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Zone1 Can the US Survive an EMP Strike?

toobfreak

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So if an EMP were to happen from a nuke strike........wouldn't there be nuclear fallout? Making air, water & soil poisonous for a time??????

Not really. Detonated that high up, the fallout would get disbursed around the globe by the jet streams making no particular area that affected.
 

HereWeGoAgain

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It ain't just southerners that know about that stuff. Grew up in Montana, and didn't really know what store bought food was until I started living with a bunch of city folk types as a foster kid.

While true there aren't that many people in Montana.
But yeah I'd expect them to know how to survive.
The South would likely hold the most of those who could survive though.
 

miketx

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So if an EMP were to happen from a nuke strike........wouldn't there be nuclear fallout? Making air, water & soil poisonous for a time??????
Not usually. They would be detonated in low earth orbit so no fallout. Whoever set it off would want to move in and take over after we're all dead.
 

HereWeGoAgain

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Not really. Detonated that high up, the fallout would get disbursed around the globe by the jet streams making no particular area that affected.

Nuclear fallout is vastly overrated when it comes to killing people.
Some say you can leave cover in as little as 24 hours. Of course you dont want to stay there but it's safe to evac after 24 hours.
 

JustAnotherNut

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While true there aren't that many people in Montana.
But yeah I'd expect them to know how to survive.
The South would likely hold the most of those who could survive though.

And don't forget the pups, they need stuff too. Luckily, if you run out of dog food there are plenty of people food options for them as well. Lots of meat/protein and fats, a few carbs/grains (yes they need grains) and a few fruits/veggies
 

Vastator

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This thread is my OPINON.

Can the US Survive an EMP Strike?

An Electro-Magnetic-Pulse much the same as a solar flare will be devastating to all things in America and abroad. This pulse will melt transformers into huge piles of molten metal and melt transmission lines. The devastation will be massive. Power generation in the United States will suddenly be taken back to the 1850's.

Food production will stop. Storages will quickly spoil. Our ability to communicate will be gone as cell towers and above ground lines will melt or be irreparably destroyed. The lasers for our fiberoptics will be destroyed rendering all of our networks useless. Water purification will stop for our towns and cities as will sewage treatment plants.

One fifty kiloton nuclear device detonated high in our atmosphere above the US would create a cascading collapse of our power grids. Vehicle electronics would be melted and make most forms of transportation useless. Areas that are under sea level would again be inundated with water as pumping would cease.

The mass kaos will rip cities apart. Only rural areas will survive the mass destruction.

How do you think America can survive without electronics today?

No. THE "US" as a governmental body, over American citizens... Could not survive an EMP strike. Their interface with the populous, and subsequently their influence over it, ( the source of its power) would be severed. Severed beyond their satellite reaction time. Local solutions would arise, faster and more prescient than a response from afar. FedGov, will have lost its flock to fuckers that put out, right here, right now. As opposed to the sheep who previously bleated for handouts. In short they'd have to work. And in that... They have no experience.
 

toobfreak

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Nuclear fallout is vastly overrated when it comes to killing people.
Some say you can leave cover in as little as 24 hours. Of course you dont want to stay there but it's safe to evac after 24 hours.

It all depends on many things. In most cases, the effect will be to contaminate soil and water which is then slowly taken up by plants and animals, gets into the food supply, and eventually builds up in our bodies leading to health issues or damage to one's DNA initiating cancers and disease over many years.
 

Dayton3

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Billy Bob is vastly overstating the damage to the United States.

For example "all vehicles". There are literally tens of thousands of older vehicles in the United States that are not vulnerable to the effects of EMP. Not to mention that most diesel vehicles would be unaffected.
 
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Billy_Bob

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Not usually. They would be detonated in low earth orbit so no fallout. Whoever set it off would want to move in and take over after we're all dead.
And that is the strategic plan. You create confusion, create infighting for food and other supplies, then attack. The populace is subjugated with very little resistance once they are hungry or starving. In the Army we used to play war games to see just how to defeat those we are up against. There is much planning in allowing your enemy to do all the work themselves.
 
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Billy_Bob

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Nuclear fallout is vastly overrated when it comes to killing people.
Some say you can leave cover in as little as 24 hours. Of course you dont want to stay there but it's safe to evac after 24 hours.
There will be little fall out risk with a low yield detonation at altitude. As toobfreak pointed out, the actual voltage spike necessary to destroy control devices is very low. A higher yield detonation would only make things worse unless you indented to take out major parts of the infrastructure. But even that would be so spread out that any radioactive fallout would be so widespread that it would be safe to be in and around within days.
 

toobfreak

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There are literally tens of thousands of older vehicles in the United States that are not vulnerable to the effects of EMP. Not to mention that most diesel vehicles would be unaffected.

Wrong. Even a truck from the 1980s with electronic ignition could be affected. Same with a diesel-- -- while the engine itself may be immune, they put computer chips everywhere through everything, and all an EMP needs to feedback into and destroying a circuitry is exposed conductors, leads, wiring, which acts like an antenna.

A lot depends on the strength, nature and position of the EMP; unfortunately, globalism has made us so much more vulnerable because all everyone ever pushes for is greater interconnectability and interdependency. Taking out a grid or system in one part of the world may affect, cripple or destroy systems far away now, if not directly through the EMP, then indirectly, due to interdependency on all of the various parts.
 

HereWeGoAgain

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It all depends on many things. In most cases, the effect will be to contaminate soil and water which is then slowly taken up by plants and animals, gets into the food supply, and eventually builds up in our bodies leading to health issues or damage to one's DNA initiating cancers and disease over many years.

Exactly...thats why you leave the area once the fallout settles.
 
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Billy_Bob

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Billy Bob is vastly overstating the damage to the United States.

For example "all vehicles". There are literally tens of thousands of older vehicles in the United States that are not vulnerable to the effects of EMP. Not to mention that most diesel vehicles would be unaffected.
That is wholey dependent on the yield of the detonation. Are your vehicles computers shielded well enough to protect them? Those little computers operate with less than 0.5 volts in the circuitry. Those circuits are easily damaged by millivolt spikes. Have you ever repaired control circuitry or computers? We wear grounding bands for a reason. Simple static spikes will destroy most electronics.
 

ABikerSailor

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Billy Bob is vastly overstating the damage to the United States.

For example "all vehicles". There are literally tens of thousands of older vehicles in the United States that are not vulnerable to the effects of EMP. Not to mention that most diesel vehicles would be unaffected.

Yes, there are a few vehicles out there that could withstand an EMP pulse, but they are few and far between. How many people do you know who still own vehicles WITHOUT computers or fuel injection? Those are cars that WILL be affected. If you have a car with no computers and an old school carb engine, you might luck out if you remember to disconnect the battery before the pulse hits. Otherwise? You're pretty much screwed and relegated to horses and bicycles. Something prior to 1976 (when computer chips first started hitting vehicles) is fairly safe. Anything after that, and you're taking a chance.

Just out of curiosity, how many people do you know who have cars that are 45 plus years old? The only ones I know are those who are collectors.
 

ABikerSailor

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Exactly...thats why you leave the area once the fallout settles.

It's not so much the fallout that is what kills you, it is the concentration of it in a given area. Yes, for surface and subsurface bursts, the fallout stays pretty much where the explosion happened, but in an airburst, or one in space, the fallout is dispersed quite quickly. In the case of one way high in the atmosphere, or in space, fallout isn't that much of a concern on the ground.
 

iamwhatiseem

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According to experts... without electricity at least 20% of the population would be dead in 30 days.
What???
People with serious medical conditions that require mechanical medical devices.
People who require insulin
People who require oxygen
Etc. etc. etc.
But most will be elderly and the very young in major cities with no heat or A/C.
In one year I think it was 70% of the population would be dead.
Starvation being the number one factor, environmental exposure right behind it.
Mostly in major metropolitan areas.
 

toobfreak

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the actual voltage spike necessary to destroy control devices is very low.

Years ago, the common voltage rail for most things was based on bipolar technology and was usually +/- 5 volts. Since then, it has been lowered to less than half of that or more through FET and CMOS technology. Ever wonder how your cellphone does so much on a little lithium battery? Lower voltage circuitry means less power consumption but also greater vulnerability. Designers are trying to make computers where a single electron = a bit! Most consumer devices have an input spec in the millivolts range--- all it takes is an induced surge conducted into a device directly or through interconnections that exceeds the threshold barrier of the solid state control chips in effect punching a hole through the dielectric junction barrier rendering the transistors or chips damaged or nonfunctional, and your device is likely dead or will fail soon after.

Power grid transformers connected through miles and miles of wiring cross country are more vulnerable. They are literally wired as EMP detectors, and as the induced current of millions of amps rushes in, this can quickly overheat the insulation in the windings leading to transformer shorts and destruction. Last I heard, replacing major power transformers for the grid can take on the order of DECADES.

As usual, all of this has been known for decades and decades but your elected officials have done nothing but plan and talk-- -- -- the military and vital government installations are protected for the most part but you are considered expendable as your elected leaders squabble about trivia and pocket money from lobbyists.
 

Dayton3

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Yes, there are a few vehicles out there that could withstand an EMP pulse, but they are few and far between. How many people do you know who still own vehicles WITHOUT computers or fuel injection? Those are cars that WILL be affected. If you have a car with no computers and an old school carb engine, you might luck out if you remember to disconnect the battery before the pulse hits. Otherwise? You're pretty much screwed and relegated to horses and bicycles. Something prior to 1976 (when computer chips first started hitting vehicles) is fairly safe. Anything after that, and you're taking a chance.

Just out of curiosity, how many people do you know who have cars that are 45 plus years old? The only ones I know are those who are collectors.
I know a number of people in my own family that have vehicles that old or older.
 

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