Biden destroyed these female athletes' opportunities and dreams

OldLady

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Men do not belong in women's sports.



Alanna Smith's dedication to her sport is profound. Just listening to the elite high school track star explain her training schedule is exhausting. Yet no matter how hard she trains, if she has to compete against biological males, she stands no chance of winning.

"There is simply a biological advantage that males have over females," explained the daughter of baseball Hall of Fame pitcher Lee Smith.

"Here is a perfect example," Smith told me. "I have a twin brother who is an athlete but does not run competitively for his sports. We raced against each other recently, and he beat me. Not because he trained harder, but because there are biological and physical advantages boys have over girls in some sports."

Smith, who set high school and county records as a short-distance track runner the moment she stepped on the field as a freshman at Danbury High School in Connecticut, says when she turns up to compete against male runners who identify and compete as females, she knows the cards are stacked against her.

And it has nothing to do with not being prepared.

"It is frustrating. I spend all of that time training to compete against other girls, and I find myself losing to biological males," she said.

Since 2017, two males who identify as female have taken 15 women's state championship titles in Connecticut. Smith's frustration led her last February to join with two other elite Connecticut runners, Selina Soule and Chelsea Mitchell, to file a federal discrimination complaint against Connecticut's policy allowing transgender competition against females. The girls explained that the suit alleges the policy unfairly marginalized them and violated Title IX, the federal law designed to ensure equal opportunities for females in education and school-based athletics.


On Inauguration Day, President Joe Biden issued an executive order saying a court case about transgender rights applies to Title IX, a federal education law that prevents discrimination based on sex. Elite female athletes such as Smith, Mitchell and Soule say Biden's pro-transgender order underscores their concerns.

Mitchell said she was ranked as the fastest girl in the 55-meter dash in Connecticut high school track in 2019. "Then I went to a high school competition, competing with two biological males who identify as girls," she said. "I really put my all into it, (but) I ultimately came in third, behind the both of them."

Soule said she missed an opportunity to qualify for the New England state championship in 2019 by one spot: "Both spots above me were taken by biological males."

Soule said that two distinct positions can be held about this that don't need to conflict with each other.

"This is not about not being supportive of the transgender community," she asserted. "Not at all. This is about fairness to girls and women. you can effectively hold both points of view."

All three athletes stressed that their objective is even-handedness in women's sports. "Title IX was created for a reason, and that was to give elite female athletes opportunities to be competitive and successful; the very objective was to have fairness in women's sports," said Soule.

Title IX was passed in 1972. In its first 10 years, the number of female athletes had blossomed to over 74,000. By 2020, that number had grown to over 220,000, according to data compiled by the NCAA.

White House press secretary Jen Psaki was one of those elite high school athletes in Connecticut in the mid-1990s who was able to shine because of Title IX as an accomplished swimmer for Greenwich High School, and she earned all-state honors in the backstroke. Psaki went on to swim for two years at William and Mary, an NCAA Division I school that currently gives out approximately 200 athletic scholarships a year, including women's swimming.

A 2020 study by the International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health showed among female and male competitive swimmers, males were increasingly faster than females beginning at the age of 10 years and continuing until the age of 17. In other words, had Psaki -- who was also the captain of the high school swim team -- had to compete against male swimmers who identified as female, her results may have fallen, despite her devotion to competing in her sport.

When asked about Biden's executive order and what the White House message is to the girls being forced to compete in sports against biological males, in particular in high school sports that lead to scholarship opportunities, Psaki said: "The president's belief is that trans rights are human rights, and that's why he signed that executive order. In terms of the determinations by universities and colleges, I would certainly defer to them."
I think it rots that transgender males can compete in some women's sports. Not fair. They're in a male body, male muscle mass and bones.
Then stop voting for people who hate women, like Joe Biden.
LOL Nice try. I think people will figure it out for themselves, given a little time. It's made more complicated when people with a hate-on for transgenders get involved; then it suddenly seems necessary to defend it in order to combat bias. But this isn't about bias. It's about reality.
 
OP
marvin martian

marvin martian

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Men do not belong in women's sports.



Alanna Smith's dedication to her sport is profound. Just listening to the elite high school track star explain her training schedule is exhausting. Yet no matter how hard she trains, if she has to compete against biological males, she stands no chance of winning.

"There is simply a biological advantage that males have over females," explained the daughter of baseball Hall of Fame pitcher Lee Smith.

"Here is a perfect example," Smith told me. "I have a twin brother who is an athlete but does not run competitively for his sports. We raced against each other recently, and he beat me. Not because he trained harder, but because there are biological and physical advantages boys have over girls in some sports."

Smith, who set high school and county records as a short-distance track runner the moment she stepped on the field as a freshman at Danbury High School in Connecticut, says when she turns up to compete against male runners who identify and compete as females, she knows the cards are stacked against her.

And it has nothing to do with not being prepared.

"It is frustrating. I spend all of that time training to compete against other girls, and I find myself losing to biological males," she said.

Since 2017, two males who identify as female have taken 15 women's state championship titles in Connecticut. Smith's frustration led her last February to join with two other elite Connecticut runners, Selina Soule and Chelsea Mitchell, to file a federal discrimination complaint against Connecticut's policy allowing transgender competition against females. The girls explained that the suit alleges the policy unfairly marginalized them and violated Title IX, the federal law designed to ensure equal opportunities for females in education and school-based athletics.


On Inauguration Day, President Joe Biden issued an executive order saying a court case about transgender rights applies to Title IX, a federal education law that prevents discrimination based on sex. Elite female athletes such as Smith, Mitchell and Soule say Biden's pro-transgender order underscores their concerns.

Mitchell said she was ranked as the fastest girl in the 55-meter dash in Connecticut high school track in 2019. "Then I went to a high school competition, competing with two biological males who identify as girls," she said. "I really put my all into it, (but) I ultimately came in third, behind the both of them."

Soule said she missed an opportunity to qualify for the New England state championship in 2019 by one spot: "Both spots above me were taken by biological males."

Soule said that two distinct positions can be held about this that don't need to conflict with each other.

"This is not about not being supportive of the transgender community," she asserted. "Not at all. This is about fairness to girls and women. you can effectively hold both points of view."

All three athletes stressed that their objective is even-handedness in women's sports. "Title IX was created for a reason, and that was to give elite female athletes opportunities to be competitive and successful; the very objective was to have fairness in women's sports," said Soule.

Title IX was passed in 1972. In its first 10 years, the number of female athletes had blossomed to over 74,000. By 2020, that number had grown to over 220,000, according to data compiled by the NCAA.

White House press secretary Jen Psaki was one of those elite high school athletes in Connecticut in the mid-1990s who was able to shine because of Title IX as an accomplished swimmer for Greenwich High School, and she earned all-state honors in the backstroke. Psaki went on to swim for two years at William and Mary, an NCAA Division I school that currently gives out approximately 200 athletic scholarships a year, including women's swimming.

A 2020 study by the International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health showed among female and male competitive swimmers, males were increasingly faster than females beginning at the age of 10 years and continuing until the age of 17. In other words, had Psaki -- who was also the captain of the high school swim team -- had to compete against male swimmers who identified as female, her results may have fallen, despite her devotion to competing in her sport.

When asked about Biden's executive order and what the White House message is to the girls being forced to compete in sports against biological males, in particular in high school sports that lead to scholarship opportunities, Psaki said: "The president's belief is that trans rights are human rights, and that's why he signed that executive order. In terms of the determinations by universities and colleges, I would certainly defer to them."
I think it rots that transgender males can compete in some women's sports. Not fair. They're in a male body, male muscle mass and bones.
Then stop voting for people who hate women, like Joe Biden.
LOL Nice try. I think people will figure it out for themselves, given a little time. It's made more complicated when people with a hate-on for transgenders get involved; then it suddenly seems necessary to defend it in order to combat bias. But this isn't about bias. It's about reality.
Your old, demented, white "president" signed this order on his very first day in office, it was a top priority. He hates women, and so do you if you support him.
 

OldLady

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Men do not belong in women's sports.



Alanna Smith's dedication to her sport is profound. Just listening to the elite high school track star explain her training schedule is exhausting. Yet no matter how hard she trains, if she has to compete against biological males, she stands no chance of winning.

"There is simply a biological advantage that males have over females," explained the daughter of baseball Hall of Fame pitcher Lee Smith.

"Here is a perfect example," Smith told me. "I have a twin brother who is an athlete but does not run competitively for his sports. We raced against each other recently, and he beat me. Not because he trained harder, but because there are biological and physical advantages boys have over girls in some sports."

Smith, who set high school and county records as a short-distance track runner the moment she stepped on the field as a freshman at Danbury High School in Connecticut, says when she turns up to compete against male runners who identify and compete as females, she knows the cards are stacked against her.

And it has nothing to do with not being prepared.

"It is frustrating. I spend all of that time training to compete against other girls, and I find myself losing to biological males," she said.

Since 2017, two males who identify as female have taken 15 women's state championship titles in Connecticut. Smith's frustration led her last February to join with two other elite Connecticut runners, Selina Soule and Chelsea Mitchell, to file a federal discrimination complaint against Connecticut's policy allowing transgender competition against females. The girls explained that the suit alleges the policy unfairly marginalized them and violated Title IX, the federal law designed to ensure equal opportunities for females in education and school-based athletics.


On Inauguration Day, President Joe Biden issued an executive order saying a court case about transgender rights applies to Title IX, a federal education law that prevents discrimination based on sex. Elite female athletes such as Smith, Mitchell and Soule say Biden's pro-transgender order underscores their concerns.

Mitchell said she was ranked as the fastest girl in the 55-meter dash in Connecticut high school track in 2019. "Then I went to a high school competition, competing with two biological males who identify as girls," she said. "I really put my all into it, (but) I ultimately came in third, behind the both of them."

Soule said she missed an opportunity to qualify for the New England state championship in 2019 by one spot: "Both spots above me were taken by biological males."

Soule said that two distinct positions can be held about this that don't need to conflict with each other.

"This is not about not being supportive of the transgender community," she asserted. "Not at all. This is about fairness to girls and women. you can effectively hold both points of view."

All three athletes stressed that their objective is even-handedness in women's sports. "Title IX was created for a reason, and that was to give elite female athletes opportunities to be competitive and successful; the very objective was to have fairness in women's sports," said Soule.

Title IX was passed in 1972. In its first 10 years, the number of female athletes had blossomed to over 74,000. By 2020, that number had grown to over 220,000, according to data compiled by the NCAA.

White House press secretary Jen Psaki was one of those elite high school athletes in Connecticut in the mid-1990s who was able to shine because of Title IX as an accomplished swimmer for Greenwich High School, and she earned all-state honors in the backstroke. Psaki went on to swim for two years at William and Mary, an NCAA Division I school that currently gives out approximately 200 athletic scholarships a year, including women's swimming.

A 2020 study by the International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health showed among female and male competitive swimmers, males were increasingly faster than females beginning at the age of 10 years and continuing until the age of 17. In other words, had Psaki -- who was also the captain of the high school swim team -- had to compete against male swimmers who identified as female, her results may have fallen, despite her devotion to competing in her sport.

When asked about Biden's executive order and what the White House message is to the girls being forced to compete in sports against biological males, in particular in high school sports that lead to scholarship opportunities, Psaki said: "The president's belief is that trans rights are human rights, and that's why he signed that executive order. In terms of the determinations by universities and colleges, I would certainly defer to them."
I think it rots that transgender males can compete in some women's sports. Not fair. They're in a male body, male muscle mass and bones.
Then stop voting for people who hate women, like Joe Biden.
LOL Nice try. I think people will figure it out for themselves, given a little time. It's made more complicated when people with a hate-on for transgenders get involved; then it suddenly seems necessary to defend it in order to combat bias. But this isn't about bias. It's about reality.
Your old, demented, white "president" signed this order on his very first day in office, it was a top priority. He hates women, and so do you if you support him.
Oh, STFU. He hates bias. The stupid parts will get worked out, eventually.
 

freyasman

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Men do not belong in women's sports.



Alanna Smith's dedication to her sport is profound. Just listening to the elite high school track star explain her training schedule is exhausting. Yet no matter how hard she trains, if she has to compete against biological males, she stands no chance of winning.

"There is simply a biological advantage that males have over females," explained the daughter of baseball Hall of Fame pitcher Lee Smith.

"Here is a perfect example," Smith told me. "I have a twin brother who is an athlete but does not run competitively for his sports. We raced against each other recently, and he beat me. Not because he trained harder, but because there are biological and physical advantages boys have over girls in some sports."

Smith, who set high school and county records as a short-distance track runner the moment she stepped on the field as a freshman at Danbury High School in Connecticut, says when she turns up to compete against male runners who identify and compete as females, she knows the cards are stacked against her.

And it has nothing to do with not being prepared.

"It is frustrating. I spend all of that time training to compete against other girls, and I find myself losing to biological males," she said.

Since 2017, two males who identify as female have taken 15 women's state championship titles in Connecticut. Smith's frustration led her last February to join with two other elite Connecticut runners, Selina Soule and Chelsea Mitchell, to file a federal discrimination complaint against Connecticut's policy allowing transgender competition against females. The girls explained that the suit alleges the policy unfairly marginalized them and violated Title IX, the federal law designed to ensure equal opportunities for females in education and school-based athletics.


On Inauguration Day, President Joe Biden issued an executive order saying a court case about transgender rights applies to Title IX, a federal education law that prevents discrimination based on sex. Elite female athletes such as Smith, Mitchell and Soule say Biden's pro-transgender order underscores their concerns.

Mitchell said she was ranked as the fastest girl in the 55-meter dash in Connecticut high school track in 2019. "Then I went to a high school competition, competing with two biological males who identify as girls," she said. "I really put my all into it, (but) I ultimately came in third, behind the both of them."

Soule said she missed an opportunity to qualify for the New England state championship in 2019 by one spot: "Both spots above me were taken by biological males."

Soule said that two distinct positions can be held about this that don't need to conflict with each other.

"This is not about not being supportive of the transgender community," she asserted. "Not at all. This is about fairness to girls and women. you can effectively hold both points of view."

All three athletes stressed that their objective is even-handedness in women's sports. "Title IX was created for a reason, and that was to give elite female athletes opportunities to be competitive and successful; the very objective was to have fairness in women's sports," said Soule.

Title IX was passed in 1972. In its first 10 years, the number of female athletes had blossomed to over 74,000. By 2020, that number had grown to over 220,000, according to data compiled by the NCAA.

White House press secretary Jen Psaki was one of those elite high school athletes in Connecticut in the mid-1990s who was able to shine because of Title IX as an accomplished swimmer for Greenwich High School, and she earned all-state honors in the backstroke. Psaki went on to swim for two years at William and Mary, an NCAA Division I school that currently gives out approximately 200 athletic scholarships a year, including women's swimming.

A 2020 study by the International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health showed among female and male competitive swimmers, males were increasingly faster than females beginning at the age of 10 years and continuing until the age of 17. In other words, had Psaki -- who was also the captain of the high school swim team -- had to compete against male swimmers who identified as female, her results may have fallen, despite her devotion to competing in her sport.

When asked about Biden's executive order and what the White House message is to the girls being forced to compete in sports against biological males, in particular in high school sports that lead to scholarship opportunities, Psaki said: "The president's belief is that trans rights are human rights, and that's why he signed that executive order. In terms of the determinations by universities and colleges, I would certainly defer to them."
I think it rots that transgender males can compete in some women's sports. Not fair. They're in a male body, male muscle mass and bones.
Then stop voting for people who hate women, like Joe Biden.
LOL Nice try. I think people will figure it out for themselves, given a little time. It's made more complicated when people with a hate-on for transgenders get involved; then it suddenly seems necessary to defend it in order to combat bias. But this isn't about bias. It's about reality.
Your old, demented, white "president" signed this order on his very first day in office, it was a top priority. He hates women, and so do you if you support him.
Oh, STFU. He hates bias. The stupid parts will get worked out, eventually.
You really believe this guy is anything but a corrupt grifter with dementia?

Seriously???
 

Seawytch

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I gotta say that is fucking hilarious, Not what happened to the girls but when it happened. 2017 and 2019. But it's Biden's EO in 2021 that destroyed them?

On the issue, I think girls should be able to move up in class and compete with the boys but not the other way around.
I do love that as of 1/19/2020....you couldn't get two guys anywhere in the world to discuss women's /girls sports. Regardless of the dude's political leanings, their race, color, creed, age, etc. There was no place in the universe where two men gave a collective single shit about women's sports.

But now...we have like 12 threads on it and right wing mouth breathing knuckle draggers are acting like they care.

This is how the rightwing really feels:

From 2010:

...The vast majority of college sports programs LOSE MONEY, big time. Especially with the bizarre requirements of Title IX, which requires multiple wimmin's sports about which no one but the players, coaches, and their parents gives a shit?
They still don't care about girls or women's sports.

For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness,

I care about fairness.
No you don't or you would require that all competitors come from the same social/economical background, are all the same height, weight and have the same exact muscle mass.


Some basketball players have acromegaly, a hormonal condition that results in very large hands and feet. This condition is surely a genetic advantage in the sport, but players with acromegaly are not banned.
Some doctors speculate that Olympic swimmer Michael Phelps has Marfan syndrome, a genetic condition that results in the long, flexible arms and legs that made Phelps such a force in the pool. Major league baseball players tend to have extraordinary eyesight, which allows them to see the seams on a tiny ball hurtling toward them at high speeds and hit it with greater success than those with poorer vision.
In all these ways, sports aren't fair and yet, these types of inequalities are not just acceptable, but mostly unnoticed. For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness, but the need to protect and reinforce the idea of gender itself.


YOur excuses for pretending to not understand that boys and girls are different, is well done.


Letting girls compete against girls, gives athletic girls a "fair" chance. Yes, not all girls have a shot, but some of them do.


Putting boys in the mix, takes that away from them.
They aren't boys. They are trans girls. Read up on Renee Richards.

Boys are boys. Girls are girls. People with mental problems don't magically change.
Transgendered individuals are not "people with mental problems". It is the 21st century. Some "boys and girls" were born into the wrong body. Fortunately, science can fix that for them and even more fortunately they are getting more support for it from family and friends.

Just another issue where the right wingers are on the wrong side of history.

Funny how that increased support doesn't seem to decrease their suicide attempts.


That Tide of History you feel so good about being on the side of? It's called "Decline and Fall".
You find suicide funny?

Actually, increased support does lead to fewer suicides.


Results
Among trans Ontarians, 35.1 % (95 % CI: 27.6, 42.5) seriously considered, and 11.2 % (95 % CI: 6.0, 16.4) attempted, suicide in the past year. Social support, reduced transphobia, and having any personal identification documents changed to an appropriate sex designation were associated with large relative and absolute reductions in suicide risk, as was completing a medical transition through hormones and/or surgeries (when needed). Parental support for gender identity was associated with reduced ideation. Lower self-reported transphobia (10th versus 90th percentile) was associated with a 66 % reduction in ideation (RR = 0.34, 95 % CI: 0.17, 0.67), and an additional 76 % reduction in attempts among those with ideation (RR = 0.24; 95 % CI: 0.07, 0.82). This corresponds to potential prevention of 160 ideations per 1000 trans persons, and 200 attempts per 1,000 with ideation, based on a hypothetical reduction of transphobia from current levels to the 10th percentile.​
Conclusions
Large effect sizes were observed for this controlled analysis of intervenable factors, suggesting that interventions to increase social inclusion and access to medical transition, and to reduce transphobia, have the potential to contribute to substantial reductions in the extremely high prevalences of suicide ideation and attempts within trans populations. Such interventions at the population level may require policy change.​

First study I've heard of that claims that. We will see if it stands up over time.
You read a lot of studies about transgender issues do you? Well, you’re missing a lot of them.



Can't be bothered to do counter research. I withdraw the point.
There is no counter research. It’s simple logic. If you accept and love your trans child, they are going to be less likely to want to commit suicide, duh. Some parents have to decide do they want a dead son or a live daughter.
It’s probably not a choice children should be making. How about they love who they are?
They can’t love who they are until they can become their true selves.

It really does often come down to a parent having to decide whether they want a live daughter or a dead son (or vice versa).
They should be able to. Lots of kids in wheelchairs want to walk, but they can still be happy.
Hopefully you will never have to find out it’s not the same. Kids try and cut their own penises off.
And what’s different? Lots of kids deal with things that they can not do. Cutting a pen is off doesn’t make a boy a girl. Seems they aren’t getting the correct treatment if they would do that.
The difference is that these children know they were born as the wrong gender.
Cutting their penises off is what kids do when not supported in their desire to transition.

The problem is parents don’t get their children treatment. They tell him to “knock it off” and just “be a boy” or “be a girl”. Oh, and the treatment that will be recommended by actual medical professionals will not be one that you agree with I’m sure...
Children don’t know much of anything. I know younger kids that want to grow up to be dinosaurs. It seems like a decision that is not for children. I mean kids aren’t treated the same as adults for crimes. I’m pretty sure that is justified as kids make a lot of mistakes.

I don’t see how playing girls sports is going to be the thing to save anyone.
These kids DO know. It’s not a game or a phase they grow out of. It’s OK. Some people (mostly Republicans) can’t or will not try to understand it unless it touches them personally.

And at what age? And ruining girls sports is the only thing keeping them from cutting the penis off?
No, support from community and family keeps them from self mutilation and suicide. Sports are often important in a community.

Yes or no, there are benefits to children participating in sports.
 

OldLady

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Men do not belong in women's sports.



Alanna Smith's dedication to her sport is profound. Just listening to the elite high school track star explain her training schedule is exhausting. Yet no matter how hard she trains, if she has to compete against biological males, she stands no chance of winning.

"There is simply a biological advantage that males have over females," explained the daughter of baseball Hall of Fame pitcher Lee Smith.

"Here is a perfect example," Smith told me. "I have a twin brother who is an athlete but does not run competitively for his sports. We raced against each other recently, and he beat me. Not because he trained harder, but because there are biological and physical advantages boys have over girls in some sports."

Smith, who set high school and county records as a short-distance track runner the moment she stepped on the field as a freshman at Danbury High School in Connecticut, says when she turns up to compete against male runners who identify and compete as females, she knows the cards are stacked against her.

And it has nothing to do with not being prepared.

"It is frustrating. I spend all of that time training to compete against other girls, and I find myself losing to biological males," she said.

Since 2017, two males who identify as female have taken 15 women's state championship titles in Connecticut. Smith's frustration led her last February to join with two other elite Connecticut runners, Selina Soule and Chelsea Mitchell, to file a federal discrimination complaint against Connecticut's policy allowing transgender competition against females. The girls explained that the suit alleges the policy unfairly marginalized them and violated Title IX, the federal law designed to ensure equal opportunities for females in education and school-based athletics.


On Inauguration Day, President Joe Biden issued an executive order saying a court case about transgender rights applies to Title IX, a federal education law that prevents discrimination based on sex. Elite female athletes such as Smith, Mitchell and Soule say Biden's pro-transgender order underscores their concerns.

Mitchell said she was ranked as the fastest girl in the 55-meter dash in Connecticut high school track in 2019. "Then I went to a high school competition, competing with two biological males who identify as girls," she said. "I really put my all into it, (but) I ultimately came in third, behind the both of them."

Soule said she missed an opportunity to qualify for the New England state championship in 2019 by one spot: "Both spots above me were taken by biological males."

Soule said that two distinct positions can be held about this that don't need to conflict with each other.

"This is not about not being supportive of the transgender community," she asserted. "Not at all. This is about fairness to girls and women. you can effectively hold both points of view."

All three athletes stressed that their objective is even-handedness in women's sports. "Title IX was created for a reason, and that was to give elite female athletes opportunities to be competitive and successful; the very objective was to have fairness in women's sports," said Soule.

Title IX was passed in 1972. In its first 10 years, the number of female athletes had blossomed to over 74,000. By 2020, that number had grown to over 220,000, according to data compiled by the NCAA.

White House press secretary Jen Psaki was one of those elite high school athletes in Connecticut in the mid-1990s who was able to shine because of Title IX as an accomplished swimmer for Greenwich High School, and she earned all-state honors in the backstroke. Psaki went on to swim for two years at William and Mary, an NCAA Division I school that currently gives out approximately 200 athletic scholarships a year, including women's swimming.

A 2020 study by the International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health showed among female and male competitive swimmers, males were increasingly faster than females beginning at the age of 10 years and continuing until the age of 17. In other words, had Psaki -- who was also the captain of the high school swim team -- had to compete against male swimmers who identified as female, her results may have fallen, despite her devotion to competing in her sport.

When asked about Biden's executive order and what the White House message is to the girls being forced to compete in sports against biological males, in particular in high school sports that lead to scholarship opportunities, Psaki said: "The president's belief is that trans rights are human rights, and that's why he signed that executive order. In terms of the determinations by universities and colleges, I would certainly defer to them."
I think it rots that transgender males can compete in some women's sports. Not fair. They're in a male body, male muscle mass and bones.
Then stop voting for people who hate women, like Joe Biden.
LOL Nice try. I think people will figure it out for themselves, given a little time. It's made more complicated when people with a hate-on for transgenders get involved; then it suddenly seems necessary to defend it in order to combat bias. But this isn't about bias. It's about reality.
Your old, demented, white "president" signed this order on his very first day in office, it was a top priority. He hates women, and so do you if you support him.
Oh, STFU. He hates bias. The stupid parts will get worked out, eventually.
You really believe this guy is anything but a corrupt grifter with dementia?

Seriously???
Yup. Really.
 

OldLady

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I gotta say that is fucking hilarious, Not what happened to the girls but when it happened. 2017 and 2019. But it's Biden's EO in 2021 that destroyed them?

On the issue, I think girls should be able to move up in class and compete with the boys but not the other way around.
I do love that as of 1/19/2020....you couldn't get two guys anywhere in the world to discuss women's /girls sports. Regardless of the dude's political leanings, their race, color, creed, age, etc. There was no place in the universe where two men gave a collective single shit about women's sports.

But now...we have like 12 threads on it and right wing mouth breathing knuckle draggers are acting like they care.

This is how the rightwing really feels:

From 2010:

...The vast majority of college sports programs LOSE MONEY, big time. Especially with the bizarre requirements of Title IX, which requires multiple wimmin's sports about which no one but the players, coaches, and their parents gives a shit?
They still don't care about girls or women's sports.

For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness,

I care about fairness.
No you don't or you would require that all competitors come from the same social/economical background, are all the same height, weight and have the same exact muscle mass.


Some basketball players have acromegaly, a hormonal condition that results in very large hands and feet. This condition is surely a genetic advantage in the sport, but players with acromegaly are not banned.
Some doctors speculate that Olympic swimmer Michael Phelps has Marfan syndrome, a genetic condition that results in the long, flexible arms and legs that made Phelps such a force in the pool. Major league baseball players tend to have extraordinary eyesight, which allows them to see the seams on a tiny ball hurtling toward them at high speeds and hit it with greater success than those with poorer vision.
In all these ways, sports aren't fair and yet, these types of inequalities are not just acceptable, but mostly unnoticed. For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness, but the need to protect and reinforce the idea of gender itself.


YOur excuses for pretending to not understand that boys and girls are different, is well done.


Letting girls compete against girls, gives athletic girls a "fair" chance. Yes, not all girls have a shot, but some of them do.


Putting boys in the mix, takes that away from them.
They aren't boys. They are trans girls. Read up on Renee Richards.

Boys are boys. Girls are girls. People with mental problems don't magically change.
Transgendered individuals are not "people with mental problems". It is the 21st century. Some "boys and girls" were born into the wrong body. Fortunately, science can fix that for them and even more fortunately they are getting more support for it from family and friends.

Just another issue where the right wingers are on the wrong side of history.

Funny how that increased support doesn't seem to decrease their suicide attempts.


That Tide of History you feel so good about being on the side of? It's called "Decline and Fall".
You find suicide funny?

Actually, increased support does lead to fewer suicides.


Results
Among trans Ontarians, 35.1 % (95 % CI: 27.6, 42.5) seriously considered, and 11.2 % (95 % CI: 6.0, 16.4) attempted, suicide in the past year. Social support, reduced transphobia, and having any personal identification documents changed to an appropriate sex designation were associated with large relative and absolute reductions in suicide risk, as was completing a medical transition through hormones and/or surgeries (when needed). Parental support for gender identity was associated with reduced ideation. Lower self-reported transphobia (10th versus 90th percentile) was associated with a 66 % reduction in ideation (RR = 0.34, 95 % CI: 0.17, 0.67), and an additional 76 % reduction in attempts among those with ideation (RR = 0.24; 95 % CI: 0.07, 0.82). This corresponds to potential prevention of 160 ideations per 1000 trans persons, and 200 attempts per 1,000 with ideation, based on a hypothetical reduction of transphobia from current levels to the 10th percentile.​
Conclusions
Large effect sizes were observed for this controlled analysis of intervenable factors, suggesting that interventions to increase social inclusion and access to medical transition, and to reduce transphobia, have the potential to contribute to substantial reductions in the extremely high prevalences of suicide ideation and attempts within trans populations. Such interventions at the population level may require policy change.​

First study I've heard of that claims that. We will see if it stands up over time.
You read a lot of studies about transgender issues do you? Well, you’re missing a lot of them.



Can't be bothered to do counter research. I withdraw the point.
There is no counter research. It’s simple logic. If you accept and love your trans child, they are going to be less likely to want to commit suicide, duh. Some parents have to decide do they want a dead son or a live daughter.
It’s probably not a choice children should be making. How about they love who they are?
They can’t love who they are until they can become their true selves.

It really does often come down to a parent having to decide whether they want a live daughter or a dead son (or vice versa).
They should be able to. Lots of kids in wheelchairs want to walk, but they can still be happy.
Hopefully you will never have to find out it’s not the same. Kids try and cut their own penises off.
And what’s different? Lots of kids deal with things that they can not do. Cutting a pen is off doesn’t make a boy a girl. Seems they aren’t getting the correct treatment if they would do that.
The difference is that these children know they were born as the wrong gender.
Cutting their penises off is what kids do when not supported in their desire to transition.

The problem is parents don’t get their children treatment. They tell him to “knock it off” and just “be a boy” or “be a girl”. Oh, and the treatment that will be recommended by actual medical professionals will not be one that you agree with I’m sure...
Children don’t know much of anything. I know younger kids that want to grow up to be dinosaurs. It seems like a decision that is not for children. I mean kids aren’t treated the same as adults for crimes. I’m pretty sure that is justified as kids make a lot of mistakes.

I don’t see how playing girls sports is going to be the thing to save anyone.
These kids DO know. It’s not a game or a phase they grow out of. It’s OK. Some people (mostly Republicans) can’t or will not try to understand it unless it touches them personally.

And at what age? And ruining girls sports is the only thing keeping them from cutting the penis off?
No, support from community and family keeps them from self mutilation and suicide. Sports are often important in a community.

Yes or no, there are benefits to children participating in sports.
Yes. I don't know what the answer is, but it's not allowing men's bodies to compete against women's athletically where size and such matter.
 

Brain357

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I gotta say that is fucking hilarious, Not what happened to the girls but when it happened. 2017 and 2019. But it's Biden's EO in 2021 that destroyed them?

On the issue, I think girls should be able to move up in class and compete with the boys but not the other way around.
I do love that as of 1/19/2020....you couldn't get two guys anywhere in the world to discuss women's /girls sports. Regardless of the dude's political leanings, their race, color, creed, age, etc. There was no place in the universe where two men gave a collective single shit about women's sports.

But now...we have like 12 threads on it and right wing mouth breathing knuckle draggers are acting like they care.

This is how the rightwing really feels:

From 2010:

...The vast majority of college sports programs LOSE MONEY, big time. Especially with the bizarre requirements of Title IX, which requires multiple wimmin's sports about which no one but the players, coaches, and their parents gives a shit?
They still don't care about girls or women's sports.

For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness,

I care about fairness.
No you don't or you would require that all competitors come from the same social/economical background, are all the same height, weight and have the same exact muscle mass.


Some basketball players have acromegaly, a hormonal condition that results in very large hands and feet. This condition is surely a genetic advantage in the sport, but players with acromegaly are not banned.
Some doctors speculate that Olympic swimmer Michael Phelps has Marfan syndrome, a genetic condition that results in the long, flexible arms and legs that made Phelps such a force in the pool. Major league baseball players tend to have extraordinary eyesight, which allows them to see the seams on a tiny ball hurtling toward them at high speeds and hit it with greater success than those with poorer vision.
In all these ways, sports aren't fair and yet, these types of inequalities are not just acceptable, but mostly unnoticed. For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness, but the need to protect and reinforce the idea of gender itself.


YOur excuses for pretending to not understand that boys and girls are different, is well done.


Letting girls compete against girls, gives athletic girls a "fair" chance. Yes, not all girls have a shot, but some of them do.


Putting boys in the mix, takes that away from them.
They aren't boys. They are trans girls. Read up on Renee Richards.

Boys are boys. Girls are girls. People with mental problems don't magically change.
Transgendered individuals are not "people with mental problems". It is the 21st century. Some "boys and girls" were born into the wrong body. Fortunately, science can fix that for them and even more fortunately they are getting more support for it from family and friends.

Just another issue where the right wingers are on the wrong side of history.

Funny how that increased support doesn't seem to decrease their suicide attempts.


That Tide of History you feel so good about being on the side of? It's called "Decline and Fall".
You find suicide funny?

Actually, increased support does lead to fewer suicides.


Results
Among trans Ontarians, 35.1 % (95 % CI: 27.6, 42.5) seriously considered, and 11.2 % (95 % CI: 6.0, 16.4) attempted, suicide in the past year. Social support, reduced transphobia, and having any personal identification documents changed to an appropriate sex designation were associated with large relative and absolute reductions in suicide risk, as was completing a medical transition through hormones and/or surgeries (when needed). Parental support for gender identity was associated with reduced ideation. Lower self-reported transphobia (10th versus 90th percentile) was associated with a 66 % reduction in ideation (RR = 0.34, 95 % CI: 0.17, 0.67), and an additional 76 % reduction in attempts among those with ideation (RR = 0.24; 95 % CI: 0.07, 0.82). This corresponds to potential prevention of 160 ideations per 1000 trans persons, and 200 attempts per 1,000 with ideation, based on a hypothetical reduction of transphobia from current levels to the 10th percentile.​
Conclusions
Large effect sizes were observed for this controlled analysis of intervenable factors, suggesting that interventions to increase social inclusion and access to medical transition, and to reduce transphobia, have the potential to contribute to substantial reductions in the extremely high prevalences of suicide ideation and attempts within trans populations. Such interventions at the population level may require policy change.​

First study I've heard of that claims that. We will see if it stands up over time.
You read a lot of studies about transgender issues do you? Well, you’re missing a lot of them.



Can't be bothered to do counter research. I withdraw the point.
There is no counter research. It’s simple logic. If you accept and love your trans child, they are going to be less likely to want to commit suicide, duh. Some parents have to decide do they want a dead son or a live daughter.
It’s probably not a choice children should be making. How about they love who they are?
They can’t love who they are until they can become their true selves.

It really does often come down to a parent having to decide whether they want a live daughter or a dead son (or vice versa).
They should be able to. Lots of kids in wheelchairs want to walk, but they can still be happy.
Hopefully you will never have to find out it’s not the same. Kids try and cut their own penises off.
And what’s different? Lots of kids deal with things that they can not do. Cutting a pen is off doesn’t make a boy a girl. Seems they aren’t getting the correct treatment if they would do that.
The difference is that these children know they were born as the wrong gender.
Cutting their penises off is what kids do when not supported in their desire to transition.

The problem is parents don’t get their children treatment. They tell him to “knock it off” and just “be a boy” or “be a girl”. Oh, and the treatment that will be recommended by actual medical professionals will not be one that you agree with I’m sure...
Children don’t know much of anything. I know younger kids that want to grow up to be dinosaurs. It seems like a decision that is not for children. I mean kids aren’t treated the same as adults for crimes. I’m pretty sure that is justified as kids make a lot of mistakes.

I don’t see how playing girls sports is going to be the thing to save anyone.
These kids DO know. It’s not a game or a phase they grow out of. It’s OK. Some people (mostly Republicans) can’t or will not try to understand it unless it touches them personally.

And at what age? And ruining girls sports is the only thing keeping them from cutting the penis off?
No, support from community and family keeps them from self mutilation and suicide. Sports are often important in a community.

Yes or no, there are benefits to children participating in sports.
Why does it matter if they participate in boys or girls? It's sports either way. Much of the benefits are from FAIR sports. That's why there are so many rules.
 

Cecilie1200

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Men do not belong in women's sports.



Alanna Smith's dedication to her sport is profound. Just listening to the elite high school track star explain her training schedule is exhausting. Yet no matter how hard she trains, if she has to compete against biological males, she stands no chance of winning.

"There is simply a biological advantage that males have over females," explained the daughter of baseball Hall of Fame pitcher Lee Smith.

"Here is a perfect example," Smith told me. "I have a twin brother who is an athlete but does not run competitively for his sports. We raced against each other recently, and he beat me. Not because he trained harder, but because there are biological and physical advantages boys have over girls in some sports."

Smith, who set high school and county records as a short-distance track runner the moment she stepped on the field as a freshman at Danbury High School in Connecticut, says when she turns up to compete against male runners who identify and compete as females, she knows the cards are stacked against her.

And it has nothing to do with not being prepared.

"It is frustrating. I spend all of that time training to compete against other girls, and I find myself losing to biological males," she said.

Since 2017, two males who identify as female have taken 15 women's state championship titles in Connecticut. Smith's frustration led her last February to join with two other elite Connecticut runners, Selina Soule and Chelsea Mitchell, to file a federal discrimination complaint against Connecticut's policy allowing transgender competition against females. The girls explained that the suit alleges the policy unfairly marginalized them and violated Title IX, the federal law designed to ensure equal opportunities for females in education and school-based athletics.


On Inauguration Day, President Joe Biden issued an executive order saying a court case about transgender rights applies to Title IX, a federal education law that prevents discrimination based on sex. Elite female athletes such as Smith, Mitchell and Soule say Biden's pro-transgender order underscores their concerns.

Mitchell said she was ranked as the fastest girl in the 55-meter dash in Connecticut high school track in 2019. "Then I went to a high school competition, competing with two biological males who identify as girls," she said. "I really put my all into it, (but) I ultimately came in third, behind the both of them."

Soule said she missed an opportunity to qualify for the New England state championship in 2019 by one spot: "Both spots above me were taken by biological males."

Soule said that two distinct positions can be held about this that don't need to conflict with each other.

"This is not about not being supportive of the transgender community," she asserted. "Not at all. This is about fairness to girls and women. you can effectively hold both points of view."

All three athletes stressed that their objective is even-handedness in women's sports. "Title IX was created for a reason, and that was to give elite female athletes opportunities to be competitive and successful; the very objective was to have fairness in women's sports," said Soule.

Title IX was passed in 1972. In its first 10 years, the number of female athletes had blossomed to over 74,000. By 2020, that number had grown to over 220,000, according to data compiled by the NCAA.

White House press secretary Jen Psaki was one of those elite high school athletes in Connecticut in the mid-1990s who was able to shine because of Title IX as an accomplished swimmer for Greenwich High School, and she earned all-state honors in the backstroke. Psaki went on to swim for two years at William and Mary, an NCAA Division I school that currently gives out approximately 200 athletic scholarships a year, including women's swimming.

A 2020 study by the International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health showed among female and male competitive swimmers, males were increasingly faster than females beginning at the age of 10 years and continuing until the age of 17. In other words, had Psaki -- who was also the captain of the high school swim team -- had to compete against male swimmers who identified as female, her results may have fallen, despite her devotion to competing in her sport.

When asked about Biden's executive order and what the White House message is to the girls being forced to compete in sports against biological males, in particular in high school sports that lead to scholarship opportunities, Psaki said: "The president's belief is that trans rights are human rights, and that's why he signed that executive order. In terms of the determinations by universities and colleges, I would certainly defer to them."
I think it rots that transgender males can compete in some women's sports. Not fair. They're in a male body, male muscle mass and bones.
Then stop voting for people who hate women, like Joe Biden.
LOL Nice try. I think people will figure it out for themselves, given a little time. It's made more complicated when people with a hate-on for transgenders get involved; then it suddenly seems necessary to defend it in order to combat bias. But this isn't about bias. It's about reality.
I just heard, "I don't have to vote for the things I say I believe. I can vote against them, and just wait for other people to eventually do the right thing."

I also like how you said the same thing we've been saying, and then decided it was perfectly okay for you to call us "people with a hate-on for transgenders", so that you could pretend that you're morally superior for absolutely no reason whatsoever. Here's a newsflash, punkin: your previous post? Makes you as much a person with a hate-on for transgenders as any of us . . . except YOU are also a coward who doesn't have the courage to act on what you pretend to believe.
 

candycorn

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Just out of curiosity...

Are there any statistics on how often this happens?

Please none of the "Once is too often" responses.

Actual stats on how often, in the US, this has taken place?
The instances cited in the article aren't enough to convince you there's a problem with letting men play women's sports in high school and college?
Well, if you want to know how I feel, read what I wrote ON YOUR THREAD:

Well there are 2 issues here.

First the "outrage" being broadcast by right wing loons. My post is about them. They couldn't give two shits about girls/women's sports before Biden got there. But now this is some major issue. I posted a citation to that effect. Its comical to see them so "outraged" by something they didn't care about 24 days ago.

The second issue is what you're talking about fairness. My position is as follows. If you were born with outdoor plumbing, you don't compete against those who were not. Never. And no, it doesn't matter how you feel or how you identify. Which is a shame too. <sarcasm on> Because I often identify as a 10 year old girl. I should go out for my niece's school team. I could light those weak assed pitchers up. <sarcasm off>. You can identify any way you want. I support it. However, It's not (or at least shouldn't be) the government's or officiating body's responsibility to accommodate you. When Obama got mixed up in the bathroom business 4+ years ago, I said that he "pressed the stupid button". I haven't read much about Biden's weighing in on the issue but it appears he's pressing it too.
That is how I feel.

Now... Can you tell me how often this has happened? Is this really worth the amount of time we're spending on it?
 

Cecilie1200

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Men do not belong in women's sports.



Alanna Smith's dedication to her sport is profound. Just listening to the elite high school track star explain her training schedule is exhausting. Yet no matter how hard she trains, if she has to compete against biological males, she stands no chance of winning.

"There is simply a biological advantage that males have over females," explained the daughter of baseball Hall of Fame pitcher Lee Smith.

"Here is a perfect example," Smith told me. "I have a twin brother who is an athlete but does not run competitively for his sports. We raced against each other recently, and he beat me. Not because he trained harder, but because there are biological and physical advantages boys have over girls in some sports."

Smith, who set high school and county records as a short-distance track runner the moment she stepped on the field as a freshman at Danbury High School in Connecticut, says when she turns up to compete against male runners who identify and compete as females, she knows the cards are stacked against her.

And it has nothing to do with not being prepared.

"It is frustrating. I spend all of that time training to compete against other girls, and I find myself losing to biological males," she said.

Since 2017, two males who identify as female have taken 15 women's state championship titles in Connecticut. Smith's frustration led her last February to join with two other elite Connecticut runners, Selina Soule and Chelsea Mitchell, to file a federal discrimination complaint against Connecticut's policy allowing transgender competition against females. The girls explained that the suit alleges the policy unfairly marginalized them and violated Title IX, the federal law designed to ensure equal opportunities for females in education and school-based athletics.


On Inauguration Day, President Joe Biden issued an executive order saying a court case about transgender rights applies to Title IX, a federal education law that prevents discrimination based on sex. Elite female athletes such as Smith, Mitchell and Soule say Biden's pro-transgender order underscores their concerns.

Mitchell said she was ranked as the fastest girl in the 55-meter dash in Connecticut high school track in 2019. "Then I went to a high school competition, competing with two biological males who identify as girls," she said. "I really put my all into it, (but) I ultimately came in third, behind the both of them."

Soule said she missed an opportunity to qualify for the New England state championship in 2019 by one spot: "Both spots above me were taken by biological males."

Soule said that two distinct positions can be held about this that don't need to conflict with each other.

"This is not about not being supportive of the transgender community," she asserted. "Not at all. This is about fairness to girls and women. you can effectively hold both points of view."

All three athletes stressed that their objective is even-handedness in women's sports. "Title IX was created for a reason, and that was to give elite female athletes opportunities to be competitive and successful; the very objective was to have fairness in women's sports," said Soule.

Title IX was passed in 1972. In its first 10 years, the number of female athletes had blossomed to over 74,000. By 2020, that number had grown to over 220,000, according to data compiled by the NCAA.

White House press secretary Jen Psaki was one of those elite high school athletes in Connecticut in the mid-1990s who was able to shine because of Title IX as an accomplished swimmer for Greenwich High School, and she earned all-state honors in the backstroke. Psaki went on to swim for two years at William and Mary, an NCAA Division I school that currently gives out approximately 200 athletic scholarships a year, including women's swimming.

A 2020 study by the International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health showed among female and male competitive swimmers, males were increasingly faster than females beginning at the age of 10 years and continuing until the age of 17. In other words, had Psaki -- who was also the captain of the high school swim team -- had to compete against male swimmers who identified as female, her results may have fallen, despite her devotion to competing in her sport.

When asked about Biden's executive order and what the White House message is to the girls being forced to compete in sports against biological males, in particular in high school sports that lead to scholarship opportunities, Psaki said: "The president's belief is that trans rights are human rights, and that's why he signed that executive order. In terms of the determinations by universities and colleges, I would certainly defer to them."
I think it rots that transgender males can compete in some women's sports. Not fair. They're in a male body, male muscle mass and bones.
Then stop voting for people who hate women, like Joe Biden.
LOL Nice try. I think people will figure it out for themselves, given a little time. It's made more complicated when people with a hate-on for transgenders get involved; then it suddenly seems necessary to defend it in order to combat bias. But this isn't about bias. It's about reality.
Your old, demented, white "president" signed this order on his very first day in office, it was a top priority. He hates women, and so do you if you support him.
Oh, STFU. He hates bias. The stupid parts will get worked out, eventually.
Please show us an example of him "hating bias", rather than just asserting it as true because that's what you need to believe to justify voting for the exact opposite of what you claim to believe.

Here's another ugly newsflash for you: What you believe is reflected in your actions, not in your words. You can mouth the "transgenders shouldn't compete in women's sports; it's not fair" line all you like. But your actions were to enable it to happen. You voted for it. You KNEW you voted for it. Therefore, what you really believe is that it's perfectly okay for other people to be harmed in order to get what YOU want.

I don't think you hate women. I just think you don't give a fat rat's ass about them one way or another. They're disposable, like Kleenex.

Now I will return you to your regularly scheduled attempt to feel good about being you.
 

Cecilie1200

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I gotta say that is fucking hilarious, Not what happened to the girls but when it happened. 2017 and 2019. But it's Biden's EO in 2021 that destroyed them?

On the issue, I think girls should be able to move up in class and compete with the boys but not the other way around.
I do love that as of 1/19/2020....you couldn't get two guys anywhere in the world to discuss women's /girls sports. Regardless of the dude's political leanings, their race, color, creed, age, etc. There was no place in the universe where two men gave a collective single shit about women's sports.

But now...we have like 12 threads on it and right wing mouth breathing knuckle draggers are acting like they care.

This is how the rightwing really feels:

From 2010:

...The vast majority of college sports programs LOSE MONEY, big time. Especially with the bizarre requirements of Title IX, which requires multiple wimmin's sports about which no one but the players, coaches, and their parents gives a shit?
They still don't care about girls or women's sports.

For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness,

I care about fairness.
No you don't or you would require that all competitors come from the same social/economical background, are all the same height, weight and have the same exact muscle mass.


Some basketball players have acromegaly, a hormonal condition that results in very large hands and feet. This condition is surely a genetic advantage in the sport, but players with acromegaly are not banned.
Some doctors speculate that Olympic swimmer Michael Phelps has Marfan syndrome, a genetic condition that results in the long, flexible arms and legs that made Phelps such a force in the pool. Major league baseball players tend to have extraordinary eyesight, which allows them to see the seams on a tiny ball hurtling toward them at high speeds and hit it with greater success than those with poorer vision.
In all these ways, sports aren't fair and yet, these types of inequalities are not just acceptable, but mostly unnoticed. For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness, but the need to protect and reinforce the idea of gender itself.


YOur excuses for pretending to not understand that boys and girls are different, is well done.


Letting girls compete against girls, gives athletic girls a "fair" chance. Yes, not all girls have a shot, but some of them do.


Putting boys in the mix, takes that away from them.
They aren't boys. They are trans girls. Read up on Renee Richards.

Boys are boys. Girls are girls. People with mental problems don't magically change.
Transgendered individuals are not "people with mental problems". It is the 21st century. Some "boys and girls" were born into the wrong body. Fortunately, science can fix that for them and even more fortunately they are getting more support for it from family and friends.

Just another issue where the right wingers are on the wrong side of history.

Funny how that increased support doesn't seem to decrease their suicide attempts.


That Tide of History you feel so good about being on the side of? It's called "Decline and Fall".
You find suicide funny?

Actually, increased support does lead to fewer suicides.


Results
Among trans Ontarians, 35.1 % (95 % CI: 27.6, 42.5) seriously considered, and 11.2 % (95 % CI: 6.0, 16.4) attempted, suicide in the past year. Social support, reduced transphobia, and having any personal identification documents changed to an appropriate sex designation were associated with large relative and absolute reductions in suicide risk, as was completing a medical transition through hormones and/or surgeries (when needed). Parental support for gender identity was associated with reduced ideation. Lower self-reported transphobia (10th versus 90th percentile) was associated with a 66 % reduction in ideation (RR = 0.34, 95 % CI: 0.17, 0.67), and an additional 76 % reduction in attempts among those with ideation (RR = 0.24; 95 % CI: 0.07, 0.82). This corresponds to potential prevention of 160 ideations per 1000 trans persons, and 200 attempts per 1,000 with ideation, based on a hypothetical reduction of transphobia from current levels to the 10th percentile.​
Conclusions
Large effect sizes were observed for this controlled analysis of intervenable factors, suggesting that interventions to increase social inclusion and access to medical transition, and to reduce transphobia, have the potential to contribute to substantial reductions in the extremely high prevalences of suicide ideation and attempts within trans populations. Such interventions at the population level may require policy change.​

First study I've heard of that claims that. We will see if it stands up over time.
You read a lot of studies about transgender issues do you? Well, you’re missing a lot of them.



Can't be bothered to do counter research. I withdraw the point.
There is no counter research. It’s simple logic. If you accept and love your trans child, they are going to be less likely to want to commit suicide, duh. Some parents have to decide do they want a dead son or a live daughter.
It’s probably not a choice children should be making. How about they love who they are?
They can’t love who they are until they can become their true selves.

It really does often come down to a parent having to decide whether they want a live daughter or a dead son (or vice versa).
They should be able to. Lots of kids in wheelchairs want to walk, but they can still be happy.
Hopefully you will never have to find out it’s not the same. Kids try and cut their own penises off.
And what’s different? Lots of kids deal with things that they can not do. Cutting a pen is off doesn’t make a boy a girl. Seems they aren’t getting the correct treatment if they would do that.
The difference is that these children know they were born as the wrong gender.
Cutting their penises off is what kids do when not supported in their desire to transition.

The problem is parents don’t get their children treatment. They tell him to “knock it off” and just “be a boy” or “be a girl”. Oh, and the treatment that will be recommended by actual medical professionals will not be one that you agree with I’m sure...
Children don’t know much of anything. I know younger kids that want to grow up to be dinosaurs. It seems like a decision that is not for children. I mean kids aren’t treated the same as adults for crimes. I’m pretty sure that is justified as kids make a lot of mistakes.

I don’t see how playing girls sports is going to be the thing to save anyone.
These kids DO know. It’s not a game or a phase they grow out of. It’s OK. Some people (mostly Republicans) can’t or will not try to understand it unless it touches them personally.

And at what age? And ruining girls sports is the only thing keeping them from cutting the penis off?
No, support from community and family keeps them from self mutilation and suicide. Sports are often important in a community.

Yes or no, there are benefits to children participating in sports.
Yes. I don't know what the answer is, but it's not allowing men's bodies to compete against women's athletically where size and such matter.
No, what you think the answer is is to allow men to compete against women athletically. We know this, because you voted for it. And you keep making excuses for "Biden isn't a bad person; he just does bad things. Oh, he signs executive orders to do things, but he doesn't REALLY believe those things. He isn't what he does; he's what I need to believe he is in order to not own what my vote for him makes me."

Lie to yourself all you like, but don't lie to us and expect it to be anything but laughed at.
 

Brain357

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I gotta say that is fucking hilarious, Not what happened to the girls but when it happened. 2017 and 2019. But it's Biden's EO in 2021 that destroyed them?

On the issue, I think girls should be able to move up in class and compete with the boys but not the other way around.
I do love that as of 1/19/2020....you couldn't get two guys anywhere in the world to discuss women's /girls sports. Regardless of the dude's political leanings, their race, color, creed, age, etc. There was no place in the universe where two men gave a collective single shit about women's sports.

But now...we have like 12 threads on it and right wing mouth breathing knuckle draggers are acting like they care.

This is how the rightwing really feels:

From 2010:

...The vast majority of college sports programs LOSE MONEY, big time. Especially with the bizarre requirements of Title IX, which requires multiple wimmin's sports about which no one but the players, coaches, and their parents gives a shit?
They still don't care about girls or women's sports.

For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness,

I care about fairness.
No you don't or you would require that all competitors come from the same social/economical background, are all the same height, weight and have the same exact muscle mass.


Some basketball players have acromegaly, a hormonal condition that results in very large hands and feet. This condition is surely a genetic advantage in the sport, but players with acromegaly are not banned.
Some doctors speculate that Olympic swimmer Michael Phelps has Marfan syndrome, a genetic condition that results in the long, flexible arms and legs that made Phelps such a force in the pool. Major league baseball players tend to have extraordinary eyesight, which allows them to see the seams on a tiny ball hurtling toward them at high speeds and hit it with greater success than those with poorer vision.
In all these ways, sports aren't fair and yet, these types of inequalities are not just acceptable, but mostly unnoticed. For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness, but the need to protect and reinforce the idea of gender itself.


YOur excuses for pretending to not understand that boys and girls are different, is well done.


Letting girls compete against girls, gives athletic girls a "fair" chance. Yes, not all girls have a shot, but some of them do.


Putting boys in the mix, takes that away from them.
They aren't boys. They are trans girls. Read up on Renee Richards.

Boys are boys. Girls are girls. People with mental problems don't magically change.
Transgendered individuals are not "people with mental problems". It is the 21st century. Some "boys and girls" were born into the wrong body. Fortunately, science can fix that for them and even more fortunately they are getting more support for it from family and friends.

Just another issue where the right wingers are on the wrong side of history.

Funny how that increased support doesn't seem to decrease their suicide attempts.


That Tide of History you feel so good about being on the side of? It's called "Decline and Fall".
You find suicide funny?

Actually, increased support does lead to fewer suicides.


Results
Among trans Ontarians, 35.1 % (95 % CI: 27.6, 42.5) seriously considered, and 11.2 % (95 % CI: 6.0, 16.4) attempted, suicide in the past year. Social support, reduced transphobia, and having any personal identification documents changed to an appropriate sex designation were associated with large relative and absolute reductions in suicide risk, as was completing a medical transition through hormones and/or surgeries (when needed). Parental support for gender identity was associated with reduced ideation. Lower self-reported transphobia (10th versus 90th percentile) was associated with a 66 % reduction in ideation (RR = 0.34, 95 % CI: 0.17, 0.67), and an additional 76 % reduction in attempts among those with ideation (RR = 0.24; 95 % CI: 0.07, 0.82). This corresponds to potential prevention of 160 ideations per 1000 trans persons, and 200 attempts per 1,000 with ideation, based on a hypothetical reduction of transphobia from current levels to the 10th percentile.​
Conclusions
Large effect sizes were observed for this controlled analysis of intervenable factors, suggesting that interventions to increase social inclusion and access to medical transition, and to reduce transphobia, have the potential to contribute to substantial reductions in the extremely high prevalences of suicide ideation and attempts within trans populations. Such interventions at the population level may require policy change.​

First study I've heard of that claims that. We will see if it stands up over time.
You read a lot of studies about transgender issues do you? Well, you’re missing a lot of them.



Can't be bothered to do counter research. I withdraw the point.
There is no counter research. It’s simple logic. If you accept and love your trans child, they are going to be less likely to want to commit suicide, duh. Some parents have to decide do they want a dead son or a live daughter.
It’s probably not a choice children should be making. How about they love who they are?
They can’t love who they are until they can become their true selves.

It really does often come down to a parent having to decide whether they want a live daughter or a dead son (or vice versa).
They should be able to. Lots of kids in wheelchairs want to walk, but they can still be happy.
Hopefully you will never have to find out it’s not the same. Kids try and cut their own penises off.
And what’s different? Lots of kids deal with things that they can not do. Cutting a pen is off doesn’t make a boy a girl. Seems they aren’t getting the correct treatment if they would do that.
The difference is that these children know they were born as the wrong gender.
Cutting their penises off is what kids do when not supported in their desire to transition.

The problem is parents don’t get their children treatment. They tell him to “knock it off” and just “be a boy” or “be a girl”. Oh, and the treatment that will be recommended by actual medical professionals will not be one that you agree with I’m sure...
Children don’t know much of anything. I know younger kids that want to grow up to be dinosaurs. It seems like a decision that is not for children. I mean kids aren’t treated the same as adults for crimes. I’m pretty sure that is justified as kids make a lot of mistakes.

I don’t see how playing girls sports is going to be the thing to save anyone.
These kids DO know. It’s not a game or a phase they grow out of. It’s OK. Some people (mostly Republicans) can’t or will not try to understand it unless it touches them personally.

And at what age? And ruining girls sports is the only thing keeping them from cutting the penis off?
No, support from community and family keeps them from self mutilation and suicide. Sports are often important in a community.

Yes or no, there are benefits to children participating in sports.
Yes. I don't know what the answer is, but it's not allowing men's bodies to compete against women's athletically where size and such matter.
No, what you think the answer is is to allow men to compete against women athletically. We know this, because you voted for it. And you keep making excuses for "Biden isn't a bad person; he just does bad things. Oh, he signs executive orders to do things, but he doesn't REALLY believe those things. He isn't what he does; he's what I need to believe he is in order to not own what my vote for him makes me."

Lie to yourself all you like, but don't lie to us and expect it to be anything but laughed at.
That's quite a jump....
 

OldLady

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YOU are also a coward who doesn't have the courage to act on what you pretend to believe.
I'm not a one issue voter. I disagree with this decision and hope it will be straightened out. I don't agree with everything any politician I vote for does. It's how it goes.
 

blackhawk

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Have you noticed it only seems to be transgender males wanting to compete against women and not transgender females wanting to compete against men? Just a wild guess on my part but that might have something to do with transgender males knowing that is a big advantage for them and transgender females knowing it isn't for them.
 

freyasman

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Men do not belong in women's sports.



Alanna Smith's dedication to her sport is profound. Just listening to the elite high school track star explain her training schedule is exhausting. Yet no matter how hard she trains, if she has to compete against biological males, she stands no chance of winning.

"There is simply a biological advantage that males have over females," explained the daughter of baseball Hall of Fame pitcher Lee Smith.

"Here is a perfect example," Smith told me. "I have a twin brother who is an athlete but does not run competitively for his sports. We raced against each other recently, and he beat me. Not because he trained harder, but because there are biological and physical advantages boys have over girls in some sports."

Smith, who set high school and county records as a short-distance track runner the moment she stepped on the field as a freshman at Danbury High School in Connecticut, says when she turns up to compete against male runners who identify and compete as females, she knows the cards are stacked against her.

And it has nothing to do with not being prepared.

"It is frustrating. I spend all of that time training to compete against other girls, and I find myself losing to biological males," she said.

Since 2017, two males who identify as female have taken 15 women's state championship titles in Connecticut. Smith's frustration led her last February to join with two other elite Connecticut runners, Selina Soule and Chelsea Mitchell, to file a federal discrimination complaint against Connecticut's policy allowing transgender competition against females. The girls explained that the suit alleges the policy unfairly marginalized them and violated Title IX, the federal law designed to ensure equal opportunities for females in education and school-based athletics.


On Inauguration Day, President Joe Biden issued an executive order saying a court case about transgender rights applies to Title IX, a federal education law that prevents discrimination based on sex. Elite female athletes such as Smith, Mitchell and Soule say Biden's pro-transgender order underscores their concerns.

Mitchell said she was ranked as the fastest girl in the 55-meter dash in Connecticut high school track in 2019. "Then I went to a high school competition, competing with two biological males who identify as girls," she said. "I really put my all into it, (but) I ultimately came in third, behind the both of them."

Soule said she missed an opportunity to qualify for the New England state championship in 2019 by one spot: "Both spots above me were taken by biological males."

Soule said that two distinct positions can be held about this that don't need to conflict with each other.

"This is not about not being supportive of the transgender community," she asserted. "Not at all. This is about fairness to girls and women. you can effectively hold both points of view."

All three athletes stressed that their objective is even-handedness in women's sports. "Title IX was created for a reason, and that was to give elite female athletes opportunities to be competitive and successful; the very objective was to have fairness in women's sports," said Soule.

Title IX was passed in 1972. In its first 10 years, the number of female athletes had blossomed to over 74,000. By 2020, that number had grown to over 220,000, according to data compiled by the NCAA.

White House press secretary Jen Psaki was one of those elite high school athletes in Connecticut in the mid-1990s who was able to shine because of Title IX as an accomplished swimmer for Greenwich High School, and she earned all-state honors in the backstroke. Psaki went on to swim for two years at William and Mary, an NCAA Division I school that currently gives out approximately 200 athletic scholarships a year, including women's swimming.

A 2020 study by the International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health showed among female and male competitive swimmers, males were increasingly faster than females beginning at the age of 10 years and continuing until the age of 17. In other words, had Psaki -- who was also the captain of the high school swim team -- had to compete against male swimmers who identified as female, her results may have fallen, despite her devotion to competing in her sport.

When asked about Biden's executive order and what the White House message is to the girls being forced to compete in sports against biological males, in particular in high school sports that lead to scholarship opportunities, Psaki said: "The president's belief is that trans rights are human rights, and that's why he signed that executive order. In terms of the determinations by universities and colleges, I would certainly defer to them."
I think it rots that transgender males can compete in some women's sports. Not fair. They're in a male body, male muscle mass and bones.
Then stop voting for people who hate women, like Joe Biden.
LOL Nice try. I think people will figure it out for themselves, given a little time. It's made more complicated when people with a hate-on for transgenders get involved; then it suddenly seems necessary to defend it in order to combat bias. But this isn't about bias. It's about reality.
Your old, demented, white "president" signed this order on his very first day in office, it was a top priority. He hates women, and so do you if you support him.
Oh, STFU. He hates bias. The stupid parts will get worked out, eventually.
You really believe this guy is anything but a corrupt grifter with dementia?

Seriously???
Yup. Really.
Wow....



You know, I work around psych patients regularly ( one of them bit me last night in fact) and almost none of them are as crazy as the people I see posting here.
 

OldLady

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Wow....
You know, I work around psych patients regularly ( one of them bit me last night in fact) and almost none of them are as crazy as the people I see posting here.
You asked me, I told ya. No reason to be insulting about it.
 

Seawytch

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I gotta say that is fucking hilarious, Not what happened to the girls but when it happened. 2017 and 2019. But it's Biden's EO in 2021 that destroyed them?

On the issue, I think girls should be able to move up in class and compete with the boys but not the other way around.
I do love that as of 1/19/2020....you couldn't get two guys anywhere in the world to discuss women's /girls sports. Regardless of the dude's political leanings, their race, color, creed, age, etc. There was no place in the universe where two men gave a collective single shit about women's sports.

But now...we have like 12 threads on it and right wing mouth breathing knuckle draggers are acting like they care.

This is how the rightwing really feels:

From 2010:

...The vast majority of college sports programs LOSE MONEY, big time. Especially with the bizarre requirements of Title IX, which requires multiple wimmin's sports about which no one but the players, coaches, and their parents gives a shit?
They still don't care about girls or women's sports.

For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness,

I care about fairness.
No you don't or you would require that all competitors come from the same social/economical background, are all the same height, weight and have the same exact muscle mass.


Some basketball players have acromegaly, a hormonal condition that results in very large hands and feet. This condition is surely a genetic advantage in the sport, but players with acromegaly are not banned.
Some doctors speculate that Olympic swimmer Michael Phelps has Marfan syndrome, a genetic condition that results in the long, flexible arms and legs that made Phelps such a force in the pool. Major league baseball players tend to have extraordinary eyesight, which allows them to see the seams on a tiny ball hurtling toward them at high speeds and hit it with greater success than those with poorer vision.
In all these ways, sports aren't fair and yet, these types of inequalities are not just acceptable, but mostly unnoticed. For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness, but the need to protect and reinforce the idea of gender itself.


YOur excuses for pretending to not understand that boys and girls are different, is well done.


Letting girls compete against girls, gives athletic girls a "fair" chance. Yes, not all girls have a shot, but some of them do.


Putting boys in the mix, takes that away from them.
They aren't boys. They are trans girls. Read up on Renee Richards.

Boys are boys. Girls are girls. People with mental problems don't magically change.
Transgendered individuals are not "people with mental problems". It is the 21st century. Some "boys and girls" were born into the wrong body. Fortunately, science can fix that for them and even more fortunately they are getting more support for it from family and friends.

Just another issue where the right wingers are on the wrong side of history.

Funny how that increased support doesn't seem to decrease their suicide attempts.


That Tide of History you feel so good about being on the side of? It's called "Decline and Fall".
You find suicide funny?

Actually, increased support does lead to fewer suicides.


Results
Among trans Ontarians, 35.1 % (95 % CI: 27.6, 42.5) seriously considered, and 11.2 % (95 % CI: 6.0, 16.4) attempted, suicide in the past year. Social support, reduced transphobia, and having any personal identification documents changed to an appropriate sex designation were associated with large relative and absolute reductions in suicide risk, as was completing a medical transition through hormones and/or surgeries (when needed). Parental support for gender identity was associated with reduced ideation. Lower self-reported transphobia (10th versus 90th percentile) was associated with a 66 % reduction in ideation (RR = 0.34, 95 % CI: 0.17, 0.67), and an additional 76 % reduction in attempts among those with ideation (RR = 0.24; 95 % CI: 0.07, 0.82). This corresponds to potential prevention of 160 ideations per 1000 trans persons, and 200 attempts per 1,000 with ideation, based on a hypothetical reduction of transphobia from current levels to the 10th percentile.​
Conclusions
Large effect sizes were observed for this controlled analysis of intervenable factors, suggesting that interventions to increase social inclusion and access to medical transition, and to reduce transphobia, have the potential to contribute to substantial reductions in the extremely high prevalences of suicide ideation and attempts within trans populations. Such interventions at the population level may require policy change.​

First study I've heard of that claims that. We will see if it stands up over time.
You read a lot of studies about transgender issues do you? Well, you’re missing a lot of them.



Can't be bothered to do counter research. I withdraw the point.
There is no counter research. It’s simple logic. If you accept and love your trans child, they are going to be less likely to want to commit suicide, duh. Some parents have to decide do they want a dead son or a live daughter.
It’s probably not a choice children should be making. How about they love who they are?
They can’t love who they are until they can become their true selves.

It really does often come down to a parent having to decide whether they want a live daughter or a dead son (or vice versa).
They should be able to. Lots of kids in wheelchairs want to walk, but they can still be happy.
Hopefully you will never have to find out it’s not the same. Kids try and cut their own penises off.
And what’s different? Lots of kids deal with things that they can not do. Cutting a pen is off doesn’t make a boy a girl. Seems they aren’t getting the correct treatment if they would do that.
The difference is that these children know they were born as the wrong gender.
Cutting their penises off is what kids do when not supported in their desire to transition.

The problem is parents don’t get their children treatment. They tell him to “knock it off” and just “be a boy” or “be a girl”. Oh, and the treatment that will be recommended by actual medical professionals will not be one that you agree with I’m sure...
Children don’t know much of anything. I know younger kids that want to grow up to be dinosaurs. It seems like a decision that is not for children. I mean kids aren’t treated the same as adults for crimes. I’m pretty sure that is justified as kids make a lot of mistakes.

I don’t see how playing girls sports is going to be the thing to save anyone.
These kids DO know. It’s not a game or a phase they grow out of. It’s OK. Some people (mostly Republicans) can’t or will not try to understand it unless it touches them personally.

And at what age? And ruining girls sports is the only thing keeping them from cutting the penis off?
No, support from community and family keeps them from self mutilation and suicide. Sports are often important in a community.

Yes or no, there are benefits to children participating in sports.
Why does it matter if they participate in boys or girls? It's sports either way. Much of the benefits are from FAIR sports. That's why there are so many rules.
Because they are girls. They would get bullied to no end if they had to play on a boys team.

You think she should be changing in the men's locker room?

1614225849615.png


What about this guy? He should wrestle with girls and use the girls locker room?

1614225986938.png
 

Seawytch

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I gotta say that is fucking hilarious, Not what happened to the girls but when it happened. 2017 and 2019. But it's Biden's EO in 2021 that destroyed them?

On the issue, I think girls should be able to move up in class and compete with the boys but not the other way around.
I do love that as of 1/19/2020....you couldn't get two guys anywhere in the world to discuss women's /girls sports. Regardless of the dude's political leanings, their race, color, creed, age, etc. There was no place in the universe where two men gave a collective single shit about women's sports.

But now...we have like 12 threads on it and right wing mouth breathing knuckle draggers are acting like they care.

This is how the rightwing really feels:

From 2010:

...The vast majority of college sports programs LOSE MONEY, big time. Especially with the bizarre requirements of Title IX, which requires multiple wimmin's sports about which no one but the players, coaches, and their parents gives a shit?
They still don't care about girls or women's sports.

For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness,

I care about fairness.
No you don't or you would require that all competitors come from the same social/economical background, are all the same height, weight and have the same exact muscle mass.


Some basketball players have acromegaly, a hormonal condition that results in very large hands and feet. This condition is surely a genetic advantage in the sport, but players with acromegaly are not banned.
Some doctors speculate that Olympic swimmer Michael Phelps has Marfan syndrome, a genetic condition that results in the long, flexible arms and legs that made Phelps such a force in the pool. Major league baseball players tend to have extraordinary eyesight, which allows them to see the seams on a tiny ball hurtling toward them at high speeds and hit it with greater success than those with poorer vision.
In all these ways, sports aren't fair and yet, these types of inequalities are not just acceptable, but mostly unnoticed. For those like Republican legislators in Montana and other states, the real reason for clinging to the necessity of gender testing isn't about fairness, but the need to protect and reinforce the idea of gender itself.


YOur excuses for pretending to not understand that boys and girls are different, is well done.


Letting girls compete against girls, gives athletic girls a "fair" chance. Yes, not all girls have a shot, but some of them do.


Putting boys in the mix, takes that away from them.
They aren't boys. They are trans girls. Read up on Renee Richards.

Boys are boys. Girls are girls. People with mental problems don't magically change.
Transgendered individuals are not "people with mental problems". It is the 21st century. Some "boys and girls" were born into the wrong body. Fortunately, science can fix that for them and even more fortunately they are getting more support for it from family and friends.

Just another issue where the right wingers are on the wrong side of history.

Funny how that increased support doesn't seem to decrease their suicide attempts.


That Tide of History you feel so good about being on the side of? It's called "Decline and Fall".
You find suicide funny?

Actually, increased support does lead to fewer suicides.


Results
Among trans Ontarians, 35.1 % (95 % CI: 27.6, 42.5) seriously considered, and 11.2 % (95 % CI: 6.0, 16.4) attempted, suicide in the past year. Social support, reduced transphobia, and having any personal identification documents changed to an appropriate sex designation were associated with large relative and absolute reductions in suicide risk, as was completing a medical transition through hormones and/or surgeries (when needed). Parental support for gender identity was associated with reduced ideation. Lower self-reported transphobia (10th versus 90th percentile) was associated with a 66 % reduction in ideation (RR = 0.34, 95 % CI: 0.17, 0.67), and an additional 76 % reduction in attempts among those with ideation (RR = 0.24; 95 % CI: 0.07, 0.82). This corresponds to potential prevention of 160 ideations per 1000 trans persons, and 200 attempts per 1,000 with ideation, based on a hypothetical reduction of transphobia from current levels to the 10th percentile.​
Conclusions
Large effect sizes were observed for this controlled analysis of intervenable factors, suggesting that interventions to increase social inclusion and access to medical transition, and to reduce transphobia, have the potential to contribute to substantial reductions in the extremely high prevalences of suicide ideation and attempts within trans populations. Such interventions at the population level may require policy change.​

First study I've heard of that claims that. We will see if it stands up over time.
You read a lot of studies about transgender issues do you? Well, you’re missing a lot of them.



Can't be bothered to do counter research. I withdraw the point.
There is no counter research. It’s simple logic. If you accept and love your trans child, they are going to be less likely to want to commit suicide, duh. Some parents have to decide do they want a dead son or a live daughter.
It’s probably not a choice children should be making. How about they love who they are?
They can’t love who they are until they can become their true selves.

It really does often come down to a parent having to decide whether they want a live daughter or a dead son (or vice versa).
They should be able to. Lots of kids in wheelchairs want to walk, but they can still be happy.
Hopefully you will never have to find out it’s not the same. Kids try and cut their own penises off.
And what’s different? Lots of kids deal with things that they can not do. Cutting a pen is off doesn’t make a boy a girl. Seems they aren’t getting the correct treatment if they would do that.
The difference is that these children know they were born as the wrong gender.
Cutting their penises off is what kids do when not supported in their desire to transition.

The problem is parents don’t get their children treatment. They tell him to “knock it off” and just “be a boy” or “be a girl”. Oh, and the treatment that will be recommended by actual medical professionals will not be one that you agree with I’m sure...
Children don’t know much of anything. I know younger kids that want to grow up to be dinosaurs. It seems like a decision that is not for children. I mean kids aren’t treated the same as adults for crimes. I’m pretty sure that is justified as kids make a lot of mistakes.

I don’t see how playing girls sports is going to be the thing to save anyone.
These kids DO know. It’s not a game or a phase they grow out of. It’s OK. Some people (mostly Republicans) can’t or will not try to understand it unless it touches them personally.

And at what age? And ruining girls sports is the only thing keeping them from cutting the penis off?
No, support from community and family keeps them from self mutilation and suicide. Sports are often important in a community.

Yes or no, there are benefits to children participating in sports.
Why does it matter if they participate in boys or girls? It's sports either way. Much of the benefits are from FAIR sports. That's why there are so many rules.
Nobody really cares if it is fair. Stop kidding yourself. As stated previously, some people are born with attributes that make them better natural athletes. Nobody proposes banning them from a sport. Social and economical advantages give athletes a leg up all the time but nobody proposes "leveling the playing field" where they are concerned. There ARE cisgendered women who are stronger or faster or have a better sky hook. Womens sports are not in danger from this tiny minority community.
 

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