America: Then and Now

[SweetSue92]

The 60’s were the worst time in history. Vietnam, Civil Rights protests, rampant assassinations

50’s were great if you were white and Christian

70’s gave us Watergate and runaway inflation

80’s was the Reagan era which was pretty good, so was the 90’s with Bill Clinton. We were at peace and the economy was good

Yeah Vietnam must have sucked. But I'm surprised you didn't think the Civil Rights movement a big plus. Huh.

I only remember the late 70s which was not good. That's why I said the early 70s.

So yeah, I guess the 80s and 90s.

 

[SweetSue92]

Lincoln was a liberal

Right, and all the bigoted Southern Democrats weren't really Democrats. Biden is a florid bigot. Is he not really a Democrat either? lol

 

[SweetSue92]

To paraphrase from the Hadith, one of Muhammad's last instructions;
"I have been commanded by Allah to fight all of mankind until all of mankind has embraced Islam."

A study of the Koran/Qur'an, Hadith, and Sira reveal that Islam believes that Paradise/Heaven is of many levels. A peaceful and non-violent Muslim only attains the lowest level(basement so to speak). To attain higher levels and greater rewards depends on being a holy warrior (mudjadeen) and engaging in Holy War/Jihad. More successful at such the higher the level and rewards in Paradise/Heaven.
...

Islamic Scriptures

WikiIslam portal for articles about Islamic Scriptures

www.wikiislam.net

This would suggest that Islam is a prescription for perpetual conflict/war and one of reasonable intelligence should be concerned about what this means for everyone here on Earth. Islamophobic is comparable to being Naziphobic.

Largest amount of genocide against the Native Americans occurred with initial explorations and colonizations by Spanish and Portuguese in the 16th and 17th centuries.

It was the near 90% decline of that indigenous population that hand those two nations start the process of import of slaves, mostly from Africa.

Many of those "pioneers" were first generation immigrants from parts of Europe whom came to the USA and disregarded Federal treaties with the Native Americans.

Oh, Joe must be calling me names again, huh? I have him on perma-ignore. Poor Joe.

 

[JoeB131]

To paraphrase from the Hadith, one of Muhammad's last instructions;
"I have been commanded by Allah to fight all of mankind until all of mankind has embraced Islam."

A study of the Koran/Qur'an, Hadith, and Sira reveal that Islam believes that Paradise/Heaven is of many levels. A peaceful and non-violent Muslim only attains the lowest level(basement so to speak). To attain higher levels and greater rewards depends on being a holy warrior (mudjadeen) and engaging in Holy War/Jihad. More successful at such the higher the level and rewards in Paradise/Heaven.

Oh, look, another Islamophobic Twat who read a few out of context verses on an Islamphobic website and thinks he understands the beliefs of 1.3 BILLION Muslims.

I could cherry pick more than a few bible verses that would make Christians look quite bad....

 

[rightwinger]

Yeah Vietnam must have sucked. But I'm surprised you didn't think the Civil Rights movement a big plus. Huh.

I only remember the late 70s which was not good. That's why I said the early 70s.

So yeah, I guess the 80s and 90s.

There was a lot of violence related to Civil Rights…….beating protestors, lynching, bombings
Wasn’t pretty

 

[JoeB131]

Right, and all the bigoted Southern Democrats weren't really Democrats. Biden is a florid bigot. Is he not really a Democrat either? lol

Sure they were Democrats, but they weren't liberals.

Just like the liberal Republicans in the North were Republicans, but they weren't conservatives.

And, no, Biden has had a long record of working for Civil Rights...

 

[rightwinger]

Right, and all the bigoted Southern Democrats weren't really Democrats. Biden is a florid bigot. Is he not really a Democrat either? lol

You are confusing political party with being liberal or conservative

Lincoln was an abolitionist…..most liberal cause of the day

 

[JackOfNoTrades]

Oh....so we should just "go along to get along" with you authoritarians, like when you were all Karens during covid? Ha. No. Sometimes the best answer, actually, USUALLY the best answer, is 'no'.

And I'm not one the conservatives who thinks "old times were always better". Whenever a conservative spouts that opinion, I think of Asian prostitutes on the west coast. Harrowing--I will never forget when I learned of it. They basically kept them in cages, fed them opium, and they were abused constantly. Most women died within a year. This was in the late 1800s. So yeah.

However.

"Progress" is also not always great. You have to weigh everything out.

All you had to do is what you constantly bray about. Respect other people. Which you wouldn't do.
It was easier to spout "fake news", "plandemic", and "stop the steal".

 

[Correll]

Watched a documentary on Westward Expansion yesterday. These pioneers lived entirely off the land, whole families in one-room log cabins surrounded by panthers and bears. The life expectancy was half what it is now.

I watched a reenactment of a young man chopping wood and a pioneer woman giving birth in a covered wagon, and thought about the "Safe Space" generation who says "Words are violence".

I have never had a more discouraged Fourth of July, and this includes after 9/11, the Iraq War, all of it. All I can say is: I really hope this is low point and we find our fortitude again--and not the hard way.

You are looking at this teh wrong way.


It is impressive the way that those people were able to walk into the wilderness and build a civilization with the tools they carried or had in a small wagon.

BUT, the difference is not so much the people, as the technology of the civilization they were building.


The technology was far simpler. Some hand tools could build a house. Some tools and a bull could build a farm. A decent midwife, adn you had the best medical care available for child birth.

As such, a single man or small group, could have the skills and resources needed to build civilization from the group up.


Today, our roles within our civilization are far more narrow and limited. The requirements for maintaining it, are far vaster and beyond any one man or small group.


If you took a young man of today, most of them could be trained in a few months to have the skills to walk into the woods and build a log cabin and a small dirt farm, and many of them could do it.


But they don't have those skills now, because those skills are useless today.


There is much to despair of with our modern culture. This is not one of them. It is a cool thing that the pioneers were able to do it, but don't feel bad that we cannot today.


If you are ever in Virginia, and get a chance, visit the Birth place of Robert E. Lee. It was a sizable plantation built by people walking into the woods and just building with what was found.


Teh wine cellar was the pit they dug the clay out of, to make bricks. And then they built the house on top of that.


Very cool.

 

[Stryder50]

Oh, look, another Islamophobic Twat who read a few out of context verses on an Islamphobic website and thinks he understands the beliefs of 1.3 BILLION Muslims.

I could cherry pick more than a few bible verses that would make Christians look quite bad....

Oh, look, another neo-Nazi whom doesn't mind global conflicts advancing a religiously biased agenda against Infidels. Fortunately, most of those 1.3 billion Muslims prefer to be apostates and not comply with parts of their scriptures.

Those Bible verses would likely be in the Old Testament and you would be engaging your neo-Nazi bias against the Jews.

As for "Christians", the ones whom would "look quite bad" were neither following nor correctly applying the New Testament. In usual human tradition, they were using religion to advance political agendas. As seen with most of the World's religions.

 

[Stryder50]

There was a lot of violence related to Civil Rights…….beating protestors, lynching, bombings
Wasn’t pretty

Mostly in the Democrat dominated and controlled Southern states.

 

[Stryder50]

Sure they were Democrats, but they weren't liberals.

Just like the liberal Republicans in the North were Republicans, but they weren't conservatives.

And, no, Biden has had a long record of working for Civil Rights...

Bollocks!

Joe Biden has a long record of working for himself via graft from the American taxpayers.

Joe Biden - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[rightwinger]

Mostly in the Democrat dominated and controlled Southern states.

Racial policies in the South existed for 200 years before the Democratic Party was formed

 

[rightwinger]

Yearning for the Good ole days never works

I am in my 60’s and will still take today over any decade in my life.

The internet, smart phones, amazing medical advances…..I would not give them up to go to simpler times

 

[Stryder50]

Racial policies in the South existed for 200 years before the Democratic Party was formed

And continued for over a century after it was formed.
Democratic Party formed in 1828;

Democratic Party (United States) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[rightwinger]

And continued for over a century after it was formed.
Democratic Party formed in 1828;

Democratic Party (United States) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

A reflection of Southern Culture not political affiliation

Democrats in the North supported Civil Rights
Republicans in the South opposed it

 

[JoeB131]

Oh, look, another neo-Nazi whom doesn't mind global conflicts advancing a religiously biased agenda against Infidels. Fortunately, most of those 1.3 billion Muslims prefer to be apostates and not comply with parts of their scriptures.

Those Bible verses would likely be in the Old Testament and you would be engaging your neo-Nazi bias against the Jews.

As for "Christians", the ones whom would "look quite bad" were neither following nor correctly applying the New Testament. In usual human tradition, they were using religion to advance political agendas. As seen with most of the World's religions.

Uh, guy, the Muslims aren't invading us, WE ARE INVADING THEM.

The problem with stupid people like you and Islamophobic Sue is that you think that our conflict with the Middle East is about religion, because religions that aren't yours are ALWAYS scary....whoooo...

We are invading their countries, taking their oil, propping up bad governments, and of course, subsidizing the Zionist takeover of Palestine. THIS is why they hate us, not that their belief if the Sky Pixie is any worse than YOUR belief in the sky pixie.

 

[SweetSue92]

You are looking at this teh wrong way.


It is impressive the way that those people were able to walk into the wilderness and build a civilization with the tools they carried or had in a small wagon.

BUT, the difference is not so much the people, as the technology of the civilization they were building.


The technology was far simpler. Some hand tools could build a house. Some tools and a bull could build a farm. A decent midwife, adn you had the best medical care available for child birth.

As such, a single man or small group, could have the skills and resources needed to build civilization from the group up.


Today, our roles within our civilization are far more narrow and limited. The requirements for maintaining it, are far vaster and beyond any one man or small group.


If you took a young man of today, most of them could be trained in a few months to have the skills to walk into the woods and build a log cabin and a small dirt farm, and many of them could do it.


But they don't have those skills now, because those skills are useless today.


There is much to despair of with our modern culture. This is not one of them. It is a cool thing that the pioneers were able to do it, but don't feel bad that we cannot today.


If you are ever in Virginia, and get a chance, visit the Birth place of Robert E. Lee. It was a sizable plantation built by people walking into the woods and just building with what was found.


Teh wine cellar was the pit they dug the clay out of, to make bricks. And then they built the house on top of that.


Very cool.

Agree with all of this.

I think I could have been more clear--what I really think we're missing is fortitude and perseverance. In whatever way that manifests--it does not have to be chopping wood. We are losing that American "can do" attitude...to the point where it's not even seen as an asset anymore.

 

[SweetSue92]

Yearning for the Good ole days never works

I am in my 60’s and will still take today over any decade in my life.

The internet, smart phones, amazing medical advances…..I would not give them up to go to simpler times

The internet--a net positive, with a lot of downsides

Smartphones--same, with TONS of downsides for babies and children. I could probably write a book, or at least bore you with a very long post

Medical advances--a mixed bag. People are turning to more natural remedies and I don't think that's a bad thing. There is serious rot and corruption in pharma companies.

RW, you are a decent guy to talk to when you get past the talking points.

 

[Correll]

Agree with all of this.

I think I could have been more clear--what I really think we're missing is fortitude and perseverance. In whatever way that manifests--it does not have to be chopping wood. We are losing that American "can do" attitude...to the point where it's not even seen as an asset anymore.

Yes, that is true. Hell, we are losing EVERYTHING, that can be called "American".