The 35.4 Percent: 109,631,000 on Welfare

[DGS49]

A few points:

(1) Check the Constitution; there is no power for Congress (or anyone else) to take money from one taxpayer and give it to another, either in cash or in kind (e.g. housing voucher) (other than as compensation for a job).

(2) Whatever numbers you choose, it is only "means tested," which excludes the tens of millions who are receiving Social Security benefits.

(3) As has been pointed out by many, many people in the past, when people come to the realization that they can vote for people who give them money and stuff, we are doomed - particularly when elected officials can ignore the restraints that are written into the Constitution (including the Tenth Amendment).

(4) The flip side of this discussion is that almost half of the U.S. voting population pays NO FEDERAL INCOME TAXES, or alternatively, "pay" a negative income tax, in the form of the EITC.

(5) If you are a taxpayer and you don't see that as a problem you are not thinking straight.

 

[DGS49]

Dear "pingy," you are aware, I presume, that in order for the Economy to accommodate new people coming into the workforce, it must create 200,000 jobs per month. Thus, the new jobs created under the Obama Administration (not that he personally had anything to do with it) are not even enough to maintain the status quo, let alone improve anything, employment-wise.

 

[CitizenSeven]

The Department of Agriculture is the agency that administers the food stamp program.
They are proud of their accomplishments in handling the record numbers of people receiving food stamps.

The Department of the Interior administers the national park system.
When you go to a national park you often see signs that say "Please don't feed the animals".

Their reasoning is that the animals will lose their ability/motivation to fend for themselves because of the free handouts.



just sayin'

And they get aggressive if you don't feed them when they've gotten use to it.

A line I read over a year ago keeps coming up: Too late to fix things, too early to start shooting. I liken our current situation to the early stages of a zombie movie, but instead of the hoards moaning "brains", it's "welfare", or "wealth redistribution". Of course, all sane and moral people have an aversion to killing things that have the appearance of humans, so perhaps we are doomed to being overrun. They already have the numbers, so there is no political solution.

Good point about the aggression.

Also good quote.."too late to fix things,but too early to start shooting"...I like that.
I think the dynamic is shifting, though. The worse they act, the more people's eyes are opened.

I don't think we'll be overrun. A large percentage of people see it for exactly what it is and won't allow it.

White liberals who think they're "safe" because they aren't "racists" will be the first ones they take out just because they're easier to get to.

When resources become scarce you'll see racial cohesion. It will make the balkans look like kids on a playground..

I hope you're right, but the numbers indicate otherwise. According to the latest, 43% of all households pay no income tax, which is an improvement over Romney's 47%, but still an insanely high number. That's 43% of the adult population right from the get-go who have zero incentive, actually a disincentive, to minimize the scope and reach of USFG income taxation. These are the people who pay nothing for the operation of the USFG, and in 35% of cases, are actually paid by the USFG for breathing. Couple that with the number who do pay, but a pittance and certainly less than their per capita share of Federal spending, and you get well over 50% very quickly. That's an unbreakable voting block, all clamoring for more subsidies, welfare, tax breaks, and pay for it via taxing the minority even more outrageous rates. A death by a thousand bites.

Those are the zombies, and they have the numbers.

 

[pinqy]

Dear "pingy," you are aware, I presume, that in order for the Economy to accommodate new people coming into the workforce, it must create 200,000 jobs per month.

No, I don't know that, because it's not true. I've done the math. You don't know it either: you just heard it from someone else and accepted it without checking.
But...I'm sure you'll actually do the math now. Though first you have to define your terms....what exactly does "accommodate new people coming into the workforce" mean? You know a job isn't a job unless there's actually a person in that job working it, right? Do you think that everyone entering the labor force should enter as employed? That would mean every 16 year old looking for a first job gets hired in less than 4 weeks from their 16th birthday. Every immigrant, every discharged military, and every released prisoner gets a job in their first 4 weeks.

Please define your terms and show your numbers.

Thus, the new jobs created under the Obama Administration (not that he personally had anything to do with it) are not even enough to maintain the status quo, let alone improve anything, employment-wise.

Not sure what you mean by the status quo....Do you mean the employment population ratio? The labor force participation rate? What exactly are you referring to and where is your data?

 

[Rotagilla]

The Department of Agriculture is the agency that administers the food stamp program.
They are proud of their accomplishments in handling the record numbers of people receiving food stamps.

The Department of the Interior administers the national park system.
When you go to a national park you often see signs that say "Please don't feed the animals".

Their reasoning is that the animals will lose their ability/motivation to fend for themselves because of the free handouts.



just sayin'

And they get aggressive if you don't feed them when they've gotten use to it.

A line I read over a year ago keeps coming up: Too late to fix things, too early to start shooting. I liken our current situation to the early stages of a zombie movie, but instead of the hoards moaning "brains", it's "welfare", or "wealth redistribution". Of course, all sane and moral people have an aversion to killing things that have the appearance of humans, so perhaps we are doomed to being overrun. They already have the numbers, so there is no political solution.

Good point about the aggression.

Also good quote.."too late to fix things,but too early to start shooting"...I like that.
I think the dynamic is shifting, though. The worse they act, the more people's eyes are opened.

I don't think we'll be overrun. A large percentage of people see it for exactly what it is and won't allow it.

White liberals who think they're "safe" because they aren't "racists" will be the first ones they take out just because they're easier to get to.

When resources become scarce you'll see racial cohesion. It will make the balkans look like kids on a playground..

I hope you're right, but the numbers indicate otherwise. According to the latest, 43% of all households pay no income tax, which is an improvement over Romney's 47%, but still an insanely high number. That's 43% of the adult population right from the get-go who have zero incentive, actually a disincentive, to minimize the scope and reach of USFG income taxation. These are the people who pay nothing for the operation of the USFG, and in 35% of cases, are actually paid by the USFG for breathing. Couple that with the number who do pay, but a pittance and certainly less than their per capita share of Federal spending, and you get well over 50% very quickly. That's an unbreakable voting block, all clamoring for more subsidies, welfare, tax breaks, and pay for it via taxing the minority even more outrageous rates. A death by a thousand bites.

Those are the zombies, and they have the numbers.

Which, in my opinion, proves that collapse is imminent. This kind of deficit is unsustainable.
They have the numbers..We have the...let's say..."abilities".

 

[CitizenSeven]

The math is quite simple: GrowthRate*Population/12 is the number of jobs needed to maintain the same level (percentage) of employment. Since time is linear, as the population grows over time, so too does the number of people entering the "working age" bracket, no matter what age you assign that. According to the latest numbers from the Census Bureau the population of the U.S. is 318 million. By that same page, we can see that the Census Bureau assumes a 0.7% growth rate. Plugging the values in, we get 185.5 thousand new jobs per month just to break even month-to-month. That won't make up for the losses sustained during 2008-2010.

 

[Rotagilla]

The math is quite simple: GrowthRate*Population/12 is the number of jobs needed to maintain the same level (percentage) of employment. Since time is linear, as the population grows over time, so too does the number of people entering the "working age" bracket, no matter what age you assign that. According to the latest numbers from the Census Bureau the population of the U.S. is 318 million. By that same page, we can see that the Census Bureau assumes a 0.7% growth rate. Plugging the values in, we get 185.5 thousand new jobs per month just to break even month-to-month. That won't make up for the losses sustained during 2008-2010.

....and then there are the illegals (that the left like so much) undercutting fair wages and displacing american workers.

 

[bluesguy1952]

So we need immigration reform to alleviate these problems. It passed over 1 year ago in the senate but the house refuses to even bring it up for a vote. John Boehner said the mainstream republicans are afraid of tea party backlash.

so the things republicans complain about can be improved or fixed but he do nothing republicans won't allow it.

 

[Rotagilla]

be serious. They don't want the border closed...Neither side..You really think there's a difference?
You really think electing ANOTHER politician will change anything? It's all political theater and controlled opposition.
If politicians wanted the border closed it WOULD be closed. It's as simple as that.

 

[pinqy]

The math is quite simple: GrowthRate*Population/12 is the number of jobs needed to maintain the same level (percentage) of employment. Since time is linear, as the population grows over time, so too does the number of people entering the "working age" bracket, no matter what age you assign that. According to the latest numbers from the Census Bureau the population of the U.S. is 318 million. By that same page, we can see that the Census Bureau assumes a 0.7% growth rate. Plugging the values in, we get 185.5 thousand new jobs per month just to break even month-to-month. That won't make up for the losses sustained during 2008-2010.

Except that a person can have more than one job. And the measure of jobs is the Current Employment Statistics, which only includes non-farm payroll jobs and counts jobs not people (so multiple jobholders are counted for each job). And since the CES uses a slightly different time frame than the Current Population Survey (which has the population data). the two aren't directly comparable.

Second...you're using the total population, which includes millions of people who either cannot get a job or face serious restrictions. And a lot of the total population growth will be from newborns, who have a rather small job market.

So.....for labor force statistics we use the Adult Civilian Non-Institutional population. This consists of everyone in the U.S. age 16 and older who is not active duty military, in prison, or in an institution (such as an assisted living facility). So that number...as of July 2014... is 248,203,000 The average population growth per month since the recession started has been 0.08%, At a current total employment level of 146,352,000 (from the Current Population survey which counts total employment and counts multiple job holders once) we would need 1.0008*146,352,000 = 120,000 to maintain the employment population level.

Now consider that the Non-Farm Payroll Jobs number (the cited "jobs created") averages about 94% of the total employment number, that means about 113,000 a month would maintain the emp-pop ratio.

All numbers are available at Employment Situation

 

[Moonglow]

The farmers enjoy the stats...

 

[gipper]

This is what the Obama Administration considers to be an economic recovery.

109,631,000 Americans lived in households that received benefits from one or more federally funded "means-tested programs" — also known as welfare — as of the fourth quarter of 2012, according to data released Tuesday by the Census Bureau.

The Census Bureau has not yet reported how many were on welfare in 2013 or the first two quarters of 2014.

But the 109,631,000 living in households taking federal welfare benefits as of the end of 2012, according to the Census Bureau, equaled 35.4 percent of all 309,467,000 people living in the United States at that time.

The 35.4 Percent: 109,631,000 on Welfare | CNS News

More bad economic news...

The following are 30 stats to show to anyone that does not believe the middle class is being destroyed...

1. In 2007, the average household in the top 5 percent had 16.5 times as much wealth as the average household overall. But now the average household in the top 5 percent has 24 times as much wealth as the average household overall.

2. According to a study recently discussed in the New York Times, the "typical American household" is now worth 36 percent less than it was worth a decade ago.

3. One out of every seven Americans rely on food banks at this point.

4. One out of every four military familiesneeds help putting enough food on the table.

5. 79 percent of the people that use food banks purchase "inexpensive, unhealthy food just to have enough to feed their families".

6. One out of every three adults in the United States has an unpaid debt that is "in collections".

7. Only 48 percent of all Americans can immediately come up with $400 in emergency cash without borrowing it or selling something.

8. The price of food continues to rise much faster than the paychecks of most middle class families. For example, the average price of ground beef has just hit a brand new all-time record high of $3.884 a pound.

9. According to one recent study, 40 percent of all households in the United States are experiencing financial stress right now.

10. The overall homeownership rate has fallen to the lowest level since 1995.

11. The homeownership rate for Americans under the age of 35 is at an all-time low.

12. According to one recent survey, 52 percentof all Americans cannot even afford the house that they are living in right now.

13. The average age of vehicles on America’s roads has hit an all-time high of 11.4 years.

14. Last year, one out of every four auto loans in the United States was made to someone with subprime credit.

15. Amazingly, one out of every six men in their prime working years (25 to 54) do not have a job at this point.

16. One recent study found that 47 percent of unemployed Americans have “completely given up” looking for a job.

17. 36 percent of Americans do not have a single penny saved for retirement.

18. According to one survey, 76 percent of all Americans are living paycheck to paycheck.

19. More than half of all working Americansmake less than $30,000 a year in wages.

20. Only four of the twenty fastest growing occupations in America require a Bachelor’s degree or better.

21. In America today, one out of every ten jobs is filled by a temp agency.

22. Due to a lack of decent jobs, half of all college graduates are still relying on their parents financially when they are two years out of school.

23. Median household income in the United States is about 7 percent lower than it was in the year 2000 after adjusting for inflation.

24. Approximately one out of every four part-time workers in America is living below the poverty line.

25. It is hard to believe, but more than one out of every five children in the United States is living in poverty in 2014.

26. According to one study, there are 49 million Americans that are dealing with food insecurity.

27. Ten years ago, the number of women in the U.S. that had jobs outnumbered the number of women in the U.S. on food stamps by more than a 2 to 1 margin. But now the number of women in the U.S. on food stamps actually exceedsthe number of women that have jobs.

28. If the middle class was actually thriving, we wouldn’t have more than a million public school children that are homeless.

29. If you can believe it, Americans received more than 2 trillion dollars in benefits from the federal government last year alone.

30. In terms of median wealth per adult, the United States is now in just 19th place in the world.

 

[oldfart]

The BLS counts jobs exactly the same way as they did when Boosh was president. You are embarrassing yourself.

Bush didn't have a policy of destroying full time jobs and replacing them with part time ones. It wouldn't hurt for you to actually read the BLS reports. It's pretty clear you have no idea what is going on in the job markets.

You're quoting political drivel. I have read the BLS reports every month for 40 years. I'm qualified in federal court as a labor economist and have testified in multiple cases. This place has a search function. Perhaps you can peruse my posts and point out any factual errors I have made in over a hundred posts on labor markets.

And stop whining. You already embarrassed yourself and are now doubling down on dumb.

 

[boedicca]

The BLS counts jobs exactly the same way as they did when Boosh was president. You are embarrassing yourself.

Bush didn't have a policy of destroying full time jobs and replacing them with part time ones. It wouldn't hurt for you to actually read the BLS reports. It's pretty clear you have no idea what is going on in the job markets.

You're quoting political drivel. I have read the BLS reports every month for 40 years. I'm qualified in federal court as a labor economist and have testified in multiple cases. This place has a search function. Perhaps you can peruse my posts and point out any factual errors I have made in over a hundred posts on labor markets.

And stop whining. You already embarrassed yourself and are now doubling down on dumb.

You are a blithering moron who can't grok the context of my original posts.

Too bad for you.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

At a certain point, people who are paying for all this federal largesse are going to shrug. Some of us are there already, but more and more are saying "why bother?". Calls for increased taxation for the self-sufficient class are just accelerating the process.

Thomas Jefferson-
"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to grain ground; that the greater the government the stronger the exploiter and the weaker the producer; that , therefore, the hope of liberty depends upon local self-)governance and the vigilance of the producer class."

Sadly, it seems the producer class is losing the battle.