Why Romney’s so afraid of talking about what he did at Bain

[OODA_Loop]

So you think it's more critical to know Obama's grade in freshman English comp 30 years ago than where Mitt hid money in 2009?

I think how he played his citizenship and ethnicity for benefit could be reasonably revealed in those upper scholastic records.

It is not an unknown occurence of late in one of the same instutions.

 

[8537]

So you think it's more critical to know Obama's grade in freshman English comp 30 years ago than where Mitt hid money in 2009?

I think how he played his citizenship and ethnicity for benefit could be reasonably revealed in those upper scholastic records.

It is not an unknown occurence of late in one of the same instutions.

Oh, you think he should produce his college transcript in order to prove he's American?

I'm not sure if you're emulating Trump or Sununu, but that tin foil is wearing thin.

 

[L.K.Eder]

Or how spectacularly the Obama administration has moved the chess pieces and made Romney's biggest perceived strength into his greatest weakness, leading the narrative completely and defining Romney before Romney had a chance to do so.

It looks like they just lucked out. I doubt they expected Team Romney would be so incompetent as to help them escalate the issue to this degree.

You would think that a guy who has been running for president for ten years would be better at this.

he wasn't actually running all these times. it was just too complicated to remove his name from the campaign merchandise.

 

[Dot Com]

Yawn.

President Romney is going to crucify the man-child Barry Hussein Sotereo (or whatever the fuck his name is) in the debates before winning the Oval Office in November's election.

Your lame-dick party's over Liberals. Your boy has trashed this country, the economy and the greatest health care system in the world - not to mention raging countless illegal wars.

 

[Dot Com]

Until they are released one cannot help but think there is something in those returns that would be worse for Romney than all the flack he is now getting.

Anyone think he can get away without releasing them. No one else has.

Far from being an astute business man he now appears to be more like a little boy trying to keep the candy a secret.

Or perhaps a crook trying to hide the stash.

Barry Hussein's College Transcripts, anyone?

what'r you going to do if/when he wins reelection asswipe?

 

[Oldstyle]

The Pain in Bain





1. Obama is more eager to make his case about Bain than Romney is. The president is comfortable attacking the negative consequences, if not the fundamental concept of free-market capitalism: outsourcing and offshoring, shuttered factories, cheap Asian imports, declining middle-class wages. These have been familiar resonant notes for Democratic candidates for the past 25 years. Romney, on the other hand, doesn’t much want to defend creative destruction. He boasts about building Bain, but won’t discuss it in detail because it opens up a conversation about those same unattractive consequences: lost jobs, bankruptcies, private pensions dumped onto the federal government. In the case of China, Romney has tried to outhawk Obama, promising to launch what would amount to a trade war beginning his first day in office. When it comes to Detroit, Romney has backed away from his principled position that failed businesses should be allowed to fail. He’s in a corner, because he thinks it’s politically unsound to say what he really believes.




2. It’s not clear that private equity—like other forms of financial innovation—is good for America. You’d think that if private equity made businesses more efficient and valuable overall, there’d be clear evidence to support it, but there isn’t. Private equity firms earn most of their money through financial engineering. A big share of their returns comes from “tax arbitrage”—figuring out how to exploit loopholes to pay less to the government. Because interest is a deductible business expense, debt financing means they often pay little or no corporate tax. Private equity’s reliance on leverage can also magnify short-term earnings without leaving the companies they manage more valuable overall. One legal but dubious practice that private equity firms engage in is paying large “special dividends” out of borrowed money. As Jim Surowiecki of the New Yorker has written, “These dividends created no economic value—they just redistributed money from the company to the private-equity investors.” There’s some anecdotal evidence that the well-regarded Bain has been a better owner than most. But there’s no real way to evaluate that either.




3. Bain shows how Wall Street is rigged in favor of the rich. Private equity firms, like hedge funds, earn their money through a 2-and-20 structure, which means investors pay a 2 percent annual management fee, and give away one-fifth of their profits. According to one study, firms like Bain get two-thirds of of their earnings from fees charged to investors, rather than from the share of profits. According to another study, private equity firms managed to keep 70 percent of all investment profits for themselves, rather than paying them out. They’ve figured out how to be hugely profitable even if they aren’t successful, and even where firms they own go bankrupt. And because their gains come in the form of “carried interest,” private equity owners are taxed at 15 percent, rather than the top corporate rate of 35 percent.




4. Romney’s Bain career is a story about rising inequality. It’s a telling that George Romney, Mitt’s father, made around $200,000 through most of the years he ran American Motors Corporation. Doing work that clearly created jobs, the elder Romney paid an effective tax rate that averaged 37 percent. His son made vastly more running a corporate chop shop in an industry that does not appear to create jobs overall. In 2010, Mitt Romney paid an effective tax rate of 13.9 percent on $21.7 million in investment income—around 14 times as his father much in inflation-adjusted terms. This difference encapsulates the change from corporate titans who lived in the same world as the people who worked for them, in an America with real social mobility, to a financial overclass that makes its own separate rules and has choked off social mobility. The elder Romney wasn’t embarrassed to explain what he’d done as a businessman or to release his tax returns.




5. Bain reminds everybody how rich Romney is, how different that makes him from ordinary people, and how this kind of advantage perpetuates itself. Five years ago, according to disclosure statements, he was already worth between $190 and $250 million, not counting another $70-100 million in trusts for his children and grandchildren, and not counting real estate worth tens of millions more. It’s not clear how he turned a maximum contribution of $450,000 over 15 years at Bain into an IRA worth between $21 and $102 million (where it grows tax free). Here’s some informed speculation. Once again, the details are mysterious even if his massive exploitation of a tax break meant to encourage middle class people to save more is not.

So tell me who "outsourced" more jobs to China...Mitt Romney or Jeff Immelt? Seriously, Synth...explain to me why we shouldn't LAUGH at a President who's primary attack on his challenger is that Romney's been TOO successful and that he did something that Obama's OWN jobs czar did, only Immelt did it on a scale a hundred times larger?

I know that Mitt Romney making so much money "mystifies" the average progressive like yourself because you don't have a CLUE how finance or the economy works. If you DID understand...you wouldn't be supporting the idiot we currently have sitting in the Oval Office.

 

[Sallow]

The Pain in Bain





1. Obama is more eager to make his case about Bain than Romney is. The president is comfortable attacking the negative consequences, if not the fundamental concept of free-market capitalism: outsourcing and offshoring, shuttered factories, cheap Asian imports, declining middle-class wages. These have been familiar resonant notes for Democratic candidates for the past 25 years. Romney, on the other hand, doesn’t much want to defend creative destruction. He boasts about building Bain, but won’t discuss it in detail because it opens up a conversation about those same unattractive consequences: lost jobs, bankruptcies, private pensions dumped onto the federal government. In the case of China, Romney has tried to outhawk Obama, promising to launch what would amount to a trade war beginning his first day in office. When it comes to Detroit, Romney has backed away from his principled position that failed businesses should be allowed to fail. He’s in a corner, because he thinks it’s politically unsound to say what he really believes.




2. It’s not clear that private equity—like other forms of financial innovation—is good for America. You’d think that if private equity made businesses more efficient and valuable overall, there’d be clear evidence to support it, but there isn’t. Private equity firms earn most of their money through financial engineering. A big share of their returns comes from “tax arbitrage”—figuring out how to exploit loopholes to pay less to the government. Because interest is a deductible business expense, debt financing means they often pay little or no corporate tax. Private equity’s reliance on leverage can also magnify short-term earnings without leaving the companies they manage more valuable overall. One legal but dubious practice that private equity firms engage in is paying large “special dividends” out of borrowed money. As Jim Surowiecki of the New Yorker has written, “These dividends created no economic value—they just redistributed money from the company to the private-equity investors.” There’s some anecdotal evidence that the well-regarded Bain has been a better owner than most. But there’s no real way to evaluate that either.




3. Bain shows how Wall Street is rigged in favor of the rich. Private equity firms, like hedge funds, earn their money through a 2-and-20 structure, which means investors pay a 2 percent annual management fee, and give away one-fifth of their profits. According to one study, firms like Bain get two-thirds of of their earnings from fees charged to investors, rather than from the share of profits. According to another study, private equity firms managed to keep 70 percent of all investment profits for themselves, rather than paying them out. They’ve figured out how to be hugely profitable even if they aren’t successful, and even where firms they own go bankrupt. And because their gains come in the form of “carried interest,” private equity owners are taxed at 15 percent, rather than the top corporate rate of 35 percent.




4. Romney’s Bain career is a story about rising inequality. It’s a telling that George Romney, Mitt’s father, made around $200,000 through most of the years he ran American Motors Corporation. Doing work that clearly created jobs, the elder Romney paid an effective tax rate that averaged 37 percent. His son made vastly more running a corporate chop shop in an industry that does not appear to create jobs overall. In 2010, Mitt Romney paid an effective tax rate of 13.9 percent on $21.7 million in investment income—around 14 times as his father much in inflation-adjusted terms. This difference encapsulates the change from corporate titans who lived in the same world as the people who worked for them, in an America with real social mobility, to a financial overclass that makes its own separate rules and has choked off social mobility. The elder Romney wasn’t embarrassed to explain what he’d done as a businessman or to release his tax returns.




5. Bain reminds everybody how rich Romney is, how different that makes him from ordinary people, and how this kind of advantage perpetuates itself. Five years ago, according to disclosure statements, he was already worth between $190 and $250 million, not counting another $70-100 million in trusts for his children and grandchildren, and not counting real estate worth tens of millions more. It’s not clear how he turned a maximum contribution of $450,000 over 15 years at Bain into an IRA worth between $21 and $102 million (where it grows tax free). Here’s some informed speculation. Once again, the details are mysterious even if his massive exploitation of a tax break meant to encourage middle class people to save more is not.

Nicely done.

 

[Sallow]

The Pain in Bain





1. Obama is more eager to make his case about Bain than Romney is. The president is comfortable attacking the negative consequences, if not the fundamental concept of free-market capitalism: outsourcing and offshoring, shuttered factories, cheap Asian imports, declining middle-class wages. These have been familiar resonant notes for Democratic candidates for the past 25 years. Romney, on the other hand, doesn’t much want to defend creative destruction. He boasts about building Bain, but won’t discuss it in detail because it opens up a conversation about those same unattractive consequences: lost jobs, bankruptcies, private pensions dumped onto the federal government. In the case of China, Romney has tried to outhawk Obama, promising to launch what would amount to a trade war beginning his first day in office. When it comes to Detroit, Romney has backed away from his principled position that failed businesses should be allowed to fail. He’s in a corner, because he thinks it’s politically unsound to say what he really believes.




2. It’s not clear that private equity—like other forms of financial innovation—is good for America. You’d think that if private equity made businesses more efficient and valuable overall, there’d be clear evidence to support it, but there isn’t. Private equity firms earn most of their money through financial engineering. A big share of their returns comes from “tax arbitrage”—figuring out how to exploit loopholes to pay less to the government. Because interest is a deductible business expense, debt financing means they often pay little or no corporate tax. Private equity’s reliance on leverage can also magnify short-term earnings without leaving the companies they manage more valuable overall. One legal but dubious practice that private equity firms engage in is paying large “special dividends” out of borrowed money. As Jim Surowiecki of the New Yorker has written, “These dividends created no economic value—they just redistributed money from the company to the private-equity investors.” There’s some anecdotal evidence that the well-regarded Bain has been a better owner than most. But there’s no real way to evaluate that either.




3. Bain shows how Wall Street is rigged in favor of the rich. Private equity firms, like hedge funds, earn their money through a 2-and-20 structure, which means investors pay a 2 percent annual management fee, and give away one-fifth of their profits. According to one study, firms like Bain get two-thirds of of their earnings from fees charged to investors, rather than from the share of profits. According to another study, private equity firms managed to keep 70 percent of all investment profits for themselves, rather than paying them out. They’ve figured out how to be hugely profitable even if they aren’t successful, and even where firms they own go bankrupt. And because their gains come in the form of “carried interest,” private equity owners are taxed at 15 percent, rather than the top corporate rate of 35 percent.




4. Romney’s Bain career is a story about rising inequality. It’s a telling that George Romney, Mitt’s father, made around $200,000 through most of the years he ran American Motors Corporation. Doing work that clearly created jobs, the elder Romney paid an effective tax rate that averaged 37 percent. His son made vastly more running a corporate chop shop in an industry that does not appear to create jobs overall. In 2010, Mitt Romney paid an effective tax rate of 13.9 percent on $21.7 million in investment income—around 14 times as his father much in inflation-adjusted terms. This difference encapsulates the change from corporate titans who lived in the same world as the people who worked for them, in an America with real social mobility, to a financial overclass that makes its own separate rules and has choked off social mobility. The elder Romney wasn’t embarrassed to explain what he’d done as a businessman or to release his tax returns.




5. Bain reminds everybody how rich Romney is, how different that makes him from ordinary people, and how this kind of advantage perpetuates itself. Five years ago, according to disclosure statements, he was already worth between $190 and $250 million, not counting another $70-100 million in trusts for his children and grandchildren, and not counting real estate worth tens of millions more. It’s not clear how he turned a maximum contribution of $450,000 over 15 years at Bain into an IRA worth between $21 and $102 million (where it grows tax free). Here’s some informed speculation. Once again, the details are mysterious even if his massive exploitation of a tax break meant to encourage middle class people to save more is not.

So tell me who "outsourced" more jobs to China...Mitt Romney or Jeff Immelt? Seriously, Synth...explain to me why we shouldn't LAUGH at a President who's primary attack on his challenger is that Romney's been TOO successful and that he did something that Obama's OWN jobs czar did, only Immelt did it on a scale a hundred times larger?

I know that Mitt Romney making so much money "mystifies" the average progressive like yourself because you don't have a CLUE how finance or the economy works. If you DID understand...you wouldn't be supporting the idiot we currently have sitting in the Oval Office.

What's your problem with either Republican Immelt or Republican Romney..outsourcing jobs?

 

[Luddly Neddite]

he hasnt been afraid to talk about it at all. In fact, he's been delibrately pointing to his record at Bain at making businesses successful as a reason to vote for him. Are you guys getting delusional?

I agree! He's been pushing it as his primary strength, far more so than his time as a "severely conservative" governor or his time using federal funds to bail out the olympics.

The problem is that what he perceived as his greatest strength has been turned into his greatest weakness by his opponent. So much so that Mitt can't even decide if he deserves credit for what Bain did in 2000.

Etch A Sketch doesn't even know where he was in 2000. Or, for that matter, what SEC documents he signed.

Barry Hussein's College Transcripts, anyone?

Mittens' fans are afraid to talk about his Bain record too. That's why they keep throwing out this tired and REALLY lame red herring.

 

[OODA_Loop]

Oh, you think he should produce his college transcript in order to prove he's American?

No. I do think it is probable that he used his ethnicity, perhaps his birthplace to gain advantage as did E. Warren.

I find it odd with his professed educational achievements to seal his records. It is counter to my daily professional experience with people and their scholastic accomplishments.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Oh, you think he should produce his college transcript in order to prove he's American?

No. I do think it is probable that he used his ethnicity, perhaps his birthplace to gain advantage as did E. Warren.

I find it odd with his professed educational achievements to seal his records. It is counter to my daily professional experience with people and their scholastic accomplishments.

Kinda like Kerry... My Dad was honorably discharged and a certificate of retirement and a letter of appreciation proudly hung on the wall.

There was no doubt as to the status of his discharge.

 

[Si modo]

So you think it's more critical to know Obama's grade in freshman English comp 30 years ago than where Mitt hid money in 2009?

I think how he played his citizenship and ethnicity for benefit could be reasonably revealed in those upper scholastic records.

It is not an unknown occurence of late in one of the same instutions.

Oh, you think he should produce his college transcript in order to prove he's American?

I'm not sure if you're emulating Trump or Sununu, but that tin foil is wearing thin.

He should produce them because (1) he claims he went to a few institutions of higher learning; (2) he claims to have both an undergrad and a JD; (3) he is a federal employee; and (4) if education is claimed, federal employees must provide transcripts to their employer.

I am one of his employers and based on his utter incompetence, I find the education claims dubious, at best.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Heres your problem with the cities going bankrupt and blaming obama.


the LIBOR scandal is about to break wide open on this side of the pond and GUESS who it turns out cheated some of these cities

Tim Geithner

Look it up

 

[Sallow]

Oh, you think he should produce his college transcript in order to prove he's American?

No. I do think it is probable that he used his ethnicity, perhaps his birthplace to gain advantage as did E. Warren.

I find it odd with his professed educational achievements to seal his records. It is counter to my daily professional experience with people and their scholastic accomplishments.

Ah..so you don't believe Harvard..which had him graduate magna cum laude? Only you can make that determination by perusing his grades. Hey..should he release his work too so you can grade him? After all..you know more then Harvard.

 

[Si modo]

Why is Obama so afraid of providing his transcripts?

 

[Sallow]

I think how he played his citizenship and ethnicity for benefit could be reasonably revealed in those upper scholastic records.

It is not an unknown occurence of late in one of the same instutions.

Oh, you think he should produce his college transcript in order to prove he's American?

I'm not sure if you're emulating Trump or Sununu, but that tin foil is wearing thin.

He should produce them because (1) he claims he went to a few institutions of higher learning; (2) he claims to have both an undergrad and a JD; (3) he is a federal employee; and (4) if education is claimed, federal employees must provide transcripts to their employer.

I am one of his employers and based on his utter incompetence, I find the education claims dubious, at best.

It's not only his "claim"..it's the claim of Harvard and Columbia. Going to college is not a democracy. You make it through..based on a rigorous set of standards. The people don't get to retroactively vote on his grades.

And you don't employ him. You probably didn't even vote for him.

 

[Dr.House]

@ Bainthers....

 

[Si modo]

Oh, you think he should produce his college transcript in order to prove he's American?

No. I do think it is probable that he used his ethnicity, perhaps his birthplace to gain advantage as did E. Warren.

I find it odd with his professed educational achievements to seal his records. It is counter to my daily professional experience with people and their scholastic accomplishments.

Ah..so you don't believe Harvard..which had him graduate magna cum laude? Only you can make that determination by perusing his grades. Hey..should he release his work too so you can grade him? After all..you know more then Harvard.

Link?

And, his claim is not a valid sourse...it's just more Obama cheap talk.

Independant proof.

 

[Article 15]

I think how he played his citizenship and ethnicity for benefit could be reasonably revealed in those upper scholastic records.

It is not an unknown occurence of late in one of the same instutions.

Oh, you think he should produce his college transcript in order to prove he's American?

I'm not sure if you're emulating Trump or Sununu, but that tin foil is wearing thin.

He should produce them because (1) he claims he went to a few institutions of higher learning; (2) he claims to have both an undergrad and a JD; (3) he is a federal employee; and (4) if education is claimed, federal employees must provide transcripts to their employer.

I am one of his employers and based on his utter incompetence, I find the education claims dubious, at best.

In four and a half years he will retroactively produce them for you.

 

[Sallow]

And who was the last president that released his college transcripts? I mean..this is kinda new.