I Do Not Celebrate Thanksgiving

[RetiredGySgt]

See above response to Shogun.

It's no different than any liberal claiming to believe in democracy and whining about Bush the past 7 years. Democracy itself, and the results of democracy are not the same animals.

Further Hamas invalidated that election by resorting to armed rebellion. They illegally seized territory and murdered members of the Government and security forces as well as private citizens.

Yes I can see it now, When the South withdrew from the Union, since their representatives and Senators and Generals were all legally elected or appointed, they should have just continued to attend congress and vote to thwart the US as it tried to put down rebellion, the Generals could have lead the troops to the Canadian border for exercises.

 

[Shogun]

Kind of mixing the apples and oranges, aren't ya? I can agree with and embrace democracy, and STILL not like the result of it.

What is it you libs say? Oh yeah, dissent is American, or democratic, or something like that?

I accept the fact that the Arabs calling themselves Palestinians voted a known terrorist organization in as their government. Now, they should and can suffer the consequences for doing so.

And, by electing a known terrorist organization in as their government, each and every Palestinian who voted for such has made him/herself complicit with Hamas' actions from that day forward.

no, I'm not mixing apples and oranges. Are you trying to wedge in a double standard? Indeed, YOU may be able to live with the results of democracy IF YOUR VOTE COUNTS YET LOSES. Would you be as quick to stand behind democracy if you knew that your vote must conform to ACCEPTABLE choices or be thrown out? Answer honestly.

Should your 08 vote not count because of the death caused by your 04 vote? Would you just sit there and let me say, "well, you voted like a death loving republican last time so just live with it now!"? no, im betting not. AND, were that the case you'd abandon all participation in democracy because there would be a chance that your vote wouldnt even count anyway.


In case you can't figure it out, republican neocon chickenhawks are no more innocent of making people die the last 4 years than Kassam Rocket wielding Pals. IN FACT, I daresay that you, for whatever rationalized reason you can come up with, are the cause of more human death in the last 5 years by the power of your own vote. So, again, since we can't trust you to vote for non-violent policy can we disenfranchise your vote and STILL EXPECT YOU TO PARTICIPATE IN DEMOCRACY?

NO!?!?! Not even if you DESERVE IT?!?!


funny how that works, eh gunny?

 

[Shogun]

See above response to Shogun.

It's no different than any liberal claiming to believe in democracy and whining about Bush the past 7 years. Democracy itself, and the results of democracy are not the same animals.

The revoking of the Pal elected results ARE NOT THE FRUITS OF DEMOCRACY.


If you think so then I guess you can fathom half of America deciding that republicans who vote for a warmonging president JUST DONT COUNT in 08. BUT, how do I know thats not an acceptable option for republicans? Face it, you are accepting hijacked democracy because it conveniently fits into your disregard for pals. Were you in the same shoes you'd say fuck democracy too by the evidence of a disenfranchised democratic poll result.

 

[Shogun]

Further Hamas invalidated that election by resorting to armed rebellion. They illegally seized territory and murdered members of the Government and security forces as well as private citizens.

Yes I can see it now, When the South withdrew from the Union, since their representatives and Senators and Generals were all legally elected or appointed, they should have just continued to attend congress and vote to thwart the US as it tried to put down rebellion, the Generals could have lead the troops to the Canadian border for exercises.

riiiight... Just like how we INVALIDATED ALL THOSE VOTING BLACK PANTHERS TOO...


Goddamn some of you people amaze me with your willingness to crap on democracy when convenient while using it as a mantra for invasions when also convenient.


THE PALS NEVER ENTERED A UNION WITH ISRAEL LIKE THE SOUTHERN STATES DID WITH THE NORTHERN STATES. Holy shit, man, THAT is some of the most retarded shit I've ever read when trying to validate the treatment of pals.


futher, do you want to similarly demonize the guy who tried to SUICIDE BOMB HITLER? Funny how HE's a hero, eh? Nelson Mandela? he sure is a thorn in your fucked up logic.


Be my guest and ignore every piece of historic evidence I post since it's pretty clear that the sum total of your evidence amounts to a giant pile of rhetorical bullshit that has less to do with history than it does your fucked up opinion.

 

[Taomon]

There's a BIG difference between defending a waging a war of terror against noncombatants. They're criminals, nothing more nor less.

Israel commits military actions targetting terrorist organizations. BIG difference.

Israel invaded Lebanon to go after Palestinian terrorists after Lebanon refused to do anything about them. Too f-ing bad.

My mind works in a pretty logical manner. It appears yours with its "never kill" philosophy is more than willing to excuse premeditated murder of innocents/noncombatants by targetting them and condemn a military that in turn targets those murderers. THAT makes no sense, junior.

Because the people of the region support Hamas and Hezbollah they themselves become the target as well, and that is what we are complicit about.

The US only wants leaders who will send money to NY banks and allow US interests to exploit resources. That meansmost leaders (especially Pakistan and Lebanon) eliminate social programs fom their already poverty stricken people. Hamas and Hezbollah provide healthcare, education, food and other things as well as fighting the Irsaerli occupation and military forces.

Israel attacks civilian targets and yet that is okay?

Saudi Arabia is a terrorist state. They are an extremist religious state worse than Iran and yet you never bad mouth them.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

riiiight... Just like how we INVALIDATED ALL THOSE VOTING BLACK PANTHERS TOO...


Goddamn some of you people amaze me with your willingness to crap on democracy when convenient while using it as a mantra for invasions when also convenient.


THE PALS NEVER ENTERED A UNION WITH ISRAEL LIKE THE SOUTHERN STATES DID WITH THE NORTHERN STATES. Holy shit, man, THAT is some of the most retarded shit I've ever read when trying to validate the treatment of pals.


futher, do you want to similarly demonize the guy who tried to SUICIDE BOMB HITLER? Funny how HE's a hero, eh? Nelson Mandela? he sure is a thorn in your fucked up logic.


Be my guest and ignore every piece of historic evidence I post since it's pretty clear that the sum total of your evidence amounts to a giant pile of rhetorical bullshit that has less to do with history than it does your fucked up opinion.

The retard is you. The Pal authority has NOTHING to do with an alliance with Israel dumbshit. The Pal Authority had elections, Hamas won a portion of that and was properly seated for it. THEN they rebelled resorting to ARMED insurrection to kill government troops and personnel and SEIZE Pal Authority territory. They no longer get to sit in the chamber of a Government they attacked with force and illegal usurped its power.

It really is not a tough concept, except for brain dead chimps like you, I guess. Hamas DID enter into an agreement with Fatah and the Pal Authority, thus the ELECTION. They refuted the election and invalidated it with ARMED rebellion.

 

[Taomon]

No, I don't condone any atonement and damned-sure don't condone your revisionist. "poor little victims" alleged education.

Dude, get off your fucking high horse, huh? You are stupid yankee that lives in the middle of Bumfuck, Nowhere and wouldn't know a Southerner if he walked up and slapped the taste out of your mouth. Try getting with the real world instead of that make-believe Utopian paradise you keep trying to sell.

I have done nothing to ANY Indians, and I'm damned sure not going to pay for shit that was done WAY before my time without having any say in the matter.

You and your bleeding heart want to kiss their asses as they demand, knock yourself out, but don't go lecturing me because I think you're a fool.

Iraq has nothing to do with invading and marginalizing indigenous people. Just more of your bullshit. Iraq was invaded and a totalitarian regime removed from power and the government turned over to the indigenous people. Therefore, your attempted deflection is irrelevant to the topic. Not even a good try.

How do you explain seeing any-and-everything ass-backward? Thought process got dyslexia, or what?

We invaded Iraq to put in a government that would allow us to controlthe oil. If we invaded to remove a totalitarian system and hand the government over to the people, then why are we still there?

And speaking of totalitarian regime, we created that regime. Sadam Hussein was on the CIA payroll and was hired to assassinate the then president of Iraq (circa 1977). When that president was finally killed, Saddam was installed as the president - and that was fine by government planners. They armed him with chemical & biological weapons. They gave him intel on Iran and helped him win that war. Why did w suddenly have a change of heart?

Not because he invaded Kuwait, we greenlighted that. It was because Half of all Kuwiti oil is owned by Bristish Petroleum. Margaret Thatcher forced George H W Bush into war. And in Republican fashion, Bush Sr made up lies about his former friend and ally to get people like you to be pro-war. To sell the idea of a New World Order.

And we allowed all of Saddam's worst atrocities to happen while we stood and watched. So who is the truly evil state? The one committing an atrocity or the one alowing it to happen even though we are infamous for acting unilaterally.

And we funded terrorist groups in Afghanistan, most of whom came from Pakistan. Pakistan is a hotbed of terrorism because we created that and prefer that. It's good for business.

 

[Taomon]

Kind of mixing the apples and oranges, aren't ya? I can agree with and embrace democracy, and STILL not like the result of it.

What is it you libs say? Oh yeah, dissent is American, or democratic, or something like that?

I accept the fact that the Arabs calling themselves Palestinians voted a known terrorist organization in as their government. Now, they should and can suffer the consequences for doing so.

And, by electing a known terrorist organization in as their government, each and every Palestinian who voted for such has made him/herself complicit with Hamas' actions from that day forward.

And each and every person that voted for the Bush/Cheney ticket in 2004 have the blood of every innocent person tortured, maimed or killed on his or her hands.

 

[Taomon]

Israel invaded Lebanon to go after Palestinian terrorists after Lebanon refused to do anything about them. Too f-ing bad.

My mind works in a pretty logical manner. It appears yours with its "never kill" philosophy is more than willing to excuse premeditated murder of innocents/noncombatants by targetting them and condemn a military that in turn targets those murderers. THAT makes no sense, junior.

Israel is annexing the whole region wherever water is available. That is Pakistan and Lebanon. So if Cuba invades Mexico and we do nothing about it can Mexico invade us in retaliation? That seems to be what you are suggesting.

Plus, Israel targets civilians. How is that any different than what you described?

 

[Shogun]

The retard is you. The Pal authority has NOTHING to do with an alliance with Israel dumbshit. The Pal Authority had elections, Hamas won a portion of that and was properly seated for it. THEN they rebelled resorting to ARMED insurrection to kill government troops and personnel and SEIZE Pal Authority territory. They no longer get to sit in the chamber of a Government they attacked with force and illegal usurped its power.

It really is not a tough concept, except for brain dead chimps like you, I guess. Hamas DID enter into an agreement with Fatah and the Pal Authority, thus the ELECTION. They refuted the election and invalidated it with ARMED rebellion.

Thankfully, name calling won't prove your point so enjoy the ranting, dipshit.


Indeed, tell me how Nelson Mandella gave up his democratic rights when he killed white south Africans. Why don't you tell me how the Boston Tea party invalidated the rights of colonists. Indeed, it's not a tough concept for people with a firmer grasp on history beyond the GOP talking point of the day. ARMED REBELLION HAS NEVER BEEN A FUCKING CRITERIA TO INVALIDATE ELECTION RESULTS. Can you prove that they are beyond your ultra quick support of ANYTHING that shits on pals? Can you give ONE OTHER EXAMPLE where a democratic results was THROWN OUT due to the violent actions of other party members?

HERES MY EVIDENCE, YOU DUMB BASTARD:



RSF sees itself as forming part of a wider Republican Movement with a number of organisations. These include (but are not limited to) the Continuity IRA, Cumann na mBan, Fianna Éireann, Cabhair and the National Commemmoration Committee. Across these organisations there is a high level of dual membership with RSF. RSF strenuously rejects the allegation that it is the "political wing" of the Continuity IRA, as it denies that the latter is its "military wing".

Despite these protestations, RSF has been proscribed by the United States State Department as terrorist organisation along with the Continuity IRA. The State Department states on its website that the "CIRA is a terrorist splinter group formed in 1994 as the clandestine armed wing of Republican Sinn Féin, which split from Sinn Féin in 1986. 'Continuity' refers to the group’s belief that it is carrying on the original Irish Republican Army’s (IRA) goal of forcing the British out of Northern Ireland. CIRA's aliases, Continuity Army Council and Republican Sinn Féin, were also included in its FTO designation." [2].

2007 Northern Ireland Assembly Election

Republican Sinn Féin ran six abstentionist candidates in the 2007 Assembly Election. As the party did not register with the Electoral Commission in Belfast, the candidates had no party affiliation recorded on the ballot paper, apart from Geraldine Taylor who appeared as an Independent.

The RSF aligned candidates netted a total of 2,522 first preference votes. The candidates share of the total valid poll (661,191) was 0.38 per cent. Their share of the total valid poll in the six constituencies in which it fielded candidates (242,860) was 1.03 per cent.[16]

* East Londonderry: Michael McGonigle (393 votes/1.14 percent of first preferences)
* West Belfast: Geraldine Taylor (427 votes/1.29 percent of first preferences)
* Fermanagh and South Tyrone: Michael McManus (431 votes/0.93 percent of first preferences)
* West Tyrone: Joe O’Neill (448 votes/1.07 percent of first preferences)
* Mid Ulster: Brendan McLaughlin (437 votes/0.98 percent of first preferences)
* Upper Bann: Barry Toman (386 votes/0.88 percent of first preferences)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republican_Sinn_Féin



So, we can stomach IRISH terrorism and allow THEIR elections to reflect the will of the people who identify with the IRA...



...but muslims?!?! hell no. THEY don't count. and, barring some miracle, I bet you can't provide an example otherwise.

 

[Taomon]

The retard is you. The Pal authority has NOTHING to do with an alliance with Israel dumbshit. The Pal Authority had elections, Hamas won a portion of that and was properly seated for it. THEN they rebelled resorting to ARMED insurrection to kill government troops and personnel and SEIZE Pal Authority territory. They no longer get to sit in the chamber of a Government they attacked with force and illegal usurped its power.

It really is not a tough concept, except for brain dead chimps like you, I guess. Hamas DID enter into an agreement with Fatah and the Pal Authority, thus the ELECTION. They refuted the election and invalidated it with ARMED rebellion.

Actually, that rebellion as you call it was caused by the US involvement to oust Hamas. It wasn't Pakistan that Hamas was fighting, it was a Pakistan/US coup.

 

[pegwinn]

Because the people of the region support Hamas and Hezbollah they themselves become the target as well, and that is what we are complicit about. IF the people choose Hamas, then they obviously support them (Hamas) in thier terrorist agenda. That makes them at risk. It was a risk they assumed freely.

We invaded Iraq to put in a government that would allow us to controlthe oil. If we invaded to remove a totalitarian system and hand the government over to the people, then why are we still there? Good Question. So far the Iraqi .gov isn't doing so well. I would guess that the benchmarks not being met has something to do with us still being there.

And speaking of totalitarian regime, we created that regime. Sadam Hussein was on the CIA payroll and was hired to assassinate the then president of Iraq (circa 1977). Interesting theory. Where can one go to learn more about it?

Not because he invaded Kuwait, we greenlighted that. It was because Half of all Kuwiti oil is owned by Bristish Petroleum. Margaret Thatcher forced George H W Bush into war. And in Republican fashion, Bush Sr made up lies about his former friend and ally to get people like you to be pro-war. To sell the idea of a New World Order. Interesting theory. Where can one go to learn more about it?


And we allowed all of Saddam's worst atrocities to happen while we stood and watched. So who is the truly evil state? The one committing an atrocity or the one alowing it to happen even though we are infamous for acting unilaterally. The one doing it. If you witness a murder and do not call the police are you as evil as the murderer? Of course not. But you knew that right?

And we funded terrorist groups in Afghanistan, most of whom came from Pakistan. Pakistan is a hotbed of terrorism because we created that and prefer that. It's good for business.Interesting theory. Where can one go to learn more about it?

And each and every person that voted for the Bush/Cheney ticket in 2004 have the blood of every innocent person tortured, maimed or killed on his or her hands. Then I guess those of us who "visited" the area are really, really, out the box huh?

Actually, that rebellion as you call it was caused by the US involvement to oust Hamas. It wasn't Pakistan that Hamas was fighting, it was a Pakistan/US coup.Interesting theory. Where can one go to learn more about it?

I snipped out the stuff that I didn't respond to IOT shorten the post.

 

[Taomon]

I snipped out the stuff that I didn't respond to IOT shorten the post.

I researched the Iraq war for a speech about two years ago. There is a wealth of information out there that has been declassified. The State department has a web site that details the Kuwait/British part of my post. It is documented that Margaret Thatcher approached Bush Sr to attack Iraq.

Regarding Saddam Hussein, do a google search for Declassified data on Saddam. There is also a wealth of information when you research the history of Iraq. It was when I was trying to recreate a timeline for Saddam's reign that I came across historical records that detail that Saddam was hired to assassinate the president of Iraq during the late 1970's. He botch the assassination and killed the driver instead.

However, he was able to take over after the CIA coup was complete, and Saddam fit the bill for us because he served our interests at that time. Doing so we created a monster. The thing is that we are culpable.

Dude, take one day and research it on the Internet for yourself (avoid news articles as much as you can, unless you can get a good mix of left & right sources) and try to get as much as you can from government sites. Try the Congressional Quarterly, the Wall Street Journal, the Central Inteligence Agency, the State Department, the Pentagon, and then go from there.

The truth is out there. I didn't make this shit up. Even the History channel concedes that Saddam was on the CIA payroll in the 1970s and was our ally during the 1980's - when he committed his worst atrocities.

 

[Taomon]

I researched the Iraq war for a speech about two years ago. There is a wealth of information out there that has been declassified. The State department has a web site that details the Kuwait/British part of my post. It is documented that Margaret Thatcher approached Bush Sr to attack Iraq.

Regarding Saddam Hussein, do a google search for Declassified data on Saddam. There is also a wealth of information when you research the history of Iraq. It was when I was trying to recreate a timeline for Saddam's reign that I came across historical records that detail that Saddam was hired to assassinate the president of Iraq during the late 1970's. He botch the assassination and killed the driver instead.

However, he was able to take over after the CIA coup was complete, and Saddam fit the bill for us because he served our interests at that time. Doing so we created a monster. The thing is that we are culpable.

Dude, take one day and research it on the Internet for yourself (avoid news articles as much as you can, unless you can get a good mix of left & right sources) and try to get as much as you can from government sites. Try the Congressional Quarterly, the Wall Street Journal, the Central Inteligence Agency, the State Department, the Pentagon, and then go from there.

The truth is out there. I didn't make this shit up. Even the History channel concedes that Saddam was on the CIA payroll in the 1970s and was our ally during the 1980's - when he committed his worst atrocities.

http://taomon.50g.com/Terrorism/iraq war.doc

 

[Alucard]

Actually Jews were NOT allowed to leave. It was not a matter of throwing them out, Germany didn't try that approach at all, they stripped them of rights, money property and then herded them up for slave labor and murder.

Be so kind as to show ANY of that happening in Israel OR in "Palastine" by Israelis.

This guy is a trip!!!!

You are such a fucking dope it is unbelibevable... Like the palestinians werent robbed of their rights, money, and property?

I wonder if the innocent palestinian women and children that were killed today would agree...

NY TIMES "In an incursion in southern Gaza, in a village near Khan Yunis, Israeli troops and tanks, backed by helicopter gunships, destroyed a house, killing two brothers, Ahmad and Sami Fayyad, their sister, Asma Fayyad, 24, and their mother, Karima Fayyad, 60. Their father, Muhammad Fayyad, a farmer, was wounded.
Medics at Nasser Hospital in Khan Yunis said that Sami Fayyad’s wife was wounded, and that the couple’s 3-year-old daughter was clinically dead."

Real nice!!!

 

[Gunny]

This guy is a trip!!!!

You are such a fucking dope it is unbelibevable... Like the palestinians werent robbed of their rights, money, and property?

I wonder if the innocent palestinian women and children that were killed today would agree...

NY TIMES "In an incursion in southern Gaza, in a village near Khan Yunis, Israeli troops and tanks, backed by helicopter gunships, destroyed a house, killing two brothers, Ahmad and Sami Fayyad, their sister, Asma Fayyad, 24, and their mother, Karima Fayyad, 60. Their father, Muhammad Fayyad, a farmer, was wounded.
Medics at Nasser Hospital in Khan Yunis said that Sami Fayyad’s wife was wounded, and that the couple’s 3-year-old daughter was clinically dead."

Real nice!!!

Yeah, it sucks when you refuse to make peace and perpetuate a state of war. If Palestinians wanted peace they could have had it YEARS ago.

So if ANYONE is a dope .....

 

[Alucard]

And each and every person that voted for the Bush/Cheney ticket in 2004 have the blood of every innocent person tortured, maimed or killed on his or her hands.

Only congress can declare war... Why do liberals insist on blaming the president for a war that Kerry Gore and Clinton voted for...??? Is it ignorance, hatred for the president, or both?

 

[Alucard]

Yeah, it sucks when you refuse to make peace and perpetuate a state of war. If Palestinians wanted peace they could have had it YEARS ago.

So if ANYONE is a dope .....

Oh come on Gunny.... You know the deal...

The Palestinians had peace until we got involved and filled their country with jews that our allies and us didnt want... So we put them in the worst place possible and gave them nukes...

 

[Taomon]

Only congress can declare war... Why do liberals insist on blaming the president for a war that Kerry Gore and Clinton voted for...??? Is it ignorance, hatred for the president, or both?

Because he, and his nechmen created the false intel that prompted Congress to vote for the authority to go to war, and that was supposed to be a last resort. But like a teen girl with daddy's credit card, Bush ran like the dickens to launch into combat mode.

I blame the president because he and his buddies lied and pushed for war. Congress was duped.

How can you blame the people who were lied to and not the liar himself?

 

[jillian]

They were duped. And it wouldn't have mattered anyway. They didn't need a single democratic vote or they wouldn't have brought it to the floor. Plus, it was post-9/11 and everyone was worried they'd be called "soft on terrorism".

My problem is the democratic congress gave him his resolution about the Irani guard, too. They could have and should have told him "no".

It IS why Obama won in Iowa yesterday and Edwards did so well. They didn't have the same baggage in that regard as the others.