Cheney Admits He Authorized Torture Against Guantanamo Detainees

[SpidermanTuba]

http://www.pubrecord.org/nationworl...zed-torture-against-guantanamo-detainees.html

Vice President Dick Cheney said for the first time Monday that he helped get the “process cleared” for the brutal interrogation program of suspected terrorists.

In an interview with ABC News, Cheney was matter-of-fact and unapologetic about the harsh techniques used against the detainees — including waterboarding, a form of simulated drowning considered torture since the days of the Inquisition.

“I was aware of the program, certainly, and involved in helping get the process cleared, as the [Central Intelligence] Agency, in effect, came in and wanted to know what they could and couldn't do,” Cheney said. “And they talked to me, as well as others, to explain what they wanted to do. And I supported it.”

Cheney made his comment in response to a question about whether he personally approved the harsh tactics used against Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the alleged mastermind of the 9/11 attacks.

"There was a period of time there, three or four years ago, when about half of everything we knew about al-Qaeda came from that one source," Cheney said. "So, it's been a remarkably successful effort; I think the results speak for themselves."

Cheney’s nonchalant response to the questions about torture was reminiscent of his casual comment to a conservative radio host in October 2006 when Cheney said the decision to waterboard suspected terrorists was a “no-brainer.”

Thousands of pages of documents released publicly since that interview would appear to show that methods used against detainees constituted cruel, inhumane and degrading treatment in violation of anti-torture statutes and international treaties signed and ratified by the United States.

Maj. Gen. Antonio Taguba, who led the investigation of abuses at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq, has said “there is no longer any doubt as to whether the current administration has committed war crimes. The only question that remains to be answered is whether those who ordered the use of torture will be held to account.”

In another interview Monday with conservative radio host Rush Limbaugh, Cheney said the U.S. prison at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, “has been very well run.”

“I think if you look at it from the perspective of the requirements we had, once you go out and capture a bunch of terrorists, as we did in Afghanistan and elsewhere, then you’ve got to have some place to put them,” Cheney said.

 

[Xenophon]

I have to point out several things, the first is, you can't commit a 'war crime' against an illeagal combatent, this is long disputed but the UN charter makes this very clear.

The second is, what 'court' was jurisdiction to make such a charge?

Acording to long established international law, the Numremberg trials were ileagal, as is the current 'world court' in the Hague.

I really wish people would stop with the 'war crime' meme, if you want to say that they committed heinous acts, that is fine, but war crime?

Sorry, doesn't work.

 

[mightypeon]

Of course you can, the whole illegal combatant thing is quite disputed and legally shaky, the Eisenträger precendent was quite bollocks too.
You cannot just go in and claim that people you imprisoned are neither Civilians nor military personal. And that you therefor can threat them in anyway you want.
Several Wehrmacht-Generals who used fairly harsh techniques against Jugoslavian partisan also defendet themselfs by stating that Titos troops were "illegal combatants" (although the term used was different), did not really work for them either.

However, as long as the US does not loose a war in a catastrophic way, no meaningfull American will ever get tried. War crime tribunals only happen to the loosers.

 

[irie]

So we waterboard a few of these terrorist assholes....so what!! Where is the outrage against these thugs when they strap on a bomb and walk into a restaurant or store and kill innocent bystanders?

Good thing we didn't have to deal with this crap in WWII or we'd all be goose stepping right now.

 

[glockmail]

Looks like your premise here Tuba is completely without merit.

 

[WillowTree]

 

[editec]

So we waterboard a few of these terrorist assholes....so what!! Where is the outrage against these thugs when they strap on a bomb and walk into a restaurant or store and kill innocent bystanders?

Good thing we didn't have to deal with this crap in WWII or we'd all be goose stepping right now.

Something to ponder from the people who quite possibly invented the most effective counter-intelligence organization on earth.

According to Christopher Hutchinson during WWII, even in England's blackest days, back when the English cities were getting blown to smithereens, the punishment meted out to interogators for torturing German spies or sabatuers was courts martial followed by serious time in prison.

You couyldn't even raise your hand to those prisoners.

Why?

Because they realized that torture didn't work, that's why.

 

[Xenophon]

That isn't quite true.

Nazi spies had a choice, they either co-operated or they were executed.

 

[Lycurgus]

And to think people pay good money to go snow boarding.

I'm sorry, but, sadly I have little remorse in this case. And YES, I realize that isn't really fair, but, it is how I feel.

 

[xsited1]

I'm sorry terrorists get treatly poorly. Maybe we should use a soft cushion or a cumfy chair during interrogations? Would that make it all better for you?

 

[glockmail]

....

Because they realized that torture didn't work, that's why.

Yet waterboarding obviously does.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

I have to point out several things, the first is, you can't commit a 'war crime' against an illeagal combatent, this is long disputed but the UN charter makes this very clear.

No it doesn't. You just made that up. I doubt you've even read the UN Charter, or really care what it says even.

The second is, what 'court' was jurisdiction to make such a charge?

Probably federal district court has jurisdiction over DC.

I really wish people would stop with the 'war crime' meme, if you want to say that they committed heinous acts, that is fine, but war crime?

Its a violation of U.S. law to torture or order torturing. That's the crime.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Of course you can, the whole illegal combatant thing is quite disputed and legally shaky,

Actually, its not even legally shaky. its legally non-existent. The Supreme Court has already spoken in the matter in Hamdan v Rumsfeld.

However, as long as the US does not loose a war in a catastrophic way, no meaningfull American will ever get tried.

Not true. American soldiers have been tried in American courts in the past for using torture, including water torture.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

So we waterboard a few of these terrorist assholes....so what!! Where is the outrage against these thugs when they strap on a bomb and walk into a restaurant or store and kill innocent bystanders?

Good thing we didn't have to deal with this crap in WWII or we'd all be goose stepping right now.

Your feelings on the matter are quite irrelevant. The law is clear.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Looks like your premise here Tuba is completely without merit.

Actually it isn't. There is long standing legal precedent for the prosecution of those who use waterboarding. US courts - miltiary and civilian - have prosecuted both our own citizens and the citizens of enemy nations in the past for using water torture. Its a crime and Dick Cheney is guilty of ordering its use which makes him a criminal.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

I'm sorry terrorists get treatly poorly. Maybe we should use a soft cushion or a cumfy chair during interrogations? Would that make it all better for you?

Its not a crime to use soft cushions of cumfy chairs during interrogation. It is a crime - both under US law and international law - to torture somebody, for any reason.

 

[Steerpike]

Actually, its not even legally shaky. its legally non-existent. The Supreme Court has already spoken in the matter in Hamdan v Rumsfeld.

You are mistaken about the holding in Hamdan and should review the case.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

You are mistaken about the holding in Hamdan and should review the case.

The Supreme Court applies the Geneva Conventions to Hamdan in that case. Cearly they believe the Geneva Conventions apply to him. It really doesn't matter either way with regard to Cheney, however, because its still a violation of U.S. law to torture somebody, it doesn't matter who they are or who is doing the torturing.

 

[Steerpike]

The Supreme Court applies the Geneva Conventions to Hamdan in that case. Cearly they believe the Geneva Conventions apply to him.

They narrowly applied portions of the Convention, or at least instructed the lower court to do so. They specifically avoided the issue of his status (as, I believe, did the District Court). You can read the opinion online if you like.

 

[glockmail]

Actually it isn't. There is long standing legal precedent for the prosecution of those who use waterboarding. US courts - miltiary and civilian - have prosecuted both our own citizens and the citizens of enemy nations in the past for using water torture. Its a crime and Dick Cheney is guilty of ordering its use which makes him a criminal.

Of course you conveniently ignore the fact that the GC only applies to legal combatants, not terrorists. *shrug*