America: “You have the RIGHT to an attorney”.....but not a doctor right guys?

[Westender]

The right to an attorney is in the Constitution. The right to a doctor isn't. The right to a doctor is simply something that the "Greatest Christian Nation" in the world should provide. After all Communist Cuba is even able to do that.

Heck what is odd is the "Greatest Christian Nation" in the world even tried to stop that from happening. Makes no sense to me.

If you are a burden to society do the honorable thing and jump oof a tall building and I am still a Democrat as far as my desig ation in the state of Florida. I will be changing that soon. I was a honorable Kennedy Democrat, "ask not what your country can do for you but what you can do for your country " I dont even recognize this disgusti g bunch now

 

[hadit]

And you do if you have health insurance. You pay a lot for it.

I do. We can do better. Other countries do.

You wanna give the government half of your paycheck and take public transportation or pay $7 a gallon for gasoline?

No, you can do that if you like. Besides like I've said many times......we aren't paying for things now.....why do we have to start with health care?

If you want National socialist healthcare, then be prepared to give half your paycheck to the government and use public transportation or pay $7 for a gallon gasoline. Check it out yourself.

National health care can be done for less than we pay now.

Not as well.

 

[pknopp]

Is the right to a doctor in the Constitution?

Funny.

Obamacare said 1) I could keep my plan, 2) keep my doctor and that 3) I would save at least $2500 a year.

Obamacare lied.

Now what?

How many times has Trump lied?

Obamacare stopped your prices from going up more than they have. You should thank Obama if your premiums only doubled. Without obamacare they would have quadrupled.
You lost your doctor? I don't know many people who lost their doctor. I think this is just a thing you guys say but really, did you really lose your doctor?

If a person bought their policy on the exchange they didn't have to lose their doctor. All they had to do was find the policy that included their doctor. It's not hard. I had to do that this year when I lost my employer provided insurance of more than 30 years. All I had to do was ask for a policy that included my existing doctors. It's wasn't hard.

It's employer provided insurance that people lose their doctor. Employees have no say and usually no choice in what health care their employer provides. The employer does that. The employer chooses what policy to get and what it covers. Not the employee or individual. People lose their doctors all the time because of employer provided insurance.

My doctor is in one state. My insurance covered me. My wife also has insurance through the state we live in. (She worked for the city). Both of us are retiring. We will have to go with my wife's insurance as we can't afford mine.

I'll have to find a new doctor.

 

[hadit]

The constitution mandates the one, not the other.

You are supposed to pay for it. I'm perfectly willing to pay for health care.

And you do if you have health insurance. You pay a lot for it.

I do. We can do better. Other countries do.

And many of those countries depend on our military spending to afford it. Think about how much more France, Italy, and Greece for example, would be paying for defense if the US didn't have a strong presence in Europe. Add to that the billions that we pump into their economies and they can afford socialized medicine. Take us out of the equation and they wouldn't be able to spend as much. That's obvious.

Our presence isn't there to protect these other countries.

Evidence?

 

[hadit]

And you do if you have health insurance. You pay a lot for it.

I do. We can do better. Other countries do.

You wanna give the government half of your paycheck and take public transportation or pay $7 a gallon for gasoline?

No, you can do that if you like. Besides like I've said many times......we aren't paying for things now.....why do we have to start with health care?

Start? We already are. And yes, we're paying for things now, because all that debt generates interest charges that eat up every increasing amounts of the budget. That's money we can't spend elsewhere.

Interest should have bankrupted us but we manipulate the monetary system, something we condemn other countries for when they do it.

We still have to pay for everything, one way or the other. That's the point, so don't try to duck it.

 

[hadit]

You are supposed to pay for it. I'm perfectly willing to pay for health care.

And you do if you have health insurance. You pay a lot for it.

I do. We can do better. Other countries do.

And many of those countries depend on our military spending to afford it. Think about how much more France, Italy, and Greece for example, would be paying for defense if the US didn't have a strong presence in Europe. Add to that the billions that we pump into their economies and they can afford socialized medicine. Take us out of the equation and they wouldn't be able to spend as much. That's obvious.

Our presence isn't there to protect these other countries.

It's to protect CocaCola so they can sell their shit to the people in those countries. That's why Coca Cola should be paying more in taxes not less.

Evidence?

 

[DGS49]

I admit I haven't followed this thread, but the OP caught my attention. It is disturbing that so many people are constitutionally illiterate. The Sixth Amendment to the Constitution states that every accused person has a RIGHT to "...the Assistance of Counsel for his defence." For the first two hundred years or so of the Republic, this was deemed to mean that the Government could not PREVENT anyone from obtaining the assistance of an attorney, but the Leftist Supreme Court more recently decided that the "right" to counsel is rather meaningless if you don't have the money to afford an attorney. So the right to have counsel was reinterpreted to mean that, if you didn't have the means to afford an attorney, a GOVERNMENT attorney would be provided to assist in your defense. And in order to make this Right a reality, it was necessary for thousands and thousands of government attorneys to be hired, and thousands more attorneys were invited to work FOR THE GOVERNMENT on a contract basis.

There is no such provision in the Constitution concerning medical care. Hence, the is no Constitutional RIght to medical care. Maybe this is good and maybe not, but the fact remains, this is not something that the Government (WE, the Taxpayers) is required to pay for.

But there is another twist: The powers of the Federal Government to SPEND MONEY are detailed in Article I, Section 8 of the COnstitution. The list is COMPREHENSIVE. How do we know the list is comprehensive? Because of the Tenth Amendment, which states in essence that the powers of the Federal Government as detailed in the Constitution are EXCLUSIVE, with any and all OTHER powers reserved for the States and the private sector.

So when we hear the politicians HINTING about providing "free" healthcare for everybody, they are being devious. It can't happen without a Constitutional Amendment.

You may be asking yourself, "What about Social Security and Medicare?" There is nothing in Article I about them!

Well, those two unconstitutional programs are constructed on the sandy soil of a FICTION. The Fiction is that Social Security and Medicare spending are NOT a case of Congress allocating and the GOvernment spending money. They are merely a case of the People dumping money into a "Trust Fund," from which their benefits will be drawn when the time comes. In effect, it's not "tax" money, it is "trust fund" money.

But this is bullshit and the USSC has confirmed that it is bullshit - while continuing to allow these unconstitutional programs to carry on. You want proof that there is no Trust Fund. Consider my uncle George. Never married, he spent his entire life working, and he continued working until he was seventy, to maximize his SS benefit when the time came. But he DIED when he turned 70. What do you suppose happened to the hundreds of thousands of dollars he and his employers deposited into the Social Security Trust Fund for him?

Poof. Gonzo. Like it never existed.

The Federal Government is PROHIBITED from establishing health care as a "right" (like the right of Counsel) without a Constitutional Amendment, which will not happen in the lifetime of anyone now living.

Sorry/

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Obama did. See I do not deny that nor did I support much of anything Obama did so yours really is not a valid rebuttal.

The budget was not funded. It ran us into another trillion dollars in debt (just like Obama).

The thing is Obama didn't do that.

The bush boy took our national debt to nearly 13 trillion dollars. He kept most of his wars off the general budget. Funding for it was mostly done by "emergency" spending bills. When Obama took office that debt was added to the general budget. Over night it shot up from 10 trillion to nearly 13 trillion dollars.

Obama started with a national debt of just short of 13 trillion dollars. He took that debt up to 19. trillion.

He added 6 trillion to the national debt. He also slashed the deficit by nearly 1 trillion dollars. The bush boy left a new historic high in deficit and over 1 trillion for the first time in our history. That deficit was 1.4 trillion when Obama took office. When Obama left office it was 400 and something billion. Which is nearly 1 trillion decrease in deficit. If he had more time or the republicans had worked with him, he would have eliminated that deficit and started to work on lowering the debt, just as Clinton was doing. Then the bush boy came along and blew it all up.

Obama got at least a little control on it but trump is president now and it's back to being out of control.

I really wish people would be honest.

Obama ran up the debt. Argue if you wish that you believe he had valid reasons to but I simply noted that like Trump he cut taxes and ran up the debt. He did.

Yes Obama ran up debt. Just not the amount that the republican you replied to stated.

All presidents do. However Obama was handed an economy in free fall. He had to spend to save our economy. It's basic economics. If he had not done that all you have to do is look at what hoover did to cause that depression and for it to last for as long as it did and for it to get worse than it could have been if the proper economic policy had been followed at the time.

While all presidents do incur debt, democratic presidents do it at a much slower rate. At least since reagan. Since that time it's been republican presidents who add huge amounts to our national debt and budget deficit. Clinton had the reagan/bush budget deficit eliminated. He balanced that mess reagan/bush left him. Created hundreds of billions in surplus, added to the national debt at a much slower rate than reagan/bush, had paid back the money reagan/bush had stolen from social security and and stopped the theft from the fund. He left a plan to have that reagan/bush national debt paid by 2010. Clinton wrote balanced budgets. reagan/bush never did that. The bush boy came next. He like reagan/bush before him, never wrote a balanced budget, he restarted the theft from social security, drastically slashed taxes and kept most of his war spending off the general budget. He left office while our economy was collapsing. Obama was handed just under 13 trillion in national debt and 1.4 trillion in budget deficit. He took that national debt to over 19 trillion and slashed the budget deficit by nearly 1 trillion down to 400 and something billion.

Obama didn't cut our taxes. He increased taxes on the rich and left the rates the same for everyone else. The bush boy tax cuts were going to expire. A part of the stimulus was keeping the tax rates the same on everyone but the rich.

We were lied to. The reason we have Trump is because President Obama was not the person Candidate Obama said he would be.

That's why Sanders is doing so well. Basically Sanders platform is Obama's original platform.

Did the establishment know he was lying cause them to not panic like they are doing with Sanders?

Oh yes, Obama lied to us about many things. He brought many from the private investment and Wall Street sector to his administration just like presidents before him. He was corporate just as the establishment is. The establishment is corporate America. It has been for a very long time.

He spent like all presidents do but not at as high rate as republicans before him.

He wouldn't have had to rescue the economy if it wasn't collapsing as he was being sworn in.

He had a congress that didn't work with him. Even to the point that budgets became continuing bills from the old budget because congress refused to compromise and allow democracy to work properly. They filibustered everything sent to the Senate from the House in the first 2 years. When the House went to republican hands, almost every bill in the senate was filibustered by the republicans until they took control of the senate. Then the democrats filibustered everything when they lost the majority. If the congress had worked with Obama I think more things could have been done.

I don't know why the democratic establishment is panicking. I've been a registered Independent since 1978. They should know that most of what Sanders wants to do has to go through congress and congress isn't going to pass much of any of it.

So we get what we have had since Obama. Government by executive order.

If the congress had worked with Obama I think more things could have been done.

Like Obama said, “You don’t like a particular policy or a particular president? Then argue for your position. Go out there and win an election. Push to change it,”

He also said, "Elections have consequences"

 

[rightwinger]

Top 10 Reasons People Go Bankrupt | HuffPost

Nobody should have to file for bankruptcy because they get sick.

they don't. What that article fails to accurately describe is that, yes, most bankruptcies include some medical bills, but no bankruptcies occur only because of medical bills. It also does not address the FACT that unpaid medical bills are almost always written off by the hospital or medical provider. Medical providers do not take people to court for unpaid medical bills.

your article is bullshit

Of course bankruptcies are because of medical bills. Yes, if you are going to file you are going to include everything but those other things are getting paid without the medical bills.

No one should have to file for bankruptcy because they get sick.

no one files bankruptcy simply because they get sick. Thats a bullshit lie.

Happens all the time
What do you think happens with overwhelming medical bills?

they get written off by the medical provider, no one files bankruptcy solely due to medical bills. YOU are lying as you do every day on this board.

You think they just ignore massive medical bills?

That’s what collection agencies are for

 

[rightwinger]

The thing is Obama didn't do that.

The bush boy took our national debt to nearly 13 trillion dollars. He kept most of his wars off the general budget. Funding for it was mostly done by "emergency" spending bills. When Obama took office that debt was added to the general budget. Over night it shot up from 10 trillion to nearly 13 trillion dollars.

Obama started with a national debt of just short of 13 trillion dollars. He took that debt up to 19. trillion.

He added 6 trillion to the national debt. He also slashed the deficit by nearly 1 trillion dollars. The bush boy left a new historic high in deficit and over 1 trillion for the first time in our history. That deficit was 1.4 trillion when Obama took office. When Obama left office it was 400 and something billion. Which is nearly 1 trillion decrease in deficit. If he had more time or the republicans had worked with him, he would have eliminated that deficit and started to work on lowering the debt, just as Clinton was doing. Then the bush boy came along and blew it all up.

Obama got at least a little control on it but trump is president now and it's back to being out of control.

I really wish people would be honest.

Obama ran up the debt. Argue if you wish that you believe he had valid reasons to but I simply noted that like Trump he cut taxes and ran up the debt. He did.

Yes Obama ran up debt. Just not the amount that the republican you replied to stated.

All presidents do. However Obama was handed an economy in free fall. He had to spend to save our economy. It's basic economics. If he had not done that all you have to do is look at what hoover did to cause that depression and for it to last for as long as it did and for it to get worse than it could have been if the proper economic policy had been followed at the time.

While all presidents do incur debt, democratic presidents do it at a much slower rate. At least since reagan. Since that time it's been republican presidents who add huge amounts to our national debt and budget deficit. Clinton had the reagan/bush budget deficit eliminated. He balanced that mess reagan/bush left him. Created hundreds of billions in surplus, added to the national debt at a much slower rate than reagan/bush, had paid back the money reagan/bush had stolen from social security and and stopped the theft from the fund. He left a plan to have that reagan/bush national debt paid by 2010. Clinton wrote balanced budgets. reagan/bush never did that. The bush boy came next. He like reagan/bush before him, never wrote a balanced budget, he restarted the theft from social security, drastically slashed taxes and kept most of his war spending off the general budget. He left office while our economy was collapsing. Obama was handed just under 13 trillion in national debt and 1.4 trillion in budget deficit. He took that national debt to over 19 trillion and slashed the budget deficit by nearly 1 trillion down to 400 and something billion.

Obama didn't cut our taxes. He increased taxes on the rich and left the rates the same for everyone else. The bush boy tax cuts were going to expire. A part of the stimulus was keeping the tax rates the same on everyone but the rich.

We were lied to. The reason we have Trump is because President Obama was not the person Candidate Obama said he would be.

That's why Sanders is doing so well. Basically Sanders platform is Obama's original platform.

Did the establishment know he was lying cause them to not panic like they are doing with Sanders?

Oh yes, Obama lied to us about many things. He brought many from the private investment and Wall Street sector to his administration just like presidents before him. He was corporate just as the establishment is. The establishment is corporate America. It has been for a very long time.

He spent like all presidents do but not at as high rate as republicans before him.

He wouldn't have had to rescue the economy if it wasn't collapsing as he was being sworn in.

He had a congress that didn't work with him. Even to the point that budgets became continuing bills from the old budget because congress refused to compromise and allow democracy to work properly. They filibustered everything sent to the Senate from the House in the first 2 years. When the House went to republican hands, almost every bill in the senate was filibustered by the republicans until they took control of the senate. Then the democrats filibustered everything when they lost the majority. If the congress had worked with Obama I think more things could have been done.

I don't know why the democratic establishment is panicking. I've been a registered Independent since 1978. They should know that most of what Sanders wants to do has to go through congress and congress isn't going to pass much of any of it.

So we get what we have had since Obama. Government by executive order.

If the congress had worked with Obama I think more things could have been done.

Like Obama said, “You don’t like a particular policy or a particular president? Then argue for your position. Go out there and win an election. Push to change it,”

He also said, "Elections have consequences"

He was also willing to work with Republicans for the good of the country.

Republicans weren’t

 

[pknopp]

The right to an attorney is in the Constitution. The right to a doctor isn't. The right to a doctor is simply something that the "Greatest Christian Nation" in the world should provide. After all Communist Cuba is even able to do that.

Heck what is odd is the "Greatest Christian Nation" in the world even tried to stop that from happening. Makes no sense to me.

If you are a burden to society do the honorable thing and jump oof a tall building and I am still a Democrat as far as my desig ation in the state of Florida. I will be changing that soon. I was a honorable Kennedy Democrat, "ask not what your country can do for you but what you can do for your country " I dont even recognize this disgusti g bunch now

It would have been raining bankers in 2008 if that was the solution.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Obama ran up the debt. Argue if you wish that you believe he had valid reasons to but I simply noted that like Trump he cut taxes and ran up the debt. He did.

Yes Obama ran up debt. Just not the amount that the republican you replied to stated.

All presidents do. However Obama was handed an economy in free fall. He had to spend to save our economy. It's basic economics. If he had not done that all you have to do is look at what hoover did to cause that depression and for it to last for as long as it did and for it to get worse than it could have been if the proper economic policy had been followed at the time.

While all presidents do incur debt, democratic presidents do it at a much slower rate. At least since reagan. Since that time it's been republican presidents who add huge amounts to our national debt and budget deficit. Clinton had the reagan/bush budget deficit eliminated. He balanced that mess reagan/bush left him. Created hundreds of billions in surplus, added to the national debt at a much slower rate than reagan/bush, had paid back the money reagan/bush had stolen from social security and and stopped the theft from the fund. He left a plan to have that reagan/bush national debt paid by 2010. Clinton wrote balanced budgets. reagan/bush never did that. The bush boy came next. He like reagan/bush before him, never wrote a balanced budget, he restarted the theft from social security, drastically slashed taxes and kept most of his war spending off the general budget. He left office while our economy was collapsing. Obama was handed just under 13 trillion in national debt and 1.4 trillion in budget deficit. He took that national debt to over 19 trillion and slashed the budget deficit by nearly 1 trillion down to 400 and something billion.

Obama didn't cut our taxes. He increased taxes on the rich and left the rates the same for everyone else. The bush boy tax cuts were going to expire. A part of the stimulus was keeping the tax rates the same on everyone but the rich.

We were lied to. The reason we have Trump is because President Obama was not the person Candidate Obama said he would be.

That's why Sanders is doing so well. Basically Sanders platform is Obama's original platform.

Did the establishment know he was lying cause them to not panic like they are doing with Sanders?

Oh yes, Obama lied to us about many things. He brought many from the private investment and Wall Street sector to his administration just like presidents before him. He was corporate just as the establishment is. The establishment is corporate America. It has been for a very long time.

He spent like all presidents do but not at as high rate as republicans before him.

He wouldn't have had to rescue the economy if it wasn't collapsing as he was being sworn in.

He had a congress that didn't work with him. Even to the point that budgets became continuing bills from the old budget because congress refused to compromise and allow democracy to work properly. They filibustered everything sent to the Senate from the House in the first 2 years. When the House went to republican hands, almost every bill in the senate was filibustered by the republicans until they took control of the senate. Then the democrats filibustered everything when they lost the majority. If the congress had worked with Obama I think more things could have been done.

I don't know why the democratic establishment is panicking. I've been a registered Independent since 1978. They should know that most of what Sanders wants to do has to go through congress and congress isn't going to pass much of any of it.

So we get what we have had since Obama. Government by executive order.

If the congress had worked with Obama I think more things could have been done.

Like Obama said, “You don’t like a particular policy or a particular president? Then argue for your position. Go out there and win an election. Push to change it,”

He also said, "Elections have consequences"

He was also willing to work with Republicans for the good of the country.

Republicans weren’t

He was also willing to work with Republicans for the good of the country.

When he had the majorities, he told Republicans, "they gotta sit in back" and "I won"

After the Republicans won the House, his idea of "work with Republicans" was, they could
do what he wanted.

His actual attempts at bipartisanship were non-existent.

​

 

[pknopp]

I do. We can do better. Other countries do.

You wanna give the government half of your paycheck and take public transportation or pay $7 a gallon for gasoline?

No, you can do that if you like. Besides like I've said many times......we aren't paying for things now.....why do we have to start with health care?

If you want National socialist healthcare, then be prepared to give half your paycheck to the government and use public transportation or pay $7 for a gallon gasoline. Check it out yourself.

National health care can be done for less than we pay now.

Not as well.

You don't have much faith in the "greatest country in the world".

 

[pknopp]

You are supposed to pay for it. I'm perfectly willing to pay for health care.

And you do if you have health insurance. You pay a lot for it.

I do. We can do better. Other countries do.

And many of those countries depend on our military spending to afford it. Think about how much more France, Italy, and Greece for example, would be paying for defense if the US didn't have a strong presence in Europe. Add to that the billions that we pump into their economies and they can afford socialized medicine. Take us out of the equation and they wouldn't be able to spend as much. That's obvious.

Our presence isn't there to protect these other countries.

Evidence?

Who is going to attack Germany?

 

[BS Filter]

You wanna give the government half of your paycheck and take public transportation or pay $7 a gallon for gasoline?

No, you can do that if you like. Besides like I've said many times......we aren't paying for things now.....why do we have to start with health care?

If you want National socialist healthcare, then be prepared to give half your paycheck to the government and use public transportation or pay $7 for a gallon gasoline. Check it out yourself.

National health care can be done for less than we pay now.

Oh yeah. Better go check the meter where you parked your unicorn

Other countries do it. Once again you are arguing we can't do what every other first world and some third world countries do.

Countries with government run healthcare for everyone take half your paycheck. Is that what you want?

 

[Sun Devil 92]

The right to an attorney is in the Constitution. The right to a doctor isn't. The right to a doctor is simply something that the "Greatest Christian Nation" in the world should provide. After all Communist Cuba is even able to do that.

Heck what is odd is the "Greatest Christian Nation" in the world even tried to stop that from happening. Makes no sense to me.

While the right answer is out there somewhere, nobody is holding the conversation.

If you start with the conclusion....you get what you have now....nothing.

What should we provide. I have an opinion. I am willing to discuss it. When you tell me the answer.....without listening to me....I shut my hears and label you an asshole.

You say you want to discuss this and then call me a name. No, not interested.

It's unfortunate:

1. You don't have very good comprehension
2. You get butthurt so easily

 

[pknopp]

No, you can do that if you like. Besides like I've said many times......we aren't paying for things now.....why do we have to start with health care?

If you want National socialist healthcare, then be prepared to give half your paycheck to the government and use public transportation or pay $7 for a gallon gasoline. Check it out yourself.

National health care can be done for less than we pay now.

Oh yeah. Better go check the meter where you parked your unicorn

Other countries do it. Once again you are arguing we can't do what every other first world and some third world countries do.

Countries with government run healthcare for everyone take half your paycheck. Is that what you want?

There is no standard tax rate anywhere.

The tax rate in Germany is between 14 and 42 percent.

In France 0% to 45%.

Switzerland? 10 to 40%.

 

[BS Filter]

If you want National socialist healthcare, then be prepared to give half your paycheck to the government and use public transportation or pay $7 for a gallon gasoline. Check it out yourself.

National health care can be done for less than we pay now.

Oh yeah. Better go check the meter where you parked your unicorn

Other countries do it. Once again you are arguing we can't do what every other first world and some third world countries do.

Countries with government run healthcare for everyone take half your paycheck. Is that what you want?

There is no standard tax rate anywhere.

The tax rate in Germany is between 14 and 42 percent.

In France 0% to 45%.

Switzerland? 10 to 40%.

Link to your source.

 

[pknopp]

National health care can be done for less than we pay now.

Oh yeah. Better go check the meter where you parked your unicorn

Other countries do it. Once again you are arguing we can't do what every other first world and some third world countries do.

Countries with government run healthcare for everyone take half your paycheck. Is that what you want?

There is no standard tax rate anywhere.

The tax rate in Germany is between 14 and 42 percent.

In France 0% to 45%.

Switzerland? 10 to 40%.

Link to your source.

Because you provided a link to your claims?

 

[BS Filter]

Oh yeah. Better go check the meter where you parked your unicorn

Other countries do it. Once again you are arguing we can't do what every other first world and some third world countries do.

Countries with government run healthcare for everyone take half your paycheck. Is that what you want?

There is no standard tax rate anywhere.

The tax rate in Germany is between 14 and 42 percent.

In France 0% to 45%.

Switzerland? 10 to 40%.

Link to your source.

Because you provided a link to your claims?

Common knowledge. Your claim that government run healthcare for everyone will cost less than now is a lie.