Ancient Church Fathers by Ken Johnson Th.d.

[Chuckt]

If there are any "pre-trib" rapture believers reading this thread can you please explain what your understanding of "the last day" is? Christians won't be caught up with Christ in the clouds until AFTER the dead in Christ rise first and the Bible says that the dead in Christ won't be raised up until "the last day." Please put this in perspective for me, if you will.

"Day" means "age".

Try Vine's Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words:

Noun Strong's Number: g2250 Greek: hemera
Age:

"a day," is rendered "age" in Luk 2:36, "of a great age" (lit., "advanced in many days"). In Luk 3:23 there is no word in the original corresponding to age. The phrase is simply "about thirty years."
See DAY, JUDGMENT, TIME, YEAR.

Blue Letter Bible - Dictionaries

The word is not as specific as you might want to understand it to be.

 

[DriftingSand]

If there are any "pre-trib" rapture believers reading this thread can you please explain what your understanding of "the last day" is? Christians won't be caught up with Christ in the clouds until AFTER the dead in Christ rise first and the Bible says that the dead in Christ won't be raised up until "the last day." Please put this in perspective for me, if you will.

"Day" means "age".

Try Vine's Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words:

Noun Strong's Number: g2250 Greek: hemera
Age:

"a day," is rendered "age" in Luk 2:36, "of a great age" (lit., "advanced in many days"). In Luk 3:23 there is no word in the original corresponding to age. The phrase is simply "about thirty years."
See DAY, JUDGMENT, TIME, YEAR.

Blue Letter Bible - Dictionaries

The word is not as specific as you might want to understand it to be.

So Christ's return will be "age" long? Or will it be in a "moment" in the "twinkling of an eye?"

 

[DriftingSand]

If there are any "pre-trib" rapture believers reading this thread can you please explain what your understanding of "the last day" is? Christians won't be caught up with Christ in the clouds until AFTER the dead in Christ rise first and the Bible says that the dead in Christ won't be raised up until "the last day." Please put this in perspective for me, if you will.

"Day" means "age".

Try Vine's Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words:

Noun Strong's Number: g2250 Greek: hemera
Age:

"a day," is rendered "age" in Luk 2:36, "of a great age" (lit., "advanced in many days"). In Luk 3:23 there is no word in the original corresponding to age. The phrase is simply "about thirty years."
See DAY, JUDGMENT, TIME, YEAR.

Blue Letter Bible - Dictionaries

The word is not as specific as you might want to understand it to be.

Sorry I couldn't type more earlier. I was trying to catch up on my "repping."

The word "day" CAN mean an age or "a thousand years" or it can mean one day as in "the morning and the evening" are a day.

I don't believe that Christ and His angels will need a thousand years to return to earth and clean it up. I believe that it will occur within a standard "day."

1 Corinthians 15:52, "In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed."

 

[Chuckt]

If there are any "pre-trib" rapture believers reading this thread can you please explain what your understanding of "the last day" is? Christians won't be caught up with Christ in the clouds until AFTER the dead in Christ rise first and the Bible says that the dead in Christ won't be raised up until "the last day." Please put this in perspective for me, if you will.

"Day" means "age".

Try Vine's Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words:

Noun Strong's Number: g2250 Greek: hemera
Age:

"a day," is rendered "age" in Luk 2:36, "of a great age" (lit., "advanced in many days"). In Luk 3:23 there is no word in the original corresponding to age. The phrase is simply "about thirty years."
See DAY, JUDGMENT, TIME, YEAR.

Blue Letter Bible - Dictionaries

The word is not as specific as you might want to understand it to be.

So Christ's return will be "age" long? Or will it be in a "moment" in the "twinkling of an eye?"

Matthew 24:36 "But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.

Acts 1:7 He said to them: "It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority.

Would you claim that we should know?

 

[Chuckt]

"Day" means "age".

Try Vine's Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words:

Blue Letter Bible - Dictionaries

The word is not as specific as you might want to understand it to be.

So Christ's return will be "age" long? Or will it be in a "moment" in the "twinkling of an eye?"

Matthew 24:36 "But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.

Acts 1:7 He said to them: "It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority.

Would you claim that we should know?

If you have free will and knew certain events, what is the probability that man could thwart God because man could change the future? For God to have certain results, He can't tell us as long as we have free will.

 

[DriftingSand]

The folks of Sodom and Gomorrah experienced "God's wrath" and yet Lot and family experienced it while on earth. The folks of Noah's day experienced "God's wrath" and yet Noah and family felt the vibrations of God's wrath first hand. Both faithful groups were spared any harm (save Lot's wife) but they were first hand witnesses to the wrath of God. Matthew says that the tribulation to come will be like it was in the time of Noah:

Matthew 24:37, "But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be."

Christ shall return and bring His wrath with Him.

Matthew 13:38-43, "38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.
41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear."

Where are the "righteous" during this time of tribulation? Right in the same "field" as "the tares." Who are removed from the world at this time? The tares are plucked up while the wheat remain.

In a pre-tribulation rapture, what would a timeline look like?

Present Age / Rapture / Tribulation / Millenial Age

Where do you place certain events like this one (Revelation 20:3)?

Revelation 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

Where do you put the loosening of Satan? Revelation 20:3 says it is after 1,000 years. I would place it at the end of the millennial reign of Christ while others would put it during the tribulation because maybe they are a-millennialists (no millennium).

So when would the righteous be separated from the wicked? At the end of the tribulation or at the end of the millennium? That effects your timeline for a pre-tribulation rapture timeline. You can have any timeline you want for your beliefs but according to a pre-tribulation rapture timeline, you have to be able to place these events to answer your question.

During the tribulation, there are going to be babies born. Do you separate the righteous from the wicked then or do you wait until the end?

Present Age / Tribulation / Christ's return / Rapture / Satan bound / Millenial Age / Satan released for a time. (I'm not hardcore on this conclusion)

 

[DriftingSand]

"Day" means "age".

Try Vine's Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words:

Blue Letter Bible - Dictionaries

The word is not as specific as you might want to understand it to be.

So Christ's return will be "age" long? Or will it be in a "moment" in the "twinkling of an eye?"

Matthew 24:36 "But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.

Acts 1:7 He said to them: "It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority.

Would you claim that we should know?

I don't know or pretend to know the actual date or day of His return but the Bible says that the dead will rise on "the last day" which is the same day that Christ returns -- in a moment -- in the twinkling of an eye.

 

[DriftingSand]

So Christ's return will be "age" long? Or will it be in a "moment" in the "twinkling of an eye?"

Matthew 24:36 "But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.

Acts 1:7 He said to them: "It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority.

Would you claim that we should know?

If you have free will and knew certain events, what is the probability that man could thwart God because man could change the future? For God to have certain results, He can't tell us as long as we have free will.

Knowing the date of Christ's return is a different topic and I happen to agree with you that no man knows but we're also told to pay attention to the times and the seasons like "watchmen on a wall." We can get a sense by paying attention to world and social events that the time of Christ's return is nearing.

 

[Chuckt]

Here are some previous posts. I don't have time to read them but I am looking for past posts I posted. It would be great if we had an index feature for certain topics.

You might find some interesting things I've posted. If you can, post here instead of there so we know where the messages are.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/religion-and-ethics/313901-the-rapture.html

http://www.usmessageboard.com/relig...ng-an-ancient-pre-trib-rapture-statement.html