Unacceptable Redistribution of Wealth

[Cold Fusion38]

Oh one more thing when you want to understand the disparity between rich and poor you also have to take into account the amount of the countries WEALTH that they control.

 

[rightwinger]

Yeah, the ones collecting welfare are all rich and living off of the poor.

Yes and its called corporate welfare. Remember the bailouts? Did that go to the poor? The rich get their welfare in different ways....tax breaks, shelters, off-shore tax free investments..
Its coming from the taxpayers and is still welfare

And none of that shit should be happening either. And another reason the present Tax Code needs to be done away with. It creates more problems than it settles and is punitive in so many ways.

And why the Founders never meant to tax INCOME of individuals to start with. It is nothing but a tool to alter behaviour against the better interests of this Republic.[/QUOTE]

BS
The Founding Fathers recognized the need for the Government to raise revenue. In the pre-industrial revolution timeperiod, an income tax would have been impractical.

 

[pal_of_poor]

What I find interesting about all of the little graphs posted by right-wingers, and the clever little charts is this. None of them represent the tax burden, no, not at all. They all talk about only the federal income tax. There is no inclusion of sales, gas, utility, property, toll-road taxes, or fees, or FICA taxes only on the first hundred thousand earned.

There is a good reason for that, of course. It is, the only tax that the truly wealthy pay more of as a percent of income, than the poor. All these people who are poor, end up paying all these other taxes, which disproportionately affect a person earning 20 grand a year. All these taxes to someone earning 300,000 dollars a year, are a pittance. They attack the one tax they pay more of, the one tax that properly assesses them greater responsibility for the much, much greater share of the commons that they use, to make their money.

A flat tax, or a national income tax, would not only hurt the economy terribly, taking money directly from the pockets of the poor and middle class. But they would finally achieve a status where the filthy richest of us, will actually pay less in taxes than a burger flipper in a fast-food restaurant.

And of these facts, right-wingers stay blissfully unaware. The next time someone bloviates around you, say, hey, how about we get rid of all regressive taxes, that way we can all make some headway. At least drop the stupid cap, so millionaire earners will at last pay as much as the middle, and upper middle class, for FICA/SS taxes. That is the least they could do.

How about we get rid of SS taxes altogether, and let me keep that 7.5% of my income? Oh wait, my employer matches it. Make that 15% more income for me.

Now, lets get to your burger flipper tax payer as it pertains to a flat tax or national sales tax compared to the burger flippers manager. Lets assume a 10% sales tax.
Joe burger flipper goes to the grocery store and spends $40 on groceries, he buys beans and chicken, his tax is $4.
Joe burger flippers manager makes a lot more money, so he goes to the grocery store and spends $100 buying steak and sushi, his tax is $10.
Which one paid more tax?
Now, lets look at it from a flat income tax point of view. Again, lets assume a flat income tax of 10%.
Joe burger flipper makes $18,000 a year, at a 10% flat tax rate he pays $1,800 of income tax.
Joe burger flippers manager makes a lot more money. He makes $50,000 a year. At a flat income tax rate of 10%, he pays $5,000 of income tax.
Which one paid more tax?

Hey, I've worked as Joe Burger-flippers manager, and you are suffering under a delusion when you say they make a lot more money. We made a bit more, an incriment more, mostly by working more hours, and earning Chinese overtime, half time for hours over forty, a base wage, and your half time was calculated by dividing total hours into the base, then dividing that figure in half. The more you worked, the less you made.

The flat tax, just like the national sales tax idea, is just the final straw in the strategy of finally getting the poor to pay, way, way, way more in overall taxes, than the rich. Not only that, but it would hurt the economy.

I'm happy with the tax system now, save the rich paying far too little, and allowing our system of government to have an 18 percent unemployment rate. The truth is, an economy has to be socialized only to the extent of its failure. And since our private system, our unregulated, lightly taxed rich system, has failed so miserably, it is time we pull back from the brink, take the wealthy, the more they make, the more we take, and put people back to work. As our private economy improves, we pull back on the taxes, at least after we pay down the debt, that has accrued due to the money flowing into the accounts of the richest people in the planet, instead of the tax coffers that would have kept us afloat.

Most estimate the flat tax to have to be at least 18 percent, so I suspect the reality is it will have to be 25 percent. The truth is, people who make less than a hundred grand will just end up paying more, and the rich will end up paying less.

 

[Againsheila]

So let's have the gubment take it from the rich and redistribute it to people that don't work or pay taxes, sooper dooper idea ......

Here's a better idea, raise the minimum wage to a living wage and stop using our tax dollars to support big businesses like Walmart with welfare to their employees. Let Walmart and other big businesses support their employees on their own.

Funny how those stimulus packages only went to the already wealthy and we have people like you complaining about taking that money away and giving it to the working people.

 

[Againsheila]

Oh one more thing when you want to understand the disparity between rich and poor you also have to take into account the amount of the countries WEALTH that they control.

Top 10% of our nation own more wealth than the bottom 90%.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

Quote: Originally Posted by dilloduck
Quote: Originally Posted by rightwinger
Quote: Originally Posted by dilloduck

"rich people" pay for your shit. Fuck with them and they will stop paying for your shit.

No they don't....I buy my own shit

Rich people make money off the efforts of others
you mean they provide jobs ?




YEAH they provide jobs OVER FUCKING SEAS!!!!! THEY DON'T GIVE A FUCK ABOUT THEIR FELLOW AMERICANS and until you get that through you thick fucking skull then you will continue to get raped by the rich!!!

 

[Modbert]

Top 10% of our nation own more wealth than the bottom 90%.

And it gets worse every year. The AVERAGE CEO now makes about 435 times more than the average worker.

 

[Againsheila]

What I find interesting about all of the little graphs posted by right-wingers, and the clever little charts is this. None of them represent the tax burden, no, not at all. They all talk about only the federal income tax. There is no inclusion of sales, gas, utility, property, toll-road taxes, or fees, or FICA taxes only on the first hundred thousand earned.

There is a good reason for that, of course. It is, the only tax that the truly wealthy pay more of as a percent of income, than the poor. All these people who are poor, end up paying all these other taxes, which disproportionately affect a person earning 20 grand a year. All these taxes to someone earning 300,000 dollars a year, are a pittance. They attack the one tax they pay more of, the one tax that properly assesses them greater responsibility for the much, much greater share of the commons that they use, to make their money.

A flat tax, or a national income tax, would not only hurt the economy terribly, taking money directly from the pockets of the poor and middle class. But they would finally achieve a status where the filthy richest of us, will actually pay less in taxes than a burger flipper in a fast-food restaurant.

And of these facts, right-wingers stay blissfully unaware. The next time someone bloviates around you, say, hey, how about we get rid of all regressive taxes, that way we can all make some headway. At least drop the stupid cap, so millionaire earners will at last pay as much as the middle, and upper middle class, for FICA/SS taxes. That is the least they could do.

How about we get rid of SS taxes altogether, and let me keep that 7.5% of my income? Oh wait, my employer matches it. Make that 15% more income for me.

Now, lets get to your burger flipper tax payer as it pertains to a flat tax or national sales tax compared to the burger flippers manager. Lets assume a 10% sales tax.
Joe burger flipper goes to the grocery store and spends $40 on groceries, he buys beans and chicken, his tax is $4.
Joe burger flippers manager makes a lot more money, so he goes to the grocery store and spends $100 buying steak and sushi, his tax is $10.
Which one paid more tax?
Now, lets look at it from a flat income tax point of view. Again, lets assume a flat income tax of 10%.
Joe burger flipper makes $18,000 a year, at a 10% flat tax rate he pays $1,800 of income tax.
Joe burger flippers manager makes a lot more money. He makes $50,000 a year. At a flat income tax rate of 10%, he pays $5,000 of income tax.
Which one paid more tax?

We have something in this state called "emissions". Every few years we have to take our cars down and pay to have the emissions checked. If we fail, we have to pay up to $1000 to have our cars fixed, and we must go to the places approved by the state to fix our car. The rich, can afford new cars and not only don't have to pay that $1000, but in many cases they skip the test completely, being able to afford the hybrids, which also give them a tax break not given to those of us that can't afford a new car every year.

The top 10% in this country own more wealth than the bottom 90%, yet they sure as heck don't pay 90% of the taxes.

 

[BasicGreatGuy]

Top 10% of our nation own more wealth than the bottom 90%.

And it gets worse every year. The AVERAGE CEO now makes about 435 times more than the average worker.

So what. A private company should be able to pay its employees whatever it wants.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

The ugly fact that so many don't want to consider. The FACT is that the ULTRA WEALTHY don't even have to work they simply live off of investments. I can tell you one thing for sure.......The tax breaks Bush gave to the ULTRA WEALTHY sure as hell didn't "trickle down" and they sure as hell didn't produce ANY jobs here in the USA! The filthy rich fuckers will gladly fuck their own mothers over if it meant another buck in the bank.

 

[The T]

Top 10% of our nation own more wealth than the bottom 90%.

And it gets worse every year. The AVERAGE CEO now makes about 435 times more than the average worker.

So what. A private company should be able to pay its employees whatever it wants.

Exactly. They can pay whatever their company can bear and it's no one's business but the stockholders, and employees of that company.

If they go under due to bad decisions? Good riddence. Nature abhores a vacuum, and some other entity will fill the void.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

Do any of you woonder why the Right Wing HATES unions?

 

[Cold Fusion38]

I say we put a HUGE tarif on any products that are built over seas by American companies so we can retrain the displaced American jobs.

 

[Modbert]

So what. A private company should be able to pay its employees whatever it wants.

They should at least comply with the laws. However, when a company starts to tank, who do you think they're going to fire? The CEO? Or are they going to cut workers? Most of the time, they cut workers.

Do you enjoy the fact that eventually will be a third world country? I mean that by the fact that the top 10% will own 95% of the wealth while the other 90% will own 5%. This will lead to even more "debt slaves" then there are now and everything else.

Something needs to be done.

 

[DiveCon]

The president doesn't control spending, the congress does.
Post a chart showing federal expenditures by congressional control and it would be more realistic. And yes, during much of the Bush administration, the republican controlled congress spent like drunken sailors. I didn't like it then either.

Drunken sailors would be a understatement. Which is why I wonder now why Republicans think they'll be taken seriously while screaming "Fiscally Conservative!"

The last time around showed they are just as bad as the Democrats, worse when they want to be, they just happen to spent our dollars on different programs for the most part. Instead of going towards education and social programs, they direct it differently. Their way to cover this spending? Cut education and the social programs.

yet the current congress is spending even more

 

[BasicGreatGuy]

Turn up the "woe is me I don't make as much money as other people" song. It is not quite loud enough in the thread.

There are several people in the thread spouting Marxist philosophy. The sad thing is, they don't even seem to realize it, while they wave the American flag.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

I think we should end ALL the safety and child labor laws. In this 21st century economy I think our CHILDREN need to shoulder their share of the burden. Put those little pricks to work in sweat shops. We need values like we had in the early 1900s.

 

[Againsheila]

And it gets worse every year. The AVERAGE CEO now makes about 435 times more than the average worker.

So what. A private company should be able to pay its employees whatever it wants.

Exactly. They can pay whatever their company can bear and it's no one's business but the stockholders, and employees of that company.

If they go under due to bad decisions? Good riddence. Nature abhores a vacuum, and some other entity will fill the void.

You would think that, wouldn't you? But instead, we've got "stimulus" packages to bail out those companies that made the bad decisions and the working people are paying the bills.

 

[BasicGreatGuy]

And it gets worse every year. The AVERAGE CEO now makes about 435 times more than the average worker.

So what. A private company should be able to pay its employees whatever it wants.

Exactly. They can pay whatever their company can bear and it's no one's business but the stockholders, and employees of that company.

If they go under due to bad decisions? Good riddence. Nature abhores a vacuum, and some other entity will fill the void.

Absolutely.

 

[BasicGreatGuy]

So what. A private company should be able to pay its employees whatever it wants.

They should at least comply with the laws. However, when a company starts to tank, who do you think they're going to fire? The CEO? Or are they going to cut workers? Most of the time, they cut workers.

Do you enjoy the fact that eventually will be a third world country? I mean that by the fact that the top 10% will own 95% of the wealth while the other 90% will own 5%. This will lead to even more "debt slaves" then there are now and everything else.

Something needs to be done.

No matter what, there are always going to be poor people who need help. We do the best we can do help through charity and other private entities. The federal government is not an insurance company. It is not their job to make you or anyone else financially whole.

There are a lot of people that make more money than me. I don't care. That is their business, not mine. See how easy it is, when you mind your own business, and stop trying to make sure everyone has the same?

No, I don't want to see my country turn into a third world hell hole. That is why I am doing all I can as an employer of this Republic, to see to it that that doesn't happen.