Why do Republicans celebrate the failure of Green Energy

[rightwinger]

Oil is just cheap enough to stay below the costs of emerging technologies. Every time we have had an energy crisis in the last 35 years, big oil has managed to get their prices to the point where new technologies are not cost effective

Oil is big enough to buy politicians and block new patents. If the free market is left alone, oil will be able to block new technology indefinitely. Other governments realize the importance of competing technologies and are willing to subsidize.......in the US, it is just a political football

 

[Nosmo King]

It's not the green energy's fault the owners are taking the government stimulus and giving it back to the guy that stole it from the American people to begin with.

I'm all for "GREEN", I just don't think politicians are the ones that should be selling it. Private investors + private money = successful business, Americans win and have real jobs. Government - campaign contributions = business failures, Americans lose and it costs them more than just money.

Do you think that oil has never accepted any federal money for development, exploration or transportation? Was the oil business in this or any other country one founded upon and sustained exclusively by private investment?

Is this why Conservatives find carbon fuel so noble? If it is, it goes to prove my theory that Conservatives are poor students of history.

Speaking of being a poor student of history, google "history of the oil industry" and report back to the class how the US government developed the oil industry. We'll wait.

well, it turns out you have some reading to do! Did you ask me to do this search because you don't think the oil companies are subsidized or that you are just too lazy to do it yourself? Or maybe you are under the impression that the oil companies AREN'T subsidized. That would be amazing because you're smart enough to know about that.

So, here are some links:

NY Times Advertisement

What

One is from the New York Times, the other from The Heritage Foundation. Both are biased, but neither refute the existence of subsidies for the oil business.

 

[rightwinger]

What amazes me is all over the map some folks are.
"There is no such thing as global warming. The earth is not warming" was their first cry.
Then of course we all know the earth is warming but we do not know how much man has influenced that.
So they change their next tune to:
"Well, maybe it is is warming but those scientists are all crooks and it may not be warming but if it is man has not contributed to it at all".
So when they are confronted with that and told to go out and put their hand over their exhaust of their car when it is running and see if it is hot or cold they have to change their tune once again.
"Well, it is warming but we do not know how much man and his pollution is causing it"
And then it progressed to "Well, Hop Sing is doing it in China so we should be able to do It" BS argument,
to where we are now:
"Well, we are polluting and the warming is happening but our economy would collapse if we did anything to stop it".
The politics of both sides is bad but the war on science is definitely American Christian right wing.

Their next argument wil be that it is too late to do anything about it so we should not even try

 

[Nosmo King]

Right wingers couldn't give a crap if "green energy" succeeds or fails. In fact, most would prefer to see it succeed, but only if it's not on the taxpayer's dime. Any industry that requires subsidies from the taxpayers to stay afloat is an industry that should die.

If this is true, shouldn't the oil business die?

How is it going to die when turds like you keep going to the gas station? The oil industry doesn't receive any subsidies. That's a left-wing myth. In fact, it has provided the government with trillions of dollars in revenues over its lifetime.

What

 

[healthmyths]

Politics aside, what is to be gained if Green Energy fails as an alternative energy source? Isn't having alternatives to big oil a benefit for this country? Why is it official GOP policy that Drill, baby drill is the only acceptable answer to our energy needs?

All new technologies suffer failures. More money has been lost in this country by speculative oil failures than anything else

Why the celebrations?

ONE word!!! HYPERBOLE!

Most of us don't celebrate failures.. that's Greenies, liberals response!
What we do though is show the hypocrisy of idiots supposedly "green" thinking but using exaggeration and LIES to push the green movement.

For example none of you greenies have YET explained to me why part of the justification is global warming and global warming is mostly based on temperature increases right? Well none of you have explained why decisions affecting MY life are being based on temperatures readings that left out 12.5% of the earth's land mass!

And that's just ONE of the fallacies of "global warming" yet children are being brainwashed about "global warming" based on false premises i.e. you can't make decisions when 12.5% of the earth's land mass is NOT included in the readings!

The "failures" were also in areas that rather then business decisions and people making the decisions making sound financial based factors $500 million was lent to "feel good" about doing something "green"!

AND then we have total idiocy of canceling Keystone so 1 million barrels now will be shipped by tankers every day at risk of accidents, weather, and damages to 1,000s of miles of coastland ... yet these same idiot greenies.. against a pipeline that at the most in one mile of pipe would carry less then 325 barrels!

ONE mile of pipe carrying 325 barrels is far less risky, has less damage yet because you GREENIES DON"T THINK you are shipping 1 million barrels per day by ship!

SEE it is stupidities like the above and i.e. Solyandra,etc. based NOT on facts, not on logic but it "feels" good!

 

[rightwinger]

The Government subsidized our railroads and interstate highways. The Government subsidized space, the Internet, celular technology. Most of our medical advances now are subsidized by the government.

R&D costs money and involves risk. Private companies do not like to assume risk without some assurance of profit. We would have missed out on a lot of advances without government support

All the government subsidized railroads went bankrupt, so that's hardly an argument in favor of subsidies.

The interstate highways put a lot of private railroads out of business. The later system wasn't costing the taxpayers a dime. The interstate highway system is nothing but a huge wasteful boondoggle.

The government never provided a dime in subsidies to the cellular phone industry. All it did is define all the cells and sell them for a fixed price. The government receives hundreds of billions in tax revenue every year from the cellular industry.

The government performed one small step in the development of the internet. The idea that private firms wouldn't have developed it on their own is laughable.

Private industry invests hundreds of billions of dollars into R&D every year. Just look how fast flat screen TVs and cellular telephones have evolved. It's totally absurd to claim technology wouldn't advance without the government.

EVERY railroad in the US was subsidized by the government. Free land, eminent domain, subsidies, protection of monopolies.....all made the railroad industry a billion dollar industry back when a billion dollars meant something

Interstate highway system is a boondoggle?

Thanks for reminding me why your posts are not worth responding to

 

[2012]

A question. Was Obama right in killing the TransCanada pipeline?

 

[Claudette]

None of this is true. You need to do a little more research, especially into recent developments. It's possible to completely meet a typical home's electricity needs from solar, and many homeowners do. Or from wind (depending on the area where you live), or from a combination. The cost up front is still fairly steep, but a lot of that is the installation cost, and that can be cut out by doing it yourself. Cost of solar panels has dropped to a little over a dollar a watt, and with a 20-year lifespan that means over 100 kwh for a dollar. That's just the solar panels of course; add other equipment and (worse) installation costs and it drops. But it's very much a viable way to create energy. It's pretty much on part with unsubsidized oil. Natural gas is slightly more expensive, nuclear is way more expensive, and coal and hydroelectric are a good deal cheaper (hydro probably always will be).

Like I said, if we would just phase out the fossil-fuel subsidies, that by itself would probably be enough to accelerate our transition to green energy rapidly. The benefits are so huge that without that artificial cost-dampener for fossil fuels, the market would take care of it.

Sorry, but your math doesn't add up. Solar costs a lot more than a dollar a watt. I recently investigated, and a 2000 watt system went for $38,000. That's little more than enough to power a blow dryer. Furthermore, it doesn't work at night, so what do you do then?

Solar power is a joke. It always will be.

If solar power were viable and affordable all us Floridians would have been using it for decades.

It ain't and we aren't.

That doesn't say that it won't be in the future but its not right now.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Why do Republicans celebrate the failure of Green Energy?

Failure???????

Bloom Energy Server Fuel Cells​

Gee.....where are Newt's Kids gonna work.....

.....NOW??!!!!!

​

 

[midcan5]

Please realize republicans still think the earth is flat, the sun the center of the universe, Hoover and Reagan were great presidents, taxes are the work of the devil, wealth is created by magic, and Newt is a excellent family man. Given these and the rest of their general idiocy, topics like progress in energy is way way over their heads. First they have to move out of the 15th century.

"Why Conservatives Can't Govern" by Alan Wolfe

"Americans may have elected a Republican president and Congress, but they are unlikely to go back to a world in which one illness can devastate their last years or one storm can destroy their lives. Because government is the one institution that allows us some control over our future, conservatism, which distrusts government so much, is best viewed as a natural counter to liberalism, which, if left unchecked, tends towards wasteful bureaucracy. Indeed, as the Bush administration fully proves, conservatism remains a force of opposition even when it purports to be a governance party. And so the best that can be hoped for is that American voters will do for conservatives what they are unable to do themselves: to vote them out of office." "Why Conservatives Can't Govern" by Alan Wolfe

 

[Oldstyle]

Pointing out that green energy hasn't worked is hardly celebrating. Failure to recognize that green energy has been a monumentally expensive failure is delusional.

What next? When the oil runs out. Do we turn to water wheels and real horse power?

This really isn't a hard concept, Kiddies...as fossil fuels run out the cost of that energy source will rise thus making alternative energy sources economically viable. What is foolish is trying to artificially raise the price of fossil fuels with regulations, taxes and moratoriums on drilling so as to make alternative energy viable. When Barack Obama said that he would like to see gas at $6 a gallon it was a perfect example of the progressive mind set that you can manipulate supply and demand of carbon fuels to make them obsolete and usher in a new age of alternative sources of energy. Let the rule of supply and demand do that.

Did anyone else happen to read the front page article in USA Today about the millions that this Administration has pumped into training programs for green energy jobs? The programs only have a 10% placement rate of the people that have completed the training because so many of the "green energy" companies aren't economically viable and aren't hiring. It's one more example of the bad policies of progressives not working in the real world.

 

[Gadawg73]

None of this is true. You need to do a little more research, especially into recent developments. It's possible to completely meet a typical home's electricity needs from solar, and many homeowners do. Or from wind (depending on the area where you live), or from a combination. The cost up front is still fairly steep, but a lot of that is the installation cost, and that can be cut out by doing it yourself. Cost of solar panels has dropped to a little over a dollar a watt, and with a 20-year lifespan that means over 100 kwh for a dollar. That's just the solar panels of course; add other equipment and (worse) installation costs and it drops. But it's very much a viable way to create energy. It's pretty much on part with unsubsidized oil. Natural gas is slightly more expensive, nuclear is way more expensive, and coal and hydroelectric are a good deal cheaper (hydro probably always will be).

Like I said, if we would just phase out the fossil-fuel subsidies, that by itself would probably be enough to accelerate our transition to green energy rapidly. The benefits are so huge that without that artificial cost-dampener for fossil fuels, the market would take care of it.

Sorry, but your math doesn't add up. Solar costs a lot more than a dollar a watt. I recently investigated, and a 2000 watt system went for $38,000. That's little more than enough to power a blow dryer. Furthermore, it doesn't work at night, so what do you do then?

Solar power is a joke. It always will be.

If solar power were viable and affordable all us Floridians would have been using it for decades.

It ain't and we aren't.

That doesn't say that it won't be in the future but its not right now.

My neighbor has 2 panels, heats all of his hot water and some of his heating in the winter. He has about 25K in it all, has lived here for 20 years and says it paid for itself about 14years. And we live in north Georgia.
Of course many do not have 25K and prefer to pay out the additional $1500 a year as convenience.
I do agree that the systems are primitive as to what we can have.
So were cell phones in 1985.

 

[candycorn]

Politics aside, what is to be gained if Green Energy fails as an alternative energy source? Isn't having alternatives to big oil a benefit for this country? Why is it official GOP policy that Drill, baby drill is the only acceptable answer to our energy needs?

All new technologies suffer failures. More money has been lost in this country by speculative oil failures than anything else

Why the celebrations?

I know...it's bizarre because it is where the future economy is. At some point this planet will be devoid of it's fossil fuels. I feel the same way when the lefties and reactionary morons of all stripes are quick to object to nuclear. It was Senator McCain's best idea to want to expand the nuke grid.

 

[Gadawg73]

Pointing out that green energy hasn't worked is hardly celebrating. Failure to recognize that green energy has been a monumentally expensive failure is delusional.

What next? When the oil runs out. Do we turn to water wheels and real horse power?

This really isn't a hard concept, Kiddies...as fossil fuels run out the cost of that energy source will rise thus making alternative energy sources economically viable. What is foolish is trying to artificially raise the price of fossil fuels with regulations, taxes and moratoriums on drilling so as to make alternative energy viable. When Barack Obama said that he would like to see gas at $6 a gallon it was a perfect example of the progressive mind set that you can manipulate supply and demand of carbon fuels to make them obsolete and usher in a new age of alternative sources of energy. Let the rule of supply and demand do that.

Did anyone else happen to read the front page article in USA Today about the millions that this Administration has pumped into training programs for green energy jobs? The programs only have a 10% placement rate of the people that have completed the training because so many of the "green energy" companies aren't economically viable and aren't hiring. It's one more example of the bad policies of progressives not working in the real world.

With no restrctions why would oil companies ever want to drill when they can buy at the spicket and ship it for less?
As of now most oil companes know that even the best case scenario they are looking at about $105 a barrel to make a profit.

 

[thereisnospoon]

It's not the green energy's fault the owners are taking the government stimulus and giving it back to the guy that stole it from the American people to begin with.

I'm all for "GREEN", I just don't think politicians are the ones that should be selling it. Private investors + private money = successful business, Americans win and have real jobs. Government - campaign contributions = business failures, Americans lose and it costs them more than just money.

Do you think that oil has never accepted any federal money for development, exploration or transportation? Was the oil business in this or any other country one founded upon and sustained exclusively by private investment?

Is this why Conservatives find carbon fuel so noble? If it is, it goes to prove my theory that Conservatives are poor students of history.

Hardly the point. Contrary to the Left's belief that large oil companies receive the lion's share of subsidies, it is actually small or independent oil business that receives them.
Fossil fuels are not in any way "noble". Those fuels are simply the least costly, easiest to market and of course used in thousands of different applications.

 

[candycorn]

Sorry, but your math doesn't add up. Solar costs a lot more than a dollar a watt. I recently investigated, and a 2000 watt system went for $38,000. That's little more than enough to power a blow dryer. Furthermore, it doesn't work at night, so what do you do then?

Solar power is a joke. It always will be.

If solar power were viable and affordable all us Floridians would have been using it for decades.

It ain't and we aren't.

That doesn't say that it won't be in the future but its not right now.

My neighbor has 2 panels, heats all of his hot water and some of his heating in the winter. He has about 25K in it all, has lived here for 20 years and says it paid for itself about 14years. And we live in north Georgia.
Of course many do not have 25K and prefer to pay out the additional $1500 a year as convenience.
I do agree that the systems are primitive as to what we can have.
So were cell phones in 1985.

One of the easiests ways to "go green" is to have your floors heated with water that is simply pumped through the earth, heated by terra firma and then ran through piping under the floor in a new house.

 

[whitehall]

Nice of the left to finally admit that green energy was a hoax.

 

[Oldstyle]

Please realize republicans still think the earth is flat, the sun the center of the universe, Hoover and Reagan were great presidents, taxes are the work of the devil, wealth is created by magic, and Newt is a excellent family man. Given these and the rest of their general idiocy, topics like progress in energy is way way over their heads. First they have to move out of the 15th century.

"Why Conservatives Can't Govern" by Alan Wolfe

"Americans may have elected a Republican president and Congress, but they are unlikely to go back to a world in which one illness can devastate their last years or one storm can destroy their lives. Because government is the one institution that allows us some control over our future, conservatism, which distrusts government so much, is best viewed as a natural counter to liberalism, which, if left unchecked, tends towards wasteful bureaucracy. Indeed, as the Bush administration fully proves, conservatism remains a force of opposition even when it purports to be a governance party. And so the best that can be hoped for is that American voters will do for conservatives what they are unable to do themselves: to vote them out of office." "Why Conservatives Can't Govern" by Alan Wolfe

W's problem wasn't "conservatism", Midcan...Bush's problem was that he forgot what conservatism means. When you spend money like a liberal then you've abandoned the core principles of conservatism. George W. Bush was NOT a fiscal conservative. The American electorate in the mid term elections sent a clear message that what they WANTED was fiscally conservative governance.

 

[candycorn]

A question. Was Obama right in killing the TransCanada pipeline?

If you're talking about Keystone; it's not dead.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Please realize republicans still think the earth is flat, the sun the center of the universe, Hoover and Reagan were great presidents, taxes are the work of the devil, wealth is created by magic, and Newt is a excellent family man.

Don't forget.....

....tax-cuts GENERATE revenue!!!!