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Ross Perot was an example of how a third party candidate lost the election to Clinton. I never compared myself to him. YOU DID THAT.A group within the party who challenges the status quo is already in effect a third party.
A third party would put a third candidate in many elections and sway the advantage to the left.
Ross Perot a prime example. It must be done from within................Unless we ditch the 2 party system all together.
Then ditch the 2 party system. That is not written in stone, it just happened. If you all believe that you constitute a majority in the country then the result will be a win. Ross Perot clearly did not represent a majority. If you compare yourselves to him, then you must think you also do not represent a majority and aren't capable of standing on your own.
The real problem I guess is in these terms you keep tossing out. You all call yourselves "true conservatives" and the rest of us "RINOs". However, given that it was our party in the first place and you are late comers, it is actually the opposite. We are the true conservatives and you all are the RINOs. If you think we are going to just roll over and let you have our party, you are out of your minds. You are a minority in our party and you will always be a minority in our party. A loud minority, I'll grant, but a minority nonetheless. If you ever want to be more than that, then get off your backsides and start your own party. In other words, grow up, get a job and move out of our basement.
To the Status Quo................If you support McLame, Bone Head, and Graham Nuts.............................then you aren't a Conservative...............and all this talk.........HOW YOU MADE THE GOP...............who they hell are you and do you have a mouse in your pocket?
Conservative Movements helped the GOP time and time again........but you would say the Conservatives are the problem.................How about 18 TRILLION reasons why we shouldn't listen to you..........................If that is Conservatism then I have some Ocean Front Property for you in Arizona................that is if we get the illegals off the land there first...................................
Your GRAND OLE PARTY didn't even have the BALLS to stand up to Obama on funding AMNESTY.................It's illegal yet the GOP gave the Green Light..............
When the status quo GOP grows a freaking spine let me know..................
3rd Party would be a direct challenge to the GOP STATUS QUO................and would be a godsend to the Dems......
You brought up Perot, not me. If you didn't think it was applicable to you, then bringing him up wasn't very bright.
So let me repeat it once again. The party isn't going to change for you. Ever. If you think it will, you are a fool. So go out on your own and act like you have a pair, rather than sucking off the GOP teat and complaining that nobody listens to you. Go... we don't need you, we don't want you. It's our party and you can stick your complaints up your collective backsides. And we sincerely hope you don't like it.
Is that clear enough? I tried not to use big words.
The fact is, both parties have changed over time and I am sure they will continue to do so.
History proves you are wrong about the party never changing.
How the Democratic and Republican Parties Have Changed in 8 Charts - NationalJournal.com
I'm not wrong. Take another look at those charts. The darkest shades are what you call the "true conservatives". It remains a minority group and that isn't going to change. Most people are not ideologues and are not attracted by either end of the political spectrum. In fact, I expect there are people who are being counted in that "very conservative" category who people here would call a RINO. This is because, while incessantly talking about liberty, they attack anyone who varies from the ideological line to any extent at all.
The GOP is never going to be what you want it to be. The large majority of republicans don't want it to be what you want it to be. So go.... create something more to your liking. We are not going to roll over for you.
Ross Perot was an example of how a third party candidate lost the election to Clinton. I never compared myself to him. YOU DID THAT.Then ditch the 2 party system. That is not written in stone, it just happened. If you all believe that you constitute a majority in the country then the result will be a win. Ross Perot clearly did not represent a majority. If you compare yourselves to him, then you must think you also do not represent a majority and aren't capable of standing on your own.
The real problem I guess is in these terms you keep tossing out. You all call yourselves "true conservatives" and the rest of us "RINOs". However, given that it was our party in the first place and you are late comers, it is actually the opposite. We are the true conservatives and you all are the RINOs. If you think we are going to just roll over and let you have our party, you are out of your minds. You are a minority in our party and you will always be a minority in our party. A loud minority, I'll grant, but a minority nonetheless. If you ever want to be more than that, then get off your backsides and start your own party. In other words, grow up, get a job and move out of our basement.
To the Status Quo................If you support McLame, Bone Head, and Graham Nuts.............................then you aren't a Conservative...............and all this talk.........HOW YOU MADE THE GOP...............who they hell are you and do you have a mouse in your pocket?
Conservative Movements helped the GOP time and time again........but you would say the Conservatives are the problem.................How about 18 TRILLION reasons why we shouldn't listen to you..........................If that is Conservatism then I have some Ocean Front Property for you in Arizona................that is if we get the illegals off the land there first...................................
Your GRAND OLE PARTY didn't even have the BALLS to stand up to Obama on funding AMNESTY.................It's illegal yet the GOP gave the Green Light..............
When the status quo GOP grows a freaking spine let me know..................
3rd Party would be a direct challenge to the GOP STATUS QUO................and would be a godsend to the Dems......
You brought up Perot, not me. If you didn't think it was applicable to you, then bringing him up wasn't very bright.
So let me repeat it once again. The party isn't going to change for you. Ever. If you think it will, you are a fool. So go out on your own and act like you have a pair, rather than sucking off the GOP teat and complaining that nobody listens to you. Go... we don't need you, we don't want you. It's our party and you can stick your complaints up your collective backsides. And we sincerely hope you don't like it.
Is that clear enough? I tried not to use big words.
The fact is, both parties have changed over time and I am sure they will continue to do so.
History proves you are wrong about the party never changing.
How the Democratic and Republican Parties Have Changed in 8 Charts - NationalJournal.com
I'm not wrong. Take another look at those charts. The darkest shades are what you call the "true conservatives". It remains a minority group and that isn't going to change. Most people are not ideologues and are not attracted by either end of the political spectrum. In fact, I expect there are people who are being counted in that "very conservative" category who people here would call a RINO. This is because, while incessantly talking about liberty, they attack anyone who varies from the ideological line to any extent at all.
The GOP is never going to be what you want it to be. The large majority of republicans don't want it to be what you want it to be. So go.... create something more to your liking. We are not going to roll over for you.
So the chart shows NO changes?
Dude you are in denial!!
But if you want to admit that the Democratic party, the party that supported or tolerated slavery and opposed civil rights reforms after the Civil War in order to retain the support of Southern voters is still the same party, then go ahead.
The GOP lost interest in moderates so long ago and showed them the door so harshly that they will never be back.
Ross Perot was an example of how a third party candidate lost the election to Clinton. I never compared myself to him. YOU DID THAT.
To the Status Quo................If you support McLame, Bone Head, and Graham Nuts.............................then you aren't a Conservative...............and all this talk.........HOW YOU MADE THE GOP...............who they hell are you and do you have a mouse in your pocket?
Conservative Movements helped the GOP time and time again........but you would say the Conservatives are the problem.................How about 18 TRILLION reasons why we shouldn't listen to you..........................If that is Conservatism then I have some Ocean Front Property for you in Arizona................that is if we get the illegals off the land there first...................................
Your GRAND OLE PARTY didn't even have the BALLS to stand up to Obama on funding AMNESTY.................It's illegal yet the GOP gave the Green Light..............
When the status quo GOP grows a freaking spine let me know..................
3rd Party would be a direct challenge to the GOP STATUS QUO................and would be a godsend to the Dems......
You brought up Perot, not me. If you didn't think it was applicable to you, then bringing him up wasn't very bright.
So let me repeat it once again. The party isn't going to change for you. Ever. If you think it will, you are a fool. So go out on your own and act like you have a pair, rather than sucking off the GOP teat and complaining that nobody listens to you. Go... we don't need you, we don't want you. It's our party and you can stick your complaints up your collective backsides. And we sincerely hope you don't like it.
Is that clear enough? I tried not to use big words.
The fact is, both parties have changed over time and I am sure they will continue to do so.
History proves you are wrong about the party never changing.
How the Democratic and Republican Parties Have Changed in 8 Charts - NationalJournal.com
I'm not wrong. Take another look at those charts. The darkest shades are what you call the "true conservatives". It remains a minority group and that isn't going to change. Most people are not ideologues and are not attracted by either end of the political spectrum. In fact, I expect there are people who are being counted in that "very conservative" category who people here would call a RINO. This is because, while incessantly talking about liberty, they attack anyone who varies from the ideological line to any extent at all.
The GOP is never going to be what you want it to be. The large majority of republicans don't want it to be what you want it to be. So go.... create something more to your liking. We are not going to roll over for you.
So the chart shows NO changes?
Dude you are in denial!!
But if you want to admit that the Democratic party, the party that supported or tolerated slavery and opposed civil rights reforms after the Civil War in order to retain the support of Southern voters is still the same party, then go ahead.
I'm not a democrat. I could not care less about the democrats. I'm a republican. This is my party. If you want to be in the party, great. But be in the party. If all you want to do is attack anyone who doesn't kowtow to your every whim, hit the bricks. Because we republicans, the real republicans, have had just about enough of this crap.
Who appointed you the God of the party. Ross Perot was an example of what happens when you get a third ticket. If you support the freaking RINO's then you are the problem and not the solution. If you support McLame and Bone Head you might as well call youselves Democraps instead of Republican.Ross Perot was an example of how a third party candidate lost the election to Clinton. I never compared myself to him. YOU DID THAT.A group within the party who challenges the status quo is already in effect a third party.those three clowns are not the GOP. They are history.
More fantasy. The leadership of the party didn't walk into their office one day, put up a sign and everyone just assumed they belonged there. They were voted in by the membership. Do you think the membership didn't know who they were? And when they finally leave those positions, they are not going to be replaced by any "true conservatives". If you want to control your party, you need to form your own party. You will never control the GOP.
A third party would put a third candidate in many elections and sway the advantage to the left.
Ross Perot a prime example. It must be done from within................Unless we ditch the 2 party system all together.
Then ditch the 2 party system. That is not written in stone, it just happened. If you all believe that you constitute a majority in the country then the result will be a win. Ross Perot clearly did not represent a majority. If you compare yourselves to him, then you must think you also do not represent a majority and aren't capable of standing on your own.
The real problem I guess is in these terms you keep tossing out. You all call yourselves "true conservatives" and the rest of us "RINOs". However, given that it was our party in the first place and you are late comers, it is actually the opposite. We are the true conservatives and you all are the RINOs. If you think we are going to just roll over and let you have our party, you are out of your minds. You are a minority in our party and you will always be a minority in our party. A loud minority, I'll grant, but a minority nonetheless. If you ever want to be more than that, then get off your backsides and start your own party. In other words, grow up, get a job and move out of our basement.
To the Status Quo................If you support McLame, Bone Head, and Graham Nuts.............................then you aren't a Conservative...............and all this talk.........HOW YOU MADE THE GOP...............who they hell are you and do you have a mouse in your pocket?
Conservative Movements helped the GOP time and time again........but you would say the Conservatives are the problem.................How about 18 TRILLION reasons why we shouldn't listen to you..........................If that is Conservatism then I have some Ocean Front Property for you in Arizona................that is if we get the illegals off the land there first...................................
Your GRAND OLE PARTY didn't even have the BALLS to stand up to Obama on funding AMNESTY.................It's illegal yet the GOP gave the Green Light..............
When the status quo GOP grows a freaking spine let me know..................
3rd Party would be a direct challenge to the GOP STATUS QUO................and would be a godsend to the Dems......
You brought up Perot, not me. If you didn't think it was applicable to you, then bringing him up wasn't very bright.
So let me repeat it once again. The party isn't going to change for you. Ever. If you think it will, you are a fool. So go out on your own and act like you have a pair, rather than sucking off the GOP teat and complaining that nobody listens to you. Go... we don't need you, we don't want you. It's our party and you can stick your complaints up your collective backsides. And we sincerely hope you don't like it.
Is that clear enough? I tried not to use big words.
Well, it depends. If you vote out RINOs and they continue to vote GOP, you haven't lost anything....making the party smaller, yes?.As has been explained, the "tea party" isn't a political party. It's a movement. There is more in common with tea partiers and conservative republicans than there are differences. What needs to be done and has in some precincts is weed out the RINO's.Unless I've missed one, I don't see any posts by conservatives who feel that the Tea Party should split from the GOP.
Interesting..
No, making the party stronger.
I don't see how voting out a RINO and voting in a true conservative Republican would make the party smaller.
Then the question becomes whether you can attract moderates or independents, and from what I understand, that isn't a priority. That would assume that the party has enough votes on its own to win.
.
That could be.Well, it depends. If you vote out RINOs and they continue to vote GOP, you haven't lost anything....making the party smaller, yes?.As has been explained, the "tea party" isn't a political party. It's a movement. There is more in common with tea partiers and conservative republicans than there are differences. What needs to be done and has in some precincts is weed out the RINO's.Unless I've missed one, I don't see any posts by conservatives who feel that the Tea Party should split from the GOP.
Interesting..
No, making the party stronger.
I don't see how voting out a RINO and voting in a true conservative Republican would make the party smaller.
Then the question becomes whether you can attract moderates or independents, and from what I understand, that isn't a priority. That would assume that the party has enough votes on its own to win.
.
The last poll I've seen indicates that most Americans lean right. We lost the Whitehouse in '08 because too many people bought into Obama's bullshit. We lost four years later because the Christian right stayed home on election day.
U.S. Liberals at Record 24 but Still Trail Conservatives
That could be.Well, it depends. If you vote out RINOs and they continue to vote GOP, you haven't lost anything....making the party smaller, yes?.As has been explained, the "tea party" isn't a political party. It's a movement. There is more in common with tea partiers and conservative republicans than there are differences. What needs to be done and has in some precincts is weed out the RINO's.
No, making the party stronger.
I don't see how voting out a RINO and voting in a true conservative Republican would make the party smaller.
Then the question becomes whether you can attract moderates or independents, and from what I understand, that isn't a priority. That would assume that the party has enough votes on its own to win.
.
The last poll I've seen indicates that most Americans lean right. We lost the Whitehouse in '08 because too many people bought into Obama's bullshit. We lost four years later because the Christian right stayed home on election day.
U.S. Liberals at Record 24 but Still Trail Conservatives
There's one thing I've noticed (this is observation only) that might move those survey numbers somewhat, though - it's been my experience that conservatives are far more likely to identify themselves as conservatives than liberals are to identify themselves as liberals.
Conservative candidates, for example, will fall all over each claiming their conservatism while liberal candidates are clearly more reticent. In our last local elections, campaign signs for conservatives trumpeted "conservative" all over the place, while signs for several candidates that made no mention of party turned out to be Dems.
My point here is that many liberals consider themselves to be mainstream or independent, so the 24% figure in the linked survey could be pretty low.
.
Why don't the centrists form their own coalition in the Republican party?
By the way, I don't think it is wise for the very conservative Republicans(Tea party?) to be excessively pushy towards the regular conservatives and moderates. It is possible to push yourselves into a third party whether you like it or not.
Politically, Moderates are necessarily for victory.
A division between the two factions of the party seems me to be the obvious answer to the current civil war-like problems in the GOP. A split would allow for the following:
(a) The Tea Party is convinced that it represents the majority of Americans, and ridding itself of the "establishment Republicans" would allow it to pursue its agenda with far more focus and clarity to achieve (what it appears to feel would be) significantly more political victories
(b) The GOP might be able to make up for those losses by attracting more moderate voters who feel that the Democrat party has moved too far to the Left, plus it would rid itself of the element of the party that it feels is, uh, a little embarrassing and a political albatross
Seems like the obvious answer. If not, why not?
.
Why don't the centrists form their own coalition in the Republican party?
By the way, I don't think it is wise for the very conservative Republicans(Tea party?) to be excessively pushy towards the regular conservatives and moderates. It is possible to push yourselves into a third party whether you like it or not.
Politically, Moderates are necessarily for victory.
I don't see Democrats wooing moderates.
Why don't the centrists form their own coalition in the Republican party?
By the way, I don't think it is wise for the very conservative Republicans(Tea party?) to be excessively pushy towards the regular conservatives and moderates. It is possible to push yourselves into a third party whether you like it or not.
Politically, Moderates are necessarily for victory.
I don't see Democrats wooing moderates.
Obama is a moderate Republican.
No one has ever achieved their goals by running away from them.
Well, first, I keep seeing, reading and hearing that the "conservatives" want the "RINOs" out of the party. So this wasn't my idea.Why is that interesting? I'm sure you would want a split and a third party that would give the Dems an advantage with the opposing side votes being divided up.Unless I've missed one, I don't see any posts by conservatives who feel that the Tea Party should split from the GOP.
Interesting.
.
Under our current system, aka 2 parties, you commit political suicide doing so...........
What happened to the blue dogs who chose not to toe the line with Dems within the party........They were destroyed because they dared to oppose the Party line. Should Blue dogs form a different party.............and would you want that option?
And second, I think that the resulting GOP might be able to pick up moderate voters who think the Dems have moved too far left, and that might very well make up for the loss of the Tea Party.
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