Howard Stern is fired

[Dan]

I will say, though, that the FCC crackdowns are coming from Bush,

I might've jumped the gun here, not sure, but the point is is that many people are losing a lot of money and consumers are losing a product they want because the government is (in my opinion) putting unnecessary restrictions on things based on the opinions of a very small group of people.

 

[OCA]

Oh I know about the porn on the net, I was trying to make a point about Stern's show and how repetitive it is. Only good thing about Howard's show is I don't get the occasional picture of some broad blowing a horse coming up lol

 

[Dan]

Oh I know about the porn on the net, I was trying to make a point about Stern's show and how repetitive it is.

Oh, OK, you're right, the show really is the most unbelievably repetetive thing on TV. Then again, E! is the same network that shows Wild On... and Celebrities Uncensored, so apparently repetition is their bit.

 

[5stringJeff]

I have never listened to Howard Stern, for the same reason that I don't watch the Osbournes - everything that's said is for shock effect only. I could care less what Howard Stern thinks, or says. The man is a total moron.

Now, the Lex and Terry show... there's a good one!

http://www.lexandterry.com/

 

[LoneVoice]

Originally posted by lilcountriegal
Yes. I'm interested in he has to say regarding the stats as well.
And as far as this:



That wasnt a difficult place to get to this past season. I wouldnt be too thrilled with that position. The entire NFC looked inconsistent this season and any average local high school football team had a fighting chance to beat them.

I'd take that bet.... Eagles vs average high school team. You're lucky that you'd never see it happen, because I'd clean ya out for every penny you got. Even if it is only $5.32, if you received your allowance that week.

Stats say lots of things. Brian Griese of the Denver Broncos has had a better Pass Efficiency Rating than Elway ever had... Does that now make Griese a better quarterback than Elway? No.... There are other factors...


Let's start off with the main statement from Rush. He said McNabb was "overrated". What "rating" did Rush assess everyone else making McNabb out to be? Nobody was saying McNabb was the best quarterback ever. Experienced analysts were commenting on McNabb like they do any other quarterback. 1 week they might comment on how great Daunte Culpepper is, next it might be Brett Favre, and next it might be Peyton Manning, or Steve McNair. McNabb is simply a talented, solid quarterback who led his team to 3 straight NFC championship games. Jim Kelly led the Buffalo Bills to 4 straight Super Bowls, is he somehow overrated too?

"Overrated" is an opinionated term that Rush can't prove, nor can anyone else disprove. So, the real statement that Rush was making was that McNabb was getting all this credit, simply because he was a Black quarterback. What was Rush basing that on? Of all the assessments that Rush could've made as to McNabb's ability (whether it be playmaking highlight reels, or team win %, or playoff performance, or stats, or numerous other options that are used to assess a QB's performance), Rush lept to the conclusion that it was race based (black thang).

When Kordell Stuart got all his attention as slash, was that race based. When Jim McMahon of the bears got all his attention was that race based (he was on a team with an one of the greatest defenses in NFL history). Does that mean McMahon shouldn't have gotten attention for his play on the field? Should we all assess McMahon as just the great white hope that really never was?

The point is, that the assessment of Donovan McNabb's performance was never race based until Rush Limbaugh made it so. Why? What was the point?

Why did it even have to be said? There is no evidence to prove or disprove McNabb's success with regards to race. Did he get an affirmative action alottment to the Eagle's football team? McNabb, we don't think you are really good enough to be the #2 pick in the draft, but we need to fill our quota, so here ya go, welcome aboard. We're altering our standards in order to let you play as a starter on the team.

None of that happened, so why did Rush make it a race based issue? (Only because McNabb is a black quarterback). Why did he say it?

 

[jimnyc]

Stats say lots of things. Brian Griese of the Denver Broncos has had a better Pass Efficiency Rating than Elway ever had... Does that now make Griese a better quarterback than Elway? No.... There are other factors...

WRONG!

Brian Griese has a career rating of 83.0 while Elway surpassed that rating on SEVEN DIFFERENT OCCASIONS. Let's not forget that he beats Griese hands down in every category mentionable.

Let's start off with the main statement from Rush. He said McNabb was "overrated". What "rating" did Rush assess everyone else making McNabb out to be? Nobody was saying McNabb was the best quarterback ever. Experienced analysts were commenting on McNabb like they do any other quarterback. 1 week they might comment on how great Daunte Culpepper is, next it might be Brett Favre, and next it might be Peyton Manning, or Steve McNair. McNabb is simply a talented, solid quarterback who led his team to 3 straight NFC championship games. Jim Kelly led the Buffalo Bills to 4 straight Super Bowls, is he somehow overrated too?

Peyton, Brett & Steve are elite QB's and it's an insult to mention them in the same sentence with McNabb.

Simply put, he was placed on a pedestal as this great QB and he was NEVER more than average.

"Overrated" is an opinionated term that Rush can't prove, nor can anyone else disprove. So, the real statement that Rush was making was that McNabb was getting all this credit, simply because he was a Black quarterback. What was Rush basing that on? Of all the assessments that Rush could've made as to McNabb's ability (whether it be playmaking highlight reels, or team win %, or playoff performance, or stats, or numerous other options that are used to assess a QB's performance), Rush lept to the conclusion that it was race based (black thang).

And it likely was due to his race. Why else place so much attention on a QB when so many other QB's were outperforming him on so many levels?

When Kordell Stuart got all his attention as slash, was that race based. When Jim McMahon of the bears got all his attention was that race based (he was on a team with an one of the greatest defenses in NFL history). Does that mean McMahon shouldn't have gotten attention for his play on the field? Should we all assess McMahon as just the great white hope that really never was?

The attention Stewart got was probably partly race based. Anytime a black athlete makes huge strides athletically it will garner attention. Furthermore, Stewart was never touted as a "great" QB, he garnered the attention because of the "wackiness" he brought to the game by being a QB SLASH RB SLASH WR.

Jim McMahon was another QB who was average, and I don't believe I ever heard him referred to as great or elite. He simply got attention because he played on one of the best teams of all time.

The point is, that the assessment of Donovan McNabb's performance was never race based until Rush Limbaugh made it so. Why? What was the point?

Because the rest of the media was afraid to be quite as blunt as Limbaugh was. The point is that McNabb was NEVER more than an average QB.

Why did it even have to be said? There is no evidence to prove or disprove McNabb's success with regards to race. Did he get an affirmative action alottment to the Eagle's football team? McNabb, we don't think you are really good enough to be the #2 pick in the draft, but we need to fill our quota, so here ya go, welcome aboard. We're altering our standards in order to let you play as a starter on the team.

But there is evidence to prove he is nothing more than an average QB, and an abundance of it! I can't think of one reason to consider him anything more. RB stats? NOPE. Passing stats? NOPE. QB percentage? NOPE. Playoff victories? NOPE.

None of that happened, so why did Rush make it a race based issue? (Only because McNabb is a black quarterback). Why did he say it?

He said it to speak the truth. Maybe he got tired of everyone fawning over McNabb and claiming he was so great. You cannot give me ANY good reasons why he should be considered anything more than an average QB, and neither can anyone else.

 

[Moi]

How we went from Howard Stern getting shut down in several markets to Rush Limbaugh is beyond me. However, since we did:

1. Howard Stern is a vile excuse for humanity and I hope he gets shut down forever. I do understand freedom of speech and, if radio weren't accessible to children, I'd say that he should be allowed to be on air. However, there are times and places when you can't always watch what your children do. I do not think that Howard Stern is appropriate in the morning or daytime when children could be listening. I certainly don't see any reason for his tv show to be cancelled though.

2. Rush Limbaugh stated an opinion. A very unpopular one but one that many people beleive is true. Sadly, few people actually heard the original broadcast and understand the context of the exchange. Certainly ESPN has the right to employ only those people who follow their guidelines. Obviously Rush did not- so, he's no longer there.

 

[Dan]

1. Howard Stern is a vile excuse for humanity and I hope he gets shut down forever. I do understand freedom of speech and, if radio weren't accessible to children, I'd say that he should be allowed to be on air. However, there are times and places when you can't always watch what your children do. I do not think that Howard Stern is appropriate in the morning or daytime when children could be listening. I certainly don't see any reason for his tv show to be cancelled though.

It's really a tough situation. The FCC's guidelines state that they will be heavily monitoring from 6AM to 10PM, so you could put Stern on after that. But, many people depend on his show to get through their morning commute. I think the best thing for everyone involved would be for Stern to just bow out, he's not funny or really culturally significant anymore anyway.

I've found some of his stuff funny (though I haven't listened in years), but like most people have been saying, it's very repetetive. I respect him because he is (or at least used to be) a rebel and fights for freedom of speech, but that's about it.

 

[acludem]

This all goes back to Janet Jackson's breast. People get pissed, Congress starts panicking because it's an election year so they start pressuring corporations. Corporations panic because they need government contracts so they start suspending and/or firing people that are contraversial.

Everyone wants the government to do their parenting for them. If you don't like what's on the radio or TV then change the damn channel. Now Congress wants to regulate Cable TV. Are you ready for Big Brother? He's coming.

acludem

 

[lilcountriegal]

"Radio talk-show host and columnist Armstrong Williams told Fox News it was unfortunate that Limbaugh inserted race into the discussion, but said that “If Rush was black he would’ve been saluted for spiking the ratings, he would’ve been given a raise and certainly wouldn’t have resigned. ... The media does go out of its way to celebrate black quarterbacks and coaches.”

Oh, and by the way, Armstrong Williams is an African American.

 

[LoneVoice]

The question is, does it promote racial divide
or does it promote racial progress?

 

[lilcountriegal]

The question is, does it promote racial divide or does it promote racial progress?

I dont believe it promotesanything. Its a simple statement of fact.

Look, I'm not a racist. I love football. There are some great players, both black and white. Some of the greatest in football are/were African American: Jerome Bettis, Emmit Smith, Mean Joe Greene, I could go on and on and on.

McNabb is a good quarterback. He is not an "outstanding" quarterback. He started out shitty this year and picked it up. Do I believe the league wants to see a black quarterback excel? Of course I do. Do I think Rush's remark was out of line? Not at all. If I thought he meant it as a racist remark, I'd feel differently. He was asked to commentate on football, and commentate is what he did. The only thing he did wrong is put what everyone else was thinking into a blatant, in your face, kind of commentary.

Had it been James Brown (commentator, not singer) that made those comments, there would be absolutely no hoop-lah.

By chance, are you an Eagles fan?

 

[LoneVoice]

Originally posted by lilcountriegal
I dont believe it promotesanything. Its a simple statement of fact.

Look, I'm not a racist. I love football. There are some great players, both black and white. Some of the greatest in football are/were African American: Jerome Bettis, Emmit Smith, Mean Joe Greene, I could go on and on and on.

McNabb is a good quarterback. He is not an "outstanding" quarterback. He started out shitty this year and picked it up. Do I believe the league wants to see a black quarterback excel? Of course I do. Do I think Rush's remark was out of line? Not at all. If I thought he meant it as a racist remark, I'd feel differently. He was asked to commentate on football, and commentate is what he did. The only thing he did wrong is put what everyone else was thinking into a blatant, in your face, kind of commentary.

Had it been James Brown (commentator, not singer) that made those comments, there would be absolutely no hoop-lah.

By chance, are you an Eagles fan?

I did a search for McNabb and outstanding to see what shows up and what they were basing that on. Here are just a few examples from the first few pages that I ran across.


http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/homeNewsDetail.jsp?id=7670

McNabb: Outstanding Again

December 7, 2003
By DAVE SPADARO

The numbers continue to jump off the page. Donovan McNabb tossed a season-best three more touchdown passes in Sunday's 36-10 win over Dallas and now has 12 on the season, seven in his last three games.
McNabb's passer rating was 105.4 and he did not turn the ball over.


Another routine game from the reigning NFC Offensive Player of the Month, eh?

"He was great," said wide receiver Freddie Mitchell, who made three big catches for 58 big yards. "Donovan played a great game."
...
McNabb saw the field extremely well and delivered the ball in a timely fashion. He used his backs well -- Correll Buckhalter, Duce Staley and Brian Westbrook combined for three touchdowns and 244 yards of offense -- and threw the ball to spots to allow the receivers outside and down the middle of the field a chance to make plays.

And there was one time McNabb ran -- and he gained 21 yards to help set up David Akers for a field goal.



In fact, he did. McNabb dissected the No. 1 defense in the NFL as the Eagles rolled up 403 total net yards. The mix was terrific, the balance was there and the passing game, save for a handful of drops, was outstanding.


http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/wire?section=nfl&id=1677381
ESPN News Wire

Wednesday, December 3, 2003


Associated Press

PHILADELPHIA -- Donovan McNabb has turned a distressing start into a special season.

The three-time Pro Bowl quarterback has rebounded from the worst stretch of his five-year career to lead the Philadelphia Eagles to seven straight victories. His outstanding performance in the last five games earned him the NFC player of the month award for November.

McNabb has overcome injuries and controversy while returning to his old form. He led the Eagles to a 5-0 record in November, the first time in franchise history the team won five games in one month.

During that span, he completed 94 of 145 passes (64.8 percent) for 1,265 yards, six touchdowns and only one interception. He also ran for 108 yards and one TD.

"He's playing very good football right now," Eagles coach Andy Reid said. "He has a great command of the offense right now. He has a lot of respect from his teammates, his peers. That's important. The command comes with time. ... He's the personality type that he'll continue to work hard and even make himself better."

McNabb is spreading the ball to several receivers, keeping everyone involved and making it difficult for defenses to key on one player. He has completed passes to at least seven receivers in each of the last five games, and once hit 10 different players.

McNabb twice threw for more than 300 yards and has recorded a passer rating of more than 100.0 in three of the last five games.

"It's a tribute to how the team changed things around," McNabb said. "We're just out there flowing and getting the timing down and we just want to keep on improving."

McNabb said the thumb injury that hampered him early in the season still isn't 100 percent, but he's better able to grip the ball now.



http://www.sptimes.com/News/010101/Columns/Defense_goes_cold_thi.shtml

Defense goes cold this time

Archive
By HUBERT MIZELL

© St. Petersburg Times, published January 1, 2001

Not a stunner, really, seeing an erratic Tampa Bay offense perish in an Eagles deep freeze. Sunday's larger shock, assuring Bucs devastation, was their renowned defense, with four Pro Bowlers, being knocked out by the solitary punch of Philadelphia quarterback Donovan McNabb.

Bucs tackling went sour. Their rushes of a nimble, creative McNabb were inconsistent, ineffective and eventually inept.

"They outhit us, which really hurts," Tony Dungy said. "Our pressure on McNabb was disappointing. When, late in the first half, we allowed the Eagles two quick touchdowns, going into a tough wind, it was a critical flaw."

McNabb, an NFL sophomore, peppered the Bucs with efficient, short passes. Then, when Tampa Bay began to defensively splinter, the 24-year-old Philly hero used his blurring scrambling to bite huge chunks out of Tampa Bay's defensive soul.

Sapp, a blustery man known for QB sacks and colorful oratory, was a Sunday shutout on field and off. He couldn't get to McNabb.

Meanwhile, McNabb kept shaking the Bucs. "Last season, when we beat Philadelphia (17-5) and sacked Donovan six times, you could see he was a kid with guts," Ahanotu said. "This time, he was outstanding. McNabb is going to have a lot of great days."

"Our main thing was to keep McNabb in the pocket," Bucs defensive lineman Anthony McFarland said, "feeling he couldn't hurt us without doing it with scrambles. McNabb is similar to (Minnesota quarterback) Daunte Culpepper, a good passer who can also hurt you with his feet."

Sunday was some McNabb feat.

"We lost control," Dungy said, "allowing McNabb to make so many third-down conversions. Too often, it was third-and-short plays. With the abilities of Donovan, it's bad news to keep allowing those situations to arise."

"In the third quarter, having dug ourselves a big hole, we needed a quick three-and-out performance against McNabb, but instead we would allow the Eagles to control the clock 12 1/2 minutes to our 2 1/2. When the fourth quarter began, they had taken over entirely.

"We didn't have our usual intensity. Didn't tackle like we usually do. I don't know why. Our defensive line didn't get much pressure on their quarterback. I don't know why.

"McNabb is good. An effective passer. Outstanding scrambler.


http://www.sjsports.com/football/eagles/2002-2003/philadelphia_eagles_1017.html

Event Spotlight:
Outstanding Offense Takes on Dominating Defense as Eagles Host Bucs
Thursday, October 17, 2002

By David W. Unkle
SJSports Staff Writer





Under the direction of head coach ANDY REID and offensive coordinator BRAD CHILDRESS, the Eagles' offense has scored 165 points in five games, most in franchise history over that span. The team is averaging an NFC-best 33 points per game and ranks third in the conference overall in points scored after only five games. Is this success something Childress, in his first season as offensive coordinator and fourth with the club, envisioned?




"I don't know if I envisioned it to the tune of 35 points per game," says Childress. "I just knew we were on the edge of being a well-oiled machine. We started to show signs late last year and I think we have picked up where we left off. Now the challenge is to keep this going throughout the season."



That well-oiled machine is spearheaded by quarterback DONOVAN MC NABB, who is off to the best start of his four-year career. His 90.4 passer rating ranks third in the NFC and he has thrown 11 touchdown passes and only three interceptions. He leads all quarterbacks with 241 yards rushing, including his second career 100-yard rushing game in a Week 5 matchup with Jacksonville.



In three career starts, including playoffs, against the Buccaneers, McNabb, the NFC’s Offensive Player of the Month for September, is a perfect 3-0 with a 93.7 passer rating, four touchdowns and two interceptions. He has also added 89 yards rushing, averaging 7.4 yards per carry.

“Philadelphia is a great football team and the defending NFC East champions,” says Bucs head coach JON GRUDEN. “It will be a good test for us and a good challenge, especially playing against Donovan McNabb. He’s built like a halfback, he’s very elusive and has a very strong arm. We have to continue to play 11-man football on defense, very disciplined and high energy, and we must control the pocket and limit some of the opportunities that he creates for their offense."



Look, I'm not trying to say that McNabb is the greatest quarterback ever. When he retires, we'll let his performance over his career speak for itself. He is still very early in career. Over the last 3 years, he has had the following game record
12-4
7-3
10-4
for a total of
29-11

It would not be a reach to call him an Outstanding quarterback! Sure, if someone wants to try to bad mouth him, then I'm sure you could find evidence for that as well. You can bad mouth anybody. Football/sports is all about hyping your favorite team/players.

The point was it was out of line for Rush to make this a racial issue and thus promote a racial divide.

Look.... if Rush had said, he thinks McNabb is overrated and here are the numbers why he believes it. That would have been one thing.

But instead Rush said McNabb is overrated (and with no other supporting facts), Rush said it's because McNabb is a black quarterback. Rush ended there.

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by LoneVoice
Look, I'm not trying to say that McNabb is the greatest quarterback ever. When he retires, we'll let his performance over his career speak for itself. He is still very early in career. Over the last 3 years, he has had the following game record
12-4
7-3
10-4
for a total of
29-11

It would not be a reach to call him an Outstanding quarterback!

Yes it would. I already stated he was an AVERAGE quarterback on a good team. The Eagles had a decent record because of their TEAM not because of McNabb. YOU CAN'T ARGUE AGAINST THE NUMBERS!!!

You post a few articles and think that somehow makes him "outstanding"? And one from the philadelphiaeagles.com!

Look.... if Rush had said, he thinks McNabb is overrated and here are the numbers why he believes it. That would have been one thing.

That's EXACTLY what I've just done for you in this thread. McNabb is AVERAGE and the numbers EASILY support that!

 

[LoneVoice]

I posted articles that exemplified his performance.

3 time pro bowl quarterback in his 5 year career.
NFC player of the month for November.
NFC player of the month for September.
Leading quarterback rusher
3 consecutive NFC championship games

He led the Eagles to a 5-0 record in November, the first time in franchise history the team won five games in one month.
The Eagles' offense led by McNabb has scored 165 points in five games, most in franchise history over that span.
The team is averaging an NFC-best 33 points per game and ranks third in the conference overall in points scored after only five games.

Comments from various people calling him an outstanding player:
His coach Andy Reid
Opposing coach Tony Dungy
Opposing coach Jon Gruden
Opposing player Bucs defensive lineman Anthony McFarland.


And that's just from the few articles that I looked at.

 

[jimnyc]

I posted articles that exemplified his performance.

Yes, 3 articles spanning his career. Do you really want me to post a whole shitload of articles that show he is average?

3 time pro bowl quarterback in his 5 year career.

Kordell Stewart was voted to the pro bowl too.

NFC player of the month for November.
NFC player of the month for September.

Wow.

Leading quarterback rusher

When? He certainly wasn't the leading rusher this year! Stop making stuff up!

He led the Eagles to a 5-0 record in November, the first time in franchise history the team won five games in one month.

Speaks volumes about the team but doesn't tell me shit about McNabb.

The Eagles' offense led by McNabb has scored 165 points in five games, most in franchise history over that span.
The team is averaging an NFC-best 33 points per game and ranks third in the conference overall in points scored after only five games.

Where are you yanking this from? after 5 games? You do realize the season is over, don't you?

If he was an outstanding QB he would have the numbers to back that up. How about you post those instead of articles and other peoples opinions. I've already posted his career rankings AND this past season rankings. Both have EASILY showed him to have numbers of a QB that sits in the middle of the pack. Can you dispute the numbers I posted? NO, you can't, they are factual numbers.

So, let's see the numbers to backup what you're saying. Not just pick out one game where he was good, but entire seasons and/or his career.

I'll be waiting...

 

[OCA]

Donovan McNabb: 2 NFC Championship appearances, 2 losses. I'm equating him with Jim Kelley, good numbers but can't win the big one.

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by OCA
Donovan McNabb: 2 NFC Championship appearances, 2 losses. I'm equating him with Jim Kelley, good numbers but can't win the big one.

He actually DOESN'T have the numbers, at least not the numbers of an "outstanding" QB. At least Jim Kelly had the numbers throughout his career regardless of how many championships he had. Donovan is just simply overrated.

 

[OCA]

I'll be honest I don't know his numbers but my point was he can't seem to win the big game. Look at Brett Farve, there have been many times where the Packers in big games(playoffs) have been down for the count but he pulls something from his ass and wins the game. Joe Montana was like that, not huge numbers but I don't think anybody in NFL history has as many 2:00 drives for 7 as him, oh and he was 4-0 in SB'S, THATS WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!:

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by OCA
I'll be honest I don't know his numbers but my point was he can't seem to win the big game. Look at Brett Farve, there have been many times where the Packers in big games(playoffs) have been down for the count but he pulls something from his ass and wins the game. Joe Montana was like that, not huge numbers but I don't think anybody in NFL history has as many 2:00 drives for 7 as him, oh and he was 4-0 in SB'S, THATS WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!:

Agreed.

An "outstanding" player will have good numbers every year and find a way to at least pull out some of the big games.

There are only a few QB's in the NFL that I would consider "outstanding", and McNabb isn't one of them. Here is what he can aspire to:

Peyton Manning
Steve McNair
Brett Favre
Tom Brady
Rich Gannon (career, not this past year)

I can get into all time QB's but the list would be too long. Suffice to say that if Donovan's career continues as it has thus far he will not be considered one of the all time greats. Hell, he's not even in the top 10 for active QB's!!