Minimal Wage. Raises. Inflation. Cost of living.

[Ray From Cleveland]

Now think about those who only make 7.25 an hour

My 20 year old nephew makes $13.50 an hour working for Wal-mart. I'd be tempted to change jobs but I'm physically incapable of standing for long periods of time. Did turn down a $13.00 an hour because it was two towns over, about 15 miles away. 5 people and two cars to divide up among them doesn't leave me with a lot of options.

Technically I bought a car. My sister drives both her sons to work with it. My mother drives me to work with hers.

See, here's the thing: who's fault is it that you don't have a lot of options? Mine? Everybody else? The gov't? An employer? Or maybe yours?

So you can't stand for long periods of time, sorry to hear that. Not being an ahole either, a lotta people have physical or mental issues through no fault of their own. But it's on you to do something about it, to find a job where you don't have to stand, whatever that is. It's not on the rest of us to take care of you, that's your responsibility.

And it's not the responsibility of any employer to pay you what you need. The Left doesn't seem to grasp that concept, so many of them want a society that is free or close to free of personal responsibility. Not many places on Earth like that. M-wage is supposed to be a starting wage rather than a lifetime wage; in a year or two you're supposed to be working your way up the income ladder by then.

When we automate everything what is your plan for the unemployed people? To ignore them until their dead bodies need to be scraped up and then use the garbage men to dispose of them for you? What is your solution when most people when forced to choose between starving to death and bank robber will chose bank robbery. Thus filling up your prisons and getting free room and board there?

We are at a point where people have to think way in advance.

I used to drive a delivery van. Spent ten years delivering, setting up and instructing people on home medical equipment. I loved the job, but also realized that I wouldn't be this strong young man my entire life, and carrying heavy electric hospital beds up three flights of stairs or oxygen tanks would not be feasible as I aged.

So I got my CDL class B license to drive a straight truck. My then brother-in-law got me a job with his company. I was not satisfied with the job so went to anther after a year. I became unhappy with that job as well, but couldn't find another, so I took my test for a Class A license which is tractor-trailer. I continued to get experience with tractor-trailers at the job I hated, and in a few months, found the job I'm at now, and I've been here for about 24 years.

During that time, I bought the property I was renting at for several years. So now I actually have two jobs.

Thinking ahead, there was no future in driving a van. You can teach a monkey how to do that; anybody can drive a van, so I learned how to drive equipment that less people had the ability to drive. I also realized I didn't want to be at the mercy of a landlord for my budget, so I became the landlord.

Don't get me wrong, I made a lot of mistakes in my life like anybody else, but I only blame myself for those mistakes and how they stopped me from getting further ahead in life.

Didn't answer my question.
Some people can't afford to think past their next meal. Many times I was forced to do laundry with my grocery money. Or pay the rent with my car payment money. Fuck em right, you got yours, fuck em.

Then ask yourself: was that societies fault or yours? I don't "have mine" and never will. But I blame myself for that and nobody else in spite of my lifelong medical problems. I with I could go back in time to do things so much differently. Since I can't, all I can do now is think of ways to move forward.

 

[Slyhunter]

My 20 year old nephew makes $13.50 an hour working for Wal-mart. I'd be tempted to change jobs but I'm physically incapable of standing for long periods of time. Did turn down a $13.00 an hour because it was two towns over, about 15 miles away. 5 people and two cars to divide up among them doesn't leave me with a lot of options.

Technically I bought a car. My sister drives both her sons to work with it. My mother drives me to work with hers.

See, here's the thing: who's fault is it that you don't have a lot of options? Mine? Everybody else? The gov't? An employer? Or maybe yours?

So you can't stand for long periods of time, sorry to hear that. Not being an ahole either, a lotta people have physical or mental issues through no fault of their own. But it's on you to do something about it, to find a job where you don't have to stand, whatever that is. It's not on the rest of us to take care of you, that's your responsibility.

And it's not the responsibility of any employer to pay you what you need. The Left doesn't seem to grasp that concept, so many of them want a society that is free or close to free of personal responsibility. Not many places on Earth like that. M-wage is supposed to be a starting wage rather than a lifetime wage; in a year or two you're supposed to be working your way up the income ladder by then.

When we automate everything what is your plan for the unemployed people? To ignore them until their dead bodies need to be scraped up and then use the garbage men to dispose of them for you? What is your solution when most people when forced to choose between starving to death and bank robber will chose bank robbery. Thus filling up your prisons and getting free room and board there?

We are at a point where people have to think way in advance.

I used to drive a delivery van. Spent ten years delivering, setting up and instructing people on home medical equipment. I loved the job, but also realized that I wouldn't be this strong young man my entire life, and carrying heavy electric hospital beds up three flights of stairs or oxygen tanks would not be feasible as I aged.

So I got my CDL class B license to drive a straight truck. My then brother-in-law got me a job with his company. I was not satisfied with the job so went to anther after a year. I became unhappy with that job as well, but couldn't find another, so I took my test for a Class A license which is tractor-trailer. I continued to get experience with tractor-trailers at the job I hated, and in a few months, found the job I'm at now, and I've been here for about 24 years.

During that time, I bought the property I was renting at for several years. So now I actually have two jobs.

Thinking ahead, there was no future in driving a van. You can teach a monkey how to do that; anybody can drive a van, so I learned how to drive equipment that less people had the ability to drive. I also realized I didn't want to be at the mercy of a landlord for my budget, so I became the landlord.

Don't get me wrong, I made a lot of mistakes in my life like anybody else, but I only blame myself for those mistakes and how they stopped me from getting further ahead in life.

Didn't answer my question.
Some people can't afford to think past their next meal. Many times I was forced to do laundry with my grocery money. Or pay the rent with my car payment money. Fuck em right, you got yours, fuck em.

Then ask yourself: was that societies fault or yours? I don't "have mine" and never will. But I blame myself for that and nobody else in spite of my lifelong medical problems. I with I could go back in time to do things so much differently. Since I can't, all I can do now is think of ways to move forward.

What difference does it make whose fault it is?
Are you planning on letting the masses starve when they automate all of the jobs?

 

[Picaro]

Let's throw open the borders, drop any minimum wage, and not only that, let's send as many ships as possible out to bring a billion people over, enough to drive wages to nearly zero, and watch the economy boom like never before.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

See, here's the thing: who's fault is it that you don't have a lot of options? Mine? Everybody else? The gov't? An employer? Or maybe yours?

So you can't stand for long periods of time, sorry to hear that. Not being an ahole either, a lotta people have physical or mental issues through no fault of their own. But it's on you to do something about it, to find a job where you don't have to stand, whatever that is. It's not on the rest of us to take care of you, that's your responsibility.

And it's not the responsibility of any employer to pay you what you need. The Left doesn't seem to grasp that concept, so many of them want a society that is free or close to free of personal responsibility. Not many places on Earth like that. M-wage is supposed to be a starting wage rather than a lifetime wage; in a year or two you're supposed to be working your way up the income ladder by then.

When we automate everything what is your plan for the unemployed people? To ignore them until their dead bodies need to be scraped up and then use the garbage men to dispose of them for you? What is your solution when most people when forced to choose between starving to death and bank robber will chose bank robbery. Thus filling up your prisons and getting free room and board there?

We are at a point where people have to think way in advance.

I used to drive a delivery van. Spent ten years delivering, setting up and instructing people on home medical equipment. I loved the job, but also realized that I wouldn't be this strong young man my entire life, and carrying heavy electric hospital beds up three flights of stairs or oxygen tanks would not be feasible as I aged.

So I got my CDL class B license to drive a straight truck. My then brother-in-law got me a job with his company. I was not satisfied with the job so went to anther after a year. I became unhappy with that job as well, but couldn't find another, so I took my test for a Class A license which is tractor-trailer. I continued to get experience with tractor-trailers at the job I hated, and in a few months, found the job I'm at now, and I've been here for about 24 years.

During that time, I bought the property I was renting at for several years. So now I actually have two jobs.

Thinking ahead, there was no future in driving a van. You can teach a monkey how to do that; anybody can drive a van, so I learned how to drive equipment that less people had the ability to drive. I also realized I didn't want to be at the mercy of a landlord for my budget, so I became the landlord.

Don't get me wrong, I made a lot of mistakes in my life like anybody else, but I only blame myself for those mistakes and how they stopped me from getting further ahead in life.

Didn't answer my question.
Some people can't afford to think past their next meal. Many times I was forced to do laundry with my grocery money. Or pay the rent with my car payment money. Fuck em right, you got yours, fuck em.

Then ask yourself: was that societies fault or yours? I don't "have mine" and never will. But I blame myself for that and nobody else in spite of my lifelong medical problems. I with I could go back in time to do things so much differently. Since I can't, all I can do now is think of ways to move forward.

What difference does it make whose fault it is?
Are you planning on letting the masses starve when they automate all of the jobs?

What's your plan? Because there is nothing to stop it other than consumers refusing to purchase products created by automation.

But we never stopped technology when we went to self-service gasoline pumps. We didn't try to stop it with the internet. We didn't try to stop it with self-serve cashiers at stores. We didn't try to stop it when the ATM took over countless jobs at the bank. We are not trying to stop it now with kiosks every damn place you go including the doctors office.

 

[Slyhunter]

When we automate everything what is your plan for the unemployed people? To ignore them until their dead bodies need to be scraped up and then use the garbage men to dispose of them for you? What is your solution when most people when forced to choose between starving to death and bank robber will chose bank robbery. Thus filling up your prisons and getting free room and board there?

We are at a point where people have to think way in advance.

I used to drive a delivery van. Spent ten years delivering, setting up and instructing people on home medical equipment. I loved the job, but also realized that I wouldn't be this strong young man my entire life, and carrying heavy electric hospital beds up three flights of stairs or oxygen tanks would not be feasible as I aged.

So I got my CDL class B license to drive a straight truck. My then brother-in-law got me a job with his company. I was not satisfied with the job so went to anther after a year. I became unhappy with that job as well, but couldn't find another, so I took my test for a Class A license which is tractor-trailer. I continued to get experience with tractor-trailers at the job I hated, and in a few months, found the job I'm at now, and I've been here for about 24 years.

During that time, I bought the property I was renting at for several years. So now I actually have two jobs.

Thinking ahead, there was no future in driving a van. You can teach a monkey how to do that; anybody can drive a van, so I learned how to drive equipment that less people had the ability to drive. I also realized I didn't want to be at the mercy of a landlord for my budget, so I became the landlord.

Don't get me wrong, I made a lot of mistakes in my life like anybody else, but I only blame myself for those mistakes and how they stopped me from getting further ahead in life.

Didn't answer my question.
Some people can't afford to think past their next meal. Many times I was forced to do laundry with my grocery money. Or pay the rent with my car payment money. Fuck em right, you got yours, fuck em.

Then ask yourself: was that societies fault or yours? I don't "have mine" and never will. But I blame myself for that and nobody else in spite of my lifelong medical problems. I with I could go back in time to do things so much differently. Since I can't, all I can do now is think of ways to move forward.

What difference does it make whose fault it is?
Are you planning on letting the masses starve when they automate all of the jobs?

What's your plan? Because there is nothing to stop it other than consumers refusing to purchase products created by automation.

But we never stopped technology when we went to self-service gasoline pumps. We didn't try to stop it with the internet. We didn't try to stop it with self-serve cashiers at stores. We didn't try to stop it when the ATM took over countless jobs at the bank. We are not trying to stop it now with kiosks every damn place you go including the doctors office.

Turn the Government into the employer of the poor. Guarantee all American citizens a minimum income for life. And if employers want to hire an American who is paid welfare for doing nothing then they better come prepared to pay what the job is actually worth doing instead of the way it is now paying the least amount as you can get away with. To pay for it you tax automation.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

We are at a point where people have to think way in advance.

I used to drive a delivery van. Spent ten years delivering, setting up and instructing people on home medical equipment. I loved the job, but also realized that I wouldn't be this strong young man my entire life, and carrying heavy electric hospital beds up three flights of stairs or oxygen tanks would not be feasible as I aged.

So I got my CDL class B license to drive a straight truck. My then brother-in-law got me a job with his company. I was not satisfied with the job so went to anther after a year. I became unhappy with that job as well, but couldn't find another, so I took my test for a Class A license which is tractor-trailer. I continued to get experience with tractor-trailers at the job I hated, and in a few months, found the job I'm at now, and I've been here for about 24 years.

During that time, I bought the property I was renting at for several years. So now I actually have two jobs.

Thinking ahead, there was no future in driving a van. You can teach a monkey how to do that; anybody can drive a van, so I learned how to drive equipment that less people had the ability to drive. I also realized I didn't want to be at the mercy of a landlord for my budget, so I became the landlord.

Don't get me wrong, I made a lot of mistakes in my life like anybody else, but I only blame myself for those mistakes and how they stopped me from getting further ahead in life.

Didn't answer my question.
Some people can't afford to think past their next meal. Many times I was forced to do laundry with my grocery money. Or pay the rent with my car payment money. Fuck em right, you got yours, fuck em.

Then ask yourself: was that societies fault or yours? I don't "have mine" and never will. But I blame myself for that and nobody else in spite of my lifelong medical problems. I with I could go back in time to do things so much differently. Since I can't, all I can do now is think of ways to move forward.

What difference does it make whose fault it is?
Are you planning on letting the masses starve when they automate all of the jobs?

What's your plan? Because there is nothing to stop it other than consumers refusing to purchase products created by automation.

But we never stopped technology when we went to self-service gasoline pumps. We didn't try to stop it with the internet. We didn't try to stop it with self-serve cashiers at stores. We didn't try to stop it when the ATM took over countless jobs at the bank. We are not trying to stop it now with kiosks every damn place you go including the doctors office.

Turn the Government into the employer of the poor. Guarantee all American citizens a minimum income for life. And if employers want to hire an American who is paid welfare for doing nothing then they better come prepared to pay what the job is actually worth doing instead of the way it is now paying the least amount as you can get away with. To pay for it you tax automation.

And that tax would be passed down to the consumer and we pay for it. Either that or they will open up automated centers in other countries and then bring those products here. How do you suppose a country 20 trillion in debt could afford "minimum income for life?" Obama Money???

 

[sealybobo]

Minimal wage increases every few years. Some employees get a raise every year if they are lucky, but some raises are insulting. Busting your butt, never late, never call off, take extra shifts, and you prove to be most reliable, just to be taken advantage of because the manager or supervisor knows you will do whatever they ask with out hesitation, so instead of wasting their time asking another employee that might not be so good or fast as you, and might be defiant and slack off. So being taken advantage of for a whole year and coming up is raise time. You are sitting in the office for your review, and the have nothing but good things to say, you are their best employee and this is the best review you have ever got. Then they tell you that you got a 15 cent raise. That is insulting if I ever got a raise that low I would tell them to keep it. Some companies once you are maxed out there is nothing to look forward to. No matter how much longer you are with that company. If that happens companies should give bonuses every year to keep employees moral up.
The Government decides to raise minimal wage every so often, to make it look like they are doing something good for the people. And the people that are making minimal wage actually believe The government did something for them.
Well in reality if inflation and cost of living increases faster then the minimal wage increases, it really doesn't matter if minimal wage increased at all if inflation and cost of living increases more and higher then minimal wage.

Ex. minimal Wage- $7.25
Gallon of milk-$4.50
Gas- $3.00 a gallon
gas bill- $100
electric bill- $70
rent- $500


Minimal Wage increases to- $8.00
Gallon of milk- $5.25
Gas- $4.00 a gallon
gas bill- $150
electric- $100
rent- $550


Minimal Wage -$8.00
milk $5.50
gas- 4.25
gas bill- $160
electric- $110
rent- $570

So if inflation and cost of living increases more often then minimal wage you are really not making more.

I think minimal wage and raises should increase at the same rate of inflation and cost of living. Also a minimal wage a company can pay their employees should be based on how much that company makes. If company A is making more then company B, company A minimal wage would be higher then company Bs minimal wage.

What if cost of living goes up and they don't raise minimum wage? And your company stops giving raises?

The answer is go find another job.

If the company can get people to work for $5 why pay more? Isn't the pay you get your incentive to do your job? Why give you a bonus then for doing your job? And what if no bonus is warranted? Will you slack even more?

You need a different job. I've worked for companies that don't pay well. My fault for taking the job and looking back I appreciate them hiring me.

 

[PoliticalChic]

We are at a point where people have to think way in advance.

I used to drive a delivery van. Spent ten years delivering, setting up and instructing people on home medical equipment. I loved the job, but also realized that I wouldn't be this strong young man my entire life, and carrying heavy electric hospital beds up three flights of stairs or oxygen tanks would not be feasible as I aged.

So I got my CDL class B license to drive a straight truck. My then brother-in-law got me a job with his company. I was not satisfied with the job so went to anther after a year. I became unhappy with that job as well, but couldn't find another, so I took my test for a Class A license which is tractor-trailer. I continued to get experience with tractor-trailers at the job I hated, and in a few months, found the job I'm at now, and I've been here for about 24 years.

During that time, I bought the property I was renting at for several years. So now I actually have two jobs.

Thinking ahead, there was no future in driving a van. You can teach a monkey how to do that; anybody can drive a van, so I learned how to drive equipment that less people had the ability to drive. I also realized I didn't want to be at the mercy of a landlord for my budget, so I became the landlord.

Don't get me wrong, I made a lot of mistakes in my life like anybody else, but I only blame myself for those mistakes and how they stopped me from getting further ahead in life.

Didn't answer my question.
Some people can't afford to think past their next meal. Many times I was forced to do laundry with my grocery money. Or pay the rent with my car payment money. Fuck em right, you got yours, fuck em.

Then ask yourself: was that societies fault or yours? I don't "have mine" and never will. But I blame myself for that and nobody else in spite of my lifelong medical problems. I with I could go back in time to do things so much differently. Since I can't, all I can do now is think of ways to move forward.

What difference does it make whose fault it is?
Are you planning on letting the masses starve when they automate all of the jobs?

What's your plan? Because there is nothing to stop it other than consumers refusing to purchase products created by automation.

But we never stopped technology when we went to self-service gasoline pumps. We didn't try to stop it with the internet. We didn't try to stop it with self-serve cashiers at stores. We didn't try to stop it when the ATM took over countless jobs at the bank. We are not trying to stop it now with kiosks every damn place you go including the doctors office.

Turn the Government into the employer of the poor. Guarantee all American citizens a minimum income for life. And if employers want to hire an American who is paid welfare for doing nothing then they better come prepared to pay what the job is actually worth doing instead of the way it is now paying the least amount as you can get away with. To pay for it you tax automation.

" Guarantee all American citizens a minimum income for life."

Tried, and found to be a complete failure.....as socialism always is.

1. Proof? Sure. The government conducted a study, 1971-1978 known as the Seattle-Denver Income Maintenance Experiment, or SIME-DIME, in which low income families were give a guaranteed income, a welfare package with everything liberal policy makers could hope for. Result: for every dollar of extra welfare given, low income recipients reduced their labor by 80 cents. http://www.policyarchive.org/handle/10207/bitstreams/12794.pdf

[The results for husbands show that the combination of negative income tax plans tested in SIME/DIME — which, as already mentioned, represents on average a relatively generous cash transfer program with a guarantee of 115% of the poverty line and a tax rate of 50% — has a significant negative effect on hours worked per year. Overview of the Final Report of the Seattle-Denver Income Maintenance Experiment]

a. Further results: dissolution of families: “This conclusion was unambiguously unfavorable to advocates of a negative income tax that would cover married couples, for two important reasons. First, increased

marital breakups among the poor would increase the numbers on

welfare and the amount of transfer payments, principally because the

separated wife and children would receive higher transfer payments.

Second, marital dissolutions and the usual accompanying absence of

fathers from households with children are generally considered unfavorable outcomes regardless of whether or not the welfare rolls increase.” http://www.bos.frb.org/economic/conf/conf30/conf30c.pdf

b. “When families received guaranteed income at 90% of the poverty level, there was a 43% increase in black family dissolution and a 63% increase in white family dissolution. At 125% of the poverty levels, dissolutions were 75% and 40%.” Robert B. Carleson, “Government Is The Problem,” p. 57.



2. Liberals used to point to Scandinavia as socialist Utopia....until this:

1. “The welfare state we have is excellent in most ways,” says Gunnar Viby Mogensen, a Danish historian. “We only have this little problem. We can’t afford it.”
   http://www.economist.com/news/speci...einventing-their-model-capitalism-says-adrian

 

[PoliticalChic]

Now think about those who only make 7.25 an hour

My 20 year old nephew makes $13.50 an hour working for Wal-mart. I'd be tempted to change jobs but I'm physically incapable of standing for long periods of time. Did turn down a $13.00 an hour because it was two towns over, about 15 miles away. 5 people and two cars to divide up among them doesn't leave me with a lot of options.

Technically I bought a car. My sister drives both her sons to work with it. My mother drives me to work with hers.

See, here's the thing: who's fault is it that you don't have a lot of options? Mine? Everybody else? The gov't? An employer? Or maybe yours?

So you can't stand for long periods of time, sorry to hear that. Not being an ahole either, a lotta people have physical or mental issues through no fault of their own. But it's on you to do something about it, to find a job where you don't have to stand, whatever that is. It's not on the rest of us to take care of you, that's your responsibility.

And it's not the responsibility of any employer to pay you what you need. The Left doesn't seem to grasp that concept, so many of them want a society that is free or close to free of personal responsibility. Not many places on Earth like that. M-wage is supposed to be a starting wage rather than a lifetime wage; in a year or two you're supposed to be working your way up the income ladder by then.

When we automate everything what is your plan for the unemployed people? To ignore them until their dead bodies need to be scraped up and then use the garbage men to dispose of them for you? What is your solution when most people when forced to choose between starving to death and bank robber will chose bank robbery. Thus filling up your prisons and getting free room and board there?

We are at a point where people have to think way in advance.

I used to drive a delivery van. Spent ten years delivering, setting up and instructing people on home medical equipment. I loved the job, but also realized that I wouldn't be this strong young man my entire life, and carrying heavy electric hospital beds up three flights of stairs or oxygen tanks would not be feasible as I aged.

So I got my CDL class B license to drive a straight truck. My then brother-in-law got me a job with his company. I was not satisfied with the job so went to anther after a year. I became unhappy with that job as well, but couldn't find another, so I took my test for a Class A license which is tractor-trailer. I continued to get experience with tractor-trailers at the job I hated, and in a few months, found the job I'm at now, and I've been here for about 24 years.

During that time, I bought the property I was renting at for several years. So now I actually have two jobs.

Thinking ahead, there was no future in driving a van. You can teach a monkey how to do that; anybody can drive a van, so I learned how to drive equipment that less people had the ability to drive. I also realized I didn't want to be at the mercy of a landlord for my budget, so I became the landlord.

Don't get me wrong, I made a lot of mistakes in my life like anybody else, but I only blame myself for those mistakes and how they stopped me from getting further ahead in life.

Didn't answer my question.
Some people can't afford to think past their next meal. Many times I was forced to do laundry with my grocery money. Or pay the rent with my car payment money. Fuck em right, you got yours, fuck em.

You seem to have survived.

 

[task0778]

You saying 15 an hour isn't pretty decent money? And you think minimum is fair, and should kept same pace as inflation? So you think its perfectly fine with minimum wage staying at 7.25, when you think 15 an hour isn't decent money?
15 an hour is a whole hell of a lot better then 7.25. I made 15 an hour for the first time when I was 22. The job I had previous to that job, I was making 10.50 an hour, and when I started to make 15 an hour there was a nice difference in the money I was saving and extra money to use for fun.

I make 10. Been making 10 an hour since 1992. Jobs keep getting replaced via automation leaving me unemployed forcing me to take a new job requiring new skill set at the bottom again. Can't afford a car, but the bills are getting paid. If I made 15 an hour I could afford a car.

Now think about those who only make 7.25 an hour

My 20 year old nephew makes $13.50 an hour working for Wal-mart. I'd be tempted to change jobs but I'm physically incapable of standing for long periods of time. Did turn down a $13.00 an hour because it was two towns over, about 15 miles away. 5 people and two cars to divide up among them doesn't leave me with a lot of options.

Technically I bought a car. My sister drives both her sons to work with it. My mother drives me to work with hers.

See, here's the thing: who's fault is it that you don't have a lot of options? Mine? Everybody else? The gov't? An employer? Or maybe yours?

So you can't stand for long periods of time, sorry to hear that. Not being an ahole either, a lotta people have physical or mental issues through no fault of their own. But it's on you to do something about it, to find a job where you don't have to stand, whatever that is. It's not on the rest of us to take care of you, that's your responsibility.

And it's not the responsibility of any employer to pay you what you need. The Left doesn't seem to grasp that concept, so many of them want a society that is free or close to free of personal responsibility. Not many places on Earth like that. M-wage is supposed to be a starting wage rather than a lifetime wage; in a year or two you're supposed to be working your way up the income ladder by then.

When we automate everything what is your plan for the unemployed people? To ignore them until their dead bodies need to be scraped up and then use the garbage men to dispose of them for you? What is your solution when most people when forced to choose between starving to death and bank robber will chose bank robbery. Thus filling up your prisons and getting free room and board there?

My solution is to learn how to fix or program robots and computers. Hey, I don't know how we're going to deal with the problems that automation is going to bring, but what I do know is that raising the minimum wage is going to hasten the day when that problem gets really bad. So cut the emotional crap and get your shit together.

 

[task0778]

Now think about those who only make 7.25 an hour

My 20 year old nephew makes $13.50 an hour working for Wal-mart. I'd be tempted to change jobs but I'm physically incapable of standing for long periods of time. Did turn down a $13.00 an hour because it was two towns over, about 15 miles away. 5 people and two cars to divide up among them doesn't leave me with a lot of options.

Technically I bought a car. My sister drives both her sons to work with it. My mother drives me to work with hers.

See, here's the thing: who's fault is it that you don't have a lot of options? Mine? Everybody else? The gov't? An employer? Or maybe yours?

So you can't stand for long periods of time, sorry to hear that. Not being an ahole either, a lotta people have physical or mental issues through no fault of their own. But it's on you to do something about it, to find a job where you don't have to stand, whatever that is. It's not on the rest of us to take care of you, that's your responsibility.

And it's not the responsibility of any employer to pay you what you need. The Left doesn't seem to grasp that concept, so many of them want a society that is free or close to free of personal responsibility. Not many places on Earth like that. M-wage is supposed to be a starting wage rather than a lifetime wage; in a year or two you're supposed to be working your way up the income ladder by then.

When we automate everything what is your plan for the unemployed people? To ignore them until their dead bodies need to be scraped up and then use the garbage men to dispose of them for you? What is your solution when most people when forced to choose between starving to death and bank robber will chose bank robbery. Thus filling up your prisons and getting free room and board there?

We are at a point where people have to think way in advance.

I used to drive a delivery van. Spent ten years delivering, setting up and instructing people on home medical equipment. I loved the job, but also realized that I wouldn't be this strong young man my entire life, and carrying heavy electric hospital beds up three flights of stairs or oxygen tanks would not be feasible as I aged.

So I got my CDL class B license to drive a straight truck. My then brother-in-law got me a job with his company. I was not satisfied with the job so went to anther after a year. I became unhappy with that job as well, but couldn't find another, so I took my test for a Class A license which is tractor-trailer. I continued to get experience with tractor-trailers at the job I hated, and in a few months, found the job I'm at now, and I've been here for about 24 years.

During that time, I bought the property I was renting at for several years. So now I actually have two jobs.

Thinking ahead, there was no future in driving a van. You can teach a monkey how to do that; anybody can drive a van, so I learned how to drive equipment that less people had the ability to drive. I also realized I didn't want to be at the mercy of a landlord for my budget, so I became the landlord.

Don't get me wrong, I made a lot of mistakes in my life like anybody else, but I only blame myself for those mistakes and how they stopped me from getting further ahead in life.

Didn't answer my question.
Some people can't afford to think past their next meal. Many times I was forced to do laundry with my grocery money. Or pay the rent with my car payment money. Fuck em right, you got yours, fuck em.

I think you spend too much time worrying about what other people think and waiting for the gov't or somebody else to save you.

 

[task0778]

We are at a point where people have to think way in advance.

I used to drive a delivery van. Spent ten years delivering, setting up and instructing people on home medical equipment. I loved the job, but also realized that I wouldn't be this strong young man my entire life, and carrying heavy electric hospital beds up three flights of stairs or oxygen tanks would not be feasible as I aged.

So I got my CDL class B license to drive a straight truck. My then brother-in-law got me a job with his company. I was not satisfied with the job so went to anther after a year. I became unhappy with that job as well, but couldn't find another, so I took my test for a Class A license which is tractor-trailer. I continued to get experience with tractor-trailers at the job I hated, and in a few months, found the job I'm at now, and I've been here for about 24 years.

During that time, I bought the property I was renting at for several years. So now I actually have two jobs.

Thinking ahead, there was no future in driving a van. You can teach a monkey how to do that; anybody can drive a van, so I learned how to drive equipment that less people had the ability to drive. I also realized I didn't want to be at the mercy of a landlord for my budget, so I became the landlord.

Don't get me wrong, I made a lot of mistakes in my life like anybody else, but I only blame myself for those mistakes and how they stopped me from getting further ahead in life.

Didn't answer my question.
Some people can't afford to think past their next meal. Many times I was forced to do laundry with my grocery money. Or pay the rent with my car payment money. Fuck em right, you got yours, fuck em.

Then ask yourself: was that societies fault or yours? I don't "have mine" and never will. But I blame myself for that and nobody else in spite of my lifelong medical problems. I with I could go back in time to do things so much differently. Since I can't, all I can do now is think of ways to move forward.

What difference does it make whose fault it is?
Are you planning on letting the masses starve when they automate all of the jobs?

What's your plan? Because there is nothing to stop it other than consumers refusing to purchase products created by automation.

But we never stopped technology when we went to self-service gasoline pumps. We didn't try to stop it with the internet. We didn't try to stop it with self-serve cashiers at stores. We didn't try to stop it when the ATM took over countless jobs at the bank. We are not trying to stop it now with kiosks every damn place you go including the doctors office.

Turn the Government into the employer of the poor. Guarantee all American citizens a minimum income for life. And if employers want to hire an American who is paid welfare for doing nothing then they better come prepared to pay what the job is actually worth doing instead of the way it is now paying the least amount as you can get away with. To pay for it you tax automation.

Tax automation to pay all Americans a minimum income for life? Do you have any idea how much money that would cost? I don't think you have thought this through, everybody gets free money whether they work or not? We've got what, like 320 million Americans, how much are you going to give each one of them? Knowing you Lefties, I assume there will be a threshhold above which you get nothing, right? So let's knock off 20 million of the top earners, that still leaves 300 million folks, are you going to give them each what amounts to minimum wage?

Let's see, $15/hr times 40 hours a week, that's $600 a week. Times 52 weeks a year, that's a bit over $30,000 a year. So how much is $30k times 300 million? We're talking $9 trillion a year to pay all that money I think; say you wipe out our current UE and SSA and other payments except for HealthCare, that's about what $2 trillion? Where's the other $7 trillion going to come from? Are you seriously going to tell me you think you can tax automation that much? It's a nice dream, but it ain't even close to reality.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Didn't answer my question.
Some people can't afford to think past their next meal. Many times I was forced to do laundry with my grocery money. Or pay the rent with my car payment money. Fuck em right, you got yours, fuck em.

Then ask yourself: was that societies fault or yours? I don't "have mine" and never will. But I blame myself for that and nobody else in spite of my lifelong medical problems. I with I could go back in time to do things so much differently. Since I can't, all I can do now is think of ways to move forward.

What difference does it make whose fault it is?
Are you planning on letting the masses starve when they automate all of the jobs?

What's your plan? Because there is nothing to stop it other than consumers refusing to purchase products created by automation.

But we never stopped technology when we went to self-service gasoline pumps. We didn't try to stop it with the internet. We didn't try to stop it with self-serve cashiers at stores. We didn't try to stop it when the ATM took over countless jobs at the bank. We are not trying to stop it now with kiosks every damn place you go including the doctors office.

Turn the Government into the employer of the poor. Guarantee all American citizens a minimum income for life. And if employers want to hire an American who is paid welfare for doing nothing then they better come prepared to pay what the job is actually worth doing instead of the way it is now paying the least amount as you can get away with. To pay for it you tax automation.

Tax automation to pay all Americans a minimum income for life? Do you have any idea how much money that would cost? I don't think you have thought this through, everybody gets free money whether they work or not? We've got what, like 320 million Americans, how much are you going to give each one of them? Knowing you Lefties, I assume there will be a threshhold above which you get nothing, right? So let's knock off 20 million of the top earners, that still leaves 300 million folks, are you going to give them each what amounts to minimum wage?

Let's see, $15/hr times 40 hours a week, that's $600 a week. Times 52 weeks a year, that's a bit over $30,000 a year. So how much is $30k times 300 million? We're talking $9 trillion a year to pay all that money I think; say you wipe out our current UE and SSA and other payments except for HealthCare, that's about what $2 trillion? Where's the other $7 trillion going to come from? Are you seriously going to tell me you think you can tax automation that much? It's a nice dream, but it ain't even close to reality.

Well.....he may be on to something here. I read an article about Basic Income that they were tossing around for parts of Switzerland. Here's how it works:

Every adult gets 18K a year from the government. It doesn't matter if you work, how much money you do or don't make, what you do with that annual check. You get 18K a year.

The catch to that is there are no more social programs: no more Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, Food stamps, HUD, nothing. You get 18K a year and figure it out for yourself.

Running the numbers, they concluded that it would actually save the country money. Not only that, but it would eliminate the discrepancies between the working and the non-working.

For instance, I have these HUD people next door to me. I don't know if they work or not, but whatever they do, they come home all hours of the night waking me and my tenants up. I reject the idea that my tax dollars are supporting non-working lowlifes to live in the suburbs next door to me when I have to work to live in the same area.

Basic income would eliminate all that. If they got 18K a year (or combined 36K a year for mother and father) they would not be able to afford to live here with their three kids. They would have to seek lower income housing in order to support their kids who are no longer on food stamps and can't get Free Lunch in school.

If you are a hard worker, you can use that extra money to pump up your retirement plan since there would be no Social Security. You can work and use those checks to pay for your children's college which is another issue liberals bring up. Healthcare? No longer a problem. We would not have to debate between government and private healthcare since you can use your check to get a great healthcare plan if you don't have one with your job.

With our social programs, they are a deterrent for people bettering themselves. If you are on food stamps and want to remain there, you must keep your income under X amount per month, otherwise your increased earnings will be deducted from you stipend. Basic income eliminates all that because you are going to get your 18K no matter if you work 20 hours or 60 hours per week. I believe it would encourage people to try harder.

 

[Slyhunter]

Then ask yourself: was that societies fault or yours? I don't "have mine" and never will. But I blame myself for that and nobody else in spite of my lifelong medical problems. I with I could go back in time to do things so much differently. Since I can't, all I can do now is think of ways to move forward.

What difference does it make whose fault it is?
Are you planning on letting the masses starve when they automate all of the jobs?

What's your plan? Because there is nothing to stop it other than consumers refusing to purchase products created by automation.

But we never stopped technology when we went to self-service gasoline pumps. We didn't try to stop it with the internet. We didn't try to stop it with self-serve cashiers at stores. We didn't try to stop it when the ATM took over countless jobs at the bank. We are not trying to stop it now with kiosks every damn place you go including the doctors office.

Turn the Government into the employer of the poor. Guarantee all American citizens a minimum income for life. And if employers want to hire an American who is paid welfare for doing nothing then they better come prepared to pay what the job is actually worth doing instead of the way it is now paying the least amount as you can get away with. To pay for it you tax automation.

Tax automation to pay all Americans a minimum income for life? Do you have any idea how much money that would cost? I don't think you have thought this through, everybody gets free money whether they work or not? We've got what, like 320 million Americans, how much are you going to give each one of them? Knowing you Lefties, I assume there will be a threshhold above which you get nothing, right? So let's knock off 20 million of the top earners, that still leaves 300 million folks, are you going to give them each what amounts to minimum wage?

Let's see, $15/hr times 40 hours a week, that's $600 a week. Times 52 weeks a year, that's a bit over $30,000 a year. So how much is $30k times 300 million? We're talking $9 trillion a year to pay all that money I think; say you wipe out our current UE and SSA and other payments except for HealthCare, that's about what $2 trillion? Where's the other $7 trillion going to come from? Are you seriously going to tell me you think you can tax automation that much? It's a nice dream, but it ain't even close to reality.

Well.....he may be on to something here. I read an article about Basic Income that they were tossing around for parts of Switzerland. Here's how it works:

Every adult gets 18K a year from the government. It doesn't matter if you work, how much money you do or don't make, what you do with that annual check. You get 18K a year.

The catch to that is there are no more social programs: no more Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, Food stamps, HUD, nothing. You get 18K a year and figure it out for yourself.

Running the numbers, they concluded that it would actually save the country money. Not only that, but it would eliminate the discrepancies between the working and the non-working.

For instance, I have these HUD people next door to me. I don't know if they work or not, but whatever they do, they come home all hours of the night waking me and my tenants up. I reject the idea that my tax dollars are supporting non-working lowlifes to live in the suburbs next door to me when I have to work to live in the same area.

Basic income would eliminate all that. If they got 18K a year (or combined 36K a year for mother and father) they would not be able to afford to live here with their three kids. They would have to seek lower income housing in order to support their kids who are no longer on food stamps and can't get Free Lunch in school.

If you are a hard worker, you can use that extra money to pump up your retirement plan since there would be no Social Security. You can work and use those checks to pay for your children's college which is another issue liberals bring up. Healthcare? No longer a problem. We would not have to debate between government and private healthcare since you can use your check to get a great healthcare plan if you don't have one with your job.

With our social programs, they are a deterrent for people bettering themselves. If you are on food stamps and want to remain there, you must keep your income under X amount per month, otherwise your increased earnings will be deducted from you stipend. Basic income eliminates all that because you are going to get your 18K no matter if you work 20 hours or 60 hours per week. I believe it would encourage people to try harder.

Problem is timing. Give a responsible person 18k at the start of the year and perhaps he'll budget accordingly, assuming his health remains stable. Someone else on the other hand may buy a big screen tv, fancy computer, video games and run out of money before the year ends. Crime will escalate at the end of the year as more and more people run dry on funds. First feeding off their own who held on to their money but can't defend themselves, then when they run dry hitting the better off folk. Better to have a monthly stipend.

People will no longer be forced to work just to survive. Those who want to do more than just survive will work harder. Special hostels will be set up by entrepreneurs for folks who just want to survive. Group homes where they can live in misery waiting for the next check. Problem once in hard to get out again.

There will be rough patches.

 

[EverCurious]

buhahahaha

How fucking pathetic that you folks are imagining this shit. $7-9T...

Why the hell would I buy into/agree with/vote for throwing $16-30k a year at /anyone/ in the country that isn't working for me or related to me?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

What difference does it make whose fault it is?
Are you planning on letting the masses starve when they automate all of the jobs?

What's your plan? Because there is nothing to stop it other than consumers refusing to purchase products created by automation.

But we never stopped technology when we went to self-service gasoline pumps. We didn't try to stop it with the internet. We didn't try to stop it with self-serve cashiers at stores. We didn't try to stop it when the ATM took over countless jobs at the bank. We are not trying to stop it now with kiosks every damn place you go including the doctors office.

Turn the Government into the employer of the poor. Guarantee all American citizens a minimum income for life. And if employers want to hire an American who is paid welfare for doing nothing then they better come prepared to pay what the job is actually worth doing instead of the way it is now paying the least amount as you can get away with. To pay for it you tax automation.

Tax automation to pay all Americans a minimum income for life? Do you have any idea how much money that would cost? I don't think you have thought this through, everybody gets free money whether they work or not? We've got what, like 320 million Americans, how much are you going to give each one of them? Knowing you Lefties, I assume there will be a threshhold above which you get nothing, right? So let's knock off 20 million of the top earners, that still leaves 300 million folks, are you going to give them each what amounts to minimum wage?

Let's see, $15/hr times 40 hours a week, that's $600 a week. Times 52 weeks a year, that's a bit over $30,000 a year. So how much is $30k times 300 million? We're talking $9 trillion a year to pay all that money I think; say you wipe out our current UE and SSA and other payments except for HealthCare, that's about what $2 trillion? Where's the other $7 trillion going to come from? Are you seriously going to tell me you think you can tax automation that much? It's a nice dream, but it ain't even close to reality.

Well.....he may be on to something here. I read an article about Basic Income that they were tossing around for parts of Switzerland. Here's how it works:

Every adult gets 18K a year from the government. It doesn't matter if you work, how much money you do or don't make, what you do with that annual check. You get 18K a year.

The catch to that is there are no more social programs: no more Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, Food stamps, HUD, nothing. You get 18K a year and figure it out for yourself.

Running the numbers, they concluded that it would actually save the country money. Not only that, but it would eliminate the discrepancies between the working and the non-working.

For instance, I have these HUD people next door to me. I don't know if they work or not, but whatever they do, they come home all hours of the night waking me and my tenants up. I reject the idea that my tax dollars are supporting non-working lowlifes to live in the suburbs next door to me when I have to work to live in the same area.

Basic income would eliminate all that. If they got 18K a year (or combined 36K a year for mother and father) they would not be able to afford to live here with their three kids. They would have to seek lower income housing in order to support their kids who are no longer on food stamps and can't get Free Lunch in school.

If you are a hard worker, you can use that extra money to pump up your retirement plan since there would be no Social Security. You can work and use those checks to pay for your children's college which is another issue liberals bring up. Healthcare? No longer a problem. We would not have to debate between government and private healthcare since you can use your check to get a great healthcare plan if you don't have one with your job.

With our social programs, they are a deterrent for people bettering themselves. If you are on food stamps and want to remain there, you must keep your income under X amount per month, otherwise your increased earnings will be deducted from you stipend. Basic income eliminates all that because you are going to get your 18K no matter if you work 20 hours or 60 hours per week. I believe it would encourage people to try harder.

Problem is timing. Give a responsible person 18k at the start of the year and perhaps he'll budget accordingly, assuming his health remains stable. Someone else on the other hand may buy a big screen tv, fancy computer, video games and run out of money before the year ends. Crime will escalate at the end of the year as more and more people run dry on funds. First feeding off their own who held on to their money but can't defend themselves, then when they run dry hitting the better off folk. Better to have a monthly stipend.

People will no longer be forced to work just to survive. Those who want to do more than just survive will work harder. Special hostels will be set up by entrepreneurs for folks who just want to survive. Group homes where they can live in misery waiting for the next check. Problem once in hard to get out again.

There will be rough patches.

It may create some problems but I think more would be solved. One of the problems with our social programs the way they are now is they teach irresponsibility. If taxpayers are going to have to pay for it anyway, our program might as well teach people how to be more responsible and plan ahead of time.

When I see these 300 lbs women in the grocery store with four kids and a SNAP's card, I get so pissed off, especially when I see their late model SUV they load the heaping cart of groceries into. The left try to make excuses for those people claiming this pig might have been able to support those four kids at one time, but just fell on hard times. I say BS. She could never afford one of those kids yet alone four, but no matter how many kids you have, the taxpayer will pay for them.

If we paid out only 18K, you'd see how fast those women would learn to keep their legs closed. That would reduce poverty in the US since the apple usually doesn't fall far from the tree.

 

[Moonglow]

Then ask yourself: was that societies fault or yours? I don't "have mine" and never will. But I blame myself for that and nobody else in spite of my lifelong medical problems. I with I could go back in time to do things so much differently. Since I can't, all I can do now is think of ways to move forward.

What difference does it make whose fault it is?
Are you planning on letting the masses starve when they automate all of the jobs?

What's your plan? Because there is nothing to stop it other than consumers refusing to purchase products created by automation.

But we never stopped technology when we went to self-service gasoline pumps. We didn't try to stop it with the internet. We didn't try to stop it with self-serve cashiers at stores. We didn't try to stop it when the ATM took over countless jobs at the bank. We are not trying to stop it now with kiosks every damn place you go including the doctors office.

Turn the Government into the employer of the poor. Guarantee all American citizens a minimum income for life. And if employers want to hire an American who is paid welfare for doing nothing then they better come prepared to pay what the job is actually worth doing instead of the way it is now paying the least amount as you can get away with. To pay for it you tax automation.

Tax automation to pay all Americans a minimum income for life? Do you have any idea how much money that would cost? I don't think you have thought this through, everybody gets free money whether they work or not? We've got what, like 320 million Americans, how much are you going to give each one of them? Knowing you Lefties, I assume there will be a threshhold above which you get nothing, right? So let's knock off 20 million of the top earners, that still leaves 300 million folks, are you going to give them each what amounts to minimum wage?

Let's see, $15/hr times 40 hours a week, that's $600 a week. Times 52 weeks a year, that's a bit over $30,000 a year. So how much is $30k times 300 million? We're talking $9 trillion a year to pay all that money I think; say you wipe out our current UE and SSA and other payments except for HealthCare, that's about what $2 trillion? Where's the other $7 trillion going to come from? Are you seriously going to tell me you think you can tax automation that much? It's a nice dream, but it ain't even close to reality.

Well.....he may be on to something here. I read an article about Basic Income that they were tossing around for parts of Switzerland. Here's how it works:

Every adult gets 18K a year from the government. It doesn't matter if you work, how much money you do or don't make, what you do with that annual check. You get 18K a year.

The catch to that is there are no more social programs: no more Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, Food stamps, HUD, nothing. You get 18K a year and figure it out for yourself.

Running the numbers, they concluded that it would actually save the country money. Not only that, but it would eliminate the discrepancies between the working and the non-working.

For instance, I have these HUD people next door to me. I don't know if they work or not, but whatever they do, they come home all hours of the night waking me and my tenants up. I reject the idea that my tax dollars are supporting non-working lowlifes to live in the suburbs next door to me when I have to work to live in the same area.

Basic income would eliminate all that. If they got 18K a year (or combined 36K a year for mother and father) they would not be able to afford to live here with their three kids. They would have to seek lower income housing in order to support their kids who are no longer on food stamps and can't get Free Lunch in school.

If you are a hard worker, you can use that extra money to pump up your retirement plan since there would be no Social Security. You can work and use those checks to pay for your children's college which is another issue liberals bring up. Healthcare? No longer a problem. We would not have to debate between government and private healthcare since you can use your check to get a great healthcare plan if you don't have one with your job.

With our social programs, they are a deterrent for people bettering themselves. If you are on food stamps and want to remain there, you must keep your income under X amount per month, otherwise your increased earnings will be deducted from you stipend. Basic income eliminates all that because you are going to get your 18K no matter if you work 20 hours or 60 hours per week. I believe it would encourage people to try harder.

For instance, I have these HUD people next door to me. I don't know if they work or not, but whatever they do, they come home all hours of the night waking me and my tenants up. I reject the idea that my tax dollars are supporting non-working lowlifes to live in the suburbs next door to me when I have to work to live in the same area.

You don't know if they work but you are willing to assume they do not to fullfill your fantasy situation so you can berate someone to show your superiority...You must be the worst landlord in the business...

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

What difference does it make whose fault it is?
Are you planning on letting the masses starve when they automate all of the jobs?

What's your plan? Because there is nothing to stop it other than consumers refusing to purchase products created by automation.

But we never stopped technology when we went to self-service gasoline pumps. We didn't try to stop it with the internet. We didn't try to stop it with self-serve cashiers at stores. We didn't try to stop it when the ATM took over countless jobs at the bank. We are not trying to stop it now with kiosks every damn place you go including the doctors office.

Turn the Government into the employer of the poor. Guarantee all American citizens a minimum income for life. And if employers want to hire an American who is paid welfare for doing nothing then they better come prepared to pay what the job is actually worth doing instead of the way it is now paying the least amount as you can get away with. To pay for it you tax automation.

Tax automation to pay all Americans a minimum income for life? Do you have any idea how much money that would cost? I don't think you have thought this through, everybody gets free money whether they work or not? We've got what, like 320 million Americans, how much are you going to give each one of them? Knowing you Lefties, I assume there will be a threshhold above which you get nothing, right? So let's knock off 20 million of the top earners, that still leaves 300 million folks, are you going to give them each what amounts to minimum wage?

Let's see, $15/hr times 40 hours a week, that's $600 a week. Times 52 weeks a year, that's a bit over $30,000 a year. So how much is $30k times 300 million? We're talking $9 trillion a year to pay all that money I think; say you wipe out our current UE and SSA and other payments except for HealthCare, that's about what $2 trillion? Where's the other $7 trillion going to come from? Are you seriously going to tell me you think you can tax automation that much? It's a nice dream, but it ain't even close to reality.

Well.....he may be on to something here. I read an article about Basic Income that they were tossing around for parts of Switzerland. Here's how it works:

Every adult gets 18K a year from the government. It doesn't matter if you work, how much money you do or don't make, what you do with that annual check. You get 18K a year.

The catch to that is there are no more social programs: no more Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, Food stamps, HUD, nothing. You get 18K a year and figure it out for yourself.

Running the numbers, they concluded that it would actually save the country money. Not only that, but it would eliminate the discrepancies between the working and the non-working.

For instance, I have these HUD people next door to me. I don't know if they work or not, but whatever they do, they come home all hours of the night waking me and my tenants up. I reject the idea that my tax dollars are supporting non-working lowlifes to live in the suburbs next door to me when I have to work to live in the same area.

Basic income would eliminate all that. If they got 18K a year (or combined 36K a year for mother and father) they would not be able to afford to live here with their three kids. They would have to seek lower income housing in order to support their kids who are no longer on food stamps and can't get Free Lunch in school.

If you are a hard worker, you can use that extra money to pump up your retirement plan since there would be no Social Security. You can work and use those checks to pay for your children's college which is another issue liberals bring up. Healthcare? No longer a problem. We would not have to debate between government and private healthcare since you can use your check to get a great healthcare plan if you don't have one with your job.

With our social programs, they are a deterrent for people bettering themselves. If you are on food stamps and want to remain there, you must keep your income under X amount per month, otherwise your increased earnings will be deducted from you stipend. Basic income eliminates all that because you are going to get your 18K no matter if you work 20 hours or 60 hours per week. I believe it would encourage people to try harder.

For instance, I have these HUD people next door to me. I don't know if they work or not, but whatever they do, they come home all hours of the night waking me and my tenants up. I reject the idea that my tax dollars are supporting non-working lowlifes to live in the suburbs next door to me when I have to work to live in the same area.

You don't know if they work but you are willing to assume they do not to fullfill your fantasy situation so you can berate someone to show your superiority...You must be the worst landlord in the business...

No, I base my opinion on them coming home at 2:30am on work nights drunk and laughing in the driveway. I base it on the fact their vehicles stay in their parking lot all day long. That's besides the fact our tax dollars should not be funding lowlifes to live in the suburbs. If I have to support you, then fine, but I'll support you over there in the inner-city......not next door to me or other people that have to get up for work in the morning.

 

[danielpalos]

Yes, it would mean less need for welfare, as it is currently known.

The level would just be raised, or like in Seattle the workers beg for less hours to be under the government threshold ,so they can continue to be eligible.

It is up to the Individual providing the labor, not just the employer.

When are you going to stop with your babble on here?

what babble? some people will and some won't; the employer won't be the Only decision maker on that.

You're like the most retarded person on this board , the king of the retards, does that make you proud?

And you claim to be 54...your wisdom sounds like it came from a China man's fart ..

not into, natural rights?

 

[task0778]

What's your plan? Because there is nothing to stop it other than consumers refusing to purchase products created by automation.

But we never stopped technology when we went to self-service gasoline pumps. We didn't try to stop it with the internet. We didn't try to stop it with self-serve cashiers at stores. We didn't try to stop it when the ATM took over countless jobs at the bank. We are not trying to stop it now with kiosks every damn place you go including the doctors office.

Turn the Government into the employer of the poor. Guarantee all American citizens a minimum income for life. And if employers want to hire an American who is paid welfare for doing nothing then they better come prepared to pay what the job is actually worth doing instead of the way it is now paying the least amount as you can get away with. To pay for it you tax automation.

Tax automation to pay all Americans a minimum income for life? Do you have any idea how much money that would cost? I don't think you have thought this through, everybody gets free money whether they work or not? We've got what, like 320 million Americans, how much are you going to give each one of them? Knowing you Lefties, I assume there will be a threshhold above which you get nothing, right? So let's knock off 20 million of the top earners, that still leaves 300 million folks, are you going to give them each what amounts to minimum wage?

Let's see, $15/hr times 40 hours a week, that's $600 a week. Times 52 weeks a year, that's a bit over $30,000 a year. So how much is $30k times 300 million? We're talking $9 trillion a year to pay all that money I think; say you wipe out our current UE and SSA and other payments except for HealthCare, that's about what $2 trillion? Where's the other $7 trillion going to come from? Are you seriously going to tell me you think you can tax automation that much? It's a nice dream, but it ain't even close to reality.

Well.....he may be on to something here. I read an article about Basic Income that they were tossing around for parts of Switzerland. Here's how it works:

Every adult gets 18K a year from the government. It doesn't matter if you work, how much money you do or don't make, what you do with that annual check. You get 18K a year.

The catch to that is there are no more social programs: no more Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, Food stamps, HUD, nothing. You get 18K a year and figure it out for yourself.

Running the numbers, they concluded that it would actually save the country money. Not only that, but it would eliminate the discrepancies between the working and the non-working.

For instance, I have these HUD people next door to me. I don't know if they work or not, but whatever they do, they come home all hours of the night waking me and my tenants up. I reject the idea that my tax dollars are supporting non-working lowlifes to live in the suburbs next door to me when I have to work to live in the same area.

Basic income would eliminate all that. If they got 18K a year (or combined 36K a year for mother and father) they would not be able to afford to live here with their three kids. They would have to seek lower income housing in order to support their kids who are no longer on food stamps and can't get Free Lunch in school.

If you are a hard worker, you can use that extra money to pump up your retirement plan since there would be no Social Security. You can work and use those checks to pay for your children's college which is another issue liberals bring up. Healthcare? No longer a problem. We would not have to debate between government and private healthcare since you can use your check to get a great healthcare plan if you don't have one with your job.

With our social programs, they are a deterrent for people bettering themselves. If you are on food stamps and want to remain there, you must keep your income under X amount per month, otherwise your increased earnings will be deducted from you stipend. Basic income eliminates all that because you are going to get your 18K no matter if you work 20 hours or 60 hours per week. I believe it would encourage people to try harder.

Problem is timing. Give a responsible person 18k at the start of the year and perhaps he'll budget accordingly, assuming his health remains stable. Someone else on the other hand may buy a big screen tv, fancy computer, video games and run out of money before the year ends. Crime will escalate at the end of the year as more and more people run dry on funds. First feeding off their own who held on to their money but can't defend themselves, then when they run dry hitting the better off folk. Better to have a monthly stipend.

People will no longer be forced to work just to survive. Those who want to do more than just survive will work harder. Special hostels will be set up by entrepreneurs for folks who just want to survive. Group homes where they can live in misery waiting for the next check. Problem once in hard to get out again.

There will be rough patches.

It may create some problems but I think more would be solved. One of the problems with our social programs the way they are now is they teach irresponsibility. If taxpayers are going to have to pay for it anyway, our program might as well teach people how to be more responsible and plan ahead of time.

When I see these 300 lbs women in the grocery store with four kids and a SNAP's card, I get so pissed off, especially when I see their late model SUV they load the heaping cart of groceries into. The left try to make excuses for those people claiming this pig might have been able to support those four kids at one time, but just fell on hard times. I say BS. She could never afford one of those kids yet alone four, but no matter how many kids you have, the taxpayer will pay for them.

If we paid out only 18K, you'd see how fast those women would learn to keep their legs closed. That would reduce poverty in the US since the apple usually doesn't fall far from the tree.

Okay, first of all we ain't Switzerland. What might work there or elsewhere does not mean it would or would not work here.

Second, Switzerland shot down the UBI proposal big time, 77% voted against it.

Third, they were proposing only about $2500 per adult and approx 1/4 of that for each child. If you going to up the money for each kid then there goes that incentive to keep your legs together. In this country $2500 ain't going to get you very far.

Fourth, that $7-9 trillion was based on Sly's state proposal to give the UBI to every American, which I assumed meant kids too. Obviously the price tag goes down if you cut the amount for each child and let's say cap it at 2 per household.

Fifth, I believe we spend around $2.5 trillion/year on our SSA/Education/Medicare/etc benefits at the federal level. Which still leaves a heckuva lot of money to pay for the UBI that we ain't got.

We better be damned sure we can make this work before making a change that is this big with as much of an impact as this could have.