Zone1 Leftists, do you agree that kids should receive sex-change operations without parental knowing?

[Curried Goats]

Zone 1 - so I can't say, I'll have to bite my tongue.

So you're incapable of a reasoned response? I accept that admission.

 

[Captain Caveman]

So you're incapable of a reasoned response? I accept that admission.

Oh no, it would be both accurate and reasoned at the same time.

 

[Curried Goats]

Oh no, it would be both accurate and reasoned at the same time.

If that were case it wouldn't be a violation of zone 1.

 

[Captain Caveman]

If that were case it wouldn't be a violation of zone 1.

Oh it is !!

 

[Curried Goats]

Oh it is !!

So you like to imagine.

 

[francoHFW]

Such a kid has a seriously fucked mind, and is in need of serious psychological/psychiatric help.

Fucking up his body is no treatment for a fucked-up mind.

Not. Try science not bigotry, hater dupe.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Not. Try science not bigotry, hater dupe.

You mean the “science” that affirms that Bruce Jenner is a woman? THAT “science”?

 

[flacaltenn]

Is there some reason you didn't quote what came after and what they attributed to higher rates of suicide? Don't worry, I'll do it for you.


“The rates of suicidal ideation and self-injury among transgender people are alarming—particularly for transgender nonbinary adults,” said study author Ilan H. Meyer, Distinguished Senior Scholar of Public Policy at the Williams Institute. “A lack of societal recognition and acceptance of gender identities outside of the binary of cisgender man or woman and increasing politically motivated attacks on transgender individuals, increase stigma and prejudice and related exposure to minority stress, which contributes to the high rates of substance use and suicidality we see among transgender people.”

You dont FIX "lack of societal recognition" by exploding the language, ignoring science and physiology and twerking in the face of 4th graders. OTH --- I believe the activists are few and far between. So there is a MAINSTREAM LGBTQ presence in society that deserves a few handshakes and encouragement, but it's largely NON-LGBTQ activists pushing the distasteful and non-representative behavior and condoning it. The left uses LGBTQ as a proxy army to attack societal tolerance and norms. And it's the GOVT that CODIFIES "gender crimes" such as misidentifying someone's gender and MANDATES the "woke" language throughout it's agencies and processes.

Dont question me right now on "minority stress.... increased stigma and prejudice". We're seeing TOTAL breakdown of tolerance in the country at this moment. The war in Israel/Palestine has brought forth even more VICIOUS intolerance of another minority in America and the world. And you can't have FREEDOM and rights WITHOUT tolerance.


So -- you are in NO danger of seeing ME -- blast an entire minority of ANY kind. But I do recognize individuality and a right to discriminate against bad actors regardless of what minorities or intersection dark corners they might reside in...

The entire concept of Identity Politics is POISON to a society and we know who pushes this destructive process. People should be judged INDIVIDUALLY -- and like the TOPIC HERE -- Neither YOU nor I can decide how to solve "gender dysphoria" for EVERY case.

Gender identity is too important to be left to "self-identification" because individuals change personal concepts catalog items thru-out their lives. And ANYONE PRETENDING to know what the future holds in gender identity for young children --- JUDGES INCLUDED -- are fools. Like a birth certificate -- it should take medical/psych eval from multiple sources to file a new gender identity. And THAT -- should not be done pre-puberty. Ideally NOT until that individual has some sense of their OWN -- about what life path they WANT to head out on. No one with a toy box or pediatrician (rare exception) HAS that drive to live life a certain way.

 

[Curried Goats]

You dont FIX "lack of societal recognition" by exploding the language, ignoring science and physiology and twerking in the face of 4th graders. OTH --- I believe the activists are few and far between. So there is a MAINSTREAM LGBTQ presence in society that deserves a few handshakes and encouragement, but it's largely NON-LGBTQ activists pushing the distasteful and non-representative behavior and condoning it. The left uses LGBTQ as a proxy army to attack societal tolerance and norms. And it's the GOVT that CODIFIES "gender crimes" such as misidentifying someone's gender and MANDATES the "woke" language throughout it's agencies and processes.

Dont question me right now on "minority stress.... increased stigma and prejudice". We're seeing TOTAL breakdown of tolerance in the country at this moment. The war in Israel/Palestine has brought forth even more VICIOUS intolerance of another minority in America and the world. And you can't have FREEDOM and rights WITHOUT tolerance.


So -- you are in NO danger of seeing ME -- blast an entire minority of ANY kind. But I do recognize individuality and a right to discriminate against bad actors regardless of what minorities or intersection dark corners they might reside in...

The entire concept of Identity Politics is POISON to a society and we know who pushes this destructive process. People should be judged INDIVIDUALLY -- and like the TOPIC HERE -- Neither YOU nor I can decide how to solve "gender dysphoria" for EVERY case.

Gender identity is too important to be left to "self-identification" because individuals change personal concepts catalog items thru-out their lives. And ANYONE PRETENDING to know what the future holds in gender identity for young children --- JUDGES INCLUDED -- are fools. Like a birth certificate -- it should take medical/psych eval from multiple sources to file a new gender identity. And THAT -- should not be done pre-puberty. Ideally NOT until that individual has some sense of their OWN -- about what life path they WANT to head out on. No one with a toy box or pediatrician (rare exception) HAS that drive to live life a certain way.

Yeah, I didn't read any of that rant.

 

[flacaltenn]

Morality is not subjective. Morality comes from God.


All horseshit. Transgender people kill themselves because they are severely ill. Folks like you perpetuate the lie that they can change their sex but deep down they know they know the truth. They can NEVER change their sex. So why do you folks keep telling them that they can? Are you next going to "affirm" to a 90-pound anorexic teen girl that she is "fat" as she believes?

It all about having life goals that SUPERCEDE the importance of "a gender". It's an age thing. If you're too young to launch a life plan -- gender is not important to that process, If the child or the parent fixate on JUST gender -- it becomes a life-blocking cuck.

Dont affirm gender. Dont discourage gender. But DO -- Focus your children on developing a life path. THAT lessens the bad outcomes. NOT surgery before they can even see what a career path is.

That's EXACTLY why there is push-back against sending 7 or 9 yr olds home from primary school pondering their vaginas and penises rather than installing a love of learning and respect for academics. Dr. Freud would tell you that anything else you might teach after focusing kids on their private parts is a lost cause. THAT'S what they are gonna think about at that age. Granted -- having kids pondering their sexual packages is a mighty powerful tool for the progressives. But it will rot a society outside-inwards in a generation or two and we're getting close to a fete d'complete on that front.

No aspirations, no fixating interests on WHAT you will do with your life -- ruins the whole party right there and makes you miserable. You fixate on the MINOR stuff like perceived gender or weight or even the economic status that you come from. And none of those PERCIEVED constraints matter as much as a plan to lay out a path for your life and make the most of it.

 

[K9Buck]

It all about having life goals that SUPERCEDE the importance of "a gender". It's an age thing. If you're too young to launch a life plan -- gender is not important to that process, If the child or the parent fixate on JUST gender -- it becomes a life-blocking cuck.

Dont affirm gender. Dont discourage gender. But DO -- Focus your children on developing a life path. THAT lessens the bad outcomes. NOT surgery before they can even see what a career path is.

That's EXACTLY why there is push-back against sending 7 or 9 yr olds home from primary school pondering their vaginas and penises rather than installing a love of learning and respect for academics. Dr. Freud would tell you that anything else you might teach after focusing kids on their private parts is a lost cause. THAT'S what they are gonna think about at that age. Granted -- having kids pondering their sexual packages is a mighty powerful tool for the progressives. But it will rot a society outside-inwards in a generation or two and we're getting close to a fete d'complete on that front.

No aspirations, no fixating interests on WHAT you will do with your life -- ruins the whole party right there and makes you miserable. You fixate on the MINOR stuff like perceived gender or weight or even the economic status that you come from. And none of those PERCIEVED constraints matter as much as a plan to lay out a path for your life and make the most of it.

If one of my children had one day decided that they were a member of the opposite sex I would NEVER have affirmed that falsehood. Perpetuating the LIE that people can change their sex does horrific damage to the troubled individual. The best way to help them is just to be honest with them and tell them that they are just fine the way they are. Thereafter, get them counseling.

 

[flacaltenn]

If one of my children had one day decided that they were a member of the opposite sex I would NEVER have affirmed that falsehood. Perpetuating the LIE that people can change their sex does horrific damage to the troubled individual. The best way to help them is just to be honest with them and tell them that they are just fine the way they are. Thereafter, get them counseling.

Not gonna let you off easy. LOL... What if at 17 they tell you they are BiSexual?

That's a part of the LGBTQ matrix. And it has NOTHING to do with "changing parts"? For that matter -- declaring they are GAY -- doesn't involve changing parts either?

This is a complex can of worms. And to sort it all out takes a bit a thought.

In MOST of the cases it's about individual morals and teachings. And focusing on JUST the "trans" worms in the can muddles it all up.

In FACT -- if EACH element of the LGBTQ complex deserves attention -- a parent, several doctors and a JUDGE could be screwing up a kids life by lobbying for trans surgery when the "life path" actually SHOULD have been just gay or bisexual. And the failure to launch into life isnt' JUST that they changed sexes -- it also altered their ability to function as a lesbian woman or gay man or a bisexual cisgender --- ALL OF THOSE genders depend on birth sex..

Makes your head spin if you really dive into this. That's why I can only do these topics sober.

 

[flacaltenn]

So, where is our outrage over Rhinoplasties, breast augmentation, Blepharoplasties, hair transplants, gastric bypass operations, liposuction, face lifts, etc?

Seems like your tolerance for "Fucking up the body" is pretty selective, Bob.

I personally find Blepharoplasties kind of offensive. We've convinced thousands of Asians that looking Asian is bad, so they undergo these surguries to look more white.

View attachment 869322

Cant compare cosmetic surgery to gender reassignment surgery. Equal chances of getting a "bad" surgeon. But cosmetic surgery is SUPPOSED to be subtle. Nothing subtle about gender surgeries.

 

[JoeB131]

You dont FIX "lack of societal recognition" by exploding the language, ignoring science and physiology and twerking in the face of 4th graders. OTH --- I believe the activists are few and far between. So there is a MAINSTREAM LGBTQ presence in society that deserves a few handshakes and encouragement, but it's largely NON-LGBTQ activists pushing the distasteful and non-representative behavior and condoning it. The left uses LGBTQ as a proxy army to attack societal tolerance and norms. And it's the GOVT that CODIFIES "gender crimes" such as misidentifying someone's gender and MANDATES the "woke" language throughout it's agencies and processes.

Or language changes. We stopped using words like "Colored" and "Negro" to describe black people, or "Oriental" to describe Asians. We stopped using demeaning words like "Gals" to describe our female coworkers.

Dont question me right now on "minority stress.... increased stigma and prejudice". We're seeing TOTAL breakdown of tolerance in the country at this moment. The war in Israel/Palestine has brought forth even more VICIOUS intolerance of another minority in America and the world. And you can't have FREEDOM and rights WITHOUT tolerance.

Oh, please. All the whining aside, it's Arab Americans who are being beaten up and killed, including in one case a child. The problem with the Jewish complaints is they think what happened on 10-7 should be used as an excuse to censor ANY criticism of Israel. And when that's not happening, they are whining louder than any Trans-person ever could.

Gender identity is too important to be left to "self-identification" because individuals change personal concepts catalog items thru-out their lives. And ANYONE PRETENDING to know what the future holds in gender identity for young children --- JUDGES INCLUDED -- are fools. Like a birth certificate -- it should take medical/psych eval from multiple sources to file a new gender identity. And THAT -- should not be done pre-puberty. Ideally NOT until that individual has some sense of their OWN -- about what life path they WANT to head out on. No one with a toy box or pediatrician (rare exception) HAS that drive to live life a certain way.

Okay, here's the thing. Only a small portion of gender dysphoric teens are getting even basic hormone treatment, much less surgery. I'm all for psych evaluations before any treatment.

Cant compare cosmetic surgery to gender reassignment surgery. Equal chances of getting a "bad" surgeon. But cosmetic surgery is SUPPOSED to be subtle. Nothing subtle about gender surgeries.

Why can't we? Both come from the same place - people aren't happy with who they are.

I go back to the Blepharoplasty. Asians - usually women - don't like looking Asian, and get their eyes "rounded". Seems to me that this shows that we've really done a number on them as a group, where they feel the need to do that to themselves

Or the late Michael Jackson. That man mutilated the hell out of himself because he hated looking like his father.

 

[flacaltenn]

Or language changes. We stopped using words like "Colored" and "Negro" to describe black people, or "Oriental" to describe Asians. We stopped using demeaning words like "Gals" to describe our female coworkers.

Sorry Dude having to dodge litigation for UNKNOWN personal pronouns that violate many rules of grammar is MANGLING the language. And has NO parallel to disposing of actual derogatory words.

I can survive the change to Congresswoman for an actual women. I cant get close to accepting that Master Bedroom is racist. Or even CARE about 34 of the 39 genders that I might offend....

 

[JoeB131]

Sorry Dude having to dodge litigation for UNKNOWN personal pronouns that violate many rules of grammar is MANGLING the language. And has NO parallel to disposing of actual derogatory words.

I can survive the change to Congresswoman for an actual women. I cant get close to accepting that Master Bedroom is racist. Or even CARE about 34 of the 39 genders that I might offend....

Sounds like you are trying to find offense.

A former coworker of mine had a coworker of his transition. Management sat everyone down, and told them that they were not to "deadname" her (use her name that she presented as male) and to use She/Her as her pronouns. That, frankly, doesn't sound terribly onerous to me.

 

[K9Buck]

Not gonna let you off easy. LOL... What if at 17 they tell you they are BiSexual?

That's a part of the LGBTQ matrix. And it has NOTHING to do with "changing parts"? For that matter -- declaring they are GAY -- doesn't involve changing parts either?

This is a complex can of worms. And to sort it all out takes a bit a thought.

In MOST of the cases it's about individual morals and teachings. And focusing on JUST the "trans" worms in the can muddles it all up.

In FACT -- if EACH element of the LGBTQ complex deserves attention -- a parent, several doctors and a JUDGE could be screwing up a kids life by lobbying for trans surgery when the "life path" actually SHOULD have been just gay or bisexual. And the failure to launch into life isnt' JUST that they changed sexes -- it also altered their ability to function as a lesbian woman or gay man or a bisexual cisgender --- ALL OF THOSE genders depend on birth sex..

Makes your head spin if you really dive into this. That's why I can only do these topics sober.

If my child said they were gay or bisexual I wouldn't love them any less. Announcing that one is gay is a far cry from wanting to take hormone blockers at 13 while also getting a double masectomy and a hysterectomy.

 

[K9Buck]

and to use She/Her as her pronouns.

And if one wanted to be referred to as "Our Glorious Emperor" the company would have required everyone to goose-step to their delusions, right?

 

[K9Buck]

. I cant get close to accepting that Master Bedroom is racist.

 

[JoeB131]

And if one wanted to be referred to as "Our Glorious Emperor" the company would have required everyone to goose-step to their delusions, right?

I usually like to be addressed as "Our Glorious Emperor" but HR has an issue with that.

They don't have one with preferred pronouns. In fact, most corporations are well ahead of society on the issue.