Another "Good Guy" with a gun murders wife and children

[Quantum Windbag]

You do realize that All In The Family was a spoof series making fun of Archie Bunker types, right?

And occasionally the writers ended up hoisting themselves by their own petards. They didn't realize it, but in that case they made Archie right.

No they didn't. You all don't get it. Knives have a function that has nothing to do with injuring or killing people. Windows have a function that has nothing to do with injuring or killing people. Same for cars, bridges, bodies of water, and all the other false analogies you gun folks throw into this debate.

Guns have only one purpose: to kill. Therefore, they are not analogous with windows, knives, hammers, bridges, cars, swimming pools, etc. Thus, the writers were being consistent in showing Archie to be someone who had poor critical thinking skills.

Guns are not designed to kill, despite your massive ignorance on the subject.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Yet Another Man With a Gun Just Murdered His Wife and Children


According to NRA logic - he was a "good guy" right up until he slaughtered his family. Then he become a "bad guy" who should be restricted from purchasing guns in the future... But he is still able to purchase ammo for the guns he already owns.... I guess ammo to shoot his dead family some more.

The tool of killing is irrelevant.
Are you capable of killing someone? I know you are but you won't admit it. Just as all humans have the capacity to take a life... when events merit it.
But to single out GUNS???

PolitiFact: Yes, more people murdered with knives, body parts and blunt objects than rifles in 2011

Facebook post says more people were murdered with knives, body parts or blunt objects than with rifles | PolitiFactHonestly if you are so concerned that a loved one with access to a gun is going to kill you YOU need to have them seek anger management!
But don't lump people with guns with domestic violence as the tool can be eliminated BUT grownups don't kill people and if you consider
your loved ones as grown up why are you concerned?

Your factoid is a trick: it says more people are killed with a knives or blunt objects than with RIFLES. Rifles, not guns, nor firearms, but rifles. In fact, more people are killed with firearms of various types than anything else combined. Who do you think you're kidding?

How many of those homicides were cops shooting people? How many were ruled justified self defense? Until you give me that breakdown you really don't have a leg to stand on.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Again, another false analogy. The purpose of doctors is not to kill. The purpose of guns is to kill. They are not analogous. You cannot logically compare doctors/medical malpractice to guns. It is irrational to try to do so.

It is also irrational to not drill down to the core issue. The purpose of guns is to kill or injure in self-defense or defense of one's family or property. Criminals kill or injure with guns for their own benefit. It always comes down to intent to discern the difference. If someone uses a gun & kill/injure someone but it was used in self-defense or protection of their family, then they are justified. However, if that person were to randomly or purposely kill/injure someone with malice thought, then they are a criminal. The weapon or tool matters not. Gun control does not impact the core issue, which is the intent & in fact, exacerbates the problem. Even if all the guns in the world were to somehow disappear tomorrow, you would still have the same level of violence. Why? Because the core issue wasn't addressed. Gun rights people understand this because we understand how the world truly works. We accept the fact the world is evil & we must do all we can to protect ourselves & our families from it. We don't blame an inanimate object nor look to it as a means to solve problems. The Left doesn't get this because they don't want to accept responsibility. It is far easier to blame a tool or society, or something else not related to the problem at hand.

Guns have only one purpose and that is to injure or kill living beings. They are only self defense in the sense that they may warn off or intimidate someone one from attacking you, or you may kill someone before he kills you. However, the core purpose of guns is to shoot at something that is a living, breathing being, to either kill or cause serious injury. Everything else you wrote is simply emotional justification for your desire to own guns. There is no pure logic in it whatsoever.

LOL, by the way: Your statement that if all guns disappeared we'd have the same level of violence is deeply incorrect. With the advent of firearms, and with their increasing sophistication, the death rate in civilian life and in wars had increased at least a thousand fold.

Skeet guns are designed with one purpose in mind, shooting clay targets. Feel free to convince yourself that clay is a living being, I won't insist that you join reality, I will just mock you for ignoring it.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

No they didn't. You all don't get it. Knives have a function that has nothing to do with injuring or killing people. Windows have a function that has nothing to do with injuring or killing people. Same for cars, bridges, bodies of water, and all the other false analogies you gun folks throw into this debate.

Guns have only one purpose: to kill. Therefore, they are not analogous with windows, knives, hammers, bridges, cars, swimming pools, etc. Thus, the writers were being consistent in showing Archie to be someone who had poor critical thinking skills.

there are an estimated 366,000,000 guns in the usa. with 8500 murders last year. that means only .0000232 guns ever kills anyone. how can a statement be made that the only purpose a gun has is to kill? the number of guns that actually ever kill any one os so minute that if this wasn't a liberal political agenda it would never even be considered an issue.

8,500 unnecessary deaths. As well, guns are responsible for a great many accidental deaths and suicides.

Guns are responsible for people killing themselves? Does that mean that people who use knives to commit suicide can blame the knife?

 

[DigitalDrifter]

Very tragic story, I grieve with the relatives and friends that are left behind, but no you cannot have my guns or my gun rights.

 

[Spoonman]

The tool of killing is irrelevant.
Are you capable of killing someone? I know you are but you won't admit it. Just as all humans have the capacity to take a life... when events merit it.
But to single out GUNS???

PolitiFact: Yes, more people murdered with knives, body parts and blunt objects than rifles in 2011

Facebook post says more people were murdered with knives, body parts or blunt objects than with rifles | PolitiFactHonestly if you are so concerned that a loved one with access to a gun is going to kill you YOU need to have them seek anger management!
But don't lump people with guns with domestic violence as the tool can be eliminated BUT grownups don't kill people and if you consider
your loved ones as grown up why are you concerned?

Your factoid is a trick: it says more people are killed with a knives or blunt objects than with RIFLES. Rifles, not guns, nor firearms, but rifles. In fact, more people are killed with firearms of various types than anything else combined. Who do you think you're kidding?

How many of those homicides were cops shooting people? How many were ruled justified self defense? Until you give me that breakdown you really don't have a leg to stand on.

those are very good points because they are figured into the homicide gun stats. just like if you ever smoked in your life, even if it was only for a year or so and you answer the question have you ever smoked, yes, when you die you become a cigarette related death stat.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

8,500 unnecessary deaths. As well, guns are responsible for a great many accidental deaths and suicides.

how many accidental deaths occur every year? cars cause more deaths than guns. if that was really our criteria we would be banning everything. prescription drugs cause more death than guns. misdiagnosis by doctors causes more death than guns.

Guns are not the problem. the fact that someone is willing to take a life is the problem. you don't need a gun to take a life. because people still kill who don't have a gun. and of those people who killed with a gun, how have any of the thousands of laws already on the books stopped them from killing? Or stopped them from getting a gun?

As long as we continue to attack an item that is really not the problem and ignore the problem, we will never fix the problem.

The point is you cannot logically compare guns to cars or gun accidents to car accidents. Cars have a completely different purpose. When you try to put ordinary every day things we use to function on the same level as guns, you create a false analogy: a logical fallacy. You may not need to kill anyone with your gun, but that is their purpose. They are not something we need on a daily basis to function.

Comparing guns to car accidents or bathroom accidents or any other of the ordinary incidents that occur through living an ordinary life is a logical fallacy. And the argument is not that people still kill who don't have guns; the argument is how much easier it is to kill with a gun and how much more death occur because of gun violence.

The point s that guns are a tool. Anything attempt to argue that guns are responsible for the misuse of a tool just makes you look stupid.

 

[Spoonman]

What I find very interesting is we currently have a mass of refugees trying to enter this country. And the reason they are trying to come here is to flee violence in their own countries. now these countries have far more restrictive gun laws than the USA. but we're a safer haven. are restrictive gun laws not stopping their violence?

 

[Bush92]

Seems like a good thread for a forum on mental illness.

 

[Peach]

more people die from DUI's but you won't hear these anti gun nutters say boo about that...they don't care about the deaths

Traffic deaths dwarf firearm deaths. DUI, even without injury or property damage, should be a felony the second time, I believe. I favor harher penalties in my state.

 

[pvsi]

Yet Another Man With a Gun Just Murdered His Wife and Children

In other news, another liberal with a car crashed and died killing a bunch of people. oops, wait, there's more. another moron with a lighter just set a house on fire.

 

[Spoonman]

more people die from DUI's but you won't hear these anti gun nutters say boo about that...they don't care about the deaths

Traffic deaths dwarf firearm deaths. DUI, even without injury or property damage, should be a felony the second time, I believe. I favor harher penalties in my state.

but would you advocate banning cars because of it. or restricting the type of cars or power of cars non offending drivers can own? is someone less likely to have an accident in a prius vs an escalade?

 

[DigitalDrifter]

What I find very interesting is we currently have a mass of refugees trying to enter this country. And the reason they are trying to come here is to flee violence in their own countries. now these countries have far more restrictive gun laws than the USA. but we're a safer haven. are restrictive gun laws not stopping their violence?

The individuals in those countries simply do not have the personal rights of gun ownership that we have. They are totally dependent on their governments to keep them safe. Of course in many cases the government themselves are the bad guys.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

1. This nut isn't a good guy.
2. If didn't have a gun, he would have killed them by some other means because... see (1.)

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Yet Another Man With a Gun Just Murdered His Wife and Children

In other news, another liberal with a car crashed and died killing a bunch of people. oops, wait, there's more. another moron with a lighter just set a house on fire.

 

[Rikurzhen]

Guns have only one purpose and that is to injure or kill living beings. They are only self defense in the sense that they may warn off or intimidate someone one from attacking you, or you may kill someone before he kills you. However, the core purpose of guns is to shoot at something that is a living, breathing being, to either kill or cause serious injury. Everything else you wrote is simply emotional justification for your desire to own guns. There is no pure logic in it whatsoever.

Cars have one purpose - to get people from point A to point B. So why are their cheap cars and luxury cars? One of the principal reasons that luxury cars exist is that people buy them as positional goods, to signal to others something about themselves. For many people the signaling aspect is more important than the transportation aspect.

You can go up and down the line on positional goods. Why does someone go to a famous nightclub loaded with paparazzi rather than to the local watering hole? The booze is the same at both. Why do women buy designer clothes rather than Walmart knockoffs? Designer shoes, designer handbags? You don't need a (I don't know any designers names other than Calvin Klein) Calvin Klein handbag that costs $800 when a Walmart handbag costs $15. But when you buy those expensive shoes or handbag or dress, you can signal to your friends and that's very important to a lot of people.

Firearms also serve the same purpose with respect to crime deterrence. We see this in the international crime statistics. Home Invasions in the US occur at a far lower incidence rate than they do in Canada or the UK. Why? Because criminals know that they're far more likely to face an armed home owner and this puts their life in risk. In Canada and the UK, the armed criminal busts into your home and holds you captive as they beat you during the robbery.

Look at this photo. This man's firearms are SERVING A PURPOSE and he doesn't have to kill anyone when he uses his firearms to serve a purpose. If you're a criminal, which house would you break into?

 

[MaxGrit]

8,500 unnecessary deaths. As well, guns are responsible for a great many accidental deaths and suicides.

how many accidental deaths occur every year? cars cause more deaths than guns. if that was really our criteria we would be banning everything. prescription drugs cause more death than guns. misdiagnosis by doctors causes more death than guns.

Guns are not the problem. the fact that someone is willing to take a life is the problem. you don't need a gun to take a life. because people still kill who don't have a gun. and of those people who killed with a gun, how have any of the thousands of laws already on the books stopped them from killing? Or stopped them from getting a gun?

As long as we continue to attack an item that is really not the problem and ignore the problem, we will never fix the problem.

The point is you cannot logically compare guns to cars or gun accidents to car accidents. Cars have a completely different purpose. When you try to put ordinary every day things we use to function on the same level as guns, you create a false analogy: a logical fallacy. You may not need to kill anyone with your gun, but that is their purpose. They are not something we need on a daily basis to function.

Comparing guns to car accidents or bathroom accidents or any other of the ordinary incidents that occur through living an ordinary life is a logical fallacy. And the argument is not that people still kill who don't have guns; the argument is how much easier it is to kill with a gun and how much more death occur because of gun violence.

Begging the question logical fallacy.

It is a valid comparison of different tools. Purpose, usefulness, and need of the tools are irrelevant since they are subjective measures.

Gun violence is a bad measure.

 

[Vandalshandle]

I'll play the idiotic car/gun argument. In order to drive a car in public, you have to prove that you are proficient in doing so, and are of legal age, to a government examiner. You must prove that you are financially responsible, by proving that you have bought insurance, to a government official. You must pay a license fee. You must renew that license fee from time to time, and the government can restrict or deny renewal of that license if you turn out to have lost your proficiency.

In my state, to buy a gun, you have to be able to give the required cash to the seller. Then, you can carry it openly anywhere, without any restraint or license, other than where posted signs in certain private or public buildings read, "no firearms allowed."

 

[MaxGrit]

I'll play the idiotic car/gun argument. In order to drive a car in public, you have to prove that you are proficient in doing so, and are of legal age, to a government examiner. You must prove that you are financially responsible, by proving that you have bought insurance, to a government official. You must pay a license fee. You must renew that license fee from time to time, and the government can restrict or deny renewal of that license if you turn out to have lost your proficiency.

In my state, to buy a gun, you have to be able to give the required cash to the seller. Then, you can carry it openly anywhere, without any restraint or license, other than where posted signs in certain private or public buildings read, "no firearms allowed."

What is your point?

 

[DigitalDrifter]

I'll play the idiotic car/gun argument. In order to drive a car in public, you have to prove that you are proficient in doing so, and are of legal age, to a government examiner. You must prove that you are financially responsible, by proving that you have bought insurance, to a government official. You must pay a license fee. You must renew that license fee from time to time, and the government can restrict or deny renewal of that license if you turn out to have lost your proficiency.

In my state, to buy a gun, you have to be able to give the required cash to the seller. Then, you can carry it openly anywhere, without any restraint or license, other than where posted signs in certain private or public buildings read, "no firearms allowed."

The difference is though, I'm not firing my weapon as I motor down the highway. I am however steering a 4000lb vehicle at 60 miles per hour and for your safety's sake, you had better hope I'm good at it.
I and millions of others all more than likely drive daily and place you and others at risk.
On the other hand, I and others may go an entire year without firing our weapons.