The God Vacuum: America and the barbarian hordes

[rtwngAvngr]

No, it simply understands and accepts the limitations of human perception and conception. With this understanding, we avoid the trap of absolutism.

No it doesn't. IT asserts that the human mind is capable verifying the truth about god, and pronounces him nonexistant. That's absolutism too.

 

[dilloduck]

No it doesn't. IT asserts that the human mind is capable verifying the truth about god, and pronounces him nonexistant. That's absolutism too.

Exactly----secularists pretend they have avoided the trap and refuse to accept that they are no further out of it than the lowliest creature on earth. What is worshipped as cutting edge today will be seen as dismal, superstitious efforts by Troglodytes tomorrow.

 

[Bonnie]

I see it every day...religious folk are a strange lot....

I do realize that there are a few wacky people out there, however that generally has nothing to do with religion, and much to do with pretending they are religious. I think it's much easier to put religious people down as that seems the be the best way for others to feel better about their choice to not believe, or espouse religion.

Relax Dr 99.98% of christians etc, are not wacky

 

[Abbey Normal]

We can debate these concepts endlessly, but when it comes to our faith, I agree with St. Augustine's dictum:

Unless you believe, you will not understand.

 

[Avatar4321]

We can debate these concepts endlessly, but when it comes to our faith, I agree with St. Augustine's dictum:

Unless you believe, you will not understand.

Im not sure thats true. I think you can understand even if you only desire to believe. And if you have that desire to know for yourself, you can study it. you can look at it from thte writer/speakers perspective and it makes total sense. and if you live it you will see the fruits of it in your life.

 

[Dr Grump]

I do realize that there are a few wacky people out there, however that generally has nothing to do with religion, and much to do with pretending they are religious. I think it's much easier to put religious people down as that seems the be the best way for others to feel better about their choice to not believe, or espouse religion.

Relax Dr 99.98% of christians etc, are not wacky

I find most religious folk that way - not just Christians..

 

[dilloduck]

I find most religious folk that way - not just Christians..

Well DUH-----Hitler found most religious folks that way too---what a surprise!

 

[MissileMan]

I think it's much easier to put religious people down as that seems the be the best way for others to feel better about their choice to not believe, or espouse religion.

I think it's much easier to assume that someone must feel badly about not believing than to consider a non-believer might be able to live a normal, happy, contented, moral life.

 

[Eightball]

I think it's much easier to assume that someone must feel badly about not believing than to consider a non-believer might be able to live a normal, happy, contented, moral life.

Well, maybe we ought to open up a new thread on "What's A Normal, Happy, Contented, Moral Life?" or "What Makes For A Normal, Happy, Contented, Moral Life?".

I think we'll get a the whole gamut of perspectives.

 

[Bullypulpit]

Can you give an example of when a mutation has given a species a new beneficial trait never before present?

There is an entire living proof of evolutionary theory located off the coast of Chile, called the Galapagos Islands. These islands are populated by examples of mutation giving species new and beneficial traits.

 

[Bullypulpit]

Rather than rebuttle your foolish comment.....I'll let a much greater Intellect do it for me, as He has much better credentials..........

Romans Chapter 1, verses 18-22.......Read it and repent, or read it and stick your fingers in your ears, and live in denial.

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,
19 because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.

It is NOT evident that any divine entity had a hand in the world that has come to be.

20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse. (Man thinks of every possible reason for existence, but supernatural...as Man inherently in his sinful nature must be the "center" of all meaning, and existence.).

There is no reason to assume that any supernatural agency is responsible for existence. There is nothing inherently "sinful" about assuming otherwise.

21 For even though they knew God, they did not [c]honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened. (Yep, according to this ominous piece of scripture, the more that man/woman denies the obvious, the more they become darkened in their minds to actually having a possible spiritual break-through that leads them to their Maker......That again is scarey and ominuous, and very sad.).

WHy does this prevent people from having a "spiritual break-through". I know many non-Christians who, by any definition, are in a state of grace.

22 Professing to be wise, they became fools,(Self explanatory....as evidenced on this message board by so many self sufficient, highly intelligent beings, who ought to know better.)

Smug self-righteousness is unbecoming of you.

 

[Annie]

Well, maybe we ought to open up a new thread on "What's A Normal, Happy, Contented, Moral Life?" or "What Makes For A Normal, Happy, Contented, Moral Life?".

I think we'll get a the whole gamut of perspectives.

I did.

 

[Bullypulpit]

No it doesn't. IT asserts that the human mind is capable verifying the truth about god, and pronounces him nonexistant. That's absolutism too.

How does one verify "the truth" about a divine being which, by its very nature, is unavailable to human perception or even comprehension? There is no means to verify this "truth" independently, objectively and repeatably. If you can do this, you might make a believer of me.

 

[mattskramer]

Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour. (Exodus 20:16)

Seems in your haste to be a smarmy little bastard you left out a few words like ...AGAINST THEY NEIGHBOR.

So, I AM talking straight. You on the other hand, are talking out your ass, as usual. I haven't ducked and dodged a thing. I think I'm being pretty straightforward in that you don't know what the fuck you are blabbing about.

Okay. So the Jew was a neighbor.

 

[mattskramer]

Which scientist observed this?

It is based on an overwhelming preponderance of evidence. Fossil records, genetics, biology, etc.

Another question to ponder is, did God create light "in transit"? I don't think so, but how, then can we observe stars that are millions of light years away if the universe is only thousands of years old? Einstein was messing around with the idea that gravity distorts time. There are many aspects of the Creation model that have not been worked out, just as there are many aspects of the material/evolution model which do not match with observed facts. Our scientific knowledge is incomplete.

No. You are ducking and dodging. Read the Bible carefully. God created light before he created the things that produce light. There is simply no getting around it.

Yes, the lie is still a sin. Should the citizen reveal the whereabouts of the hidden Jews? No. In our fallen world, we do not always have the luxury of choosing between right and wrong. At times, we are forced to choose the lesser of two evils.

Wow! God permits us to sin given the circumstances?

 

[no1tovote4]

It is based on an overwhelming preponderance of evidence. Fossil records, genetics, biology, etc.



No. You are ducking and dodging. Read the Bible carefully. God created light before he created the things that produce light. There is simply no getting around it.



Wow! God permits us to sin given the circumstances?

How bright must the Big Bang have been? It seems that the light was created before other things... If you take that into account. Then the things separated. Then the stars were set in the firmament... Hmmm... It actually sounds like the events of the Big Bang to me. The Earth was without form and void... Until it settled how formed was the Earth? So forth. I am not "ducking and dodging", I am not a Christian or a Jew, this isn't "sacred" to me, I don't need to find excuses. It just seems to fit...

 

[Dr Grump]

Well DUH-----Hitler found most religious folks that way too---what a surprise!

Er, I meant not wacky....

 

[MissileMan]

How bright must the Big Bang have been? It seems that the light was created before other things... If you take that into account. Then the things separated. Then the stars were set in the firmament... Hmmm... It actually sounds like the events of the Big Bang to me. The Earth was without form and void... Until it settled how formed was the Earth? So forth. I am not "ducking and dodging", I am not a Christian or a Jew, this isn't "sacred" to me, I don't need to find excuses. It just seems to fit...

Do you think natural explanations for alleged supernatural events supports or detracts from the case that God did it?

 

[no1tovote4]

Do you think natural explanations for alleged supernatural events supports or detracts from the case that God did it?

I think neither... I just find it interesting that it follows the story so well, in allegorical terms of course. It seems that the early man who wrote it knew more about what happened than could logically be explained. Primordial memory perhaps?

As I said, I am not a Christian or a Jew so I have no real dog in this fight. It interests me.

 

[MissileMan]

I think neither... I just find it interesting that it follows the story so well, in allegorical terms of course. It seems that the early man who wrote it knew more about what happened than could logically be explained. Primordial memory perhaps?

As I said, I am not a Christian or a Jew so I have no real dog in this fight. It interests me.

I wasn't talking specifically about the Big Bang, but other stories as well, like red clay washing into the Nile turning it blood red, things like that.