What Have We Learned?

[elvis]

What have we learned in 2 millennia? Not much.

"The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest Rome become bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance."
---- Cicero - 55 BC

I agree, I'm sure that will be too confusing to liberals and their economic ideology.

Its pretty basic stuff!

Instead people are racking up more debt then ever, the government is spending way too much money on needless social programs, unemployment is an epidemic, those who never worked ever are entitled to more then the bottom of the barrel working class and the politicians pander it all.

Left wing priorities will destroy this nation.

Hey dingbat, who doubled the National Debt in eight years? And who were the pork barrel prima donnas for that eight years? Who went to war on the basis of lies and spent over 4200 lives, and more money than this stimulas for those lies?

You fellows will spend any amount on ill advised military adventures, pork, tax breaks for the very wealthy, but the idea of something for the citizens of the nation is just more than you can bear.

But just sit back and watch. You are no longer in the drivers seat.

Yeah it's ok when Obama spends money we don't have, right?

 

[mash107]

I agree, I'm sure that will be too confusing to liberals and their economic ideology.

Its pretty basic stuff!

Instead people are racking up more debt then ever, the government is spending way too much money on needless social programs, unemployment is an epidemic, those who never worked ever are entitled to more then the bottom of the barrel working class and the politicians pander it all.

Left wing priorities will destroy this nation.

Hey dingbat, who doubled the National Debt in eight years? And who were the pork barrel prima donnas for that eight years? Who went to war on the basis of lies and spent over 4200 lives, and more money than this stimulas for those lies?

You fellows will spend any amount on ill advised military adventures, pork, tax breaks for the very wealthy, but the idea of something for the citizens of the nation is just more than you can bear.

But just sit back and watch. You are no longer in the drivers seat.

Yeah it's ok when Obama spends money we don't have, right?

lol.

I agree war was a waste. And it was under Bush where spending -increased- (not talking about tax cuts, as that's related to revenue, not expenditure) more than any other U.S. President in the history of our nation. What would you do if it's pretty clear spending is why we're in this mess? Oh, spend more of course!

 

[garyd]

Um no Defense spending cannot possibly create ninety percent of the debt as the Defense department Since the time of Reagan hasn't been more than about 30% of the Budget and is currently only about 20% of the budget year in and year out. Out of last years 3 + trillion dollar budget well less than 1 trillion went to the defense department. Even if the entire defense department budget was a waste of money (it isn't unless you think our military should still be equipped with 12 lb Napoleons and smoothbore muskets) it still can't possibly be 90% of the waste. And it was massive defense spending that drug us out of the Great Depression after 8 years of social spending that did little beyond growing the national debt. Yes Bush and REaan did some things wrong. In Reagan's case mostly not vetoing enough bullshit Democratic legislation, In Bush's case by increasing social spending by massive amounts.

 

[jeffrockit]

Why all the revisionist talk of Bush. I agree he spent like it was going out of style but the libs screamed about it ever step of the way. It would seem from the liberal posts, that excessive government spending is OK if it is done by one of their own. I have yet to see one lib admit that this bill was a mistake or that even some of the pork was a mistake. To blindly follow party lines is the mistake.
I agree with the one poster that Obama did not inherit this mess, he campaigned for it and won.

 

[garyd]

And his party of the last forty years has more than held there own when it came to laying the ground work for the Housing debacle that caused it.

 

[DiveCon]

But if they cut taxes doesn't that mean people will save? And what's needed is spending, not saving?

So, government still has to run and it has to stimulate the economy so cutting taxes, government income, seems to be not very productive.

The pork is interesting. I know we do it but the funny thing is that in our legislature (and I NOT holding ours up as exemplars) someone can't stuff a bill. A bill here is very specific and anything foreign to that bill will get the boot and quick smart. I don't know why that is, I just know it is. Of course plenty of local members and Ministers will funnel off grants and what have you to their local seats, if they can get away with it, but they do tend to get found out. But the ability of US legislators to put irrelevant stuff into a bill is interesting to me.

i wish they couldnt do that here

and technically, they SHOULDNT be
anything worth doing should be its own bill

No, they should not be doing it. However, it was brought to a high art by the Republicans under Bush. More earmarks than ever before in history by a bunch. 31,709 earmarks under Bush.

Now not all of this money was a waste. Often earmarks are a way to get money for special, needed projects in a district. Projects that often aid the whole nation. However, all too often they are just money thrown at something that aids a local business and does little for the rest of the citizens. Kind of like the bridge to nowhere in Alaska.

bullshit
you are nothing but a partisan fucking hack if you think the dems are not just as bad when it comes to earmarks
if not worse
give us a fucking break from your partisan bullshit

 

[Diuretic]

I think there's government spending and there's government spending. The invasion and occupation of Iraq is an example of bad government spending. Stimulating a domestic economy is an example of good government spending.

 

[mash107]

I think there's government spending and there's government spending. The invasion and occupation of Iraq is an example of bad government spending. Stimulating a domestic economy is an example of good government spending.

I sort of agree. There's a missile that provides nothing back to society. And then there's a bridge that is somewhat useful to society, even if it may be poorly constructed. But one can't disagree that -all- types of government spending displaces people out of work.

 

[elvis]

But if they cut taxes doesn't that mean people will save? And what's needed is spending, not saving?

So, government still has to run and it has to stimulate the economy so cutting taxes, government income, seems to be not very productive.

The pork is interesting. I know we do it but the funny thing is that in our legislature (and I NOT holding ours up as exemplars) someone can't stuff a bill. A bill here is very specific and anything foreign to that bill will get the boot and quick smart. I don't know why that is, I just know it is. Of course plenty of local members and Ministers will funnel off grants and what have you to their local seats, if they can get away with it, but they do tend to get found out. But the ability of US legislators to put irrelevant stuff into a bill is interesting to me.

i wish they couldnt do that here

and technically, they SHOULDNT be
anything worth doing should be its own bill

No, they should not be doing it. However, it was brought to a high art by the Republicans under Bush. More earmarks than ever before in history by a bunch. 31,709 earmarks under Bush.

Now not all of this money was a waste. Often earmarks are a way to get money for special, needed projects in a district. Projects that often aid the whole nation. However, all too often they are just money thrown at something that aids a local business and does little for the rest of the citizens. Kind of like the bridge to nowhere in Alaska.

Hey fuckhead, quit being Obama's Monica, k?

 

[DiveCon]

I think there's government spending and there's government spending. The invasion and occupation of Iraq is an example of bad government spending. Stimulating a domestic economy is an example of good government spending.

I sort of agree. There's a missile that provides nothing back to society. And then there's a bridge that is somewhat useful to society, even if it may be poorly constructed. But one can't disagree that -all- types of government spending displaces people out of work.

actually, it takes people to BUILD those missiles
so it does provide jobs
if you dont think so, look up why Tip O'Neil kept the Army procurement of A-10 warthogs well past what they ever wanted
(hint, look where they were being built)

 

[Diuretic]

actually, it takes people to BUILD those missiles
so it does provide jobs
if you dont think so, look up why Tip O'Neil kept the Army procurement of A-10 warthogs well past what they ever wanted
(hint, look where they were being built)

Quite right, it does provide jobs, but when there's sufficient materiel for all the needs of defence isn't the spending then just wasteful? It sounds a bit like the sort of things the old Soviets got up to, producing aircraft that weren't even going to be used. I suppose they could wrap them up and store them at Davis-Monthan but what if the factory re-tooled and workers re-skilled for more productive purposes? Government money could be used to achieve that, surely.

 

[Chris]

I think there's government spending and there's government spending. The invasion and occupation of Iraq is an example of bad government spending. Stimulating a domestic economy is an example of good government spending.

Exactly.

Notice how BITTER the wing nuts are because Obama has acted quickly to try to save America.

They would rather America go down the tubes.

Of course most of them are retired military, so they are on the public sugar tit.

 

[DiveCon]

I think there's government spending and there's government spending. The invasion and occupation of Iraq is an example of bad government spending. Stimulating a domestic economy is an example of good government spending.

Exactly.

Notice how BITTER the wing nuts are because Obama has acted quickly to try to save America.

They would rather America go down the tubes.

Of course most of them are retired military, so they are on the public sugar tit.

wrong again, MORON

America is going down the tubes because of bullshit like what Obama is doing
its worse that the bullshit Bush did at the end

 

[Chris]

I think there's government spending and there's government spending. The invasion and occupation of Iraq is an example of bad government spending. Stimulating a domestic economy is an example of good government spending.

Exactly.

Notice how BITTER the wing nuts are because Obama has acted quickly to try to save America.

They would rather America go down the tubes.

Of course most of them are retired military, so they are on the public sugar tit.

wrong again, MORON

America is going down the tubes because of bullshit like what Obama is doing
its worse that the bullshit Bush did at the end

Case in point....

 

[elvis]

Exactly.

Notice how BITTER the wing nuts are because Obama has acted quickly to try to save America.

They would rather America go down the tubes.

Of course most of them are retired military, so they are on the public sugar tit.

wrong again, MORON

America is going down the tubes because of bullshit like what Obama is doing
its worse that the bullshit Bush did at the end

Case in point....

Kirky Lewinsky must have had to swallow tonight.

 

[Chris]

wrong again, MORON

America is going down the tubes because of bullshit like what Obama is doing
its worse that the bullshit Bush did at the end

Case in point....

Kirky Lewinsky must have had to swallow tonight.

Another case in point....

 

[DiveCon]

Exactly.

Notice how BITTER the wing nuts are because Obama has acted quickly to try to save America.

They would rather America go down the tubes.

Of course most of them are retired military, so they are on the public sugar tit.

wrong again, MORON

America is going down the tubes because of bullshit like what Obama is doing
its worse that the bullshit Bush did at the end

Case in point....

if you didnt have your head so firmly ensconced in Obama's rectal cavity you would be able to see that this is just MORE of the same shit you bitched about Bush doing

 

[Chris]

wrong again, MORON

America is going down the tubes because of bullshit like what Obama is doing
its worse that the bullshit Bush did at the end

Case in point....

if you didnt have your head so firmly ensconced in Obama's rectal cavity you would be able to see that this is just MORE of the same shit you bitched about Bush doing

Obama is not wasting $700 billion dollars and 4,000 American lives setting up a Shia government in Iraq allied with Iran.

Obama is trying to save American from Phil Gramm's disasterous deregualtion of the markets.

You morton....

 

[DiveCon]

Case in point....

if you didnt have your head so firmly ensconced in Obama's rectal cavity you would be able to see that this is just MORE of the same shit you bitched about Bush doing

Obama is not wasting $700 billion dollars and 4,000 American lives setting up a Shia government in Iraq allied with Iran.

Obama is trying to save American from Phil Gramm's disasterous deregualtion of the markets.

You morton....

again you prove what a fucking moron you are

 

[RetiredGySgt]

What have we learned in 2 millennia? Not much.

"The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest Rome become bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance."
---- Cicero - 55 BC

I agree, I'm sure that will be too confusing to liberals and their economic ideology.

Its pretty basic stuff!

Instead people are racking up more debt then ever, the government is spending way too much money on needless social programs, unemployment is an epidemic, those who never worked ever are entitled to more then the bottom of the barrel working class and the politicians pander it all.

Left wing priorities will destroy this nation.

Hey dingbat, who doubled the National Debt in eight years? And who were the pork barrel prima donnas for that eight years? Who went to war on the basis of lies and spent over 4200 lives, and more money than this stimulas for those lies?

You fellows will spend any amount on ill advised military adventures, pork, tax breaks for the very wealthy, but the idea of something for the citizens of the nation is just more than you can bear.

But just sit back and watch. You are no longer in the drivers seat.

Hey DIPSHIT, who will TRIPLE the National Debt in 8 years if all his spending plans are enacted? Trillions of deficit dollars planned to be spent. How is it bad for Bush but ok for Obama?