Zone1 Catholic Church's Position Against the Death Penalty

[Meriweather]

Nope....
This is where I'm going to disagree.

The Catholic Church has had MASSIVE internal problems with their labor force. Not minor ones. Massive internal politics has made it to where none of these problems are addressed appropriately either. Oversight has been an ongoing problem with most large institutions and the Catholic Church has proven to not be immune as well.

I'm not finger pointing or anything of that sort. Just stating the obvious facts. The current pope has not exactly delighted the membership desiring a more biblical morality. (Like John Paul) Meaning that the root problem resides with the Cardinals and Bishops...further indicating a grass roots problem.

There exists too many problems in using a religious organization for secular work. (ACLU wouldn't stand for it either)

Then let the ACLU take it on. And let the Catholic Church clean up its own house so it can take it on. "Let someone else do it" is not an option for those who speak out calling for others to change. Go back to the old quote (or cliche) of "See a need, fill a need." Yourself.

 

[TNHarley]

And that is why the Church should take over housing, teaching, caring for, and rehabilitating death row inmates.

Why should people trust the catholic church to do those things? You know, considering their barbaric history and infatuation with doing and covering up sex abuse on children?

 

[Meriweather]

They are kids.

Were kids. The Church (at least in most parts of the world, and definitely in the United States) have been working on eliminating this for decades now. Leave the 70s and 80s...welcome to the 20s.

 

[there4eyeM]

The Church of Rome (aka "Catholic") killed enough people for its purposes. Either it has grown tired of the practice or, since it more or less has no further power to enforce such measures, can afford to mouth clichés concerning the issue.

 

[Arlette]

Pederasty was the main problem, not pedophilia.

And zone 1, by the way.

What exactly is the difference?

 

[TNHarley]

Were kids. The Church (at least in most parts of the world, and definitely in the United States) have been working on eliminating this for decades now. Leave the 70s and 80s...welcome to the 20s.

oh well by gawd. Good for them. LOL
That isnt something that just goes away.

 

[Meriweather]

Why should people trust the catholic church to do those things? You know, considering their barbaric history and infatuation with doing and covering up sex abuse on children?

Being a reporter at the time, I have said this, revealed this, over and over and over again. School Districts, churches, businesses (including the medical and psychiatric fields) were just as--in fact in most cases--more involved in how child abuse cases were handled in the 20th Century (and earlier). In fact, it was the psychiatric community who initiated seminars and then moving offenders (in all organizations) somewhere else. It was the Catholic Church who told those heading this, "It's not working, it's not working, it's not working." So...those in charge decided to throw the Catholic Church under the bus, distracting and therefore saving, public schools and other organizations.

Why didn't some reporters write a story? I am sure some did. I did...the result being told, "We don't want to upset everyone. Taxes pay for public schools. Businesses pay for the advertising that keeps papers as a money-making business. Can't upset them."

You don't know the half of what was being hidden by society and its organizations. Expose the Church and take the heat off of everyone else. It worked...at least for a time. A closer look is beginning to be taken when it comes to schools.

 

[TNHarley]

What exactly is the difference?

age. 15 year old vs 8 year old.
Semantics IMO. Both are kids.

 

[Meriweather]

The Church of Rome (aka "Catholic") killed enough people for its purposes.

When? Please provide the dates.

 

[martybegan]

They are kids.

The Priest issue relates to gay men thinking going into the Priesthood would "cure" them of their issues back in the day. They had arrested sexual development and thus were attracted to boys at the age their own development stopped. 99% of the priest molestation cases were pubescent or post pubescent boys. The other likelihood is some of them were abused as kids as well, and we have seen this can become a form of contagion, the abuse passed down generations.

Pedophiles are a very specific deviancy, that has NEVER EVER EVER had social approval, unlike pederasty and old men marrying very young girls. Pedophiles are also usually not gender specific.

The Catholic Church seems to have corrected the issue in the past decade or so, the remaining issue is them fessing up to the coverups all those years.

Like all words relating to problems and issues, people like to lump things together to make it simpler. The Trans situation and the homeless situation are other examples of this.

 

[TNHarley]

Being a reporter at the time, I have said this, revealed this, over and over and over again. School Districts, churches, businesses (including the medical and psychiatric fields) were just as--in fact in most cases--more involved in how child abuse cases were handled in the 20th Century (and earlier). In fact, it was the psychiatric community who initiated seminars and then moving offenders (in all organizations) somewhere else. It was the Catholic Church who told those heading this, "It's not working, it's not working, it's not working." So...those in charge decided to throw the Catholic Church under the bus, distracting and therefore saving, public schools and other organizations.

Why didn't some reporters write a story? I am sure some did. I did...the result being told, "We don't to upset everyone. Taxes pay for public schools. Businesses pay for the advertising that keeps papers as a money-making business. Can't upset them."

You don't know the half of what was being hidden by society and its organizations. Expose the Church and take the heat off of everyone else. It worked...at least for a time. A closer look is beginning to be taken when it comes to schools.

Yep, teachers seem to have an issue as well. Has nothing to do with catholics.
Please stop trying to normalize it.

 

[martybegan]

What exactly is the difference?

See my reply to TN below.

If one wants to discuss a topic, one must know the details of the topic, even if this is getting OFF-topic.

 

[JohnDB]

Then let the ACLU take it on. And let the Catholic Church clean up its own house so it can take it on. "Let someone else do it" is not an option for those who speak out calling for others to change. Go back to the old quote (or cliche) of "See a need, fill a need." Yourself.

The members of the Catholic Church have been literally shouting about the abuses and corruption within itself for decades now...to no effect. No one does anything as it's the Cardinals and Bishops personally profiting from the abuses. (Vows of poverty Long since forgotten )

The volume of SA at the Catholic seminaries is obscene to say the least. And the students must submit to it or be tossed out. And that's just the seminaries. There exists also slave trade, unethical sweat shops owned by bishops and cardinals, and those trinkets sold at the churches bookstore?(medallions and necklaces, bookmarks and coffee cups) Yeah....I Really wouldn't purchase those if I were you.


So....they are truly not the group you want doing the work you suggest.

Salvation Army is somewhat better equipped to do the work but only marginally so. They have been having issues of late as well.

 

[TNHarley]

The Priest issue relates to gay men thinking going into the Priesthood would "cure" them of their issues back in the day. They had arrested sexual development and thus were attracted to boys at the age their own development stopped. 99% of the priest molestation cases were pubescent or post pubescent boys. The other likelihood is some of them were abused as kids as well, and we have seen this can become a form of contagion, the abuse passed down generations.

Pedophiles are a very specific deviancy, that has NEVER EVER EVER had social approval, unlike pederasty and old men marrying very young girls. Pedophiles are also usually not gender specific.

The Catholic Church seems to have corrected the issue in the past decade or so, the remaining issue is them fessing up to the coverups all those years.

Like all words relating to problems and issues, people like to lump things together to make it simpler. The Trans situation and the homeless situation are other examples of this.

So all you just said basically rests on access. They had access to boys. You dont know what would have happened if they were girls there too.

 

[martybegan]

So all you just said basically rests on access. They had access to boys. You dont know what would have happened if they were girls there too.

They had access to girls as well. Even girls schools had priests.

 

[TNHarley]

See my reply to TN below.

If one wants to discuss a topic, one must know the details of the topic, even if this is getting OFF-topic.

Its very much on topic. How could we trust the church to run prisons with their history of human abuses?

 

[JohnDB]

So all you just said basically rests on access. They had access to boys. You dont know what would have happened if they were girls there too.

There's a REASON the nun population has fallen off drastically.
They don't want to become pregnant.

 

[TNHarley]

They had access to girls as well. Even girls schools had priests.

Jesus... You want to compare a girl going to church to little boys that worked for them all the time? Mkay

 

[22lcidw]

How many deaths row inmates has the Catholic Church saved from execution?

May I say, cut the taxes on people and then see what you say. And really, it is the taxation on us all that causes all of this.

 

[martybegan]

Its very much on topic. How could we trust the church to run prisons with their history of human abuses?

I don't want them running prisons. But if the topic is to be debated, it has to be honestly debated.