Contrasting Cases: Two People Fired Due to 'Net Postings

[Skull Pilot]

Do you compel your employees to friend you or your business on facebook, Skull Pilot?

No but i have my ways. I have internet spies that are friends with my employees. I personally do not do facebook

I wonder if part of the problem lies right there, legally. What right does an employer have to spy on his employee's net activity conducted in their private lives? Such conduct by a neighbor or stranger might could be criminal....(if extreme and then only if the law continues to develop as it has).

I also wonder what harm could flow from a net posting that is set up as private by the employee to such a degree that it took spying to get at it? If it concerned a customer of the employer's, how on earth could that customer ever come to hear of it?

This is without a doubt a kinetic area of law and technology. I'm fairly certain there are now services you can buy to gather whatever has been written about you or your business anywhere on the 'net. Dunno if such services guarantee they can retrieve privately set postings or not.

I don't concern myself with the vagueness of the law. As a condition of employment all of my employees must abide by the codes of conduct spelled out in the employee manual. Any and all dealings with our clients are to remain strictly confidential if a person can't do that then they can't work for me. Period.

And it doesn't matter how i find out if they violated a code of conduct only that they committed said violation.

 

[Madeline]

No but i have my ways. I have internet spies that are friends with my employees. I personally do not do facebook

I wonder if part of the problem lies right there, legally. What right does an employer have to spy on his employee's net activity conducted in their private lives? Such conduct by a neighbor or stranger might could be criminal....(if extreme and then only if the law continues to develop as it has).

I also wonder what harm could flow from a net posting that is set up as private by the employee to such a degree that it took spying to get at it? If it concerned a customer of the employer's, how on earth could that customer ever come to hear of it?

This is without a doubt a kinetic area of law and technology. I'm fairly certain there are now services you can buy to gather whatever has been written about you or your business anywhere on the 'net. Dunno if such services guarantee they can retrieve privately set postings or not.

I don't concern myself with the vagueness of the law. As a condition of employment all of my employees must abide by the codes of conduct spelled out in the employee manual. Any and all dealings with our clients are to remain strictly confidential if a person can't do that then they can't work for me. Period.

And it doesn't matter how i find out if they violated a code of conduct only that they committed said violation.

I can certainly see different needs for different employers, Skull Pilot. If you run a trucking company, an employee's post to the effect that he went to work hung over would reasonably alarm you. If you run a security company, a post to the effect that they'll be missing work might alarm you for fear is would signal to burglars that the client's place will be unguarded. And certainly, no business wants to lose customers and good will over an employee's 'net postings.

I'm not critisizng you for your concern; seems 100% reasonable to me. Just wanted to discuss what the law may or may not have done to sift through your rights vs. those of the employee as of now. This area of law usually lags far behind the emerging technology, as you doubtless already know.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Posting a disparaging comment online for all to see is not necessarily protected speech.

 

[Sky Dancer]

If anything these stories illustrate why we shouldn't be posting on line while at work, and how much care we should take with Facebook.

I don't do Facebook at all.

 

[Madeline]

Posting a disparaging comment online for all to see is not necessarily protected speech.

You have a right to free speech, iamwhatiseem. You may say whatever you like wherever you like, legally, and the government will take you to task only if the speech is criminal (as in offering a bribe or starting a panic in an enclosed space) or if it is libelous. You can be contractually obligated to surrender certain free speech rights (as in, you have agreed to do up a book on tape for publisher X and cannot then do up the same book for publisher Y).

You have all the rights that then remain regarding free speech, including the right to insult someone else.

The question is, can your employer place you under a duty to refrain from writing insulting remarks about his business and its customers on the 'net?

IMO, it just is not clear cut. But we cannot begin by asking whether the speech was of any value and should be protected.....that is 180 degrees different than the analysis that is called for.

 

[Madeline]

If anything these stories illustrate why we shouldn't be posting on line while at work, and how much care we should take with Facebook.

I don't do Facebook at all.

I cannot imagine why any teacher, social worker etc. would ever consider facebook, unless they had all their privacy settings turned up full blast -- and mebbe not even then.

 

[judyd]

I believe both people were vulnerable to firing. The EMT should have kept her whining to the PM and IM feature of Facebook. It kind of depends on how private she had her settings on her wall, actually. If she had them ultra private, then the boss would have only found out if one of her FB friends had gone to him. Facebook can be a much more public setting than merely backbiting the boss at the water cooler. And, some bosses don't allow negative gossip to occur in their workplace, or negative things to be said about them outside of work.

The other fellow, it sounds like, inappropriately used company resources for a campaign. He should have played by the book since he had enemies because of his opinions and stances. Bad move on his part.

Even if your account is set at private, if one of your friends makes a comment about your comment, it shows up on their wall, which the boss may be able to see.

I am constantly surprised at how often I see people complaining about their jobs, their boss, their boyfriends, etc. Also, I know of an elementary school teacher who is constantly posting photos of herself drinking--in fact those are pretty much the only pictures of herself that she posts--when she's out partying and drinking. I would think that eventually those would get back to her school or the parents.

 

[Middleman]

I believe both people were vulnerable to firing. The EMT should have kept her whining to the PM and IM feature of Facebook. It kind of depends on how private she had her settings on her wall, actually. If she had them ultra private, then the boss would have only found out if one of her FB friends had gone to him. Facebook can be a much more public setting than merely backbiting the boss at the water cooler. And, some bosses don't allow negative gossip to occur in their workplace, or negative things to be said about them outside of work.

The other fellow, it sounds like, inappropriately used company resources for a campaign. He should have played by the book since he had enemies because of his opinions and stances. Bad move on his part.

Even if your account is set at private, if one of your friends makes a comment about your comment, it shows up on their wall, which the boss may be able to see.

I am constantly surprised at how often I see people complaining about their jobs, their boss, their boyfriends, etc. Also, I know of an elementary school teacher who is constantly posting photos of herself drinking--in fact those are pretty much the only pictures of herself that she posts--when she's out partying and drinking. I would think that eventually those would get back to her school or the parents.

I'm fairly certain they have an option where your wall posts can be kept totally private, and not seen by 'friends of friends'.