Dirty, polluting, Wind Power

[elektra]

In a thread about the pollution of Wind Turbines, old crock wants to talk about batteries.

 

[9aces]

In a thread about the pollution of Wind Turbines, old crock wants to talk about batteries.

I noticed he didn't step up to the plate yet. Good at posting links other people thinks it seems...not so hot at looking at an engineering problem himself.

 

[Old Rocks]

First, the pollution problem is a red herring, essentially non-existant. Second, grid scale storage is a technology that can reduce costs to the consumer, and make the grid far more robust. Plus make solar and wind much more profitable. Both ideas are anathemas to the present energy corporations. But those corporations are rapidly disappearing. Peabody and the rest are nearly in bankruptcy from the inroads that natural gas and the alternative have made. This analysis is spells out the whys of the lack of grid scale batteries being already online.

Whatever happened to Oncor's big energy storage plans?

 

[mamooth]

Germany now gets 30% of its grid power from renewables, a bigger share than coal. Germany sometimes produces so much renewable power, electricity prices go negative -- producers pay consumers to use the excess electricity.

German power prices negative over weekend

So, if Germany is making so much wind power, why isn't is a toxic wasteland? Oh, that's right, the deniers are just faking stories again. All the normal people understand the stupidity of "See this picture of a wind turbine with a stain? That proves all wind turbines are poisoning the earth!", but the deniers are nonetheless still clinging to such craziness. They've presented zero evidence for their fraudulent claims, and now they're throwing tantrums because it's being pointed out they're making fraudulent claims.

History will not view deniers kindly. It will classify them as people who worked very hard to destroy the environment for the sake of their politics.

 

[elektra]

Germany now gets 30% of its grid power from renewables, a bigger share than coal. Germany sometimes produces so much renewable power, electricity prices go negative -- producers pay consumers to use the excess electricity.

German power prices negative over weekend

So, if Germany is making so much wind power, why isn't is a toxic wasteland? Oh, that's right, the deniers are just faking stories again. All the normal people understand the stupidity of "See this picture of a wind turbine with a stain? That proves all wind turbines are poisoning the earth!", but the deniers are nonetheless still clinging to such craziness. They've presented zero evidence for their fraudulent claims, and now they're throwing tantrums because it's being pointed out they're making fraudulent claims.

History will not view deniers kindly. It will classify them as people who worked very hard to destroy the environment for the sake of their politics.

Do you have proof to support your claim that Wind Turbines in Germany do not cause any pollution?

The must be built by magic, green fairies?

Either way, where is your proof that supports your outragous claims.

 

[Billy_Bob]

First, the pollution problem is a red herring, essentially non-existant. Second, grid scale storage is a technology that can reduce costs to the consumer, and make the grid far more robust. Plus make solar and wind much more profitable. Both ideas are anathemas to the present energy corporations. But those corporations are rapidly disappearing. Peabody and the rest are nearly in bankruptcy from the inroads that natural gas and the alternative have made. This analysis is spells out the whys of the lack of grid scale batteries being already online.

Whatever happened to Oncor's big energy storage plans?

LOL

* Cost over runs...

* Insufficient gains is charge rate and storage capabilities..

* Massive environmental wastes created.. (many already black balled by the EPA and heavily fined.. <-- Now that's funny)

* Cost of power generation is still way to low to make wind and solar power comparable and cost effective...


Old Crock, do ever read what it is you post? That was a long list of FAILURES by your beloved eco-nazi's...

 

[Billy_Bob]

Germany now gets 30% of its grid power from renewables, a bigger share than coal. Germany sometimes produces so much renewable power, electricity prices go negative -- producers pay consumers to use the excess electricity.

German power prices negative over weekend

So, if Germany is making so much wind power, why isn't is a toxic wasteland? Oh, that's right, the deniers are just faking stories again. All the normal people understand the stupidity of "See this picture of a wind turbine with a stain? That proves all wind turbines are poisoning the earth!", but the deniers are nonetheless still clinging to such craziness. They've presented zero evidence for their fraudulent claims, and now they're throwing tantrums because it's being pointed out they're making fraudulent claims.

History will not view deniers kindly. It will classify them as people who worked very hard to destroy the environment for the sake of their politics.

Poor little hairball...

Cant read or do a search in google?

Germany's Green Energy Disaster: A Cautionary Tale For World Leaders

“The generating capacity of very large wind power installations may peak at between 0.5 and 1 watts per square meter,” the study concluded. “Previous estimates, which ignored the turbines’ slowing effect on the wind, had put that figure at between 2 and 7 watts per square meter.”

Such are the shifting sands upon which Merkel has staked her country’s energy future.

Because renewable power sources have been so unreliable, Germany has been forced to construct numerous new coal plants in an effort to replace the nuclear energy it has taken offline. In fact the country will build more coal-fired facilities this year than at any time in the past two decades – bringing an estimated 5,300 megawatts of new capacity online. Most of these facilities will burn lignite, too, which is strip-mined and emits nearly 30 percent more carbon dioxide than hard coal.

In other words Germany is dirtying the planet in the name of clean energy – and sticking its citizens with an ever-escalating tab so it can subsidize an energy source which will never generate sufficient power.

As Germany comes crashing down.... And 30% is a lie.. It is far less than 3%... with the wind blowing and zero when its not..

 

[Billy_Bob]

Windreich files for bankruptcy

As experts have feared for some time, Windreich GmbH is insolvent. The largest German offshore wind farm developer submitted an application for self-administered insolvency at the end of last week. Holger Blümle from the firm Schultze & Braun was appointed to be the provisional administrator. In addition, the company founder Willi Balz has resigned as a managing partner. Just two weeks ago, Balz had expressed optimism about the economic development of Windreich, despite the numbers being deeply in the red. The new - and for the time being the only - managing director of Windreich GmbH is Werner Heer. Heer had previously been an adviser to the company.

Balz's withdrawal is apparently closely linked to the financing of the MEG I offshore project, Windreich's second 400-MW wind farm. "During discussions with our investors, it became clear that a change in management was essential for the successful continuation of our discussions," Heer said. He wants to ensure that the MEG I project company remains as unaffected as possible by the restructuring of Windreich. During the coming weeks, a restructuring plan will be developed, submitted to the provisional administrator Blümle for review and then presented to creditors and investors.

Yep Germany is sure on top of the wind game... blowing a lot of hot air as their major players in building wind turbines crashes.. And the reorganization of the company failed... 5,900 wind turbines now sit idled and rusting...

 

[elektra]

First, the pollution problem is a red herring, essentially non-existant. Second, grid scale storage is a technology that can reduce costs to the consumer, and make the grid far more robust. Plus make solar and wind much more profitable. Both ideas are anathemas to the present energy corporations. But those corporations are rapidly disappearing. Peabody and the rest are nearly in bankruptcy from the inroads that natural gas and the alternative have made. This analysis is spells out the whys of the lack of grid scale batteries being already online.

Whatever happened to Oncor's big energy storage plans?

Solar and Wind are driving electrical prices to the highest levels in history and now you make the ridiculous claim that spending more on batteries will cost less?

 

[mamooth]

So are you frauds ever going to even try to back up your completely faked stories about wind turbines causing pollution by leaking massive amounts of oil?

That is what this thread is about now, your openly fraudulent claims, and why you even thought you could get away with making them.

 

[elektra]

So are you frauds ever going to even try to back up your completely faked stories about wind turbines causing pollution by leaking massive amounts of oil?

That is what this thread is about now, your openly fraudulent claims, and why you even thought you could get away with making them.

See them giant spatters of black oil and that black oil all over the underside of that there turbine, maMOOT? That is pollution, maMOOT, how much oil does your ideas cist us, millions of barrels a year? A hundred million? Do you even know

Multiply by 1,000,000 or more, how many are installed world wide? That figure is a secret, why?

 

[flacaltenn]

First, the pollution problem is a red herring, essentially non-existant. Second, grid scale storage is a technology that can reduce costs to the consumer, and make the grid far more robust. Plus make solar and wind much more profitable. Both ideas are anathemas to the present energy corporations. But those corporations are rapidly disappearing. Peabody and the rest are nearly in bankruptcy from the inroads that natural gas and the alternative have made. This analysis is spells out the whys of the lack of grid scale batteries being already online.

Whatever happened to Oncor's big energy storage plans?

You don't NEED large amounts of GridScale storage unless your generation sources are sketchy and unreliable. You turned that around. Wind and solar make the Grid infinitely LESS robust. And that's why you cling to this really bad environmental solution..

 

[flacaltenn]

Germany now gets 30% of its grid power from renewables, a bigger share than coal. Germany sometimes produces so much renewable power, electricity prices go negative -- producers pay consumers to use the excess electricity.

German power prices negative over weekend

So, if Germany is making so much wind power, why isn't is a toxic wasteland? Oh, that's right, the deniers are just faking stories again. All the normal people understand the stupidity of "See this picture of a wind turbine with a stain? That proves all wind turbines are poisoning the earth!", but the deniers are nonetheless still clinging to such craziness. They've presented zero evidence for their fraudulent claims, and now they're throwing tantrums because it's being pointed out they're making fraudulent claims.

History will not view deniers kindly. It will classify them as people who worked very hard to destroy the environment for the sake of their politics.

Yep.. 30% for a couple HOURS over a weekend. Annually averaged,, it's 30% of 30%.. But annually averaged is not a luxury that Power Engineers have in their toolbox to keep the lights on.. Is it???

 

[flacaltenn]

When we start including the costs of idling the REAL generators to put a wind peak on the Grid -- then I'll discuss the "costs". Right now -- all those Homer Simpsons are still paid to eat doughnuts and staff and maintain the REAL generators because the Grid is REQUIRED to give priority to wind/solar... And that doesn't count the energy ACTUALLY DUMPED because you can't turn a coal plant on/off like a light switch.

 

[elektra]

When we start including the costs of idling the REAL generators to put a wind peak on the Grid -- then I'll discuss the "costs". Right now -- all those Homer Simpsons are still paid to eat doughnuts and staff and maintain the REAL generators because the Grid is REQUIRED to give priority to wind/solar... And that doesn't count the energy ACTUALLY DUMPED because you can't turn a coal plant on/off like a light switch.

It took a new government agency just to try to prevent blackouts, they had to replace every meter in the state so that the whole grid would not collapse.

 

[ChrisL]

They seem to take up a lot of space. Doesn't that have an effect on the environment as well? I imagine that trees have to be cut down, and ecosystems destroyed.

 

[ChrisL]

View attachment 61756

Can you post a photo of clean coal energy?

Didn't think so.

Of course I can, these are pics I took personally.

Lol! Mind if I ask you why you took pictures of that? Kind of unusual.

 

[elektra]

Lol! Mind if I ask you why you took pictures of that? Kind of unusual.

I took the pics to make this thread. I was startled to see the leaking oil polluting the desert abd our water.

What is so unusual about taking pics of pollution? People do it all the time. People take pics of accidents, fires, buildings collapsing, earthquakes, these pics fit right in.

If you witnessed something polluting the environment that was uniticed or not reported would you not take a photo if you were looking at it with a camera in your hand?

 

[ChrisL]

Lol! Mind if I ask you why you took pictures of that? Kind of unusual.

I took the pics to make this thread. I was startled to see the leaking oil polluting the desert abd our water.

What is so unusual about taking pics of pollution? People do it all the time. People take pics of accidents, fires, buildings collapsing, earthquakes, these pics fit right in.

If you witnessed something polluting the environment that was uniticed or not reported would you not take a photo if you were looking at it with a camera in your hand?

No, I'm talking about the picture that I quoted above? You said it was a picture of a coal burning facility? Just wondering why you went around taking these kinds of pictures. I thought it may have been related to your job. Don't be offended.

 

[Billy_Bob]

Lol! Mind if I ask you why you took pictures of that? Kind of unusual.

I took the pics to make this thread. I was startled to see the leaking oil polluting the desert abd our water.

What is so unusual about taking pics of pollution? People do it all the time. People take pics of accidents, fires, buildings collapsing, earthquakes, these pics fit right in.

If you witnessed something polluting the environment that was uniticed or not reported would you not take a photo if you were looking at it with a camera in your hand?

No, I'm talking about the picture that I quoted above? You said it was a picture of a coal burning facility? Just wondering why you went around taking these kinds of pictures. I thought it may have been related to your job. Don't be offended.

That coal burning facility has 99.8% water vapor going up its stack... There are no heavy metals, carbon soot, or other particulate matter, NO POLLUTION...! That is why he took a picture of that coal burning power plants exhaust stack..