CDZ My gun control plan that will stop 95-99% of gun crime and murder in the U.S.

[M14 Shooter]

It shouldn't.

no,, it shouldnt,,,
I have to wonder what is meant by a weapon,,

Given that you believe an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness, I have to wonder why you support full enforcement of current penalties.

I support what we have because its what we have,, the problem is its not being enforced,,

BUT, if they actually enforce current penalties, it increases the probability that someone will face an actual penalty for his crime.
This is an effective increase in penalties.
Why won't actual enforcement of current penalties lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness?

because current penalties are not a life sentence,,,

They ARE, howsoever an effective increase in penalties.
You believe an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness.

 

[Porter Rockwell]

I support a life sentence on any criminal who uses a gun for an actual gun crime..... and 30 years if a criminal is caught in possession of a gun, even if they are not using it at that moment for crime.

This will dry up gun crime over night. Criminals will stop using guns for robberies, rapes and murders.....and those who do will be gone forever......

Criminals will also stop walking around with guns in their pants......which is the leading cause of random gang shootings in our cities. if they are stopped by police, with a gun in their pants, they are gone for 30 years...they will stop carrying those guns, and random gang violence will end.

You implement this with two other things...

1) No More Bargaining Away the Gun Charge.........it must be against the law to bargain away a gun charge as part of a plea deal....this stops.

2) When a criminal is arrested for any crime, and booked in...they will be read the announcement that any use of a crime is a life sentence without parole, owning or carrying a gun as a felon is a 30 year sentence without parole....when they are released from custody...the same will be read to them again....when they meet their parole officer it will be read to them again.....the U.S. government will also buy and send out Public announcements on this policy on t.v. radio. and cable......

That is how you stop gun crime over night.

Mass shooters are different..... but with only 93 people killed in mass public shootings in 2018, they are not the major problem in gun crime.

The value in my plan......it actually targets the individuals actually using guns to commit crimes and murder people....

It does not require new background check laws, it does not require gun licensing, licensing gun owners, gun registration, new taxes, fees or regulations on guns...

By making gun crime a life sentence, criminals will stop using guns for crime and will stop carrying guns around for protection.....

Also....a nurse, with a legal gun, driving from Pennsylvania, to New Jersey, will not be considered a gun criminal.....that will end. Criminals with a record of crime, caught with a gun will get 30 years, no deals.....and criminals who use guns for actual crime...robbing the local store, rape, robbery, murder.....life without parole...

This, of course, eliminates the need for more gun control laws...we can already do this.....

I have not read the 17 pages of responses (though I will read them eventually), but I wanted to thank you for effort, but sadly have to disagree with you on how to stop gun violence.

The objective of the founders was that everybody who wanted one could own a firearm. Maintaining a militia was already an impossible task, so the founders / framers settled on making sure that the preexisting Right to keep and bear Arms was guaranteed.

Even if you instituted the death penalty, the people you call criminals can still get a firearm AND many Americans are historically attuned to the fact that the Right to keep and bear Arms is an absolute, inherent, unalienable, natural, God given and irrevocable Right that is above the law. Even the most law abiding American is going to own a firearm. If you cannot trust a "criminal" to own a firearm, why did you let them out of prison in the first place? Don't you think that by creating different classes of citizens you will ultimately end up with either the law abiding having to forfeit their Rights OR an internal civil war will erupt due to the disparities between classes of citizens?

If you brought your idea here as a starting point - an idea to be discussed and culled for workable ideas, I can appreciate that. But, historically punishment is not a deterrent to crime. We already have more people in prison than any nation on the planet. Drug charges can screw up the rest of your entire life. For every drug addict in a mental health facility, more than 10 drug addicts are in prison. It doesn't sound to me that you have really thought this through.

I have a plan to reduce mass shootings (not the drug deal type shootings that are used for sensationalism), but the Sandy Hook, Parkland, Columbine, El Paso kinds of mass shootings by 90 percent. AND, I'm not just pulling numbers out of my ass. I have spent upward of four decades on the research. It would impact the drug deals gone bad / gang shootings and domestic violence - but I could not fathom a guess as to how much. For the real mass shootings I can do what I claim and it would not take an increase in taxes, no new bureaucracies and no gun control. Because it contains NO gun control, the liberals won't support it and, for unexplained reasons, the Republicans never back preventative measures. They have become reactionaries. Anyway, that is my initial thoughts.

 

[2aguy]

Right. the point is the increased penalties he seeks can be applied to all weapons, not just guns.
Would you oppose this?

we already have that,,

We do not already have the increased penalties he seeks, else he would not seek them.
Would you oppose the increased penalties if they applied to ALL weapons?

except for the fact its a culture problem not a weapon problem,,

an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness,,,

More likely, as Japan showed us..... the perps will stop using guns. They can commit rape and robbery without guns.

correct me if I'm wrong but arent guns illegal there,, or very restricted???

Yes......and yet their criminals were using fully automatic military weapons and grenades...despite their gun control laws.....and as my link shows, with the article on the Yakuza....they stopped using guns and even carrying guns because the life sentence for gun crime, and the 10 year sentence for mere possession, made it too much to pay for the crime.....

They didn't need all the other gun control laws....Japanese people are conformist and law abiding to a point we will never know.....but even with that, their criminals ignored their gun control laws....until the penalty was too high...

 

[2aguy]

I support a life sentence on any criminal who uses a gun for an actual gun crime..... and 30 years if a criminal is caught in possession of a gun, even if they are not using it at that moment for crime.

This will dry up gun crime over night. Criminals will stop using guns for robberies, rapes and murders.....and those who do will be gone forever......

Criminals will also stop walking around with guns in their pants......which is the leading cause of random gang shootings in our cities. if they are stopped by police, with a gun in their pants, they are gone for 30 years...they will stop carrying those guns, and random gang violence will end.

You implement this with two other things...

1) No More Bargaining Away the Gun Charge.........it must be against the law to bargain away a gun charge as part of a plea deal....this stops.

2) When a criminal is arrested for any crime, and booked in...they will be read the announcement that any use of a crime is a life sentence without parole, owning or carrying a gun as a felon is a 30 year sentence without parole....when they are released from custody...the same will be read to them again....when they meet their parole officer it will be read to them again.....the U.S. government will also buy and send out Public announcements on this policy on t.v. radio. and cable......

That is how you stop gun crime over night.

Mass shooters are different..... but with only 93 people killed in mass public shootings in 2018, they are not the major problem in gun crime.

The value in my plan......it actually targets the individuals actually using guns to commit crimes and murder people....

It does not require new background check laws, it does not require gun licensing, licensing gun owners, gun registration, new taxes, fees or regulations on guns...

By making gun crime a life sentence, criminals will stop using guns for crime and will stop carrying guns around for protection.....

Also....a nurse, with a legal gun, driving from Pennsylvania, to New Jersey, will not be considered a gun criminal.....that will end. Criminals with a record of crime, caught with a gun will get 30 years, no deals.....and criminals who use guns for actual crime...robbing the local store, rape, robbery, murder.....life without parole...

This, of course, eliminates the need for more gun control laws...we can already do this.....

I have not read the 17 pages of responses (though I will read them eventually), but I wanted to thank you for effort, but sadly have to disagree with you on how to stop gun violence.

The objective of the founders was that everybody who wanted one could own a firearm. Maintaining a militia was already an impossible task, so the founders / framers settled on making sure that the preexisting Right to keep and bear Arms was guaranteed.

Even if you instituted the death penalty, the people you call criminals can still get a firearm AND many Americans are historically attuned to the fact that the Right to keep and bear Arms is an absolute, inherent, unalienable, natural, God given and irrevocable Right that is above the law. Even the most law abiding American is going to own a firearm. If you cannot trust a "criminal" to own a firearm, why did you let them out of prison in the first place? Don't you think that by creating different classes of citizens you will ultimately end up with either the law abiding having to forfeit their Rights OR an internal civil war will erupt due to the disparities between classes of citizens?

If you brought your idea here as a starting point - an idea to be discussed and culled for workable ideas, I can appreciate that. But, historically punishment is not a deterrent to crime. We already have more people in prison than any nation on the planet. Drug charges can screw up the rest of your entire life. For every drug addict in a mental health facility, more than 10 drug addicts are in prison. It doesn't sound to me that you have really thought this through.

I have a plan to reduce mass shootings (not the drug deal type shootings that are used for sensationalism), but the Sandy Hook, Parkland, Columbine, El Paso kinds of mass shootings by 90 percent. AND, I'm not just pulling numbers out of my ass. I have spent upward of four decades on the research. It would impact the drug deals gone bad / gang shootings and domestic violence - but I could not fathom a guess as to how much. For the real mass shootings I can do what I claim and it would not take an increase in taxes, no new bureaucracies and no gun control. Because it contains NO gun control, the liberals won't support it and, for unexplained reasons, the Republicans never back preventative measures. They have become reactionaries. Anyway, that is my initial thoughts.

And I respectfully disagree with you.... As japan shows, if the penalty for using a gun is too high, the criminals will change their behavior....why use a gun to commit a rape that will get you 7 years for the rape, but using a gun makes it a life sentence? Why carry a gun in your pants when a random stop by police for speeding or any other encounter will equal a 10 year sentence?

As to the argument about we already have more people in prison.....if you have read my other posts, you will see that the problem isn't how many we have in prison, but how many democrat party judges, prosecutors and politicians let out on Bond from jail, and out of prison on light sentences.....allowing them to go back out to the community despite multiple gun felonies...where they eventually end up murdering people...

Our problem isn't locking people up...our problem is the democrat party judges letting repeat, known, violent gun offenders out of prison over and over again....my plan stops this.

 

[2aguy]

I support a life sentence on any criminal who uses a gun for an actual gun crime..... and 30 years if a criminal is caught in possession of a gun, even if they are not using it at that moment for crime.

This will dry up gun crime over night. Criminals will stop using guns for robberies, rapes and murders.....and those who do will be gone forever......

Criminals will also stop walking around with guns in their pants......which is the leading cause of random gang shootings in our cities. if they are stopped by police, with a gun in their pants, they are gone for 30 years...they will stop carrying those guns, and random gang violence will end.

You implement this with two other things...

1) No More Bargaining Away the Gun Charge.........it must be against the law to bargain away a gun charge as part of a plea deal....this stops.

2) When a criminal is arrested for any crime, and booked in...they will be read the announcement that any use of a crime is a life sentence without parole, owning or carrying a gun as a felon is a 30 year sentence without parole....when they are released from custody...the same will be read to them again....when they meet their parole officer it will be read to them again.....the U.S. government will also buy and send out Public announcements on this policy on t.v. radio. and cable......

That is how you stop gun crime over night.

Mass shooters are different..... but with only 93 people killed in mass public shootings in 2018, they are not the major problem in gun crime.

The value in my plan......it actually targets the individuals actually using guns to commit crimes and murder people....

It does not require new background check laws, it does not require gun licensing, licensing gun owners, gun registration, new taxes, fees or regulations on guns...

By making gun crime a life sentence, criminals will stop using guns for crime and will stop carrying guns around for protection.....

Also....a nurse, with a legal gun, driving from Pennsylvania, to New Jersey, will not be considered a gun criminal.....that will end. Criminals with a record of crime, caught with a gun will get 30 years, no deals.....and criminals who use guns for actual crime...robbing the local store, rape, robbery, murder.....life without parole...

This, of course, eliminates the need for more gun control laws...we can already do this.....

I have not read the 17 pages of responses (though I will read them eventually), but I wanted to thank you for effort, but sadly have to disagree with you on how to stop gun violence.

The objective of the founders was that everybody who wanted one could own a firearm. Maintaining a militia was already an impossible task, so the founders / framers settled on making sure that the preexisting Right to keep and bear Arms was guaranteed.

Even if you instituted the death penalty, the people you call criminals can still get a firearm AND many Americans are historically attuned to the fact that the Right to keep and bear Arms is an absolute, inherent, unalienable, natural, God given and irrevocable Right that is above the law. Even the most law abiding American is going to own a firearm. If you cannot trust a "criminal" to own a firearm, why did you let them out of prison in the first place? Don't you think that by creating different classes of citizens you will ultimately end up with either the law abiding having to forfeit their Rights OR an internal civil war will erupt due to the disparities between classes of citizens?

If you brought your idea here as a starting point - an idea to be discussed and culled for workable ideas, I can appreciate that. But, historically punishment is not a deterrent to crime. We already have more people in prison than any nation on the planet. Drug charges can screw up the rest of your entire life. For every drug addict in a mental health facility, more than 10 drug addicts are in prison. It doesn't sound to me that you have really thought this through.

I have a plan to reduce mass shootings (not the drug deal type shootings that are used for sensationalism), but the Sandy Hook, Parkland, Columbine, El Paso kinds of mass shootings by 90 percent. AND, I'm not just pulling numbers out of my ass. I have spent upward of four decades on the research. It would impact the drug deals gone bad / gang shootings and domestic violence - but I could not fathom a guess as to how much. For the real mass shootings I can do what I claim and it would not take an increase in taxes, no new bureaucracies and no gun control. Because it contains NO gun control, the liberals won't support it and, for unexplained reasons, the Republicans never back preventative measures. They have become reactionaries. Anyway, that is my initial thoughts.

Mass public shootings are not effected by my idea....they need to be dealt with differently.....share your idea here, or start a new thread and we can discuss it.

 

[2aguy]

True, but.... Fully enforcing the law only means it is more likely a penalty will be applied -- thus, in effect, increasing the penalties.
An increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness,,,
So... why do you support enforcement of current penalties?

its going to take me a minute to figure out what you just said,,,

It shouldn't.

no,, it shouldnt,,,
I have to wonder what is meant by a weapon,,

Given that you believe an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness, I have to wonder why you support full enforcement of current penalties.

think about it,,
your going to rob someone with a gun and you know it would lead to a life sentence, why wouldnt you just go ahead and kill the only witness??

Why wouldn't you change to a knife and pick your victim more carefully.....redirect your process to attack the old, the weak, and isolated females......?

This way, you get 3 years for the robbery with the knife, but not a life sentence....word will get around and criminal behavior will change.

 

[2aguy]

no,, it shouldnt,,,
I have to wonder what is meant by a weapon,,

Given that you believe an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness, I have to wonder why you support full enforcement of current penalties.

I support what we have because its what we have,, the problem is its not being enforced,,

BUT, if they actually enforce current penalties, it increases the probability that someone will face an actual penalty for his crime.
This is an effective increase in penalties.
Why won't actual enforcement of current penalties lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness?

because current penalties are not a life sentence,,,

How is a life sentence commensurate with robbery? More importantly; who is gonna have to foot the bill for the convicted persons room, board, medical, and security?

Paying to keep a violent criminal in prison is cheaper than the damage and cost they create running out in public.

 

[progressive hunter]

we already have that,,

We do not already have the increased penalties he seeks, else he would not seek them.
Would you oppose the increased penalties if they applied to ALL weapons?

except for the fact its a culture problem not a weapon problem,,

an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness,,,

More likely, as Japan showed us..... the perps will stop using guns. They can commit rape and robbery without guns.

correct me if I'm wrong but arent guns illegal there,, or very restricted???

Yes......and yet their criminals were using fully automatic military weapons and grenades...despite their gun control laws.....and as my link shows, with the article on the Yakuza....they stopped using guns and even carrying guns because the life sentence for gun crime, and the 10 year sentence for mere possession, made it too much to pay for the crime.....

They didn't need all the other gun control laws....Japanese people are conformist and law abiding to a point we will never know.....but even with that, their criminals ignored their gun control laws....until the penalty was too high...

are you saying there are no crimes committed with guns there???

 

[progressive hunter]

Given that you believe an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness, I have to wonder why you support full enforcement of current penalties.

I support what we have because its what we have,, the problem is its not being enforced,,

BUT, if they actually enforce current penalties, it increases the probability that someone will face an actual penalty for his crime.
This is an effective increase in penalties.
Why won't actual enforcement of current penalties lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness?

because current penalties are not a life sentence,,,

How is a life sentence commensurate with robbery? More importantly; who is gonna have to foot the bill for the convicted persons room, board, medical, and security?

Paying to keep a violent criminal in prison is cheaper than the damage and cost they create running out in public.

opinions vary,,,

 

[progressive hunter]

its going to take me a minute to figure out what you just said,,,

It shouldn't.

no,, it shouldnt,,,
I have to wonder what is meant by a weapon,,

Given that you believe an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness, I have to wonder why you support full enforcement of current penalties.

think about it,,
your going to rob someone with a gun and you know it would lead to a life sentence, why wouldnt you just go ahead and kill the only witness??

Why wouldn't you change to a knife and pick your victim more carefully.....redirect your process to attack the old, the weak, and isolated females......?

This way, you get 3 years for the robbery with the knife, but not a life sentence....word will get around and criminal behavior will change.

I will not even attempt to go inside the mind of a criminal, at best all you can do is speculate which is the same as making shit up

 

[2aguy]

We do not already have the increased penalties he seeks, else he would not seek them.
Would you oppose the increased penalties if they applied to ALL weapons?

except for the fact its a culture problem not a weapon problem,,

an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness,,,

More likely, as Japan showed us..... the perps will stop using guns. They can commit rape and robbery without guns.

correct me if I'm wrong but arent guns illegal there,, or very restricted???

Yes......and yet their criminals were using fully automatic military weapons and grenades...despite their gun control laws.....and as my link shows, with the article on the Yakuza....they stopped using guns and even carrying guns because the life sentence for gun crime, and the 10 year sentence for mere possession, made it too much to pay for the crime.....

They didn't need all the other gun control laws....Japanese people are conformist and law abiding to a point we will never know.....but even with that, their criminals ignored their gun control laws....until the penalty was too high...

are you saying there are no crimes committed with guns there???

Nope....I am saying that the penalties are so high they are rarely used now. I showed you that in 2006 they were still using fully automatic weapons in their gang wars....and grenades....and the Yakuza interviewed in the article pointed out that they pay the price if they use a gun.....

 

[Vastator]

Given that you believe an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness, I have to wonder why you support full enforcement of current penalties.

I support what we have because its what we have,, the problem is its not being enforced,,

BUT, if they actually enforce current penalties, it increases the probability that someone will face an actual penalty for his crime.
This is an effective increase in penalties.
Why won't actual enforcement of current penalties lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness?

because current penalties are not a life sentence,,,

How is a life sentence commensurate with robbery? More importantly; who is gonna have to foot the bill for the convicted persons room, board, medical, and security?

Paying to keep a violent criminal in prison is cheaper than the damage and cost they create running out in public.

Can you prove that assertion?

 

[2aguy]

We do not already have the increased penalties he seeks, else he would not seek them.
Would you oppose the increased penalties if they applied to ALL weapons?

except for the fact its a culture problem not a weapon problem,,

an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness,,,

More likely, as Japan showed us..... the perps will stop using guns. They can commit rape and robbery without guns.

correct me if I'm wrong but arent guns illegal there,, or very restricted???

Yes......and yet their criminals were using fully automatic military weapons and grenades...despite their gun control laws.....and as my link shows, with the article on the Yakuza....they stopped using guns and even carrying guns because the life sentence for gun crime, and the 10 year sentence for mere possession, made it too much to pay for the crime.....

They didn't need all the other gun control laws....Japanese people are conformist and law abiding to a point we will never know.....but even with that, their criminals ignored their gun control laws....until the penalty was too high...

are you saying there are no crimes committed with guns there???

In fact, they just had a shooting there......and if the police catch the shooter, they are going to prison for life.........f

And as my original post points out...... this would dry up 95% of common gun crime...not all gun crime.....and I also pointed out the gangs would simply start to use 15 year olds more and more for their killing....

Man shot in Kobe in apparent gang feud - Japan Today

A man affiliated with Japan's largest crime syndicate was shot Wednesday in Kobe apparently in connection with a feud among factions of the Yamaguchi-gumi organization in the western Japan city and surrounding areas, police said.

 

[progressive hunter]

except for the fact its a culture problem not a weapon problem,,

an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness,,,

More likely, as Japan showed us..... the perps will stop using guns. They can commit rape and robbery without guns.

correct me if I'm wrong but arent guns illegal there,, or very restricted???

Yes......and yet their criminals were using fully automatic military weapons and grenades...despite their gun control laws.....and as my link shows, with the article on the Yakuza....they stopped using guns and even carrying guns because the life sentence for gun crime, and the 10 year sentence for mere possession, made it too much to pay for the crime.....

They didn't need all the other gun control laws....Japanese people are conformist and law abiding to a point we will never know.....but even with that, their criminals ignored their gun control laws....until the penalty was too high...

are you saying there are no crimes committed with guns there???

Nope....I am saying that the penalties are so high they are rarely used now. I showed you that in 2006 they were still using fully automatic weapons in their gang wars....and grenades....and the Yakuza interviewed in the article pointed out that they pay the price if they use a gun.....

so they still do the crimes even though the penalty is high,,and they even use full auto and grenades, which have never been used here

that just proves it wont work

 

[2aguy]

I support what we have because its what we have,, the problem is its not being enforced,,

BUT, if they actually enforce current penalties, it increases the probability that someone will face an actual penalty for his crime.
This is an effective increase in penalties.
Why won't actual enforcement of current penalties lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness?

because current penalties are not a life sentence,,,

How is a life sentence commensurate with robbery? More importantly; who is gonna have to foot the bill for the convicted persons room, board, medical, and security?

Paying to keep a violent criminal in prison is cheaper than the damage and cost they create running out in public.

Can you prove that assertion?

Here...one look at the cost of various crimes...

The Cost of Crime to Society: New Crime-Specific Estimates for Policy and Program Evaluation

30,000 dollars a year or so to keep a criminal locked up...

vs...

Total costs (first reported in 2000 U.S. dollars) were $4.4 million per act of murder/manslaughter, $219,286 per robbery, $369,739 per rape/sexual assault, $105,545 per aggravated assault, $22,739 per property offense, and $28,121 per drug offense.

 

[progressive hunter]

except for the fact its a culture problem not a weapon problem,,

an increase in penalties would most likely lead to the perp just killing the victim to avoid having a witness,,,

More likely, as Japan showed us..... the perps will stop using guns. They can commit rape and robbery without guns.

correct me if I'm wrong but arent guns illegal there,, or very restricted???

Yes......and yet their criminals were using fully automatic military weapons and grenades...despite their gun control laws.....and as my link shows, with the article on the Yakuza....they stopped using guns and even carrying guns because the life sentence for gun crime, and the 10 year sentence for mere possession, made it too much to pay for the crime.....

They didn't need all the other gun control laws....Japanese people are conformist and law abiding to a point we will never know.....but even with that, their criminals ignored their gun control laws....until the penalty was too high...

are you saying there are no crimes committed with guns there???

In fact, they just had a shooting there......and if the police catch the shooter, they are going to prison for life.........f

And as my original post points out...... this would dry up 95% of common gun crime...not all gun crime.....and I also pointed out the gangs would simply start to use 15 year olds more and more for their killing....

Man shot in Kobe in apparent gang feud - Japan Today

A man affiliated with Japan's largest crime syndicate was shot Wednesday in Kobe apparently in connection with a feud among factions of the Yamaguchi-gumi organization in the western Japan city and surrounding areas, police said.

95% my ass,,,

 

[M14 Shooter]

I will not even attempt to go inside the mind of a criminal, at best all you can do is speculate which is the same as making shit up

Which, apparently is exactly what you did.

 

[2aguy]

More likely, as Japan showed us..... the perps will stop using guns. They can commit rape and robbery without guns.

correct me if I'm wrong but arent guns illegal there,, or very restricted???

Yes......and yet their criminals were using fully automatic military weapons and grenades...despite their gun control laws.....and as my link shows, with the article on the Yakuza....they stopped using guns and even carrying guns because the life sentence for gun crime, and the 10 year sentence for mere possession, made it too much to pay for the crime.....

They didn't need all the other gun control laws....Japanese people are conformist and law abiding to a point we will never know.....but even with that, their criminals ignored their gun control laws....until the penalty was too high...

are you saying there are no crimes committed with guns there???

Nope....I am saying that the penalties are so high they are rarely used now. I showed you that in 2006 they were still using fully automatic weapons in their gang wars....and grenades....and the Yakuza interviewed in the article pointed out that they pay the price if they use a gun.....

so they still do the crimes even though the penalty is high,,and they even use full auto and grenades, which have never been used here

that just proves it wont work

You missed it...... it was because their gun control laws were not stopping the use of fully automatic weapons.....and grenades, that they increased the penalty to life in prison.......that stopped this activity......
They were still using fully automatic weapons....then they passed the new sentences and that crime stopped......

https://www.asiatimes.com/2017/12/article/japans-gun-control-laws-strict-yakuza-turn-toy-pistols/

Ryo Fujiwara, long-time writer on yakuza affairs and author of the book, The Three Yamaguchi-Gumi, says that the punishment for using a gun in a gang war or in a crime is now so heavy that most yakuza avoid their use at all – unless it is for an assassination.

“In a hit, whoever fires the gun, or is made to take responsibility for firing the gun, has to pretty much be willing to go to jail for the rest of their life. That’s a big decision. The repercussions are big, too. No one wants to claim responsibility for such acts – the gang office might actually get shut-down.”

The gang typically also has to support the family of the hit-man while he is in prison, which is also a financial burden for the organization.

Japan’s Firearms and Swords Control Laws make it a crime to illegally possess a gun, with a punishment of jail time of up to 10 years.

Illegal possession more than one gun, the penalty goes up to 15 years in prison. If you own a gun and matching ammunition, that’s another charge and a heavier penalty. The most severe penalty is for the act of discharging a gun in a train, on a bus, or most public spaces, which can result in a life sentence.

---

A low-ranking member of the Kobe-Yamaguchi-gumi put it this way: “All of the smart guys got rid of their guns a long-time ago. The penalties are way too high. You get life in prison if you just fire a gun. That’s not fun.”

 

[2aguy]

More likely, as Japan showed us..... the perps will stop using guns. They can commit rape and robbery without guns.

correct me if I'm wrong but arent guns illegal there,, or very restricted???

Yes......and yet their criminals were using fully automatic military weapons and grenades...despite their gun control laws.....and as my link shows, with the article on the Yakuza....they stopped using guns and even carrying guns because the life sentence for gun crime, and the 10 year sentence for mere possession, made it too much to pay for the crime.....

They didn't need all the other gun control laws....Japanese people are conformist and law abiding to a point we will never know.....but even with that, their criminals ignored their gun control laws....until the penalty was too high...

are you saying there are no crimes committed with guns there???

In fact, they just had a shooting there......and if the police catch the shooter, they are going to prison for life.........f

And as my original post points out...... this would dry up 95% of common gun crime...not all gun crime.....and I also pointed out the gangs would simply start to use 15 year olds more and more for their killing....

Man shot in Kobe in apparent gang feud - Japan Today

A man affiliated with Japan's largest crime syndicate was shot Wednesday in Kobe apparently in connection with a feud among factions of the Yamaguchi-gumi organization in the western Japan city and surrounding areas, police said.

95% my ass,,,

This is how their behavior changes...

Last June, two members of the Matsuba-kai crime group, had a wrist watch worth 850,000 yen ($7,626) sent to their office in the Arakawa district of Tokyo, cash on delivery.

When the watch arrived, one of the gang members pulled out a model gun and told the delivery workers, “Leave the watch and get out of here!”

The deliverymen, however, didn’t flinch. They grabbed back the box with the watch, took the model gun away from the yakuza, ran out of the office and called the police. The gang members were later arrested on charges of attempted extortion.

 

[progressive hunter]

correct me if I'm wrong but arent guns illegal there,, or very restricted???

Yes......and yet their criminals were using fully automatic military weapons and grenades...despite their gun control laws.....and as my link shows, with the article on the Yakuza....they stopped using guns and even carrying guns because the life sentence for gun crime, and the 10 year sentence for mere possession, made it too much to pay for the crime.....

They didn't need all the other gun control laws....Japanese people are conformist and law abiding to a point we will never know.....but even with that, their criminals ignored their gun control laws....until the penalty was too high...

are you saying there are no crimes committed with guns there???

In fact, they just had a shooting there......and if the police catch the shooter, they are going to prison for life.........f

And as my original post points out...... this would dry up 95% of common gun crime...not all gun crime.....and I also pointed out the gangs would simply start to use 15 year olds more and more for their killing....

Man shot in Kobe in apparent gang feud - Japan Today

A man affiliated with Japan's largest crime syndicate was shot Wednesday in Kobe apparently in connection with a feud among factions of the Yamaguchi-gumi organization in the western Japan city and surrounding areas, police said.

95% my ass,,,

This is how their behavior changes...

Last June, two members of the Matsuba-kai crime group, had a wrist watch worth 850,000 yen ($7,626) sent to their office in the Arakawa district of Tokyo, cash on delivery.

When the watch arrived, one of the gang members pulled out a model gun and told the delivery workers, “Leave the watch and get out of here!”

The deliverymen, however, didn’t flinch. They grabbed back the box with the watch, took the model gun away from the yakuza, ran out of the office and called the police. The gang members were later arrested on charges of attempted extortion.

correct me if I'm wrong but arent guns illegal there,, or very restricted???

Yes......and yet their criminals were using fully automatic military weapons and grenades...despite their gun control laws.....and as my link shows, with the article on the Yakuza....they stopped using guns and even carrying guns because the life sentence for gun crime, and the 10 year sentence for mere possession, made it too much to pay for the crime.....

They didn't need all the other gun control laws....Japanese people are conformist and law abiding to a point we will never know.....but even with that, their criminals ignored their gun control laws....until the penalty was too high...

are you saying there are no crimes committed with guns there???

In fact, they just had a shooting there......and if the police catch the shooter, they are going to prison for life.........f

And as my original post points out...... this would dry up 95% of common gun crime...not all gun crime.....and I also pointed out the gangs would simply start to use 15 year olds more and more for their killing....

Man shot in Kobe in apparent gang feud - Japan Today

A man affiliated with Japan's largest crime syndicate was shot Wednesday in Kobe apparently in connection with a feud among factions of the Yamaguchi-gumi organization in the western Japan city and surrounding areas, police said.

95% my ass,,,

This is how their behavior changes...

Last June, two members of the Matsuba-kai crime group, had a wrist watch worth 850,000 yen ($7,626) sent to their office in the Arakawa district of Tokyo, cash on delivery.

When the watch arrived, one of the gang members pulled out a model gun and told the delivery workers, “Leave the watch and get out of here!”

The deliverymen, however, didn’t flinch. They grabbed back the box with the watch, took the model gun away from the yakuza, ran out of the office and called the police. The gang members were later arrested on charges of attempted extortion.

sounds like you would be better off moving there than changing us here

NO MORE NEW GUN LAWS...........