Do you Believe that there is Extraterrestrial Life?

[JWBooth]

yes there is plant life on Venus

You sure? 800 degrees Fahrenheit. 90 atmospheres. Sulfuric acid.

Maybe not.

ever hear of a Venus Flytrap?....yea thats were they are from.....

DJ on WKRP? Dude was cool, but no way does he handle 800 degrees.

 

[JWBooth]

I has already been proven there is life on other planets....Plant life and microscopic life.

has it?

yes there is plant life on Venus

The vegetation stored in the vacuum of space between your ears doesn't count.

 

[JimBowie1958]

do your own research before commenting so assertively on a topic, hey?

https://www.google.com/#q=new+planets+found+in+goldilocks+zone

anyone with "firm" belief that we're the only intelligent life doesn't have much of a "firm" grasp on how big of a stretch they need to make for said belief to be "firm."

I'll let YOU stick to the veiled insults and condescending tones.

These articles are all about the same one planet. If you understood the Rare Earth Hypothesis at all you would know that there is much more to it that finding an earth sized planet the correct distance from its star. I am not impressed by this find at all. Whether it make you feel awkward or not, my belief stands firm. And I am supported by the fact that there have been no contact or any evidence supporting the belief that sentient beings exist at all anywhere.

Hey, someone has to be number one.

aliens....to the left of us...aliens to the right of us.....look if they can master space travel etc and so forth...why not just announce that they are here...

There are huge impacts to such a thing becoming publicly known fact, were it true.

I personally think that it more probable that sentient life has evolved on other planets before Earth, since we have no reason to believe that we are some statistically exceptional early case of evolution. Even if one trillionth of the plausible life supporting planets will eventually evolve intelligent life, we have uncountable likely cases of intelligent life having evolved already. If we are even in the top one thousandth fastest evolving sentient life forms then there have been billions across this universe to have evolved before us by thousands of years.

That means that is very likely, if sentient life is capable of unguided evolution, that species of intelligent beings have already evolved in our own galaxy and are thousands of years ahead of us in technology.

Looking at the exponential rate of advance of technology, these beings would be like gods to us.

 

[JimBowie1958]

I take solace in philosophy anytime I am confronted with questions like this. Two branches of philosophy that I find useful in answering this particular question are mathematics and observational science. Given the vastness of the universe, it is hard to imagine a universe where we are the only kid in the block especially if you use mathematical ideas such as theory of probability, order of entropy, etc.

But then we have to confront another reality which brings us back to observational science. To this date, we have not been able to observe and verify the existence of life much less the intelligent one outside of this planet. We (great apes) have been around on this planet for 20 million years, now. If there were intelligent lives besides our own, we would have heard back from them by now.

I think you are ignoring the colossal impact the hypothetical FACT being known (in and of itself) of the existence of alien sentient life would have on people on this planet, even if only the worst possibilities are extremely unlikely, would it be responsible to out the aliens too soon?

Methinks so.

 

[indiajo]

I take solace in philosophy anytime I am confronted with questions like this. Two branches of philosophy that I find useful in answering this particular question are mathematics and observational science. Given the vastness of the universe, it is hard to imagine a universe where we are the only kid in the block especially if you use mathematical ideas such as theory of probability, order of entropy, etc.

But then we have to confront another reality which brings us back to observational science. To this date, we have not been able to observe and verify the existence of life much less the intelligent one outside of this planet. We (great apes) have been around on this planet for 20 million years, now. If there were intelligent lives besides our own, we would have heard back from them by now. May be they came in our distant past when we were not able to observe or communicate with them. May be the distance between them and us is so vast that it creates a natural barrier that cannot be overcome; if this is true, we will never make the contact. So it is quite possible that even though there are intelligent lives out there, we will never meet them.

We are very luck that things have been pretty calm in our neighborhood of the galaxy for past few million years which allowed major forms of life to evolve. This however, is not going to be the case permanently. As we know good chunk of life has been wiped out many times and then it evolved again; this has been repeated quite a few times now. The interval at which this mass extinction takes place is 65-million-year. Interestingly enough, this coincides with the vertical oscillation period of our solar system across the disc of our Milky Way galaxy. We are heading towards an assured mass extinction in less than 65-million years provided we do not get hit by an asteroid in the mean time. But let us say, we get luck, just for the sake of optimism, and we outlive all these extinctions, even then we will not be able to avoid the reality that the Sun will run out of fuel in few billion years and when that happens, continuation of life will not be possible in our solar system.

This life is precious and yet temporary. There is no eternal life. There is one life embedded in one chance we get. One moment is all we have to live our life in. So I say, "Peace to ya all!"

I agree to that. But one more thing. Possibly there are thousands or even hundreds of tousands of theoretically life supporting planets in our own galaxy. But there are restrictions for evolution. A big one is gravity. Double the diameter of the earth and you get 8 times the gravity. I would weigh then, say, around 600 kg. Baahhhh. This would make the evolution of a technologically versatile intelligence not quite easy. Very small people with very big problems getting something into space.
On the other hand we know that a little less gravity like on Mars leads to the loss of the atmosphere. Bad Karma.
Then, they could be on the other side of the disc. We don't even know how it looks like there because we cannot see through the core.
Next, we are in a position to emit radiation since around 100 years now. If they are at par in evolution with us it would take around 100.000 years for their signals to reach us. Or vice versa. If we should detect a signal, it comes from a very long time ago in the history of their planet.

There is absolutely no reason to fear aliens. I am pretty sure they exist, or have existed, or will exist. Somewhere. Only thar somewhere is for sure in a unimaginable vast physical distance.
Only religions woud have to change their stories a little bit should we find a proof for extraterrestrial intelligent life. Maybe so: god has set up different zoos for his entertainment.

 

[Vikrant]

I take solace in philosophy anytime I am confronted with questions like this. Two branches of philosophy that I find useful in answering this particular question are mathematics and observational science. Given the vastness of the universe, it is hard to imagine a universe where we are the only kid in the block especially if you use mathematical ideas such as theory of probability, order of entropy, etc.

But then we have to confront another reality which brings us back to observational science. To this date, we have not been able to observe and verify the existence of life much less the intelligent one outside of this planet. We (great apes) have been around on this planet for 20 million years, now. If there were intelligent lives besides our own, we would have heard back from them by now. May be they came in our distant past when we were not able to observe or communicate with them. May be the distance between them and us is so vast that it creates a natural barrier that cannot be overcome; if this is true, we will never make the contact. So it is quite possible that even though there are intelligent lives out there, we will never meet them.

We are very luck that things have been pretty calm in our neighborhood of the galaxy for past few million years which allowed major forms of life to evolve. This however, is not going to be the case permanently. As we know good chunk of life has been wiped out many times and then it evolved again; this has been repeated quite a few times now. The interval at which this mass extinction takes place is 65-million-year. Interestingly enough, this coincides with the vertical oscillation period of our solar system across the disc of our Milky Way galaxy. We are heading towards an assured mass extinction in less than 65-million years provided we do not get hit by an asteroid in the mean time. But let us say, we get luck, just for the sake of optimism, and we outlive all these extinctions, even then we will not be able to avoid the reality that the Sun will run out of fuel in few billion years and when that happens, continuation of life will not be possible in our solar system.

This life is precious and yet temporary. There is no eternal life. There is one life embedded in one chance we get. One moment is all we have to live our life in. So I say, "Peace to ya all!"

I agree to that. But one more thing. Possibly there are thousands or even hundreds of tousands of theoretically life supporting planets in our own galaxy. But there are restrictions for evolution. A big one is gravity. Double the diameter of the earth and you get 8 times the gravity. I would weigh then, say, around 600 kg. Baahhhh. This would make the evolution of a technologically versatile intelligence not quite easy. Very small people with very big problems getting something into space.
On the other hand we know that a little less gravity like on Mars leads to the loss of the atmosphere. Bad Karma.
Then, they could be on the other side of the disc. We don't even know how it looks like there because we cannot see through the core.
Next, we are in a position to emit radiation since around 100 years now. If they are at par in evolution with us it would take around 100.000 years for their signals to reach us. Or vice versa. If we should detect a signal, it comes from a very long time ago in the history of their planet.

There is absolutely no reason to fear aliens. I am pretty sure they exist, or have existed, or will exist. Somewhere. Only thar somewhere is for sure in a unimaginable vast physical distance.
Only religions woud have to change their stories a little bit should we find a proof for extraterrestrial intelligent life. Maybe so: god has set up different zoos for his entertainment.

Absolutely, with our evolved means of communications, there is a chance that we will make a contact in future. But I do not agree in theory with you that we should not fear aliens. If they are anything like us humans, they will if they could invade us to take our goats and women. I do agree however, that the space between them and us is insurmountable and therein lies ours and theirs security.

 

[Thunderbird]

I think it is unlikely that there are other intelligent aliens within our galaxy.

Fermi paradox

If there are intelligent aliens outside our galaxy we may never contact them.

[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Universe-Teeming-Aliens-WHERE-EVERYBODY/dp/0387955011/ref=pd_sim_b_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=16P31P83ZQ3W5DPFCK0W"]If the Universe Is Teeming with Aliens ... WHERE IS EVERYBODY?[/ame]

 

[JimBowie1958]

I take solace in philosophy anytime I am confronted with questions like this. Two branches of philosophy that I find useful in answering this particular question are mathematics and observational science. Given the vastness of the universe, it is hard to imagine a universe where we are the only kid in the block especially if you use mathematical ideas such as theory of probability, order of entropy, etc.

But then we have to confront another reality which brings us back to observational science. To this date, we have not been able to observe and verify the existence of life much less the intelligent one outside of this planet. We (great apes) have been around on this planet for 20 million years, now. If there were intelligent lives besides our own, we would have heard back from them by now. May be they came in our distant past when we were not able to observe or communicate with them. May be the distance between them and us is so vast that it creates a natural barrier that cannot be overcome; if this is true, we will never make the contact. So it is quite possible that even though there are intelligent lives out there, we will never meet them.

We are very luck that things have been pretty calm in our neighborhood of the galaxy for past few million years which allowed major forms of life to evolve. This however, is not going to be the case permanently. As we know good chunk of life has been wiped out many times and then it evolved again; this has been repeated quite a few times now. The interval at which this mass extinction takes place is 65-million-year. Interestingly enough, this coincides with the vertical oscillation period of our solar system across the disc of our Milky Way galaxy. We are heading towards an assured mass extinction in less than 65-million years provided we do not get hit by an asteroid in the mean time. But let us say, we get luck, just for the sake of optimism, and we outlive all these extinctions, even then we will not be able to avoid the reality that the Sun will run out of fuel in few billion years and when that happens, continuation of life will not be possible in our solar system.

This life is precious and yet temporary. There is no eternal life. There is one life embedded in one chance we get. One moment is all we have to live our life in. So I say, "Peace to ya all!"

I agree to that. But one more thing. Possibly there are thousands or even hundreds of tousands of theoretically life supporting planets in our own galaxy. But there are restrictions for evolution. A big one is gravity. Double the diameter of the earth and you get 8 times the gravity. I would weigh then, say, around 600 kg. Baahhhh. This would make the evolution of a technologically versatile intelligence not quite easy. Very small people with very big problems getting something into space.
On the other hand we know that a little less gravity like on Mars leads to the loss of the atmosphere. Bad Karma.
Then, they could be on the other side of the disc. We don't even know how it looks like there because we cannot see through the core.
Next, we are in a position to emit radiation since around 100 years now. If they are at par in evolution with us it would take around 100.000 years for their signals to reach us. Or vice versa. If we should detect a signal, it comes from a very long time ago in the history of their planet.

There is absolutely no reason to fear aliens. I am pretty sure they exist, or have existed, or will exist. Somewhere. Only thar somewhere is for sure in a unimaginable vast physical distance.
Only religions woud have to change their stories a little bit should we find a proof for extraterrestrial intelligent life. Maybe so: god has set up different zoos for his entertainment.

Absolutely, with our evolved means of communications, there is a chance that we will make a contact in future. But I do not agree in theory with you that we should not fear aliens. If they are anything like us humans, they will if they could invade us to take our goats and women. I do agree however, that the space between them and us is insurmountable and therein lies ours and theirs security.

I seriously doubt that any aliens are planning to invade Earth to take our women.

If they can reach us crossing the vast voids of space, they will be using fuels and tech that are way beyond what we have and that they might profitably invade and steal.

My best guess is that they are at a minimum traders and most likely part of a league of sentient life forms already.

 

[JimBowie1958]

I think it is unlikely that there are other intelligent aliens within our galaxy.

Fermi paradox

If there are intelligent aliens outside our galaxy we may never contact them.

If the Universe Is Teeming with Aliens ... WHERE IS EVERYBODY?

The Fermi Paradox isn't that hard to explain in that it is quite likely that any star hopping race of sentient beings will be using some other kind of communication that is not hobbled by the speed of light.

 

[HUGGY]

Perhaps the "stuff" that allows light to travel through what appears as empty space in waves has properties which act in an instantaneous manner when accessed properly thereby achieving speeds of communication MUCH faster than the speed of light much like light is faster than sound. Sound requires molecules much like waves in water. Light also travels in waves but what we "see" may have nothing to do with how light travels in apparent vacuume. I believe we will eventually discover how to use the same stuff light uses to travel on or it's near cousin and find we can communicate MUCH farther and faster than the speed of light.

I think we will discover that the stuff in the void of space is connected like those balls hanging on strings where you bounce one end and the ball on the opposite end reacts.

 

[Thunderbird]

The Fermi Paradox isn't that hard to explain in that it is quite likely that any star hopping race of sentient beings will be using some other kind of communication that is not hobbled by the speed of light.

1) Why wouldn't some group or individual within this civilization contact us? 2) How do you know this kind of communication is possible?

 

[jon_berzerk]

I think it is unlikely that there are other intelligent aliens within our galaxy.

Fermi paradox

If there are intelligent aliens outside our galaxy we may never contact them.

If the Universe Is Teeming with Aliens ... WHERE IS EVERYBODY?

not for hundreds of years anyway

 

[Montrovant]

I think it is unlikely that there are other intelligent aliens within our galaxy.

Fermi paradox

If there are intelligent aliens outside our galaxy we may never contact them.

If the Universe Is Teeming with Aliens ... WHERE IS EVERYBODY?

The Fermi Paradox seems very flawed to me. It seems based on an assumption of continued and steady expansion and colonization, even over millions of years. I don't think we have any reason to expect that kind of expansion. There are probably innumerable reasons or scenarios in which expansion and colonization would slow or halt. Wars, political strife, lack of resources, lowered birth rates, distance between potential planets, there's no reason to assume the kind of expansion the Fermi Paradox requires.

 

[JimBowie1958]

The Fermi Paradox isn't that hard to explain in that it is quite likely that any star hopping race of sentient beings will be using some other kind of communication that is not hobbled by the speed of light.

1) Why wouldn't some group or individual within this civilization contact us?

Tricky question since I don't have any factual descriptions of who/what the aliens are.

I do think it is far more likely that whatever civilization exists among the aliens it is peaceful, far in advance of us technologically and morally, and that they want to make observations that are not skewed by us knowing that they are there. This is basic scientific method for observing intelligent life, I would imagine.

2) How do you know this kind of communication is possible?

Well, I don't KNOW that it is possible but there are things that look like they have a very decent chance of panning out, like using quantum entangled particles to communicate almost instantly across limitless distances.

I just see no reason to suppose that the aliens will still be using electromagnetic waves which simply are unsuitable for interstellar communications and are only suitable for local interplanetary needs at best. I do think they will not be used for even interplanetary communications within the next few centuries.

 

[indiajo]

I take solace in philosophy anytime I am confronted with questions like this. Two branches of philosophy that I find useful in answering this particular question are mathematics and observational science. Given the vastness of the universe, it is hard to imagine a universe where we are the only kid in the block especially if you use mathematical ideas such as theory of probability, order of entropy, etc.

But then we have to confront another reality which brings us back to observational science. To this date, we have not been able to observe and verify the existence of life much less the intelligent one outside of this planet. We (great apes) have been around on this planet for 20 million years, now. If there were intelligent lives besides our own, we would have heard back from them by now. May be they came in our distant past when we were not able to observe or communicate with them. May be the distance between them and us is so vast that it creates a natural barrier that cannot be overcome; if this is true, we will never make the contact. So it is quite possible that even though there are intelligent lives out there, we will never meet them.

We are very luck that things have been pretty calm in our neighborhood of the galaxy for past few million years which allowed major forms of life to evolve. This however, is not going to be the case permanently. As we know good chunk of life has been wiped out many times and then it evolved again; this has been repeated quite a few times now. The interval at which this mass extinction takes place is 65-million-year. Interestingly enough, this coincides with the vertical oscillation period of our solar system across the disc of our Milky Way galaxy. We are heading towards an assured mass extinction in less than 65-million years provided we do not get hit by an asteroid in the mean time. But let us say, we get luck, just for the sake of optimism, and we outlive all these extinctions, even then we will not be able to avoid the reality that the Sun will run out of fuel in few billion years and when that happens, continuation of life will not be possible in our solar system.

This life is precious and yet temporary. There is no eternal life. There is one life embedded in one chance we get. One moment is all we have to live our life in. So I say, "Peace to ya all!"

I agree to that. But one more thing. Possibly there are thousands or even hundreds of tousands of theoretically life supporting planets in our own galaxy. But there are restrictions for evolution. A big one is gravity. Double the diameter of the earth and you get 8 times the gravity. I would weigh then, say, around 600 kg. Baahhhh. This would make the evolution of a technologically versatile intelligence not quite easy. Very small people with very big problems getting something into space.
On the other hand we know that a little less gravity like on Mars leads to the loss of the atmosphere. Bad Karma.
Then, they could be on the other side of the disc. We don't even know how it looks like there because we cannot see through the core.
Next, we are in a position to emit radiation since around 100 years now. If they are at par in evolution with us it would take around 100.000 years for their signals to reach us. Or vice versa. If we should detect a signal, it comes from a very long time ago in the history of their planet.

There is absolutely no reason to fear aliens. I am pretty sure they exist, or have existed, or will exist. Somewhere. Only thar somewhere is for sure in a unimaginable vast physical distance.
Only religions woud have to change their stories a little bit should we find a proof for extraterrestrial intelligent life. Maybe so: god has set up different zoos for his entertainment.

Absolutely, with our evolved means of communications, there is a chance that we will make a contact in future. But I do not agree in theory with you that we should not fear aliens. If they are anything like us humans, they will if they could invade us to take our goats and women. I do agree however, that the space between them and us is insurmountable and therein lies ours and theirs security.

I think you are right with your pont. A species that is able and willing to spread out and explore will by nature be agressive, if not violent. Self sufficient flower power hippies will not built and man spacecrafts with all the risks involved. If they would take the risks of exploring they will see a gain in it to justify the enterprise.
And I m afraid they would not be satisfied with some goats.
But as it was already said, the distance is our shield. A pretty reliable one.

P.S. If they wanted women, we have some in Germany we would be delighted to hand over to them. Maybe with some goats extra to make sure they wouldn't bring them back.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

FranCoWtFs posts remove any and all doubt that there are extraterrestrials

Sent from smartphone using my wits and Taptalk

 

[Steven_R]

The Fermi Paradox isn't that hard to explain in that it is quite likely that any star hopping race of sentient beings will be using some other kind of communication that is not hobbled by the speed of light.

1) Why wouldn't some group or individual within this civilization contact us?

Tricky question since I don't have any factual descriptions of who/what the aliens are.

I do think it is far more likely that whatever civilization exists among the aliens it is peaceful, far in advance of us technologically and morally, and that they want to make observations that are not skewed by us knowing that they are there. This is basic scientific method for observing intelligent life, I would imagine.

2) How do you know this kind of communication is possible?

Well, I don't KNOW that it is possible but there are things that look like they have a very decent chance of panning out, like using quantum entangled particles to communicate almost instantly across limitless distances.

I just see no reason to suppose that the aliens will still be using electromagnetic waves which simply are unsuitable for interstellar communications and are only suitable for local interplanetary needs at best. I do think they will not be used for even interplanetary communications within the next few centuries.

Why would any intelligent and technologically capable extraterrestrial life want to contact us? What do the hairless apes of an insignificant planet orbiting an insignificant star in the outreaches of a typical spiral galaxy have to offer in the first place, much less before we get into just how violent that ape is?

I mean, aliens can't live on Earth. Hell, I'm from here and my family has been here for a billion years and 3/4 of the globe is covered in a substance that will kill me, not including areas that are too hot or too cold or too arid or too high to sustain life. We haven't even gotten into weather patterns, earthquakes, landslides, or biological nasties like bacteria and predators. Earth is a deathtrap. I'd be better off on a geologically dead body like the Moon, since I'm going to be forced to engineer the place to suit my needs anyways.

There's nothing special about the Earth from a geologic standpoint. If aliens need something like iron or carbon or even water, it's far easier to mine asteroids.

And then there's humanity. We talk a good game about wanting peace, but kill each other over nothing.

I guess, other than observing humans and other life just out of curiosity, there's just nothing attractive about us.

 

[Thunderbird]

The Fermi Paradox seems very flawed to me. It seems based on an assumption of continued and steady expansion and colonization, even over millions of years. I don't think we have any reason to expect that kind of expansion.

isn't growth and expansion fundamental to life?

There are probably innumerable reasons or scenarios in which expansion and colonization would slow or halt. Wars, political strife, lack of resources, lowered birth rates, distance between potential planets, there's no reason to assume the kind of expansion the Fermi Paradox requires.

You seem to be describing a dying civilization.

 

[Montrovant]

The Fermi Paradox seems very flawed to me. It seems based on an assumption of continued and steady expansion and colonization, even over millions of years. I don't think we have any reason to expect that kind of expansion.

isn't growth and expansion fundamental to life?

There are probably innumerable reasons or scenarios in which expansion and colonization would slow or halt. Wars, political strife, lack of resources, lowered birth rates, distance between potential planets, there's no reason to assume the kind of expansion the Fermi Paradox requires.

You seem to be describing a dying civilization.

Expansion is not fundamental to life.

A civilization does not have to die to have war or disease or simply run out of the resources needed for interstellar travel.

There is no reason to assume any civilization which colonizes more than their original world will continue to do so at a fairly steady pace for millions of years. That is the basis of the Fermi Paradox from the little I read; an assumption that continued colonization at a particular pace is inevitable.

 

[Thunderbird]

I do think it is far more likely that whatever civilization exists among the aliens it is peaceful, far in advance of us technologically and morally,

Think of all the societies that have been technologically advanced and immoral!

and that they want to make observations that are not skewed by us knowing that they are there. This is basic scientific method for observing intelligent life, I would imagine.

Would ALL aliens follow this rule?

I just see no reason to suppose that the aliens will still be using electromagnetic waves which simply are unsuitable for interstellar communications and are only suitable for local interplanetary needs at best. I do think they will not be used for even interplanetary communications within the next few centuries.

Why do people assume scientific advances will continue indefinitely?