Another conservative

[Immanuel]

I'm hoping to find some reasonable discussions here. I'm tired of Obama sucks, Bush sucks, Clinton sucks and hatred in general.

I assume most liberals are fair & honest people with a different perspective & I'd like to figure out how we all start with loving the USA and kids but come to such different methods.

I'm tired of the GOP too, it's just too stupid to win. If I had enough charisma & cash I'd start the Anti-Republican Party.

I live in Southern California & have a wife & two daughters.

Cheers-

Welcome Wiz,

I agree most liberals are fair and honest people. I participate in three different forums at the moment and have found that very same thing. Here at USMB we run the gamut from fun threads to downright nasty threads. Sometimes the fun threads even end up as nasty threads, but that is just the nature of threads.

As for moderation, it is done here moderately. Not too much and not too little. Although, I have read complaints about the moderators moving threads as in from one forum to "conspiracy theory" or "flame zone", but since I browse using the "New Posts" function I rarely realize it.

Welcome to USMB. Enjoy your stay here and if you do want to speak with a reasonable conservative... well, someone might point you to one or two around here.

Hi and welcome.

I've been on the board for about a month. There are some good debaters here, but also a lot of trolls, baiters and flamers hang out here, and they are not regulated at all.

If you want a forum were you can express your opinions and discuss topics without a bunch of "you're a fucking jerk" type posts followed by equivalent emails, you might want to consider another board. A lot of threads seem to end up that way.

Just my two cents.

Irie,

I understand what you mean, but, I've been around for a long time and quite frankly, I don't know of many boards that allow freedom of thought and discussion that don't have threads that end up in the manner you discuss.

Sure, we could all go post at DU, until we get banned for not towing their line, but they are all a bunch of "yes men", so why bother.

Immie

 

[Iriemon]

Weak. Seriously.

Funny; I had a similar reaction.

Give me a break.. You went to the Flame Zone (very self explanatory) to pull from threads to prove your point. Those posts are exactly where they belong, and nobody forces anyone else to go there..

No, I just pulled a thread I'd recently read; I didn't realize where it was.

But why do you keep bringing up a straw man?

If you are taking the position that flaming baiting and trolling posts are not common except in the flame zone, I'll show you a hundred others easily that are not in the flame zone.

You've never denied that what I say is true because it is true. If you are not really contesting that flaming and trolling isn't common, wtf are you wasting all this time for?

But when asked if you've done your fair share of reporting threads that YOU feel vaporized, well, you ignored that, and went back to the silly "are you trying to say there's no flaming here?" question that didn't even warrant a response.

I haven't reported any. Are you a mod? Are you saying if I report them something will be done about it? How do you know?

 

[Iriemon]

welcome to the club, wizard, if you are still around after this awesome thread played out. As a resident troll, flame-baiter and all around asshole i invite you to enjoy what usmb has to offer in the way of political discussion. But, also, i advise you to discover the block user button in the event that you attract the attention of one of our fine, upstanding thread killers, topic jumpers or vitriolic fucks. We enjoy loose moderation around here for the sake of entertainment and an exchange of ideas; for better or worse. As gunny stated, we only really pounce on a small number of offenses but we are, by no means, ungoverned. While there are many boards that have a lock down on acceptable posts there are also many far worse than what you'll find here. Again, welcome to the party and i look forward to calling you a cock-hungry son of a bitch in the near future!

lmao!

 

[Iriemon]

So, you pulled two examples from the Flame Zone (which is exactly where they belonged) to prove your point? Seriously? I'd almost rep you for that because it's so damned funny. But I really hate to encourage your type of behavior.

This board gets upwards of 2000 new posts a day. Mods/Admin rely on the reporting of posts/threads to bring their attention to things that need it. If a thread has gotten so derailed with personal insults, those posts are moved to the Flame Zone, and the thread allowed to carry on.

If posts are not moved, and HAVE been reported, and you know for a fact they've been seen by ALL the Mods, obviously, they're not offending anyone's sensibilities except yours, in which case, it might be time to look at your OWN presence here.

Next?

So you do not deny that flaming baiting and trolling is common here.

That was my point from the first post we've now gone back and forth on for two pages.

Next?

The purpose of my post that you avoided addressing was not to deny anything.

Huh? The post you responded to responded to Dis' post, not yours. I did not avoid yours but responded to it in #28.

Flaming and baiting is common. Trolling, except for those who are so over the top they are the very definition of the word is a matter of perspective. Those who are nothing but trolls are controlled and their posts/threads for the most part policed and controlled.

As are the worst of the flamers.

Since baiting seems to be considered part of legitimate debate nowadays on and off the board, would kind of be hard to do anything about that. It exists on ALL boards.

My point is freedom has a responsibility as well as a price. It's suffering those who neither use it wisely nor responsibly.

No problem with any of this, thanks for the explanation.

 

[Iriemon]

Weak. Seriously.

Funny; I had a similar reaction.

Regardless...as I said.. with 62 posts a day, my guess is this place isn't that bad, since that doesn't leave you much time to pursue other (better?) boards?

Seems pretty self evident.

Enjoy this board with this set of Admins, and owners, because your views and opinions would have been squashed (and you with them) under some of the previous ownership.

Could be

There's a neat little report function for threads that you think have gone over the top.

Enjoy, and YOU have a nice day.

I don't generally bother the mods unless there is something that I think is over the top. They are on the threads and see what is going on generally.

 

[Dis]

Funny; I had a similar reaction.

Give me a break.. You went to the Flame Zone (very self explanatory) to pull from threads to prove your point. Those posts are exactly where they belong, and nobody forces anyone else to go there..

No, I just pulled a thread I'd recently read; I didn't realize where it was.

But why do you keep bringing up a straw man?

If you are taking the position that flaming baiting and trolling posts are not common except in the flame zone, I'll show you a hundred others easily that are not in the flame zone.

You've never denied that what I say is true because it is true. If you are not really contesting that flaming and trolling isn't common, wtf are you wasting all this time for?

But when asked if you've done your fair share of reporting threads that YOU feel vaporized, well, you ignored that, and went back to the silly "are you trying to say there's no flaming here?" question that didn't even warrant a response.

I haven't reported any. Are you a mod? Are you saying if I report them something will be done about it? How do you know?

Well, therein lies part of your problem. If you don't report them, or at least ASK a Mod/Admin if they qualify for movement so the rational discussion can continue, how do you expect them to be moved? Or, do you expect each Mod and Admin be required to read each and every new post since their last login (which, as I said, can be upwards of around 2000 a day), and make a decision on what should or should not be moved prior to them posting themselves?

I'm saying that IF you feel they've deteriorated enough to where they should be moved because they're causing a major disruption to everyone still trying to rationally discuss (if anyone even is), then you, as a member, have an obligation to bring it to someones attention rather than bitching about nothing being done, and telling someone else trolling is allowed to run rampant here..

Yeah, I was a Mod here awhile back. Everything (and I do mean everything) that gets reported gets looked at, and a decision made on how to best handle it (whether you hear about that decision or not).

 

[Iriemon]

I'm hoping to find some reasonable discussions here. I'm tired of Obama sucks, Bush sucks, Clinton sucks and hatred in general.

I assume most liberals are fair & honest people with a different perspective & I'd like to figure out how we all start with loving the USA and kids but come to such different methods.

I'm tired of the GOP too, it's just too stupid to win. If I had enough charisma & cash I'd start the Anti-Republican Party.

I live in Southern California & have a wife & two daughters.

Cheers-

Welcome Wiz,

I agree most liberals are fair and honest people. I participate in three different forums at the moment and have found that very same thing. Here at USMB we run the gamut from fun threads to downright nasty threads. Sometimes the fun threads even end up as nasty threads, but that is just the nature of threads.

As for moderation, it is done here moderately. Not too much and not too little. Although, I have read complaints about the moderators moving threads as in from one forum to "conspiracy theory" or "flame zone", but since I browse using the "New Posts" function I rarely realize it.

Welcome to USMB. Enjoy your stay here and if you do want to speak with a reasonable conservative... well, someone might point you to one or two around here.

Hi and welcome.

I've been on the board for about a month. There are some good debaters here, but also a lot of trolls, baiters and flamers hang out here, and they are not regulated at all.

If you want a forum were you can express your opinions and discuss topics without a bunch of "you're a fucking jerk" type posts followed by equivalent emails, you might want to consider another board. A lot of threads seem to end up that way.

Just my two cents.

Irie,

I understand what you mean, but, I've been around for a long time and quite frankly, I don't know of many boards that allow freedom of thought and discussion that don't have threads that end up in the manner you discuss.

Sure, we could all go post at DU, until we get banned for not towing their line, but they are all a bunch of "yes men", so why bother.

Immie

Thanks -- I like you have no interested in hanging out in specialized boards like DU or freerepublic. I like seeing the arguments from both sides.

It is possible to moderate more actively posts that are little more than flaming. But there's always a compromise attached to it, as others have pointed out.

This Board's been around awhile and seems pretty successful so they've found a moderation mix that a lot of people seem to like. The bitch for me is that a number of those that like it are the ones that most activily engage in the flaming/baiting. But that's my issue to deal with.

 

[Iriemon]

Give me a break.. You went to the Flame Zone (very self explanatory) to pull from threads to prove your point. Those posts are exactly where they belong, and nobody forces anyone else to go there..

No, I just pulled a thread I'd recently read; I didn't realize where it was.

But why do you keep bringing up a straw man?

If you are taking the position that flaming baiting and trolling posts are not common except in the flame zone, I'll show you a hundred others easily that are not in the flame zone.

You've never denied that what I say is true because it is true. If you are not really contesting that flaming and trolling isn't common, wtf are you wasting all this time for?

But when asked if you've done your fair share of reporting threads that YOU feel vaporized, well, you ignored that, and went back to the silly "are you trying to say there's no flaming here?" question that didn't even warrant a response.

I haven't reported any. Are you a mod? Are you saying if I report them something will be done about it? How do you know?

Well, therein lies part of your problem. If you don't report them, or at least ASK a Mod/Admin if they qualify for movement so the rational discussion can continue, how do you expect them to be moved? Or, do you expect each Mod and Admin be required to read each and every new post since their last login (which, as I said, can be upwards of around 2000 a day), and make a decision on what should or should not be moved prior to them posting themselves?

I'm saying that IF you feel they've deteriorated enough to where they should be moved because they're causing a major disruption to everyone still trying to rationally discuss (if anyone even is), then you, as a member, have an obligation to bring it to someones attention rather than bitching about nothing being done, and telling someone else trolling is allowed to run rampant here..

Yeah, I was a Mod here awhile back. Everything (and I do mean everything) that gets reported gets looked at, and a decision made on how to best handle it (whether you hear about that decision or not).

Thank's for your advice. I note Gunny and Del have looked at this thread, and if they are of the opinion that flaming/baiting is out of control and want people to point it out to them so they can take action, they can say so.

 

[catzmeow]

Thank's for your advice. I note Gunny and Del have looked at this thread, and if they are of the opinion that flaming/baiting is out of control and want people to point it out to them so they can take action, they can say so.

Well-intended advice to Irie: When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.

 

[Dis]

No, I just pulled a thread I'd recently read; I didn't realize where it was.

But why do you keep bringing up a straw man?

If you are taking the position that flaming baiting and trolling posts are not common except in the flame zone, I'll show you a hundred others easily that are not in the flame zone.

You've never denied that what I say is true because it is true. If you are not really contesting that flaming and trolling isn't common, wtf are you wasting all this time for?



I haven't reported any. Are you a mod? Are you saying if I report them something will be done about it? How do you know?

Well, therein lies part of your problem. If you don't report them, or at least ASK a Mod/Admin if they qualify for movement so the rational discussion can continue, how do you expect them to be moved? Or, do you expect each Mod and Admin be required to read each and every new post since their last login (which, as I said, can be upwards of around 2000 a day), and make a decision on what should or should not be moved prior to them posting themselves?

I'm saying that IF you feel they've deteriorated enough to where they should be moved because they're causing a major disruption to everyone still trying to rationally discuss (if anyone even is), then you, as a member, have an obligation to bring it to someones attention rather than bitching about nothing being done, and telling someone else trolling is allowed to run rampant here..

Yeah, I was a Mod here awhile back. Everything (and I do mean everything) that gets reported gets looked at, and a decision made on how to best handle it (whether you hear about that decision or not).

Thank's for your advice. I note Gunny and Del have looked at this thread, and if they are of the opinion that flaming/baiting is out of control and want people to point it out to them so they can take action, they can say so.

Agreed, they can. Maybe they will, maybe they won't. But I don't think you should give someone the impression that this board is a free for all left totally unchecked, which is what you DID imply, no matter how you wish to skew it when such is not true.

 

[Iriemon]

Thank's for your advice. I note Gunny and Del have looked at this thread, and if they are of the opinion that flaming/baiting is out of control and want people to point it out to them so they can take action, they can say so.

Well-intended advice to Irie: When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.

I'm not sure your point, Catz, are you agreeing with Dis saying I should report those kinds of posts more often, or agreeing with me that it would be generally useless?

 

[Dis]

Thank's for your advice. I note Gunny and Del have looked at this thread, and if they are of the opinion that flaming/baiting is out of control and want people to point it out to them so they can take action, they can say so.

Well-intended advice to Irie: When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.

I'm not sure your point, Catz, are you agreeing with Dis saying I should report those kinds of posts more often, or agreeing with me that it would be generally useless?

More often than never? Since you've said you haven't reported any...

And, saying you haven't reported any, how can you then say that doing such would be useless when I've already told you that every complaint gets looked at, often by the entire Mod Squad as WELL as Gunny?

 

[Iriemon]

Well, therein lies part of your problem. If you don't report them, or at least ASK a Mod/Admin if they qualify for movement so the rational discussion can continue, how do you expect them to be moved? Or, do you expect each Mod and Admin be required to read each and every new post since their last login (which, as I said, can be upwards of around 2000 a day), and make a decision on what should or should not be moved prior to them posting themselves?

I'm saying that IF you feel they've deteriorated enough to where they should be moved because they're causing a major disruption to everyone still trying to rationally discuss (if anyone even is), then you, as a member, have an obligation to bring it to someones attention rather than bitching about nothing being done, and telling someone else trolling is allowed to run rampant here..

Yeah, I was a Mod here awhile back. Everything (and I do mean everything) that gets reported gets looked at, and a decision made on how to best handle it (whether you hear about that decision or not).

Thank's for your advice. I note Gunny and Del have looked at this thread, and if they are of the opinion that flaming/baiting is out of control and want people to point it out to them so they can take action, they can say so.

Agreed, they can. Maybe they will, maybe they won't. But I don't think you should give someone the impression that this board is a free for all left totally unchecked, which is what you DID imply, no matter how you wish to skew it when such is not true.

Fair enough point. I re-read my initial post in this thread, and my statement "There are some good debaters here, but also a lot of trolls, baiters and flamers hang out here, and they are not regulated at all" which I agree with you does imply this board is a free for all left totally unchecked which is not accurate. Change from "at all" to "much" or maybe "heavily"

 

[Iriemon]

Well-intended advice to Irie: When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.

I'm not sure your point, Catz, are you agreeing with Dis saying I should report those kinds of posts more often, or agreeing with me that it would be generally useless?

More often than never? Since you've said you haven't reported any...

And, saying you haven't reported any, how can you then say that doing such would be useless when I've already told you that every complaint gets looked at, often by the entire Mod Squad as WELL as Gunny?

Because it happens all the time. How could the mod team not be aware of it? Gunny acknowledged it in pst #32. You think sending a pm to the mod team about DiveCon (just to use one example) writing a post calling somebody a fucking moron is going to be viewed as a violation of policy? Hell if it was DiveCon would have been banned long ago.

 

[Dis]

I'm not sure your point, Catz, are you agreeing with Dis saying I should report those kinds of posts more often, or agreeing with me that it would be generally useless?

More often than never? Since you've said you haven't reported any...

And, saying you haven't reported any, how can you then say that doing such would be useless when I've already told you that every complaint gets looked at, often by the entire Mod Squad as WELL as Gunny?

Because it happens all the time. How could the mod team not be aware of it? Gunny acknowledged it in pst #32. You think sending a pm to the mod team about DiveCon writing a post calling somebody a fucking moron is going to be viewed as a violation of policy? Hell if it was DiveCon would have been banned long ago.

Gunny acknowledged that it happens (who wouldn't?).. Not that it's constantly seen, and constantly ignored..just that it happens.

Divecon calling someone a fucking moron is not derailing an entire thread, nor is it breaking any rules. It's Divecon calling someone a fucking moron. Whether you choose to take exception to it, or even pay any attention to it is on you..

It takes more than one person to derail a thread. A good rule of thumb (at least in my opinion) is that if 3 people are discussing completely on topic, and Divecon comes in an calls someone a fucking moron, that's worth ignoring, but not worth reporting.. But, if Divecon, and 1-2 of those people spend the next 10-15 messages throwing sand in each others eyes to such a degree, the entire thread has been disrupted, and it's hard to figure out what's *really* going on, you might want to consider reporting it, because at *lleast* Divecon's fucking moron comment, and those after will get moved to the Flame Zone, leaving the rest of the thread intact, and cleaned up for you to continue on with your discussion.

Pretty simple, if you ask me, and there are plenty of maid uniforms to go around. Only a limited number of brooms, tho.

 

[Iriemon]

More often than never? Since you've said you haven't reported any...

And, saying you haven't reported any, how can you then say that doing such would be useless when I've already told you that every complaint gets looked at, often by the entire Mod Squad as WELL as Gunny?

Because it happens all the time. How could the mod team not be aware of it? Gunny acknowledged it in pst #32. You think sending a pm to the mod team about DiveCon writing a post calling somebody a fucking moron is going to be viewed as a violation of policy? Hell if it was DiveCon would have been banned long ago.

Gunny acknowledged that it happens (who wouldn't?).. Not that it's constantly seen, and constantly ignored..just that it happens.

Divecon calling someone a fucking moron is not derailing an entire thread, nor is it breaking any rules. It's Divecon calling someone a fucking moron. Whether you choose to take exception to it, or even pay any attention to it is on you.

So what is your point? I never claimed that a lot of folks broke the rules.

It takes more than one person to derail a thread. A good rule of thumb (at least in my opinion) is that if 3 people are discussing completely on topic, and Divecon comes in an calls someone a fucking moron, that's worth ignoring, but not worth reporting.. But, if Divecon, and 1-2 of those people spend the next 10-15 messages throwing sand in each others eyes to such a degree, the entire thread has been disrupted, and it's hard to figure out what's *really* going on, you might want to consider reporting it, because at *lleast* Divecon's fucking moron comment, and those after will get moved to the Flame Zone, leaving the rest of the thread intact, and cleaned up for you to continue on with your discussion.

OK

Pretty simple, if you ask me, and there are plenty of maid uniforms to go around. Only a limited number of brooms, tho.

I hear you -- moderating is a thankless task. Though if your rule is that calling people fucking moron is acceptable, you can't be surprised when that happens frequently and threads often devolve into flame wars.

 

[Dis]

Because it happens all the time. How could the mod team not be aware of it? Gunny acknowledged it in pst #32. You think sending a pm to the mod team about DiveCon writing a post calling somebody a fucking moron is going to be viewed as a violation of policy? Hell if it was DiveCon would have been banned long ago.

Gunny acknowledged that it happens (who wouldn't?).. Not that it's constantly seen, and constantly ignored..just that it happens.

Divecon calling someone a fucking moron is not derailing an entire thread, nor is it breaking any rules. It's Divecon calling someone a fucking moron. Whether you choose to take exception to it, or even pay any attention to it is on you.

So what is your point? I never claimed that a lot of folks broke the rules.

It takes more than one person to derail a thread. A good rule of thumb (at least in my opinion) is that if 3 people are discussing completely on topic, and Divecon comes in an calls someone a fucking moron, that's worth ignoring, but not worth reporting.. But, if Divecon, and 1-2 of those people spend the next 10-15 messages throwing sand in each others eyes to such a degree, the entire thread has been disrupted, and it's hard to figure out what's *really* going on, you might want to consider reporting it, because at *lleast* Divecon's fucking moron comment, and those after will get moved to the Flame Zone, leaving the rest of the thread intact, and cleaned up for you to continue on with your discussion.

OK

Pretty simple, if you ask me, and there are plenty of maid uniforms to go around. Only a limited number of brooms, tho.

I hear you -- moderating is a thankless task. Though if your rule is that calling people fucking moron is acceptable, you can't be surprised when that happens frequently and threads often devolve into flame wars.

If someone is a fucking moron, odds are pretty good someone's going to call them a fucking moron.

Nothing here surprises me. I've been around since almost the inception of this board, as have a couple other people that are still here. Calling someone a fucking moron, and having it remain in the thread isn't even worth looking at twice.

When you've been here more than a month, and have looked inside, outside, around, over, and under the box, and then tried to smash it just to see what it's made of, odds are pretty good you'll come to appreciate how the boards run, even if you think the level of dirt is enough to warn someone over, rather than just letting them post and form their own opinion.

 

[Iriemon]

Gunny acknowledged that it happens (who wouldn't?).. Not that it's constantly seen, and constantly ignored..just that it happens.

Divecon calling someone a fucking moron is not derailing an entire thread, nor is it breaking any rules. It's Divecon calling someone a fucking moron. Whether you choose to take exception to it, or even pay any attention to it is on you.

So what is your point? I never claimed that a lot of folks broke the rules.

OK

Pretty simple, if you ask me, and there are plenty of maid uniforms to go around. Only a limited number of brooms, tho.

I hear you -- moderating is a thankless task. Though if your rule is that calling people fucking moron is acceptable, you can't be surprised when that happens frequently and threads often devolve into flame wars.

If someone is a fucking moron, odds are pretty good someone's going to call them a fucking moron.

Figures you'd say that, you fucking moron.

Nothing here surprises me. I've been around since almost the inception of this board, as have a couple other people that are still here. Calling someone a fucking moron, and having it remain in the thread isn't even worth looking at twice.

When you've been here more than a month, and have looked inside, outside, around, over, and under the box, and then tried to smash it just to see what it's made of, odds are pretty good you'll come to appreciate how the boards run, even if you think the level of dirt is enough to warn someone over, rather than just letting them post and form their own opinion.

I just calls 'em as I see 'em. So far I haven't seen anyone including you really take issue with my perception, except that I agreed with you that it was inaccurate to say "not regulated at all."

Just kidding about the fucking moron. : ) Though honestly, people who hurl insults the most are the ones most deserving of the insults they hurl. Just my opinion.

 

[Dis]

So what is your point? I never claimed that a lot of folks broke the rules.

OK



I hear you -- moderating is a thankless task. Though if your rule is that calling people fucking moron is acceptable, you can't be surprised when that happens frequently and threads often devolve into flame wars.

If someone is a fucking moron, odds are pretty good someone's going to call them a fucking moron.

Figures you'd say that, you fucking moron.

Nothing here surprises me. I've been around since almost the inception of this board, as have a couple other people that are still here. Calling someone a fucking moron, and having it remain in the thread isn't even worth looking at twice.

When you've been here more than a month, and have looked inside, outside, around, over, and under the box, and then tried to smash it just to see what it's made of, odds are pretty good you'll come to appreciate how the boards run, even if you think the level of dirt is enough to warn someone over, rather than just letting them post and form their own opinion.

I just calls 'em as I see 'em. So far I haven't seen anyone including you really take issue with my perception, except that I agreed with you that it was inaccurate to say not regulated at all.

Just kidding about the fucking moron. : ) Though honestly, people who hurl insults the most IMO are the ones most deserving of the insults the hurl.

I was just sayin...

 

[Iriemon]

If someone is a fucking moron, odds are pretty good someone's going to call them a fucking moron.

Figures you'd say that, you fucking moron.

Nothing here surprises me. I've been around since almost the inception of this board, as have a couple other people that are still here. Calling someone a fucking moron, and having it remain in the thread isn't even worth looking at twice.

When you've been here more than a month, and have looked inside, outside, around, over, and under the box, and then tried to smash it just to see what it's made of, odds are pretty good you'll come to appreciate how the boards run, even if you think the level of dirt is enough to warn someone over, rather than just letting them post and form their own opinion.

I just calls 'em as I see 'em. So far I haven't seen anyone including you really take issue with my perception, except that I agreed with you that it was inaccurate to say not regulated at all.

Just kidding about the fucking moron. : ) Though honestly, people who hurl insults the most IMO are the ones most deserving of the insults the hurl.

I was just sayin...

Yeah, because usually it's the fucking morons who will admit to having phrased something inaccurately in a debate. I've noticed that too.