Can bible study groups be in error?

anotherlife

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Bible study groups are based on well prepared materials, usually by very well educated members of the Faith. Also, bible studies are essential in bringing the Word to people and develop individual understanding of it.

But with all that well prepared materials, and with all that serious work and time put in by the group leader, can they still be wrong?

Here is an example. Apostle Paul writes to be a good citizen, do as your country tells you to, pay your taxes, and so on. But we already know, that half the countries impose special taxes that are developed specifically against Christians, in order to starve them to death. Most notably, Jordania has no Christian's left, as a result.

So, wouldn't the correct interpretation of Paul's word be, that Christians should no challenge their government, only. If your government is after you, do you have to put out? When Satan is after you, you are told not to put out. So, what is the correct bible study then?
 

irosie91

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Link to Bible verse=-?
Paul is interpreted ------as something like-----DO WHATEVAH THE ROMANS
WANT YOU TO DO. ---------- . Those are based on --- his putative writings that made it
past the Nicean council think "POLITICS"
 

hobelim

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Link to Bible verse=-?
For example, Romans 13:1-7.


That was supposedly written by Paul during the reign of Nero teaching christians submission to government authorities and the emperor of Rome. Doesn't that raise every red flag in your head?

Does that sound like the way to salvation? The gospel of Jesus Christ? Submission to a psychopath? Just turn a blind eye to government corruption, injustices and atrocities and fund it? Thats what God wants? I don't think so.

Stay away from basement bible study sessions, unless you want your rational mind, your birthright as a human being, surgically removed by trained personnel and eaten by a bunch of ghouls.


Use your own mind to think. If you come up with nothing try harder. The more you apply your own mind to understand the more you will be able to. Don't lift your skirt for every church group that winks at you. They will all line up with that goofy smile waiting to take their turn draining the the life force right out of your soul until you are turned into an intellectual invalid, unable to get up from the floor, naked and ashamed.
 
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The Irish Ram

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That is a really good question.
On one hand, in Romans, it says if we owe taxes, pay taxes. If we owe revenue, pay revenue, owe respect, give respect. If we owe honor, give honor.
Then there is the flip side, that under no circumstances are we to receive the mark our government is going to introduce, even unto death.

Both options could result in starvation. The latter especially will. But rebelling against government isn't encouraged in the new Testament.
Christ didn't advocate it against Rome, and doesn't advocate it in Revelation. Nowhere can I find, "Rise up against evil rulers".
So I am going to say, beware, pray for discernment, be aware of the times we live in , but don't raise a sword against a perverse government. That's the Lord's job.
 

hobelim

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That is a really good question.
On one hand, in Romans, it says if we owe taxes, pay taxes. If we owe revenue, pay revenue, owe respect, give respect. If we owe honor, give honor.
Then there is the flip side, that under no circumstances are we to receive the mark our government is going to introduce, even unto death.

Both options could result in starvation. The latter especially will. But rebelling against government isn't encouraged in the new Testament.
Christ didn't advocate it against Rome, and doesn't advocate it in Revelation. Nowhere can I find, "Rise up against evil rulers".
So I am going to say, beware, pray for discernment, be aware of the times we live in , but don't raise a sword against a perverse government. That's the Lord's job.

Render unto caesar etc.

To the average person standing around it would have seemed like Jesus was advocating paying taxes supporting the Roman occupation but to the observant Jew who knew that everything belonged to God and nothing belonged to caesar especially in Judea he was really saying the exact opposite, give caesar nothing.
 
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anotherlife

anotherlife

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That is a really good question.
On one hand, in Romans, it says if we owe taxes, pay taxes. If we owe revenue, pay revenue, owe respect, give respect. If we owe honor, give honor.
Then there is the flip side, that under no circumstances are we to receive the mark our government is going to introduce, even unto death.

Both options could result in starvation. The latter especially will. But rebelling against government isn't encouraged in the new Testament.
Christ didn't advocate it against Rome, and doesn't advocate it in Revelation. Nowhere can I find, "Rise up against evil rulers".
So I am going to say, beware, pray for discernment, be aware of the times we live in , but don't raise a sword against a perverse government. That's the Lord's job.

Render unto caesar etc.

To the average person standing around it would have seemed like Jesus was advocating paying taxes supporting the Roman occupation but to the observant Jew who knew that everything belonged to God and nothing belonged to caesar especially in Judea he was really saying the exact opposite, give caesar nothing.
Even if we consider, that Jesus first asked whose picture was on that money, before he said render onto Ceasar?
 

The Irish Ram

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Hi hobe. If Jesus was saying the opposite and Jews knew it, the Pharisees would have condemned Christ on it and would have run to the Romans screaming sedition. They were unable to trick Him with the question.
He meant exactly what He said. No interpretation necessary. Coins, taxes, gold aren't important. Give it to whomever wants or needs it, and concentrate on what Christ said about Heaven. Gold is so unimportant they pave the streets with it there. For enduring down here we live in mansions in Paradise. Jesus was making a distinction between what is valuable and what is not in our Father's eyes. Christ put things in perspective.
 

ABikerSailor

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Do Bible groups get it wrong? Yep. And, you can see it for yourself if you visit the various factions of Christianity, and see how Episcopalians, Southern and Northern Baptists, Lutherans, Protestants and all the others interpret it. Some groups can have very strident disagreements in what their interpretation is over other types of Christians.

And, considering that the KJV of the Bible is not only the most used, but also the most heavily edited version, I'd be willing to say that they all get it wrong, because they are working with incomplete information.

Might also wanna look into how the Torah was translated into Greek, and then from Greek to Roman, and finally from Roman to English, with lots of other books being added to it.
 

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If they are all in a 100% agreement....they get added to the cult list
 

The Irish Ram

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The Bible tells us we are not to argue over doctrine. And yet, Christ's Church has completely fractured over dogma.
Read your Bible and pray for discernment and if something contrary to what the Bible says comes up, you'll know it in a heartbeat. It jumps right up and smacks you in the face. There is so much of it here you'll feel like you just walked through a car wash!

We have the most loving Father. This is His nature:
If you don't eat meat on Fri, as a sacrifice to God, He counts it as righteousness on your part, for His sake.
If you eat meat on Fri. to honor God, He counts it as righteousness on your part, for His sake.
He is a good Father to have.
 
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irosie91

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Hi hobe. If Jesus was saying the opposite and Jews knew it, the Pharisees would have condemned Christ on it and would have run to the Romans screaming sedition. They were unable to trick Him with the question.
He meant exactly what He said. No interpretation necessary. Coins, taxes, gold aren't important. Give it to whomever wants or needs it, and concentrate on what Christ said about Heaven. Gold is so unimportant they pave the streets with it there. For enduring down here we live in mansions in Paradise. Jesus was making a distinction between what is valuable and what is not in our Father's eyes. Christ put things in perspective.
wrong again Ram------the Pharisees did not LIKE THE ROMANS. When Jesus was hiding from
the Romans he lived amongst the Pharisees. Jesus was a Pharisee. Do you have OTHER examples
of Jews TURNING JEWS into the Pharisees? Your catechism whore lied. The people prone to cooperate with the romans were THE SADDUCEES. Your catechism whore lied again
 

shimon

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Not that Iwish to interfere in your conversations but to make a point “ the render unto Caesar” cannot be something that can be taken very seriously as the title Caesar was not really adopted until around 70 AD.. Yes some emperors used it prior to that to consolidate their claims to being the head of the Roman Empire but a red flag should come up regarding this phrase that was probably added in at a much later date my feelings of around the 3 rd century when Roman emperors used it to strengthen their claims and the council of Nicea..... Frankly it is important for people to use their minds and question why the Romans would want such a saying placed into the New Testament and why so many just accept it without question after all taxes and collecting money is the lifeblood of every empire and it is to their advantage to see that they get it and what better way then to insist that it was said in the New Testament by their own creation...Think about it....
 

irosie91

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Not that Iwish to interfere in your conversations but to make a point “ the render unto Caesar” cannot be something that can be taken very seriously as the title Caesar was not really adopted until around 70 AD.. Yes some emperors used it prior to that to consolidate their claims to being the head of the Roman Empire but a red flag should come up regarding this phrase that was probably added in at a much later date my feelings of around the 3 rd century when Roman emperors used it to strengthen their claims and the council of Nicea..... Frankly it is important for people to use their minds and question why the Romans would want such a saying placed into the New Testament and why so many just accept it without question after all taxes and collecting money is the lifeblood of every empire and it is to their advantage to see that they get it and what better way then to insist that it was said in the New Testament by their own creation...Think about it....
Not that Iwish to interfere in your conversations but to make a point “ the render unto Caesar” cannot be something that can be taken very seriously as the title Caesar was not really adopted until around 70 AD.. Yes some emperors used it prior to that to consolidate their claims to being the head of the Roman Empire but a red flag should come up regarding this phrase that was probably added in at a much later date my feelings of around the 3 rd century when Roman emperors used it to strengthen their claims and the council of Nicea..... Frankly it is important for people to use their minds and question why the Romans would want such a saying placed into the New Testament and why so many just accept it without question after all taxes and collecting money is the lifeblood of every empire and it is to their advantage to see that they get it and what better way then to insist that it was said in the New Testament by their own creation...Think about it....

AGREE times 10 million-------anyone who fails to see the NT as roman empire propaganda is an

IDIOT
 

hobelim

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That is a really good question.
On one hand, in Romans, it says if we owe taxes, pay taxes. If we owe revenue, pay revenue, owe respect, give respect. If we owe honor, give honor.
Then there is the flip side, that under no circumstances are we to receive the mark our government is going to introduce, even unto death.

Both options could result in starvation. The latter especially will. But rebelling against government isn't encouraged in the new Testament.
Christ didn't advocate it against Rome, and doesn't advocate it in Revelation. Nowhere can I find, "Rise up against evil rulers".
So I am going to say, beware, pray for discernment, be aware of the times we live in , but don't raise a sword against a perverse government. That's the Lord's job.

Render unto caesar etc.

To the average person standing around it would have seemed like Jesus was advocating paying taxes supporting the Roman occupation but to the observant Jew who knew that everything belonged to God and nothing belonged to caesar especially in Judea he was really saying the exact opposite, give caesar nothing.
Even if we consider, that Jesus first asked whose picture was on that money, before he said render onto Ceasar?

Yes, he mentioned the picture to emphasize the fact that it was the image of a man who was worshipped as a god which made paying taxes to caesar apostasy.
 
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The Irish Ram

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Hi hobe. If Jesus was saying the opposite and Jews knew it, the Pharisees would have condemned Christ on it and would have run to the Romans screaming sedition. They were unable to trick Him with the question.
He meant exactly what He said. No interpretation necessary. Coins, taxes, gold aren't important. Give it to whomever wants or needs it, and concentrate on what Christ said about Heaven. Gold is so unimportant they pave the streets with it there. For enduring down here we live in mansions in Paradise. Jesus was making a distinction between what is valuable and what is not in our Father's eyes. Christ put things in perspective.
wrong again Ram------the Pharisees did not LIKE THE ROMANS. When Jesus was hiding from
the Romans he lived amongst the Pharisees. Jesus was a Pharisee. Do you have OTHER examples
of Jews TURNING JEWS into the Pharisees? Your catechism whore lied. The people prone to cooperate with the romans were THE SADDUCEES. Your catechism whore lied again
No, I am not. The Pharisees used the Romans to their advantage. They didn't have to like them. The question the Pharisees asked Christ was intentionally to get Him in trouble with Rome, not the Temple.
Christ never hid. Why would He? He was here on a mission. Christ was turned into Rome,(by a Jew), not to the Temple priests.
Christ was never a Pharisee. He taught in the Temple as a child, but was never well received as an adult. Jesus used the Pharisees as an example of how not to behave.
As for your smart remarks, they are uncalled for, and wrong again rosie. I had no catechism whore, since I have never been Catholic. And if I wasn't such a good Christian, I'd think maybe you're the whore.:tomato:
 

hobelim

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The Bible tells us we are not to argue over doctrine. And yet, Christ's Church has completely fractured over dogma.
Read your Bible and pray for discernment and if something contrary to what the Bible says comes up, you'll know it in a heartbeat. It jumps right up and smacks you in the face. There is so much of it here you'll feel like you just walked through a car wash!

We have the most loving Father. This is His nature:
If you don't eat meat on Fri, as a sacrifice to God, He counts it as righteousness on your part, for His sake.
If you eat meat on Fri. to honor God, He counts it as righteousness on your part, for His sake.
He is a good Father to have.

Hi Ram. The Bible tells "us" not to argue over doctrine? Are you joking?

The bible was written is such a way that any given sentence can have many layers of meanings, not all of them necessarily right, the intended meaning, or even directly connected to the literal meanings of the words used.

How are people not supposed to argue over doctrine?

When the priest of the Lord stirs the waters of contention, the truth is brought out.
 
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