Bakers fined for not working homosexual "wedding" continue fighting for their freedoms

[owebo]

Making someone do work they do not want to do.....you call that slavery.....which the democrats know quite well....they owned blacks as slaves for a very long time...now they want to own everyone as slaves....even bakers....

Interesting take...what if your boss tells you to do something you don't like? Slavery? Just like black slavery?

The point of owning your own business is that you are the boss and you decide what shall be done in your services not the general public regardless of their personal preferences, dysfunctions sexual or otherwise.

So...you don't believe businesses should be licensed

So, when I get a license, that state will tell me what I can make so I know what kind of business I can run?

The state does not tell you what to make, but you must follow that state's business laws....if you want to make widgets, you still have to follow business law if you want t.hat license.

Yes, so you're saying they tell you what to make...because you used it as your defense to force people to make things....,

 

[Silhouette]

You don't think someone should follow the business laws they agree to when they get a license?

You realize you can't force someone to choose between the 1st Amendment and some Johnny-come-lately PA laws right? You can't say "renounce your faith or no business license for you!" And the 1st doesn't read "freedom of church". It's freedom of INDIVIDUALS to exercise their faith EVERY DAY, EVERYWHERE they find themselves.

Good luck asking Congress to amend the 1st Amendment. We all know where this is heading..

So you are against PA laws...what are you actively doing to get them repealed in your state?

As you know, I like creative solutions that take advantage of opposition's hypocrisy. It tends to kill their arguments in court. I think, like the gays targeted the Kleins, the Christians should target the Church of LGBT. In each state, Christians should find homosexual print shops. And they should each order a sign that says "homosexuality is a sin unto God" for billboards and posting in prominent areas everywhere. They have to be for prominent display though. They'll encounter much more resistance that way.

Then when the first Church of LGBT parishioner fails to print the sign because of personal misgivings (faith), Christians sue them to the hilt and insist they are fined according to PA laws. And watch how fast "we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" is revived...lol..

We are talking about two religions here properly. So what's good for one is good for the other, yes?

Christians could just as easily go on staged discrimination-hunts just like the Church of LGBT does. And frankly I wonder why they haven't already?

 

[RodISHI]

Making someone do work they do not want to do.....you call that slavery.....which the democrats know quite well....they owned blacks as slaves for a very long time...now they want to own everyone as slaves....even bakers....

Interesting take...what if your boss tells you to do something you don't like? Slavery? Just like black slavery?

The point of owning your own business is that you are the boss and you decide what shall be done in your services not the general public regardless of their personal preferences, dysfunctions sexual or otherwise.

So...you don't believe businesses should be licensed

Licenses are for public safety not for taking God given constitutional rights. To attempt to use them for any other purpose is worse than fascism.

 

[2aguy]

Making someone do work they do not want to do.....you call that slavery.....which the democrats know quite well....they owned blacks as slaves for a very long time...now they want to own everyone as slaves....even bakers....

Interesting take...what if your boss tells you to do something you don't like? Slavery? Just like black slavery?

The point of owning your own business is that you are the boss and you decide what shall be done in your services not the general public regardless of their personal preferences, dysfunctions sexual or otherwise.

So...you don't believe businesses should be licensed

So, when I get a license, that state will tell me what I can make so I know what kind of business I can run?

The state does not tell you what to make, but you must follow that state's business laws....if you want to make widgets, you still have to follow business law if you want t.hat license.

Yep...except the can't violate your religious freedom.......that is guaranteed in the Bill of Rights...

So...if you open a business and get a business license...does that mean the police can then search your property without a warrant? Do you surrender your 5th Amendment protections against self incrimination because you got a business license?

Your Rights do not stop because you opened a business....

 

[2aguy]

Making someone do work they do not want to do.....you call that slavery.....which the democrats know quite well....they owned blacks as slaves for a very long time...now they want to own everyone as slaves....even bakers....

Interesting take...what if your boss tells you to do something you don't like? Slavery? Just like black slavery?

The point of owning your own business is that you are the boss and you decide what shall be done in your services not the general public regardless of their personal preferences, dysfunctions sexual or otherwise.

So...you don't believe businesses should be licensed

Yep....they should be licensed...for health practices and tax purposes....but that license is not them signing away their Constitutionally protected Rights........

 

[2aguy]

Nope....wallace was a democrat and he violated the Constitutional Rights of blacks......just like you guys are for these bakers....what is it with you guys and forcing people to work for you when they don't want too........is it a mental illness, or just a habit.....?

The bakers violated the constitutional rights of the gay couple. Just like George Wallace tried with black people. I pity the bakers.

No...they didn't violate anyone's Constitutional rights...you don't have a right to a wedding cake. Wallace, a democrat, used the power of government to deny Constitutional rights to black people........you support violating Constitutional Rights the same way he did.....

They did violate the couple's rights. One day if a Muslim says you can't buy some kabobs because you're an infidel, you can sue them too.

Nope....you can lie about the Constitution all you want...you can force people at gun point to be slaves....but the First Amendment protects the religious freedom of these bakers even if they are running a business......a Right isn't stopped at a property line...

They can't claim religious freedom if the only class of "sinners" they refuse service to are gays. For example, if they bake cakes for second marriages, these are classed in the Bible as "adultery", a stoning offence according to scripture, as this is one of the 10 Commandments. If your are refusing service to gays on religious grounds, you can't pick and choose your sins, you have to discriminate against all such similar sins. The Bible strictly prohibits divorce and remarriage, so this is not some perverse whim of mine.

There are a lot of things in the Bible which civilized people have stopped doing, including but not limited to: stoning adulterers; keeping slaves; and marrying your brother's widow, but keep Jesus' commandment of "Love one another as I have loved you", apparently is one of them.

Wrong....that is what their religion says....they interperet their religious beliefs, not the state. It is the First Amendment.....government cannot make laws against free practice of a religion....

 

[JumpingPete]

The bakers violated the constitutional rights of the gay couple. Just like George Wallace tried with black people. I pity the bakers.

No...they didn't violate anyone's Constitutional rights...you don't have a right to a wedding cake. Wallace, a democrat, used the power of government to deny Constitutional rights to black people........you support violating Constitutional Rights the same way he did.....

They did violate the couple's rights. One day if a Muslim says you can't buy some kabobs because you're an infidel, you can sue them too.

Nope....you can lie about the Constitution all you want...you can force people at gun point to be slaves....but the First Amendment protects the religious freedom of these bakers even if they are running a business......a Right isn't stopped at a property line...

They can't claim religious freedom if the only class of "sinners" they refuse service to are gays. For example, if they bake cakes for second marriages, these are classed in the Bible as "adultery", a stoning offence according to scripture, as this is one of the 10 Commandments. If your are refusing service to gays on religious grounds, you can't pick and choose your sins, you have to discriminate against all such similar sins. The Bible strictly prohibits divorce and remarriage, so this is not some perverse whim of mine.

There are a lot of things in the Bible which civilized people have stopped doing, including but not limited to: stoning adulterers; keeping slaves; and marrying your brother's widow, but keep Jesus' commandment of "Love one another as I have loved you", apparently is one of them.

Wrong....that is what their religion says....they interperet their religious beliefs, not the state. It is the First Amendment.....government cannot make laws against free practice of a religion....

And which moron told you that? It isn't true.

 

[JumpingPete]

Making someone do work they do not want to do.....you call that slavery.....which the democrats know quite well....they owned blacks as slaves for a very long time...now they want to own everyone as slaves....even bakers....

Interesting take...what if your boss tells you to do something you don't like? Slavery? Just like black slavery?

The point of owning your own business is that you are the boss and you decide what shall be done in your services not the general public regardless of their personal preferences, dysfunctions sexual or otherwise.

So...you don't believe businesses should be licensed

Yep....they should be licensed...for health practices and tax purposes....but that license is not them signing away their Constitutionally protected Rights........

You'd be surprised.

 

[JumpingPete]

Interesting take...what if your boss tells you to do something you don't like? Slavery? Just like black slavery?

The point of owning your own business is that you are the boss and you decide what shall be done in your services not the general public regardless of their personal preferences, dysfunctions sexual or otherwise.

So...you don't believe businesses should be licensed

So, when I get a license, that state will tell me what I can make so I know what kind of business I can run?

The state does not tell you what to make, but you must follow that state's business laws....if you want to make widgets, you still have to follow business law if you want t.hat license.

Yep...except the can't violate your religious freedom.......that is guaranteed in the Bill of Rights...

So...if you open a business and get a business license...does that mean the police can then search your property without a warrant? Do you surrender your 5th Amendment protections against self incrimination because you got a business license?

Your Rights do not stop because you opened a business....

Part of them do. A business owner is not the same as a street preacher or a schoolgirl.

 

[bodecea]

Making someone do work they do not want to do.....you call that slavery.....which the democrats know quite well....they owned blacks as slaves for a very long time...now they want to own everyone as slaves....even bakers....

Interesting take...what if your boss tells you to do something you don't like? Slavery? Just like black slavery?

The point of owning your own business is that you are the boss and you decide what shall be done in your services not the general public regardless of their personal preferences, dysfunctions sexual or otherwise.

So...you don't believe businesses should be licensed

Licenses are for public safety not for taking God given constitutional rights. To attempt to use them for any other purpose is worse than fascism.

So you are against PA laws? What are you actively doing to get them repealed in your state since you believe them wrong?

And "god given constitutional rights"? Which god?

 

[bodecea]

The bakers violated the constitutional rights of the gay couple. Just like George Wallace tried with black people. I pity the bakers.

No...they didn't violate anyone's Constitutional rights...you don't have a right to a wedding cake. Wallace, a democrat, used the power of government to deny Constitutional rights to black people........you support violating Constitutional Rights the same way he did.....

They did violate the couple's rights. One day if a Muslim says you can't buy some kabobs because you're an infidel, you can sue them too.

Nope....you can lie about the Constitution all you want...you can force people at gun point to be slaves....but the First Amendment protects the religious freedom of these bakers even if they are running a business......a Right isn't stopped at a property line...

They can't claim religious freedom if the only class of "sinners" they refuse service to are gays. For example, if they bake cakes for second marriages, these are classed in the Bible as "adultery", a stoning offence according to scripture, as this is one of the 10 Commandments. If your are refusing service to gays on religious grounds, you can't pick and choose your sins, you have to discriminate against all such similar sins. The Bible strictly prohibits divorce and remarriage, so this is not some perverse whim of mine.

There are a lot of things in the Bible which civilized people have stopped doing, including but not limited to: stoning adulterers; keeping slaves; and marrying your brother's widow, but keep Jesus' commandment of "Love one another as I have loved you", apparently is one of them.

Wrong....that is what their religion says....they interperet their religious beliefs, not the state. It is the First Amendment.....government cannot make laws against free practice of a religion....

Who's stopping them from worshipping?

 

[2aguy]

Making someone do work they do not want to do.....you call that slavery.....which the democrats know quite well....they owned blacks as slaves for a very long time...now they want to own everyone as slaves....even bakers....

Interesting take...what if your boss tells you to do something you don't like? Slavery? Just like black slavery?

The point of owning your own business is that you are the boss and you decide what shall be done in your services not the general public regardless of their personal preferences, dysfunctions sexual or otherwise.

So...you don't believe businesses should be licensed

Licenses are for public safety not for taking God given constitutional rights. To attempt to use them for any other purpose is worse than fascism.

So you are against PA laws? What are you actively doing to get them repealed in your state since you believe them wrong?

And "god given constitutional rights"? Which god?

It doesn't matter which god....the First Amendment protects the worship of all of them........

 

[2aguy]

No...they didn't violate anyone's Constitutional rights...you don't have a right to a wedding cake. Wallace, a democrat, used the power of government to deny Constitutional rights to black people........you support violating Constitutional Rights the same way he did.....

They did violate the couple's rights. One day if a Muslim says you can't buy some kabobs because you're an infidel, you can sue them too.

Nope....you can lie about the Constitution all you want...you can force people at gun point to be slaves....but the First Amendment protects the religious freedom of these bakers even if they are running a business......a Right isn't stopped at a property line...

They can't claim religious freedom if the only class of "sinners" they refuse service to are gays. For example, if they bake cakes for second marriages, these are classed in the Bible as "adultery", a stoning offence according to scripture, as this is one of the 10 Commandments. If your are refusing service to gays on religious grounds, you can't pick and choose your sins, you have to discriminate against all such similar sins. The Bible strictly prohibits divorce and remarriage, so this is not some perverse whim of mine.

There are a lot of things in the Bible which civilized people have stopped doing, including but not limited to: stoning adulterers; keeping slaves; and marrying your brother's widow, but keep Jesus' commandment of "Love one another as I have loved you", apparently is one of them.

Wrong....that is what their religion says....they interperet their religious beliefs, not the state. It is the First Amendment.....government cannot make laws against free practice of a religion....

Who's stopping them from worshipping?

The government...if they hold to their beliefs, they lose their ability to own a business.....that is against the First Amendment....the government can't establish a religion or prohibit the free practice of one.....

 

[2aguy]

The point of owning your own business is that you are the boss and you decide what shall be done in your services not the general public regardless of their personal preferences, dysfunctions sexual or otherwise.

So...you don't believe businesses should be licensed

So, when I get a license, that state will tell me what I can make so I know what kind of business I can run?

The state does not tell you what to make, but you must follow that state's business laws....if you want to make widgets, you still have to follow business law if you want t.hat license.

Yep...except the can't violate your religious freedom.......that is guaranteed in the Bill of Rights...

So...if you open a business and get a business license...does that mean the police can then search your property without a warrant? Do you surrender your 5th Amendment protections against self incrimination because you got a business license?

Your Rights do not stop because you opened a business....

Part of them do. A business owner is not the same as a street preacher or a schoolgirl.

No...a business owner can have religious beliefs...they do not surrender their Right to the free exercise of Religion simply because they open a business.......

 

[2aguy]

When you say.....bake this cake in violation of your religious beliefs....you are violating the 1st Amendment of the Constitution....

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.[1]

Bake this cake in violation of your religious beliefs...or you will not be allowed to own a business...is a clear violation of the First Amendment...

 

[JumpingPete]

So...you don't believe businesses should be licensed

So, when I get a license, that state will tell me what I can make so I know what kind of business I can run?

The state does not tell you what to make, but you must follow that state's business laws....if you want to make widgets, you still have to follow business law if you want t.hat license.

Yep...except the can't violate your religious freedom.......that is guaranteed in the Bill of Rights...

So...if you open a business and get a business license...does that mean the police can then search your property without a warrant? Do you surrender your 5th Amendment protections against self incrimination because you got a business license?

Your Rights do not stop because you opened a business....

Part of them do. A business owner is not the same as a street preacher or a schoolgirl.

No...a business owner can have religious beliefs...they do not surrender their Right to the free exercise of Religion simply because they open a business.......

They have rights, the business (mostly) does not. When running the business what they believe doesn't matter. The rules are the same for everyone, Muslim, Jew, Atheist, or Christian. They all pay taxes and obey the rules or out of business they go. They can save their hatred others for church and non-business hours. The courts are clear on this.

 

[JumpingPete]

When you say.....bake this cake in violation of your religious beliefs....you are violating the 1st Amendment of the Constitution....

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.[1]

Bake this cake in violation of your religious beliefs...or you will not be allowed to own a business...is a clear violation of the First Amendment...

Baking a cake for money is not an expression of your First Amendment rights.

 

[dblack]

When you say.....bake this cake in violation of your religious beliefs....you are violating the 1st Amendment of the Constitution....

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.[1]

Bake this cake in violation of your religious beliefs...or you will not be allowed to own a business...is a clear violation of the First Amendment...

Baking a cake for money is not an expression of your First Amendment rights.

But refusing to do so can be.

Personally, I don't think this is limited to the first amendment. It's a much deeper violation of the fundamental freedom of conscience, the freedom to decide who to serve and who to shun.

 

[bodecea]

So...you don't believe businesses should be licensed

So, when I get a license, that state will tell me what I can make so I know what kind of business I can run?

The state does not tell you what to make, but you must follow that state's business laws....if you want to make widgets, you still have to follow business law if you want t.hat license.

Yep...except the can't violate your religious freedom.......that is guaranteed in the Bill of Rights...

So...if you open a business and get a business license...does that mean the police can then search your property without a warrant? Do you surrender your 5th Amendment protections against self incrimination because you got a business license?

Your Rights do not stop because you opened a business....

Part of them do. A business owner is not the same as a street preacher or a schoolgirl.

No...a business owner can have religious beliefs...they do not surrender their Right to the free exercise of Religion simply because they open a business.......

However, if their religion keeps them from serving all the law requires, why be in that business? Kind of stupid...like a Muslim taxi-driver refusing to take people with pets as fare. Ridiculous.


I still would like to see what religion requires the cake to be at the marriage ceremony.

 

[bodecea]

When you say.....bake this cake in violation of your religious beliefs....you are violating the 1st Amendment of the Constitution....

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.[1]

Bake this cake in violation of your religious beliefs...or you will not be allowed to own a business...is a clear violation of the First Amendment...

Baking a cake for money is not an expression of your First Amendment rights.

But refusing to do so can be.

Personally, I don't think this is limited to the first amendment. It's a much deeper violation of the fundamental freedom of conscience, the freedom to decide who to serve and who to shun.

So, you don't like PA laws. What have you actively done to get them repealed in your state?