines of the early Gnostic Christian belief that the body houses a spirit that it has had both prior to current existence and with the prospect of future existence in a physical body.

Rational Religion does not create a dogma for any mystery of life.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Would you like to ban religion?

No. never.

You live in Texas.

Texas bans Rational Religion when a woman gets pregnant

 

[Hawkins]

Tump did not win’

50 states including those run by Republicans like Georgis’ Wisconsin and Arizona certified their elections in mid December 2021 concluding that Trump’s big lie was nothing more than that a big lie in a plot to hold onto power against the will of the people and the constitution of the United States.

I never watch CNN’

The Republican Party is a lawless party and a lying party.

I am a rational theist, and I believe in the rule of law, which includes Republican president loses an election. He respects the people, and he leaves office without trying to overturn it.

We do not have a king or want a king who has no respect for the law


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"The Age of Reason," by Thomas Paine, is a deistic treatise that critiques organized religion, particularly Christianity, and advocates for a belief in God based on reason rather than revelation. Paine argues that the Bible is not divinely inspired but a collection of myths, and that true religious duties involve reason, justice, mercy, and promoting human happiness. He rejects the concept of miracles and divine revelation, emphasizing that God's existence is knowable through observation of nature and reason, not through supernatural claims

Present the counts as the evidence! Your reply represents only your own opinion and by faith.

Counts: where did you get the counts which showed Biden won? How credible is your source of the counts....etc. Other than that, it's all from your faith as an opinion (by atheism standard that is).

By the spokeswoman of the White House, they have several hundred pages of evidence showing that Trump won, while Biden was cheating. She represents the government, and had much more credibility than you and your words (without any support, of counts and sources of counts, and those counts reached you and don't tell me that it's from CNN).

To put it another way, if you can effectively present the evidence that Biden actually won, no fools, in front of hard evidence, would rush into the capitol with a gun!

 

[presonorek]

i am not sure

i would like to see what others think

The Cosmological Argument is a very logical argument in my opinion. Humans love to find an origin to an origin and then find that origin's origin. There had to be a first cause. Was that a god? Maybe, maybe not. I don't necessarily believe in a god but I do believe that there was a first cause. That first cause had to be outside of what we know about the physical world. I don't think this first cause has the traits we assign to a god such as all knowing, all powerful, all good, all loving, so on and so forth.

My short answer is no. My longer answer is no, but I believe in a first cause that could possibly be a god.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

The Cosmological Argument is a very logical argument in my opinion. Humans love to find an origin to an origin and then find that origin's origin. There had to be a first cause. Was that a god? Maybe, maybe not. I don't necessarily believe in a god but I do believe that there was a first cause. That first cause had to be outside of what we know about the physical world. I don't think this first cause has the traits we assign to a god such as all knowing, all powerful, all good, all loving, so on and so forth.

My short answer is no. My longer answer is no, but I believe in a first cause that could possibly be a god.

Where are you on this list?