Simple Point Missing in the Union threads

[thereisnospoon]

Only 10% of all American workers even belong to a union.

Republicans believe in "prosperity through lower wages". Oh, and they think education is for "snobs".

7%....10% was about a decade ago.

 

[MeBelle]

Only 10% of all American workers even belong to a union.

Republicans believe in "prosperity through lower wages". Oh, and they think education is for "snobs".

Talking point for the day rdean?

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Wow, it has nothing to do with biology or chemistry. LMAO.......

Perhaps you should use metaphors that you understand then.

So far, I've not been impressed by your alleged 'intellectual prowess'......I never said I didn't believe in it.....but I doubt you've thought it through enough to fully understand the implications of it, or even why we are able to study it.

Since you seem to want to enslave people to government, toe the government education line and cannot seem to even keep up with your metaphors, I don't believe in debating you will accomplish much. It has managed to kill some time I needed to kill and thanks for the entertainment.

Yes. You're right. I want to enslave people to the government. And you want to enslave them to Corporate America...or just condemn them to die. Because that's better than taking assistance, right?

Christ.

And please, enlighten me, why does the sky appear blue, exactly?

I already explained to why I care if you believe in evolution. It speaks to whether you can accept universal fact or not.

Universal fact? Bwwwahahahhhahahahaaaa...

BTW....No one is enslaved to corporate America. That is the kind of poorly thought out response I've come to expect from the left.

Do you even know what a company is? I'll give you a hint. It has no evil designs against people. It provides a need to society. It has no power over anyone.

Government has real power. They have guns and people willing to force you to follow their dictates. Companies do not. Government has the authority to take your freedom from you and lock you away. Companies do not.

Companies do not force people to be dependent upon them Government does.

I can go on, but I think I probably lost you when I said something you don't agree with. Its the sure sign of a liberal. It closes their minds and turns them into hate machines. Have a nice life.

No one said companies are evil. Yes, they provide a service and a value, but not an altruistic one. Companies serve their needs and their needs only, out of necessity. And there are plent of people enslaved to Corporate America. To deny that is to live in Magical Conservative Land where every company is perfect, run by saints.

You didn't lose me because you expressed an opposing view, you pretentious twat. I just disiagree with your assertion that companies are these saintly run organizations that do nothing but good. That is naive beyond all compare.

Evolution is a universal fact, or truth. It's not really up for a debate, except among circles who dont really understand science, that is. And that's why I asked. There's no point in debating something with someone who doesn't believe in something that takes no belief to be true.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Why We Need Unions

If you've ever asked for a raise at work, you should understand the concept of leverage: to the extent that your employer needs you, you have it, and you're able to get something (increased wages) for it; to the extent that your employer considers you replaceable, you lack it, and therefore have no way to improve your own position. In the retail and service industries, employees lack leverage almost by definition. Anyone who makes trouble can simply be tossed out and replaced. Unions give those employees leverage. That leverage is a means to a fair wage. Not an outrageous, outsized wage; a fair wage. Any union that bankrupts the parent company is a failure, because all the union members end up unemployed. It is in the interest of unions to achieve the best possible conditions for workers that still allow the company to flourish. A union does not throw off the balance of power in the workplace—lack of a union does.

Large corporations are machines designed to make money for shareholders. They do it well. To expect them to do anything but minimize wages and maximize profit is to misunderstand their nature. The most basic sense of decency and respect for human rights dictates that there must be some mechanism by which the workers—the humans—can assert their interests. Otherwise they will be crushed by the machine. It's all very plain to see.

I get a raise pretty much every year and I'm generally not disappointed with them. There was only one time I ever went to my boss and asked for a raise out of turn and you know what? I got it, because I'm a valuable employee who is an asset to the company. I didn't need a union to negotiate it for me. Your incompetence is not my problem.

 

[skookerasbil]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEwXa197uBU]The Most Disappointed Barrett Supporter In Wisconsin - YouTube[/ame]



Wonder how hard this dolt pumped his cat the night of the election??????????


Im still laughing. Unions = meh

 

[Darkwind]

Yes. You're right. I want to enslave people to the government. And you want to enslave them to Corporate America...or just condemn them to die. Because that's better than taking assistance, right?

Christ.

And please, enlighten me, why does the sky appear blue, exactly?

I already explained to why I care if you believe in evolution. It speaks to whether you can accept universal fact or not.

Universal fact? Bwwwahahahhhahahahaaaa...

BTW....No one is enslaved to corporate America. That is the kind of poorly thought out response I've come to expect from the left.

Do you even know what a company is? I'll give you a hint. It has no evil designs against people. It provides a need to society. It has no power over anyone.

Government has real power. They have guns and people willing to force you to follow their dictates. Companies do not. Government has the authority to take your freedom from you and lock you away. Companies do not.

Companies do not force people to be dependent upon them Government does.

I can go on, but I think I probably lost you when I said something you don't agree with. Its the sure sign of a liberal. It closes their minds and turns them into hate machines. Have a nice life.

No one said companies are evil. Yes, they provide a service and a value, but not an altruistic one. Companies serve their needs and their needs only, out of necessity. And there are plent of people enslaved to Corporate America. To deny that is to live in Magical Conservative Land where every company is perfect, run by saints.

You didn't lose me because you expressed an opposing view, you pretentious twat. I just disiagree with your assertion that companies are these saintly run organizations that do nothing but good. That is naive beyond all compare.

Evolution is a universal fact, or truth. It's not really up for a debate, except among circles who dont really understand science, that is. And that's why I asked. There's no point in debating something with someone who doesn't believe in something that takes no belief to be true.

Name Me one company that can prevent you from leaving....Now tell Me, where do I go when I want to quit My government? It really is just that basic.

I never claimed businesses are saintly, and you know what? I don't have to. They don't exist to be altruistic. That is for private citizens and organizations that see a need to do that kind of thing.

Government is the epitome of greed and power run amok. It is why the Founding Fathers wanted it caged, and limited in power and scope. They were wise beyond even what they knew.

And evolution is NOT a universal fact. It is a theory, one that evolves every day. There are far to many questions that have not been answered regarding evolution. But don't let the fact that science........real science....never assumes anything is settled science or that any fact is 'Universal'. It goes against the very premise of science. Question everything. BTW...I happen to believe in Evolution....but not the way you want it believed.

 

[Gremlin-USA]

The Most Disappointed Barrett Supporter In Wisconsin - YouTube

Wonder how hard this dolt pumped his cat the night of the election??????????

Im still laughing. Unions = meh

OMG, I almost shed a tear for the poor guy, that was so touching

If he is correct, we all better pack our bags and move somewhere where Democracy still lives

Seriously, how do idiots like that find there way home every evening?

 

[Darkwind]

Oh, the "Government is evil and fucks everything up so why try?" motto of modern Conservatism.

Trying to lump everyone on assistance programs into one group is stupid. There are a million reasons people need government help. And I just hope and pray that one day you're in the position to need it, and one of your NeoCon friends is there to remind you to just "tough it out" a little bit more.

Government is a necessary evil, but requires restriction to enumerated powers and nothing more. The credo of every American should be, free from government. At least, the thinking ones.

There are millions of people on assistance. And you see nothing wrong with that? NOTHING AT ALL? There are people who will DIE if they do not get government assistance. Just how beholden are to a government that holds you enslaved for your very life, if they do not intervene? How can anyone not look at that without horror? My God, how heartless and cruel is it to totally subjugate someone for their very existence? Yet you want to call Me an asshole, a sadist. When you learn right from the very beginning in life that life is not fair, and that no one owes you anything, you tend to be very motivated to survive. That is what it takes to live in this world. Motivation to survive. Hell, it is how you get rich..

Now, lets take one last look at how fucked in the head you are.....People standing on the sidelines, houses gone, bills so high they cannot possibly pay for them all, and you want government to take MY hard earned taxes and give it to them.....those who fucked up on their own.....those who made their own choices and lost......and you claim I'm standing on the sidelines?

I own My home.. I have bills I can afford....and I had all that long before 08.

I've never needed government to help me live, or make me happy, or provide for me.

I participate.

So, get it right. Your the en-slaver, the sadist, the fucking overseer with the whip, forcing fewer and fewer people to pay for more and more of the services that government does not have the authority to provide.

I just wonder what you will tell yourself when government collapses and cannot provide for those people you think need caring for.. There are going to be a lot of deaths in this country.....because of visions like yours.

In response to your last sentence. Precisely what is going on in the Euro-Zone.
The governments of Greece, Portugal and Spain are in the deepest depths of Hell all because of socialism, mandatory government pensions, low retirement age, subsidizing of of business so that workers no matter how useless are retained by the employer....
It's all crashing.

yes, I agree. But I was thinking more along the lines of the people in this country who would, if government collapsed or just went bankrupt (same thing I suppose) that would starve to death because they are so dependent upon government that they cannot even provide the most basic sustenance for themselves.

I just don't know why people don't see the disaster that is heading their way.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Universal fact? Bwwwahahahhhahahahaaaa...

BTW....No one is enslaved to corporate America. That is the kind of poorly thought out response I've come to expect from the left.

Do you even know what a company is? I'll give you a hint. It has no evil designs against people. It provides a need to society. It has no power over anyone.

Government has real power. They have guns and people willing to force you to follow their dictates. Companies do not. Government has the authority to take your freedom from you and lock you away. Companies do not.

Companies do not force people to be dependent upon them Government does.

I can go on, but I think I probably lost you when I said something you don't agree with. Its the sure sign of a liberal. It closes their minds and turns them into hate machines. Have a nice life.

No one said companies are evil. Yes, they provide a service and a value, but not an altruistic one. Companies serve their needs and their needs only, out of necessity. And there are plent of people enslaved to Corporate America. To deny that is to live in Magical Conservative Land where every company is perfect, run by saints.

You didn't lose me because you expressed an opposing view, you pretentious twat. I just disiagree with your assertion that companies are these saintly run organizations that do nothing but good. That is naive beyond all compare.

Evolution is a universal fact, or truth. It's not really up for a debate, except among circles who dont really understand science, that is. And that's why I asked. There's no point in debating something with someone who doesn't believe in something that takes no belief to be true.

Name Me one company that can prevent you from leaving....Now tell Me, where do I go when I want to quit My government? It really is just that basic.

I never claimed businesses are saintly, and you know what? I don't have to. They don't exist to be altruistic. That is for private citizens and organizations that see a need to do that kind of thing.

Government is the epitome of greed and power run amok. It is why the Founding Fathers wanted it caged, and limited in power and scope. They were wise beyond even what they knew.

And evolution is NOT a universal fact. It is a theory, one that evolves every day. There are far to many questions that have not been answered regarding evolution. But don't let the fact that science........real science....never assumes anything is settled science or that any fact is 'Universal'. It goes against the very premise of science. Question everything. BTW...I happen to believe in Evolution....but not the way you want it believed.

I hate to break it to you, but the same species of creature runs government that runs corporations. And I don't agree with your movement's assertion that all government is bad. It's just not true or pracitical to have that mentality. Those who fear government do so because they lack the desire to change it.

And, evolution is a fact. Yes, we learn more about what it is and how it works every day, but it is not a theory. Your insistence that it is shows how out of touch with actual scientists you are.

The point is that you don't have to believe in evolution. Because it's like believing in gravity.

 

[thereisnospoon]

The Most Disappointed Barrett Supporter In Wisconsin - YouTube

Wonder how hard this dolt pumped his cat the night of the election??????????

Im still laughing. Unions = meh

OMG, I almost shed a tear for the poor guy, that was so touching

If he is correct, we all better pack our bags and move somewhere where Democracy still lives

Seriously, how do idiots like that find there way home every evening?

My wonder is the uncanny ability for news reporters to find these people and get a mic and camera in their face....

 

[thereisnospoon]

In response to your last sentence. Precisely what is going on in the Euro-Zone.
The governments of Greece, Portugal and Spain are in the deepest depths of Hell all because of socialism, mandatory government pensions, low retirement age, subsidizing of of business so that workers no matter how useless are retained by the employer....
It's all crashing.

yes, I agree. But I was thinking more along the lines of the people in this country who would, if government collapsed or just went bankrupt (same thing I suppose) that would starve to death because they are so dependent upon government that they cannot even provide the most basic sustenance for themselves.

I just don't know why people don't see the disaster that is heading their way.

Perhaps it is because they think it will never happen. And they do not have a care in the world as long as the check arrives each month.

 

[hortysir]

No, you fucking moron. That letter he wrote, that you quoted, was in response to a public sector worker asking to have union rights pushed for public sector employees. But if you did the required reading, you'd know that FDR's real dream was to get the Worker's Bill of Rights passed which would have made certain guarantees to ALL workers, public and private sector, rendering your quote sort of irrelevant. But I know, you'll hitch your wagon to it, and ignore the actual truth of the vision that FDR really had for the nation.

Derrrrrrrrrrrrrrrppppppppp.

Boy? You're lost. I bolded the pertinent part.

Again...FORGET how to read?

FDR was against PSU's...period.

I know fucktard. What I said was the part you put in bold was from a letter he wrote to a dude asking for union rights for the public sector. However that quote does not accurately reflect FDR's vision for labor in this country, regardless of public or private sector.

Did you do the googling I told you to do? Of course you didn't. You'd have to put down the McRib to do it. So here you go, I'll hand feed you some science:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=effDfpKYcVo]FDR's Economic Bill of Rights - YouTube[/ame]

Your shill-ness is noted.


It is, therefore, with a feeling of gratification that I have noted in the constitution of the National Federation of Federal Employees the provision that “under no circumstances shall this Federation engage in or support strikes against the United States Government.”

 

[thereisnospoon]

No one said companies are evil. Yes, they provide a service and a value, but not an altruistic one. Companies serve their needs and their needs only, out of necessity. And there are plent of people enslaved to Corporate America. To deny that is to live in Magical Conservative Land where every company is perfect, run by saints.

You didn't lose me because you expressed an opposing view, you pretentious twat. I just disiagree with your assertion that companies are these saintly run organizations that do nothing but good. That is naive beyond all compare.

Evolution is a universal fact, or truth. It's not really up for a debate, except among circles who dont really understand science, that is. And that's why I asked. There's no point in debating something with someone who doesn't believe in something that takes no belief to be true.

Name Me one company that can prevent you from leaving....Now tell Me, where do I go when I want to quit My government? It really is just that basic.

I never claimed businesses are saintly, and you know what? I don't have to. They don't exist to be altruistic. That is for private citizens and organizations that see a need to do that kind of thing.

Government is the epitome of greed and power run amok. It is why the Founding Fathers wanted it caged, and limited in power and scope. They were wise beyond even what they knew.

And evolution is NOT a universal fact. It is a theory, one that evolves every day. There are far to many questions that have not been answered regarding evolution. But don't let the fact that science........real science....never assumes anything is settled science or that any fact is 'Universal'. It goes against the very premise of science. Question everything. BTW...I happen to believe in Evolution....but not the way you want it believed.

I hate to break it to you, but the same species of creature runs government that runs corporations. And I don't agree with your movement's assertion that all government is bad. It's just not true or pracitical to have that mentality. Those who fear government do so because they lack the desire to change it.

And, evolution is a fact. Yes, we learn more about what it is and how it works every day, but it is not a theory. Your insistence that it is shows how out of touch with actual scientists you are.

The point is that you don't have to believe in evolution. Because it's like believing in gravity.

The difference is the federal government produces nothing. And when it's costs get out of control, it can lay more taxes or simply print more money to feed the insatiable desire to spend with reckless abandon.

 

[Darkwind]

No one said companies are evil. Yes, they provide a service and a value, but not an altruistic one. Companies serve their needs and their needs only, out of necessity. And there are plent of people enslaved to Corporate America. To deny that is to live in Magical Conservative Land where every company is perfect, run by saints.

You didn't lose me because you expressed an opposing view, you pretentious twat. I just disiagree with your assertion that companies are these saintly run organizations that do nothing but good. That is naive beyond all compare.

Evolution is a universal fact, or truth. It's not really up for a debate, except among circles who dont really understand science, that is. And that's why I asked. There's no point in debating something with someone who doesn't believe in something that takes no belief to be true.

Name Me one company that can prevent you from leaving....Now tell Me, where do I go when I want to quit My government? It really is just that basic.

I never claimed businesses are saintly, and you know what? I don't have to. They don't exist to be altruistic. That is for private citizens and organizations that see a need to do that kind of thing.

Government is the epitome of greed and power run amok. It is why the Founding Fathers wanted it caged, and limited in power and scope. They were wise beyond even what they knew.

And evolution is NOT a universal fact. It is a theory, one that evolves every day. There are far to many questions that have not been answered regarding evolution. But don't let the fact that science........real science....never assumes anything is settled science or that any fact is 'Universal'. It goes against the very premise of science. Question everything. BTW...I happen to believe in Evolution....but not the way you want it believed.

I hate to break it to you, but the same species of creature runs government that runs corporations. And I don't agree with your movement's assertion that all government is bad. It's just not true or pracitical to have that mentality. Those who fear government do so because they lack the desire to change it.

And, evolution is a fact. Yes, we learn more about what it is and how it works every day, but it is not a theory. Your insistence that it is shows how out of touch with actual scientists you are.

The point is that you don't have to believe in evolution. Because it's like believing in gravity.

I have a clue for you. That which you cannot change rapidly, but has the ability to remove your liberty and freedom IS something to be feared. And limited. I don't want to remove all government. But I do want government limited in its ability to do anything but protect us from the rest of the world. The rest of what government does is rarely needed, and often without authority.

Evolution is not a fact. You can repeat it until you grow a tail, it won't make it a fact. When you can answer some of the unanswered questions regarding evolution, you go ahead and publish your findings. I'll give a looksie. Until then, you're just talking to the wall. I won't be changing My mind on your say so.

 

[Darkwind]

yes, I agree. But I was thinking more along the lines of the people in this country who would, if government collapsed or just went bankrupt (same thing I suppose) that would starve to death because they are so dependent upon government that they cannot even provide the most basic sustenance for themselves.

I just don't know why people don't see the disaster that is heading their way.

Perhaps it is because they think it will never happen. And they do not have a care in the world as long as the check arrives each month.

Yes. And they wonder why we question education when they believe that, but history proves otherwise.

 

[JimBowie1958]

The difference is the federal government produces nothing.

Roads, schools, standardization, fair markets....

You still assert the government does nothing?

Then why were previous generations so convinced that it is a necesary evil?

'Necesary' implies it provides something of some kind that is unique to government, no?

 

[Darkwind]

The difference is the federal government produces nothing.

Roads, schools, standardization, fair markets....

You still assert the government does nothing?

Then why were previous generations so convinced that it is a necesary evil?

'Necesary' implies it provides something of some kind that is unique to government, no?

*sigh*

Let Me highlight the part you people always seem to gloss over......

Roads, schools, and fair markets have no need of a federal government and standardization is something I thought the progressives were against? After all, is that what NCLB is. Standardization of education.......

 

[clevergirl]

The difference is the federal government produces nothing.

Roads, schools, standardization, fair markets....

You still assert the government does nothing?

Then why were previous generations so convinced that it is a necesary evil?

'Necesary' implies it provides something of some kind that is unique to government, no?

He used the term "produces". He did not say government serves no purpose. I am pretty certain he was talking about a comparison to a capitalistic endeavor in light of how much government costs to operate. In other words, his frustration arises from how out of balance government cost is VS what it serves.