Game Over

[Oddball]

WE end up with nothing, while those with the means to secure access to law makers end up with all the perks.

We may yet become a real place run by patrician companies with nothing going to the plebeians.

Well, that's a symptom of gubmint that controls too much and has too much power....Something authoritarian do-gooder libs just love, when it claims to achieve ends they approve of.

You don't get it both ways, bunkie.

It ain't the gumint. It's those with access to it calling the shots.

Thanks, judicial activists on SCOTUS! You just sold out access to lawmakers to the highest bidder!

Dadgumm, are you naïve.

If gubmint didn't have the excessive power, there'd be nothing to buy or sell.

Foo.

 

[Nosmo King]

Call it the optimism of youth. I'm still young enough to believe that, just because we have had great days behind us, doesn't mean there are no more ahead of us. We just have to get back to what made us great. We've been on the downhill slide because we keep forgetting to live by our Constitution.

Come clean! Do you think that monkeying around with the marginal tax rates for the richest folks here will keep manufacturing jobs in America? Do you think eliminating any chance at real health care reform will produce one good paying middle class job? do you think that oppressing gay rights, turning a blind eye to the environment, eliminating Social Security and Medicare benefits for the elderly and turning banks and multi-national corporations loose to do as they please will actually secure a future for a 2010 high school graduate?

It ain't the constitution, it's the laissez faire attitude Conservatives want toward globalization that is ruining this nation.

No American jobs means no American future.

This thread isn't about that. It's about giving up on the 'American Dream'. I haven't given up on it. I would prefer my fellow Americans do what we do best.... fight, side by side, to secure our future. We will not agree on every path we take to get there but I'm still idealistic enough to believe that we can get there.

You want to fight side by side to secure the American dream? fine! Help us out and write your congressman and tell him that we need real health care reform now! Tell him that companies which outsource, downsize and move out of America no longer get government contracts. Tell him that banks which gamble with depositors money are no longer welcome here (try France).

Fight side by side for the American dream. I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[Truthmatters]

Then pack and leave. Cuba is nice this time of year. America needs people prepared to work, not sit around and whine cuz they didn't get the nanny state they wanted. You want a nanny state, there's the whole of Europe to pick from. I recommend France.

CG, the Golden age (the apex of American power and prestige) has come and gone. That was the 40s, 50s and early 60s. We've been on the downhill slide ever since, it's historically cyclical for all major world powers.

Call it the optimism of youth. I'm still young enough to believe that, just because we have had great days behind us, doesn't mean there are no more ahead of us. We just have to get back to what made us great. We've been on the downhill slide because we keep forgetting to live by our Constitution.

How do the people do ANYTHING if their voices are drowned out by corporate profits?

 

[Nosmo King]

Well, that's a symptom of gubmint that controls too much and has too much power....Something authoritarian do-gooder libs just love, when it claims to achieve ends they approve of.

You don't get it both ways, bunkie.

It ain't the gumint. It's those with access to it calling the shots.

Thanks, judicial activists on SCOTUS! You just sold out access to lawmakers to the highest bidder!

Dadgumm, are you naïve.

If gubmint didn't have the excessive power, there'd be nothing to buy or sell.

Foo.

Would you reduce the power of the police to protect you and your property?

They are the gubmint too, ya know.

Do you believe that corporations are citizens too? Do they have responsibilities to their workers and the community they are established in? Or can they get away with whatever they like in the name of 'freedom'?

 

[Dr.House]

So the libs who think it's ok for unions to "buy candidates" all of a sudden have a problem with corporations "buying candidates"...

Interesting...

 

[Truthmatters]

Man you really dont get it do you

 

[logical4u]

Corporations have a right to have their voice heard as well. I know you libs hate corporations that make your life easier, but they are here to say and will survive your whining and anti american sentiment.

Could you please explain how corporations make our life easier? Tell me, please. I live in the Rust Belt where corporations have pulled up stakes, ruined communities and moved their operations to Asia and Mexico. Now, we have nothing but the poisoned land and water they left behind.

Please tell us, Mr. Corporation, how our lives are easier as a result of downsizing, globalization, corporate influence in workplace safety, product safety and environmental safe guards.

I am not arguing with your downside of corporations, but when you ask what they gave us....steel, gasoline, medine, eletricity on demand, any product that was used to build the building you live in and the fixtures used to make your life 'easier' (light switches, faucets, toilets, etc), the paper you use to write, the books you read, etc, etc, etc.

Gov has always climbed in bed with money to gain power, in exchange the gov changes the rules to protect the existing industries.

If you want a fair playing field, that is a good thing, if you want to eliminate 'corporations', go take a serious look at any structure and think how long it would take to build without 'corporations'. When you look at getting supplies somewhere 'fast', it is the corporations that have the 'can do' techniques and experience.

Bottom line...the gov is more responsible for corporations being 'monsters' than the corporations are, they just do what they are legally able to do. Above that, morality, is even more important. If there are no morals, gov and corps will do whatever they want. That brings us to a whole new discussion, one that most people refuse to acknowledge; it is to close to home.

 

[rightwinger]

I have been tellinig you for a few years that the golden age of America is past.

Then pack and leave. Cuba is nice this time of year. America needs people prepared to work, not sit around and whine cuz they didn't get the nanny state they wanted. You want a nanny state, there's the whole of Europe to pick from. I recommend France.

CG, the Golden age (the apex of American power and prestige) has come and gone. That was the 40s, 50s and early 60s. We've been on the downhill slide ever since, it's historically cyclical for all major world powers.

I disagree...
As a country we are well advanced from that "golden age" The 40s, 50s and 60s were a disgrace in terms of civil rights for blacks, women and gays. We have made significant progress since that time.
We are also well advanced in terms of international power. We were involved in the Cold War in the 40s, 50s and 60s and were one of two super powers. We are the only game in town now.

 

[Oddball]

Would you reduce the power of the police to protect you and your property?

They are the gubmint too, ya know.

Red herring.

Do you believe that corporations are citizens too? Do they have responsibilities to their workers and the community they are established in? Or can they get away with whatever they like in the name of 'freedom'?

Corporations are 14th Amendment "persons", per the SCOTUS decision in Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad. That's one of them "settled law" thingies.

The only obligations any businesses have are to make something others want to buy and refrain from physically harming another or their property.....Period.

 

[uscitizen]

Then pack and leave. Cuba is nice this time of year. America needs people prepared to work, not sit around and whine cuz they didn't get the nanny state they wanted. You want a nanny state, there's the whole of Europe to pick from. I recommend France.

CG, the Golden age (the apex of American power and prestige) has come and gone. That was the 40s, 50s and early 60s. We've been on the downhill slide ever since, it's historically cyclical for all major world powers.

Call it the optimism of youth. I'm still young enough to believe that, just because we have had great days behind us, doesn't mean there are no more ahead of us. We just have to get back to what made us great. We've been on the downhill slide because we keep forgetting to live by our Constitution.

Just after WW2 we had a small fraction of the worlds population but manufactured over half of the worlds goods.

 

[Truthmatters]

we are not going to have any golden years in the future

 

[Dr.House]

Man you really dont get it do you

I get it...

You lie....

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

we are not going to have any golden years in the future

Dont give up on the independant majority of americans so quickly truth. We just started waking up toward the end of bush, granted we kept hitting snooze....but now Obama got us out of bed and we are going to fix it one progressive politician at a time.

 

[Oddball]

Man.....I've never seen anyone work so hard to be such a pouty-puss.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuStsFW4EmQ]YouTube - Kelly's Heroes Oddball - Negative Waves[/ame]

 

[Truthmatters]

Wheres the lie fool?


We now will have elections that are dominated by corporate spending on supporting or apposing certain candidates.

No one will be able to raise enough money to fight the influence.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

The political pendulum swings from one side to the other. It never stays in one place for long. It was to the right for eight years and then swung to the left. It is now self correcting to move more towards the center.

It is not the end of the world but the way our political system works.

My biggest concern is that the right and left can no longer work together to find a middle ground. it is all or nothing for one side or the other. The result is that we end up with nothing

Me Too

Excellent post man

EDIT: I saw some comments about how is getting nothing from the government bad. Ummm....good question!!!. When it comes to the government less is always more in my book but at the same time i'm pragmatic enough to know we occasionally need them to make a new law and with the current system we either get an all or nothing law which always ends up sucking for one side or the other.

I dont want much at all from the government equal protection under the law secure borders .
I support government doing science projects .
Im not a fan of gift cards.

 

[del]

Wheres the lie fool?


We now will have elections that are dominated by corporate spending on supporting or apposing certain candidates.

No one will be able to raise enough money to fight the influence.

damn, you're stupid.

 

[Truthmatters]

we are not going to have any golden years in the future

Dont give up on the independant majority of americans so quickly truth. We just started waking up toward the end of bush, granted we kept hitting snooze....but now Obama got us out of bed and we are going to fix it one progressive politician at a time.

You wont have to the corporations will make the Americans who agree with me obsolete.

I know you like that idea but that kills us as a democracy.

It wont take long for even you to hate it.

 

[del]

we are not going to have any golden years in the future

Dont give up on the independant majority of americans so quickly truth. We just started waking up toward the end of bush, granted we kept hitting snooze....but now Obama got us out of bed and we are going to fix it one progressive politician at a time.

You wont have to the corporations will make the Americans who agree with me obsolete.

I know you like that idea but that kills us as a democracy.

It wont take long for even you to hate it.

i just sent $25 to AIG.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

The political pendulum swings from one side to the other. It never stays in one place for long. It was to the right for eight years and then swung to the left. It is now self correcting to move more towards the center.

It is not the end of the world but the way our political system works.

My biggest concern is that the right and left can no longer work together to find a middle ground. it is all or nothing for one side or the other. The result is that we end up with nothing

Me Too

Excellent post man

EDIT: I saw some comments about how is getting nothing from the government bad. Ummm....good question!!!. When it comes to the government less is always more in my book but at the same time i'm pragmatic enough to know we occasionally need them to make a new law and with the current system we either get an all or nothing law which always ends up sucking for one side or the other.

I dont want much at all from the government equal protection under the law secure borders .
I support government doing science projects .
Im not a fan of gift cards.

In my opinion the federal government's role is very simple:

1) Protect us from foreign threats (not just militarily)
2) Equal Protection under the law
3) Stay out of the people's way and in doing so stay out of state governance.

Thats it....thats all the feds SHOULD be invovled in. The rest should fall to individual states and towns.