Better to be murdered by an NRA gun nut, not an illegal alien

[Sun Devil 92]

We object to any murder that can easily had been avoided due to government policies. We release too many thugs from prisons, we don't lock up deranged mentally ill, and we allow criminal illegal aliens into our country. All because of bleeding heart liberal policies in our justice system.

Oh right, it's liberals' fault. I understand you'd rather blame liberals for the crimes committed by the weapons mongering, NRA supporting gun fanatics in the US. Somehow it's always the fault of the leftists for denanding that we regulate guns in our cities.

If according to you there should be no illegal immigrants in the US, then I demand that there should be no gun murders in the US either. When you stop the gun related murders in the US, then I will agree to your demands to having 0 illegal immigrants in the US.

Go ahead and prevent 100% of preventable murders first, then we will go ahead and offer you 100% illegl-free United States.

Is this a deal?

No.....

Murder is illegal....

So are these people....

You want to make a deal to finally enforce laws.....

Go have sex with yourself.

 

[Brain357]

We object to any murder that can easily had been avoided due to government policies. We release too many thugs from prisons, we don't lock up deranged mentally ill, and we allow criminal illegal aliens into our country. All because of bleeding heart liberal policies in our justice system.

The US has a murder rate that is FOUR TIMES higher than the murder rates in other first world countries.

List of countries by intentional homicide rate - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

According to wikipedia

The USA 4.7 per 100,000
The UK 1.0
Spain 0.8
France 1.0
Germany 0.8
Austria 0.9
Switzerland 0.6
Sweden 0.7
Norway 2.2
Australia 1.1
Holland 0.9
New Zealand 0.9
Iceland 0.3
Canada 1.6

All countries who have a comparable economic situation.

So why is the US more than double the highest of these countries? What is going wrong?

I mean, many of these countries liberals are more left wing, policies in these countries are generally more left wing. And yet murder rates are lower.
Some of these countries even have guns, to a certain extent. Not like the US, but guns are still there.

So, what is going on in the US?

The US, richest country in the world, with an education system which is good for the rich and poor for the poor. Ghettos in inner cities that help keep a cycle of poverty, and still no one really seems to care too much. Opportunities are often far away for those in the inner cities, they're simply told that everyone can make it. Whereas in other countries governments are pro-active and they see the results of this. Whereas the in the US everyone can always deflect the blame (as will no doubt happen in reply to this post) and nothing will ever happen.

One example of this was Jamie Oliver's TV program where he went to a school in a place which has a high level of obesity, and he attempted to change attitudes to eating in schools. He was told he'd have to prove that his project worked before anyone would go near it. He couldn't prove it would work until he implemented it. But he can't implement it until he's proven it. He can't prove it until he's implemented it. He can't implement it until he's proven it.

Then it gets worse. Michelle Obama says kids should be restricted to one ketchup sachet per school meal and the right go nuts. They think that kids have a right to eat as many as they like at school.

Forget teaching kids about healthy eating. Forget trying to solve a major obesity problem. No, simply attack anyone who tries to tell you that what you're doing (in ignorance) is not good for you.

How is anything ever going to change and get better which such an attitude?

You do realize that Americana use guns to stop violent criminal attack 2 million times a year...right? And that gun mureders are going down, not up as more Americans own and Cary guns ...right?

and criminals in Europe get fully automatic rifles and 30 round magazines easily...as they do in .france, Belgium, Denmark and Sweden...right...that they don't use them in crimes is cultural and has nothing to do with accessibility...since their criminals get guns as easily as ours,do...right?

and that mass shootings inEurope, when they happen are far worse than they are here...right? because no one over there is armed except for the criminals ...and a lot of the time not even the police have guns...like in Norway and France......

2 million is a made up number supported by nothing in reality. Based on what we know it's not even mathematically possible.

 

[2aguy]

Brain..you come back and just start lying...you know that number comes from actual research into self defense with guns...over a 40 year period by different researchers, both private and public.....many of whom are rabidly anti gun........

and just this week there have been defenses where no shots were fired or the criminals were simply injured or captured........so lying isn't going to change the truth, or reality....

 

[Vigilante]

CONS get angry only when the murderer is illegal.

If youre going to say ridiculous shit like this in an intelligent discussion, why should anyone listen to anything you have to say?

I enjoy exposing RWers' hypocrisy. They want democratic government to protect all its citizens in Benghazi and in San Francisco.

When 240 marines die while President Reagan was in charge, cons are perfectly happy to brush aside that event by shrugging off.

Listen con, you can watch Fox nuse if you don't like my posts here. All I know is RW hypocrisy is too easy to expose. I hope you guys continue to send Palin and Bachmann to run for president against their formidable democratic rivals. We need the entertainment every night.

No, you horse's ass, we on the right get mad at all murder...ESPECIALLY BLACK THUGERY MURDER that your president hasn't said shit about or even investigated it... But let it be one demented white boy killing blacks, and the SHTF!

Chicago Has Had More Than 12,000 Shootings Since 2010 (MAP)

DNAinfo.com ^ | July 7, 2015 | Tanveer Ali
CHICAGO LAWN — When Marshall Hawkins walks around his neighborhood, he carefully picks a route based on the places where people haven't been shot. "If there are flowers on the block, you can go there," the 38-year-old said. "If there's been police tape or gunshots, you avoid it." Such is life for the former North Sider in his adopted Chicago Lawn neighborhood. Same for his kids: 5 and 7. "On days that I can't pick them up and drive them to school, I give specific directions. 'Don't take this street. Go this way. Not that way,' " Hawkins said.

 

[Brain357]

Brain..you come back and just start lying...you know that number comes from actual research into self defense with guns...over a 40 year period by different researchers, both private and public.....many of whom are rabidly anti gun........

and just this week there have been defenses where no shots were fired or the criminals were simply injured or captured........so lying isn't going to change the truth, or reality....

I know that a survey is not REALITY. I know that the vast majority of gun studies say it is less than 2 million. I know that only like 50 defenses make the news each year. I know only about 230 criminals are killed in defense each year. I know the NCVS says there are about 108k and it is a MUCH larger survey than any of the gun surveys. And I know your favorite gun surveys have all been debunked many times over. Sorry, but no lying here. REALITY doesn't support your claim, neither do your own gun studies. The two studies with the largest numbers are a joke. One you can't even prove exists and the other wasn't even a national study.

 

[auditor0007]

We object to any murder that can easily had been avoided due to government policies. We release too many thugs from prisons, we don't lock up deranged mentally ill, and we allow criminal illegal aliens into our country. All because of bleeding heart liberal policies in our justice system.

Of course we all know that illegal aliens have only entered this country under Democratic administrations. No illegal aliens ever entered this country as Nixon, Ford, Reagan, GH Bush or GW Bush were in office. You guys kill me.

 

[AvgGuyIA]

Judging from the RWers reaction to the murder in SF, it seems that they would be "happier" if murders were committed by legal US citizen NRA members who exercise their second amendment rights and use a weapon to kill other people.

It seems the RWers are very angry that the murder in SF was committed by an illegal alien. I didn't know that there are "good murderers" and "bad murderers" in this world.

RWers ignore NRA gun nuts committing murders. They only get extremely agitated when the murderer is in the US illegally.

NRA gun nut murderers? You're nuts.

In the meantime, everyone please sign the Kate's Law petition to put illegals convicted of a crime in jail for 5 years if deported and they return. Go to. www,billoreilly.com and sign the petition. Thanks

 

[2aguy]

We object to any murder that can easily had been avoided due to government policies. We release too many thugs from prisons, we don't lock up deranged mentally ill, and we allow criminal illegal aliens into our country. All because of bleeding heart liberal policies in our justice system.

Of course we all know that illegal aliens have only entered this country under Democratic administrations. No illegal aliens ever entered this country as Nixon, Ford, Reagan, GH Bush or GW Bush were in office. You guys kill me.

Yeah you guys lied to Reagan to when he did the amnesty...he did the amnesty and the lefties in congress did not hold up their end of the agreement....never, ever trust a lefty....

 

[2aguy]

Brain..you come back and just start lying...you know that number comes from actual research into self defense with guns...over a 40 year period by different researchers, both private and public.....many of whom are rabidly anti gun........

and just this week there have been defenses where no shots were fired or the criminals were simply injured or captured........so lying isn't going to change the truth, or reality....

I know that a survey is not REALITY. I know that the vast majority of gun studies say it is less than 2 million. I know that only like 50 defenses make the news each year. I know only about 230 criminals are killed in defense each year. I know the NCVS says there are about 108k and it is a MUCH larger survey than any of the gun surveys. And I know your favorite gun surveys have all been debunked many times over. Sorry, but no lying here. REALITY doesn't support your claim, neither do your own gun studies. The two studies with the largest numbers are a joke. One you can't even prove exists and the other wasn't even a national study.

The average of gun studies that do not include police or military is 2 million times a year.

Really...you only count as real the gun self defense stories that make it to the evening news...what a moron.

230 criminals shot does not include the criminals driven off, shot and merely injured or those held by the gun owner till police arrived...you stupidity has grown tiresome.....

And to that point...the National Crime Victimization Survey never directly asks about guns...not once...it is in fact not a gun self defense study at all...and has been shown to be innaccurate in the areas it is supposed to study such as rape and sexual assault......

So you cite the numbers of a study that is not a study of gun self defense and then claim that that is the accurate number for self defense uses of a gun... vs .......40 years of actual research by economists and criminologists specifically looking at guns used in self defense...

Again...you anti gun stupidity is really old brain.....

 

[2aguy]

Judging from the RWers reaction to the murder in SF, it seems that they would be "happier" if murders were committed by legal US citizen NRA members who exercise their second amendment rights and use a weapon to kill other people.

It seems the RWers are very angry that the murder in SF was committed by an illegal alien. I didn't know that there are "good murderers" and "bad murderers" in this world.

RWers ignore NRA gun nuts committing murders. They only get extremely agitated when the murderer is in the US illegally.

NRA gun nut murderers? You're nuts.

In the meantime, everyone please sign the Kate's Law petition to put illegals convicted of a crime in jail for 5 years if deported and they return. Go to. www,billoreilly.com and sign the petition. Thanks

Why only 5 years......but I will go and sign it.........someone has to do something to stop this madness....

 

[2aguy]

Brain..you come back and just start lying...you know that number comes from actual research into self defense with guns...over a 40 year period by different researchers, both private and public.....many of whom are rabidly anti gun........

and just this week there have been defenses where no shots were fired or the criminals were simply injured or captured........so lying isn't going to change the truth, or reality....

I know that a survey is not REALITY. I know that the vast majority of gun studies say it is less than 2 million. I know that only like 50 defenses make the news each year. I know only about 230 criminals are killed in defense each year. I know the NCVS says there are about 108k and it is a MUCH larger survey than any of the gun surveys. And I know your favorite gun surveys have all been debunked many times over. Sorry, but no lying here. REALITY doesn't support your claim, neither do your own gun studies. The two studies with the largest numbers are a joke. One you can't even prove exists and the other wasn't even a national study.

Here is the truth about the NCVS ....

National Crime Victimization Survey A new report finds that the Justice Department has been undercounting instances of rape and sexual assault.

And another reason to not use the NCVS...they can't even count those things they are actually studying correctly, let alone something like guns that they aren't actually studying...

National Crime Victimization Survey A new report finds that the Justice Department has been undercounting instances of rape and sexual assault.

How helpful, then, that the Justice Department asked the National Research Council (part of the National Academies, which also includes the National Academy of Sciences and the Institute of Medicine) to study how successfully the federal government measures rape. The answer has just arrived, in a report out Tuesday with the headline from the press release: “The National Crime Victimization Survey Is Likely Undercounting Rape and Sexual Assault.” We’re not talking about small fractions—we’re talking about the kind of potentially massive underestimate that the military and the Justice Department have warned about for years—and that could be throwing a wrench into the effort to do the most effective type of rape prevention.....

But here are the flaws that call the nice-sounding stats into doubt: The NCVS is designed to measure all kinds of crime victimization. The questions it poses about sexual violence are embedded among questions that ask about lots of other types of crime. For example:

So......the NCVS can't get an accurate account of what it is researching....how do we know this...the numbers are off...

There is, in fact, an existing survey that has many of the attributes the NCVS currently lacks. It’s administered by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, and it’s called the National Intimate Partner and Sexual Violence Survey. (NISVS is the acronym. Apologies for the alphabet soup.)

NISVS “represents the public health perspective,” as Tuesday’s report puts it, and it asks questions about specific behavior, including whether the survey-taker was unable to consent to sex because he or she had been drinking or taking drugs. NISVS was first conducted in 2010, so it doesn’t go back in time the way the NCVS numbers do. But here’s the startling direct comparison between the two measures: NISVS counted 1.27 million total sexual acts of forced penetration for women over the past year (including completed, attempted, and alcohol or drug facilitated).

NCVS counted only 188,380 for rape and sexual assault. And the FBI, which collects its data from local law enforcement, and so only counts rapes and attempted rapes that have been reported as crimes, totaled only 85,593 for 2010.

So no....the NCVS is not a tool to understand the use of guns for self defense..........And the most obvious point.......they undercount rape and sexual assault by a vast number compared to an actual study that researches rape and sexual assault....using the same method the anti gunners claim for the number of gun defenses....

But here’s the startling direct comparison between the two measures: NISVS counted 1.27 million total sexual acts of forced penetration for women over the past year (including completed, attempted, and alcohol or drug facilitated).

NCVS counted only 188,380 for rape and sexual assault.

So this study, which isn't a gun study...is the one you rely on for truth.....

 

[2aguy]

Brain..you come back and just start lying...you know that number comes from actual research into self defense with guns...over a 40 year period by different researchers, both private and public.....many of whom are rabidly anti gun........

and just this week there have been defenses where no shots were fired or the criminals were simply injured or captured........so lying isn't going to change the truth, or reality....

I know that a survey is not REALITY. I know that the vast majority of gun studies say it is less than 2 million. I know that only like 50 defenses make the news each year. I know only about 230 criminals are killed in defense each year. I know the NCVS says there are about 108k and it is a MUCH larger survey than any of the gun surveys. And I know your favorite gun surveys have all been debunked many times over. Sorry, but no lying here. REALITY doesn't support your claim, neither do your own gun studies. The two studies with the largest numbers are a joke. One you can't even prove exists and the other wasn't even a national study.

For those interested...the actual studies on gun self defense....

I just averaged the studies......which were conducted by different researchers, from both private and public researchers, over a period of 40 years looking specifically at guns and self defense....the name of the researcher is first, then the year then the number of times they determined guns were used for self defense......notice how many of them there are and how many of them were done by gun grabbers like the clinton Justice Dept. and the obama CDC

And these aren't all of the studies either...there are more...and they support the ones below.....

A quick guide to the studies and the numbers.....the full lay out of what was studied by each study is in the links....
GunCite-Gun Control-How Often Are Guns Used in Self-Defense

GunCite Frequency of Defensive Gun Use in Previous Surveys

Field...1976....3,052,717 ( no cops, military)
DMIa 1978...2,141,512 ( no cops, military)
L.A. TIMES...1994...3,609,68 ( no cops, military)
Kleck...2.5 million ( no cops, military)

Obama's CDC....2013....500,000--3million

--------------------


Bordua...1977...1,414,544

DMIb...1978...1,098,409 ( no cops, military)

Hart...1981...1.797,461 ( no cops, military)

Mauser...1990...1,487,342 ( no cops, military)

Gallup...1993...1,621,377 ( no cops, military)

DEPT. OF JUSTICE...1994...1.5 million

Journal of Quantitative Criminology--- 989,883 times per year."
-------------------------------------------
Ohio...1982...771,043

Gallup...1991...777,152

Tarrance... 1994... 764,036 (no cops, military)

Lawerence Southwich Jr. 400,000 fewer violent crimes and at least 800,000 violent crimes deterred..
*****************************************
If you take the studies from that Kleck cites in his paper, 16 of them....and you only average the ones that exclude military and police shootings..the average becomes 2 million...I use those studies because I have the details on them...and they are still 10 studies (including Kleck's)....

 

[Brain357]

Brain..you come back and just start lying...you know that number comes from actual research into self defense with guns...over a 40 year period by different researchers, both private and public.....many of whom are rabidly anti gun........

and just this week there have been defenses where no shots were fired or the criminals were simply injured or captured........so lying isn't going to change the truth, or reality....

I know that a survey is not REALITY. I know that the vast majority of gun studies say it is less than 2 million. I know that only like 50 defenses make the news each year. I know only about 230 criminals are killed in defense each year. I know the NCVS says there are about 108k and it is a MUCH larger survey than any of the gun surveys. And I know your favorite gun surveys have all been debunked many times over. Sorry, but no lying here. REALITY doesn't support your claim, neither do your own gun studies. The two studies with the largest numbers are a joke. One you can't even prove exists and the other wasn't even a national study.

The average of gun studies that do not include police or military is 2 million times a year.

Really...you only count as real the gun self defense stories that make it to the evening news...what a moron.

230 criminals shot does not include the criminals driven off, shot and merely injured or those held by the gun owner till police arrived...you stupidity has grown tiresome.....

And to that point...the National Crime Victimization Survey never directly asks about guns...not once...it is in fact not a gun self defense study at all...and has been shown to be innaccurate in the areas it is supposed to study such as rape and sexual assault......

So you cite the numbers of a study that is not a study of gun self defense and then claim that that is the accurate number for self defense uses of a gun... vs .......40 years of actual research by economists and criminologists specifically looking at guns used in self defense...

Again...you anti gun stupidity is really old brain.....

Stupidity is believing in surveys when EVERYTHING from reality says your number is crazy. Where is your support from REALITY? All you have are surveys. Are you aware surveys are often very wrong? Heck your own gun surveys vary from 500k to 3.5 million. That proves they are not accurate. And what sort of idiot just averages them all? 11 of your 16 surveys say it is less than 2 million but because you have 2 completely ridiculous surveys the average is 2 million. Using the median value at least would be less of a joke.

Show me mathematically how your claim is even possible. I have already proven it is not.

 

[2aguy]

Brain..you come back and just start lying...you know that number comes from actual research into self defense with guns...over a 40 year period by different researchers, both private and public.....many of whom are rabidly anti gun........

and just this week there have been defenses where no shots were fired or the criminals were simply injured or captured........so lying isn't going to change the truth, or reality....

I know that a survey is not REALITY. I know that the vast majority of gun studies say it is less than 2 million. I know that only like 50 defenses make the news each year. I know only about 230 criminals are killed in defense each year. I know the NCVS says there are about 108k and it is a MUCH larger survey than any of the gun surveys. And I know your favorite gun surveys have all been debunked many times over. Sorry, but no lying here. REALITY doesn't support your claim, neither do your own gun studies. The two studies with the largest numbers are a joke. One you can't even prove exists and the other wasn't even a national study.

The average of gun studies that do not include police or military is 2 million times a year.

Really...you only count as real the gun self defense stories that make it to the evening news...what a moron.

230 criminals shot does not include the criminals driven off, shot and merely injured or those held by the gun owner till police arrived...you stupidity has grown tiresome.....

And to that point...the National Crime Victimization Survey never directly asks about guns...not once...it is in fact not a gun self defense study at all...and has been shown to be innaccurate in the areas it is supposed to study such as rape and sexual assault......

So you cite the numbers of a study that is not a study of gun self defense and then claim that that is the accurate number for self defense uses of a gun... vs .......40 years of actual research by economists and criminologists specifically looking at guns used in self defense...

Again...you anti gun stupidity is really old brain.....

Stupidity is believing in surveys when EVERYTHING from reality says your number is crazy. Where is your support from REALITY? All you have are surveys. Are you aware surveys are often very wrong? Heck your own gun surveys vary from 500k to 3.5 million. That proves they are not accurate. And what sort of idiot just averages them all? 11 of your 16 surveys say it is less than 2 million but because you have 2 completely ridiculous surveys the average is 2 million. Using the median value at least would be less of a joke.

Show me mathematically how your claim is even possible. I have already proven it is not.

Pulling numbers out of your ass is not proving they are wrong......40 years, research done by actual professional researchers...16 different studies.... vs brain, the internet gun grabber........

 

[Brain357]

Brain..you come back and just start lying...you know that number comes from actual research into self defense with guns...over a 40 year period by different researchers, both private and public.....many of whom are rabidly anti gun........

and just this week there have been defenses where no shots were fired or the criminals were simply injured or captured........so lying isn't going to change the truth, or reality....

I know that a survey is not REALITY. I know that the vast majority of gun studies say it is less than 2 million. I know that only like 50 defenses make the news each year. I know only about 230 criminals are killed in defense each year. I know the NCVS says there are about 108k and it is a MUCH larger survey than any of the gun surveys. And I know your favorite gun surveys have all been debunked many times over. Sorry, but no lying here. REALITY doesn't support your claim, neither do your own gun studies. The two studies with the largest numbers are a joke. One you can't even prove exists and the other wasn't even a national study.

For those interested...the actual studies on gun self defense....

I just averaged the studies......which were conducted by different researchers, from both private and public researchers, over a period of 40 years looking specifically at guns and self defense....the name of the researcher is first, then the year then the number of times they determined guns were used for self defense......notice how many of them there are and how many of them were done by gun grabbers like the clinton Justice Dept. and the obama CDC

And these aren't all of the studies either...there are more...and they support the ones below.....

A quick guide to the studies and the numbers.....the full lay out of what was studied by each study is in the links....
GunCite-Gun Control-How Often Are Guns Used in Self-Defense

GunCite Frequency of Defensive Gun Use in Previous Surveys

Field...1976....3,052,717 ( no cops, military)
DMIa 1978...2,141,512 ( no cops, military)
L.A. TIMES...1994...3,609,68 ( no cops, military)
Kleck...2.5 million ( no cops, military)

Obama's CDC....2013....500,000--3million

--------------------


Bordua...1977...1,414,544

DMIb...1978...1,098,409 ( no cops, military)

Hart...1981...1.797,461 ( no cops, military)

Mauser...1990...1,487,342 ( no cops, military)

Gallup...1993...1,621,377 ( no cops, military)

DEPT. OF JUSTICE...1994...1.5 million

Journal of Quantitative Criminology--- 989,883 times per year."
-------------------------------------------
Ohio...1982...771,043

Gallup...1991...777,152

Tarrance... 1994... 764,036 (no cops, military)

Lawerence Southwich Jr. 400,000 fewer violent crimes and at least 800,000 violent crimes deterred..
*****************************************
If you take the studies from that Kleck cites in his paper, 16 of them....and you only average the ones that exclude military and police shootings..the average becomes 2 million...I use those studies because I have the details on them...and they are still 10 studies (including Kleck's)....

LA times and Field are your two biggest. Please share your details of the LA Times. Just how many people were surveyed? Are you aware the Field wasn't even a national survey? Are you aware that crime has come down over 30% since the newest of those studies?

 

[Brain357]

Brain..you come back and just start lying...you know that number comes from actual research into self defense with guns...over a 40 year period by different researchers, both private and public.....many of whom are rabidly anti gun........

and just this week there have been defenses where no shots were fired or the criminals were simply injured or captured........so lying isn't going to change the truth, or reality....

I know that a survey is not REALITY. I know that the vast majority of gun studies say it is less than 2 million. I know that only like 50 defenses make the news each year. I know only about 230 criminals are killed in defense each year. I know the NCVS says there are about 108k and it is a MUCH larger survey than any of the gun surveys. And I know your favorite gun surveys have all been debunked many times over. Sorry, but no lying here. REALITY doesn't support your claim, neither do your own gun studies. The two studies with the largest numbers are a joke. One you can't even prove exists and the other wasn't even a national study.

The average of gun studies that do not include police or military is 2 million times a year.

Really...you only count as real the gun self defense stories that make it to the evening news...what a moron.

230 criminals shot does not include the criminals driven off, shot and merely injured or those held by the gun owner till police arrived...you stupidity has grown tiresome.....

And to that point...the National Crime Victimization Survey never directly asks about guns...not once...it is in fact not a gun self defense study at all...and has been shown to be innaccurate in the areas it is supposed to study such as rape and sexual assault......

So you cite the numbers of a study that is not a study of gun self defense and then claim that that is the accurate number for self defense uses of a gun... vs .......40 years of actual research by economists and criminologists specifically looking at guns used in self defense...

Again...you anti gun stupidity is really old brain.....

Stupidity is believing in surveys when EVERYTHING from reality says your number is crazy. Where is your support from REALITY? All you have are surveys. Are you aware surveys are often very wrong? Heck your own gun surveys vary from 500k to 3.5 million. That proves they are not accurate. And what sort of idiot just averages them all? 11 of your 16 surveys say it is less than 2 million but because you have 2 completely ridiculous surveys the average is 2 million. Using the median value at least would be less of a joke.

Show me mathematically how your claim is even possible. I have already proven it is not.

Pulling numbers out of your ass is not proving they are wrong......40 years, research done by actual professional researchers...16 different studies.... vs brain, the internet gun grabber........

11 of those studies say it is under 2 million. That is a big majority. Your own surveys say it is less than 2 million. If surveys are so accurate why such a huge range of numbers? Seems clear they are not accurate...

You can't even prove it is possible mathematically. Wow.

 

[frigidweirdo]

You do realize that Americana use guns to stop violent criminal attack 2 million times a year...right? And that gun mureders are going down, not up as more Americans own and Cary guns ...right?

and criminals in Europe get fully automatic rifles and 30 round magazines easily...as they do in .france, Belgium, Denmark and Sweden...right...that they don't use them in crimes is cultural and has nothing to do with accessibility...since their criminals get guns as easily as ours,do...right?

and that mass shootings inEurope, when they happen are far worse than they are here...right? because no one over there is armed except for the criminals ...and a lot of the time not even the police have guns...like in Norway and France......

Yeah, I do realise that gun murders are going down, and they're still more than 4 times higher than most western countries.

Yes, criminals can get guns in Europe, so why are murder rates much lower?

You say it's cultural, nothing to do with accessibility. I disagree. The culture is based on accessibility. Just because you CAN get something, doesn't mean that accessibility is the same. It probably costs a lot more to get a gun in Europe than in the US. Guns are available through stealing, and other ways, whereas in Europe many have to be imported which causes no end of problems.

Mass shootings are worse over there? Not really. There are hardly mass shootings.

The UK has had two mass shootings in the last 30 years or so. One was Dunblaine (where Andy Murray was at school) and the Cumbrian shootings. 12 people died in Cumbria in 2010 and 16 people died in Dunblaine.

12 people were killed in Aurora in 2012 by James Holmes, 13 in Binghamton in 2009, 10 in Alabama in 2009, in Red Lake in 2005 10 people died, 15 died in Columbine, 33 died in Virginia Tech

The numbers are pretty similar. The highest numbers are into the needs, more or less. There are some exceptions, like Virginia Tech.

Where the difference lies in the number of low level attacks where one or two people are killed.

Let's look at Secondary Schools, it's where kids go through the hardest time and most likely to snap

List of attacks related to secondary schools - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

This has all secondary school attacks, not just shootings, in the world that are known.

I count 32 incidents where people are killed in US schools since 2010

I count 2 incidents in where people are killed in UK schools (4 dead) since 2010.

Population wise, the UK is 5 times smaller than the US. So, make that three times more incidents in the US than the UK. All of the UK's incidents were without guns.

 

[2aguy]

You do realize that Americana use guns to stop violent criminal attack 2 million times a year...right? And that gun mureders are going down, not up as more Americans own and Cary guns ...right?

and criminals in Europe get fully automatic rifles and 30 round magazines easily...as they do in .france, Belgium, Denmark and Sweden...right...that they don't use them in crimes is cultural and has nothing to do with accessibility...since their criminals get guns as easily as ours,do...right?

and that mass shootings inEurope, when they happen are far worse than they are here...right? because no one over there is armed except for the criminals ...and a lot of the time not even the police have guns...like in Norway and France......

Yeah, I do realise that gun murders are going down, and they're still more than 4 times higher than most western countries.

Yes, criminals can get guns in Europe, so why are murder rates much lower?

You say it's cultural, nothing to do with accessibility. I disagree. The culture is based on accessibility. Just because you CAN get something, doesn't mean that accessibility is the same. It probably costs a lot more to get a gun in Europe than in the US. Guns are available through stealing, and other ways, whereas in Europe many have to be imported which causes no end of problems.

Mass shootings are worse over there? Not really. There are hardly mass shootings.

The UK has had two mass shootings in the last 30 years or so. One was Dunblaine (where Andy Murray was at school) and the Cumbrian shootings. 12 people died in Cumbria in 2010 and 16 people died in Dunblaine.

12 people were killed in Aurora in 2012 by James Holmes, 13 in Binghamton in 2009, 10 in Alabama in 2009, in Red Lake in 2005 10 people died, 15 died in Columbine, 33 died in Virginia Tech

The numbers are pretty similar. The highest numbers are into the needs, more or less. There are some exceptions, like Virginia Tech.

Where the difference lies in the number of low level attacks where one or two people are killed.

Let's look at Secondary Schools, it's where kids go through the hardest time and most likely to snap

List of attacks related to secondary schools - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

This has all secondary school attacks, not just shootings, in the world that are known.

I count 32 incidents where people are killed in US schools since 2010

I count 2 incidents in where people are killed in UK schools (4 dead) since 2010.

Population wise, the UK is 5 times smaller than the US. So, make that three times more incidents in the US than the UK. All of the UK's incidents were without guns.

You say it's cultural, nothing to do with accessibility. I disagree. The culture is based on accessibility. Just because you CAN get something, doesn't mean that accessibility is the same.

Criminals in Europe routinely get fully automatic rifles with 30 round magazines...European law enforcement has stated that getting these guns is easy...they can get them even with criminal convictions in countries that don't have gun stores and don't let any civilians have these fully automatic weapons.....

It has everything to do with culture since they can get these guns whenever they want them....they have a history of Feudalism and pacifism as a result of the World Wars and their culture of class in their society......

 

[frigidweirdo]

and another thing.....Europe is importing immigrants from countries far more violent than Europe...and soon their violent gun crime will be increasing.....

And this has been happening for a long time now. Gun crime actually increased with Jamaican immigration, this seems to have stopped now that new laws are in place. The Yardies and other gangs brought their guns with them. The police are dealing with this sort of thing effectively. Immigration is still a problem, but mainly for other reasons and more low level crime than murder.

Police winning battle against inner city gun crime - Crime - UK - The Independent

"Firearms offences have fallen by more than 40 percent in less than a decade, with the rise of “gun culture” in Britain’s inner cities apparently reversed because of improved police intelligence."

This is part of the difference in the UK and US. The UK tries to solve problems at the core. The US tries to set an example, show that they're being tough on crime, which helps their cause.

 

[2aguy]

You do realize that Americana use guns to stop violent criminal attack 2 million times a year...right? And that gun mureders are going down, not up as more Americans own and Cary guns ...right?

and criminals in Europe get fully automatic rifles and 30 round magazines easily...as they do in .france, Belgium, Denmark and Sweden...right...that they don't use them in crimes is cultural and has nothing to do with accessibility...since their criminals get guns as easily as ours,do...right?

and that mass shootings inEurope, when they happen are far worse than they are here...right? because no one over there is armed except for the criminals ...and a lot of the time not even the police have guns...like in Norway and France......

Yeah, I do realise that gun murders are going down, and they're still more than 4 times higher than most western countries.

Yes, criminals can get guns in Europe, so why are murder rates much lower?

You say it's cultural, nothing to do with accessibility. I disagree. The culture is based on accessibility. Just because you CAN get something, doesn't mean that accessibility is the same. It probably costs a lot more to get a gun in Europe than in the US. Guns are available through stealing, and other ways, whereas in Europe many have to be imported which causes no end of problems.

Mass shootings are worse over there? Not really. There are hardly mass shootings.

The UK has had two mass shootings in the last 30 years or so. One was Dunblaine (where Andy Murray was at school) and the Cumbrian shootings. 12 people died in Cumbria in 2010 and 16 people died in Dunblaine.

12 people were killed in Aurora in 2012 by James Holmes, 13 in Binghamton in 2009, 10 in Alabama in 2009, in Red Lake in 2005 10 people died, 15 died in Columbine, 33 died in Virginia Tech

The numbers are pretty similar. The highest numbers are into the needs, more or less. There are some exceptions, like Virginia Tech.

Where the difference lies in the number of low level attacks where one or two people are killed.

Let's look at Secondary Schools, it's where kids go through the hardest time and most likely to snap

List of attacks related to secondary schools - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

This has all secondary school attacks, not just shootings, in the world that are known.

I count 32 incidents where people are killed in US schools since 2010

I count 2 incidents in where people are killed in UK schools (4 dead) since 2010.

Population wise, the UK is 5 times smaller than the US. So, make that three times more incidents in the US than the UK. All of the UK's incidents were without guns.

I thought so....when you go to your link...they count every shooting at a school as a school shooting.....which is not what people think when you say school shooting...the first 2 are men killing wives and girlfriends who work at the buildings...total crap link......

And just wait.....Europe is importing people from violent cultures...cultures that do not share the same pacifism of Europe...and the shootings in France are going up....and you will see more and more of it as these cultures clash......